public school as a great equaliser

[**guest**]

what would you say to someone in a casual conversation, if you said you were homeschooling, and the person said she was an ardent supporter of public schools because they are such great 'equalisers'?

i was tempted to say that that was one of my reasons to homeschool (like do i really want my kids to be equal to everybody else?), but then i felt my response would sound like i was being socially irresponsible.

[ledzepplon]

Yeah, GO MEDIOCRITY.

Seriouly, I went to some very good public schools where I got a great education. But the "equallizer" bit is joke, since schools in wealthy areas have more money and resources.

[Hera]

"Huh. Have you ever read that story, Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut?"

[OTMomma]

There was an article in the most recent Mothering about African American families homeschooling- the author did not feel that public schools were at all up to equal for all students.

I would also note that I've read a number of things about how minority students are over represented in special ed programs across the country- that is definately not equalizing. And while I'm on the soapbox- what kind of jobs are these "equalized" children going to have? It sounds like there will be no nobel prize winners coming from this "equlizing" system does it?

[**guest**]

Originally Posted by Hera

"Huh. Have you ever read that story, Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut?"

are you asking me, or suggesting this as a come back? i love Vonnegut. haven't read this one, though.

[CarolinaHomeschool]

Originally Posted by annabanana

what would you say to someone in a casual conversation, if you said you were homeschooling, and the person said she was an ardent supporter of public schools because they are such great 'equalisers'?

I would politely ask her to explain what she meant and then go from there. You can either answer with a neutral "That's an interesting viewpoint" if you don't want to debate the issue with her, or explain your point of view according to her explanation of "equalizer."

If she's saying that the schools make all children appear equal in each other's eyes, then she has an idealistic view of the schools. They are full of cliques, the have's, the have not's, are usually self-segregated due to peer pressure, etc. Equalizer? Not in my experience.

By the way, if you run into anti-homeschooling family, friends, or strangers and want suggestions about dealing with them, take a look at my FAQs area at http://www.carolinahomeschooler.com/faq.htm and click on the Anti-Homeschooling section.

Dianna

[Dar]

Oh, Harrison Bergeron rocks! And it would be a good comeback - it's about a hypothetical future where everyone is "equal". The whole story is here.

I would reply that the public schools are in no way equalizers. I've been in public schools with swimming pools and microscpes and tennis courts and laptops for all, and 12 students per classroom (and no home in that district went for under a million), and I've been in schools with 40 kids in a a classroom, and 3 textbooks for them to share, and leaky ceilings, and mold, and a revolving door of substitute teachers...

dar

[white_feather]

By no means are various public schools across the country 'equal'. But being in a classroom is often an equalizer. Quite often, bringing children down to the lower end of average - especially with the no child left behind act, which means kids are often left hanging until the kids struggling most catch the concept. It's a bit old, but I enjoyed reading the book, Dumbing Down Our Kids.

[Dillpicklechip]

Originally Posted by Hera

"Huh. Have you ever read that story, Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut?"

:

I read that story many years ago but I've always remembered it; it made a big impression on me. Why indeed, is mediocrity something we should strive for?

[lotusmamma]

Who wants homogenized kids? Or an homogenized society for that matter?

Sam in Sydney
Mum to 3 individual unschoolers

[chaos_pie]

David Guterson in his homeschooling book addresses this idea also.

I think it is interesting and would wonder why your friend had this value.

[Hera]

Originally Posted by annabanana

are you asking me, or suggesting this as a come back? i love Vonnegut. haven't read this one, though.

A comeback, because it was the first thing that popped into my mind...

It's a good one, though, you should read it

[elizam]

Harrison Bergeron!

Originally Posted by Hera

"Huh. Have you ever read that story, Harrison Bergeron by Kurt Vonnegut?"

Too funny.....I've never heard of that story, and tonight I read about it not only here, but on another website as well!

[Roar]

The book Savage Inequalities by Jonathan Kozol is a must read on this topic. Your public library probably has it and here is a short summary. http://www.wier.ca/~%20daniel_schugu...1991kozol.html

My response would be to say that I recognize most children go to public school and it makes me incredibly sad that what is offered depends so much on social class. I can't imagine anyone who has visited a range of schools in this country could really believe that there are equal offerings to all children. It isn't even close.

[zoebird]

i would ask them to define what "equalizer" means and how that is socially functional or relevant.

i would also assert that i, too, support public schools because not everyone is able to educate their children on their own--and therefore the state (in which i participate) provides those children, and anyone else who would want to participate, with the opportunity for education.

i believe that education is an 'equalizer' and that every child has a 'right' to education. but simply, i can educate my children myself, saving valuable resources for the state so that it can educate those children whose parents are unable to educate them.

[Rivka5]

I'm a staunch supporter of the public schools too, because I know too many people who essentially raised themselves on the streets while their parents were off doing drugs, or in jail, or struggling with a serious and untreated mental illness, or working three jobs to get by, or dealing on a drug corner.

I think that free public schools need to exist because they give SOME chance of an education (and some social services, and some clean & sober role models, and two hot meals a day) to kids who would otherwise find those things awfully hard to come by.

I think that free public schools need to exist, and be well funded, and be a whole lot better than they are, because any educational system that relies SOLELY on parents making good choices for their kids is going to mean that kids whose parents can't minimally get their act together are going to fall through the cracks and have nothing. And there are a lot of kids like that.

If that's what your friend is thinking of as "equalization," I can sort of see her point. But in actual practice, of course, the public schools represent a low floor of opportunity that all kids have access to, while some children get much, much, much more.

[Ruthla]

I went to public school. I don't get this "equalizer" thing at all. Kids from rich neighborhoods get "good" schools. Kids from poor neighborhoods go to "bad" schools. Get inside any school and kids only socialize within their cliques.

I don't want my kids "equalized." I want my kids to have a strong foundation in who they are so that when they deal with "the real world" as adults they can withstand it.

[Roo_Online]

I would want to say, "WTF are you talking about?" but that would be just in my head.

Aloud, I would, like others have said, ask the person to claify what s/he means by that statement. To me, it sounds like a phrase that was meant to put you on the defensive. Don't take the bait.

Public schools are great equalizers? WTF?!

[Meg Murry.]

Originally Posted by annabanana

what would you say to someone in a casual conversation, if you said you were homeschooling, and the person said she was an ardent supporter of public schools because they are such great 'equalisers'?

i was tempted to say that that was one of my reasons to homeschool (like do i really want my kids to be equal to everybody else?), but then i felt my response would sound like i was being socially irresponsible.

First of all, the notion that they are "great equalizers" is out of some socialist fantasy wonderland in her own head, I'll tell you that right off. Anywhere -- I don't care where the heck you live -- there are good schools and bad-azz scary schools, and, surprise of surprises, they go along with the (also not equal) socioeconomic divisions in your given area. Therefore, her argument is flawed at its very assumption and is therefore not worth considering.

For the sake of more argument, though, let's say that it was true. Isn't that a reason NOT to send someone to school? Doesn't everyone being equal smack uncomfortably of Harrison Bergeron to her? Isn't the lack of individuality (which is what you get when everyone's equal) antithetical to the very nature of democracy itself? Isn't the idea that everyone's the same rather fascistic in its essence? Therefore, that would be a reason TO homeschool: to preserve individual identity without its being subsumed by the collective.

Just my two cents.

[Meg Murry.]

Originally Posted by annabanana

are you asking me, or suggesting this as a come back? i love Vonnegut. haven't read this one, though.

Ooh, you haven't? Here! ----> Harrison Bergeron.