Praise thread spinoff: How does no praise make a child feel? - Page 3

[DevaMajka]

Originally Posted by Twocoolboys

I think by not saying it, you are virtually saying you are a "bad helper", especially when the child is prompting you.

I very much disagree.
Ds says "I'm a big helper" Replying "yes, you ARE! Now let's take this bulb and put it in the box. Yep, just like that. Thank you" is in no way suggesting that ds is not helping to my standards. I'm just not going to *judge* his helping. I'm going to leave that to him- he knows I appreciate it, he knows he is putting the ornaments in the boxes like I want, he knows I'm happy that the tree is getting taken down (he knows all that because I tell him). I'm pretty sure that a 2.5 yo (at least my 2.5yo)can take that info and decide for himself if his actions are "good" or "bad." (which he did, by saying he was a good helper). I'll agree with his judgements, but I'm not going to judge him.

I'm not going to define what my ds does as "good" or "bad" as in, "good helping" or "hitting is bad." I'm just not. To me, that is counterproductive to my assumption that children are innately social beings, and have an innate understanding about social living.

Originally Posted by sunnysideup

Did your mother give you plenty of attention? Did she show interest and appreciation in who you are and the things you do? Did she show her complete joy and delight in you? Because I think you can and should do all of those things without judgement.

yes. I do the same, without adding in my judgement. (and you have a very pretty daughter). I shower my ds with affection, attention, love.

This quote sums up a lot of how I feel about praising children
"The familiar expedients of praise and blame wreak havoc upon the motives of children, especially the smallest ones. If the child does something useful, like putting on his own clothes or feeding the dog, bringing in a handful of field flowers or making an ashtray from a lump of clay, nothing can be more discouraging than an expression of surprise that he has behaved socially: “Oh, what a good girl!” “Look what Georgie has made all by himself!” and similar exclamations imply that sociality is unexpected, uncharacteristic, and unusual in the child." The Continuum Concept pg 88

and this too from Unconditional Parenting
"“Children’s sense of competence, and perhaps of their worth, may come to rise or fall as a result of our reaction. They look to us, figuratively and sometimes literally, to see whether we approve of what they’ve done. (It’s a little like toddlers who take their cue from us when they fall down…)
As a result of praise, children become less able or willing to take pride in their own accomplishments- or to decide what IS an accomplishment. In extreme cases, they can turn into “praise junkies” who, even as adults, continue to rely on other people for validation…”
(my bold in both quotes)

[chinaKat]

I have to say that I think it's fascinating that the people who say that their parents didn't praise and that they did not benefit from that are being responded to with questions about their parents' general ability to parent and show love.

The implication here seems to be that it couldn't possibly be the lack of praise that was the problem. There is clearly something inadequate in the parenting to make the children feel this way.

Interesting.

did your parents do ANYTHING to enforce a positive self-esteem? did they get involved in your life? did they show interest? did they show affection? telling someone how valuable they are to you is not the same as praise, did they ever do that?

Did your mother give you plenty of attention? Did she show interest and appreciation in who you are and the things you do? Did she show her complete joy and delight in you?

[Twocoolboys]

Originally Posted by sunnysideup

Did your mother give you plenty of attention? Did she show interest and appreciation in who you are and the things you do? Did she show her complete joy and delight in you? Because I think you can and should do all of those things without judgement.

I don't want this to be about me, but my mom did a somewhat ok job at these things. She was a single parent and I am 1 of 4 kids, so she was stretched. But she supported us all in sports, was there for home games, spent time with us, played board games with us, took an interest in our school work, etc. So, I do think she did a lot of these things. I think the poor kids who grow up with none of the above and no praise are the ones who really struggle. Just like chinaKat said, I never felt not loved. I never felt not wanted or not supported.

[QUOTE=Deva33mommy;7054241]

I'm not going to define what my ds does as "good" or "bad" as in, "good helping" or "hitting is bad." I'm just not. To me, that is counterproductive to my assumption that children are innately social beings, and have an innate understanding about social living.

I would not use the word "bad" to describe anything a child did, for sure. I don't get so hung up on the word "good". I use it. I don't use it to excess and prefer to be more specific, but I am not going to not use it. And, I'm not going to feel guilty for using it or think that I am damaging my child for using it.

This quote sums up a lot of how I feel about praising children
"The familiar expedients of praise and blame wreak havoc upon the motives of children, especially the smallest ones. If the child does something useful, like putting on his own clothes or feeding the dog, bringing in a handful of field flowers or making an ashtray from a lump of clay, nothing can be more discouraging than an expression of surprise that he has behaved socially: “Oh, what a good girl!” “Look what Georgie has made all by himself!” and similar exclamations imply that sociality is unexpected, uncharacteristic, and unusual in the child." The Continuum Concept pg 88

Well, this makes a lot of sense to me. In those examples given, I would never talk down to a child like that. But, I don't really think this is what most people do when praising, is it? If so, then I've got the wrong idea about praise - lol. That element of surprise at the child doing something is what gets me here. Do people really do this?

and this too from Unconditional Parenting
"“Children’s sense of competence, and perhaps of their worth, may come to rise or fall as a result of our reaction. They look to us, figuratively and sometimes literally, to see whether we approve of what they’ve done. (It’s a little like toddlers who take their cue from us when they fall down…)
As a result of praise, children become less able or willing to take pride in their own accomplishments- or to decide what IS an accomplishment. In extreme cases, they can turn into “praise junkies” who, even as adults, continue to rely on other people for validation…”
(my bold in both quotes)

This is the part of the "theory" that I don't agree with. Children do look to us, for sure, and that is exactly why I will continue to praise. I do not think I am creating praise junkies. Quite the contrary, my 7 year old is one of the most self-assured kids around.

[Shaki]

Originally Posted by chinaKat

But... you were an adult when this took place, not a child. Your collaborator was not your primary caregiver, the person you looked to first to form your own personal value system. You could easily see that his praise was judgment, and it clearly wasn't something you were looking to hear at that time.

I don't think anybody in this thread is advocating excessive or inappropriately placed praise.

That's a good point regarding my earlier post. I do think there is something valid to the idea that genuine sharing in the moment (which Alfie K might call a "you did it" attitude rather than a "good job" attitude) has a deeper value than non-specific praise; regardless of who it's coming from (primary caregiver or peer) and regardless of age. That's what I was getting at.

[chinaKat]

Originally Posted by Shaki

I do think there is something valid to the idea that genuine sharing in the moment (which Alfie K might call a "you did it" attitude rather than a "good job" attitude) has a deeper value than non-specific praise; regardless of who it's coming from (primary caregiver or peer) and regardless of age.

Yep, I would agree with that!