How does adoption make you feel?

[BCFD]

I am curious if any moms here have gone through the IVF process with no success and then adopted. My partner and I decided on IVF with donor sperm since I had IVF insurance coverage and we figured that would be the most "frugal" way to start a family. Even with insurance, we paid close to $40K. I never dreampt I'd have fertility issues, although I had never tried getting pg either. To make a long story short, 4 years later after a m/c, ectopic, chemical and many BFN's my partner heard an ad on the radio about a foster care agency where they also mentioned adoption. We immediately looked into it (and my insurance was just about to run out!). We went through our PRIDE class and 9 months later a perfect, beautiful, little pink baby girl came to us. Since then we have adopted another baby girl and were just placed with DD#1's bio sister and are hoping to adopt her in 2007. My children are my world and I can't imagine having any other kids but them (them specifically!). I always say that I wouldn't trade 50,000 bio kids for my little angels. They were definitely conceived and born for my arms.

The entire time going through IF treatments I never even thought about my child being "my biological child". It's just not something that crossed my mind. Because I am in a same sex relationship, we had already given up 1/2 the biology (the baby wouldn't be genetically linked to my partner), and it just really never was a topic or issue. It just simply was going to be "our baby".

Fast forward to when DD was 8 months old.....I joined an AP mom's group and everybody there nursed their bio babies. They were always very supportive of me, but I always got those, "you poor sad mother..you'll never know what it's like to nurse your child or sustain her life from the milk of your breasts" looks. In fact, a lot of moms there would talk about this right in front of me...while I fed my baby with a bottle! It was all about birth stories and giving birth and feeling the baby kick and breastfeeding. I confided in a few women that I felt close to that hearing this stuff was very painful and I thought that a mother's group was all about being a "mother"...not a "biological mother". Some of them got it and didn't talk about it as much in front of me. I finally stopped going because every time I'd leave I was practically in tears. They were a very insensitive group. That group did help me to look into adoptive BF and I have nursed my children with the Lact-Aid system and tried (oh how I tried!) to induce lactation. I did get some milk, but it was so little I got to use my lupron needs to collect it (they actually came in handy!) off of the horn!! I'm still a very huge advocate of bf'ing and it makes me so angry to see mom's that can bf not doing it. They have no clue about how lucky they are and the gift they are able to give their children.

Today was a bad day. Something happened to me (the whole breast vs. bottle thing) and I have literally spent the entire day crying about this. All 3 of my kids just went down for a 3 hour nap...and so did mommy. My DP, on the other hand, thinks that I'm overly sensitive and she can't believe I give one second of thought to this. She couldn't care less that we FF and use a botltle. She was a huge supporter of me doing the adoptive breastfeeding protocol and she reminds me every day that we are incredibly mommies to our children. I know this, but it still hurts when I hear people being so harsh about the bottle. Even though a lot of AP mama's say "we understand" I still get those "uh huh, sure..." looks.

My question to all the adoptive mama's here that don't have bio children, has this ever happened to you? HOw do you handle it? How do you try to explain to mothers with bio kids that formula is our ONLY option? Am I just too sensitive about this? Are you too sensitive about this? LOL! Please tell me I'm not alone. I have posted similar questions on a couple of other boards I frequent (not on MDC), but nobody really says much. THey just throw out the "big hugs" or "hang in there's". Thanks!

[DeannaK]

My question to all the adoptive mama's here that don't have bio children, has this ever happened to you?

Yep! I mourn not being able to breast feed my son or give birth to HIM. I don't want a different child I just wish I could have made and born him.

How do you handle it?

I think you just handle it. Vent to your DP when you can. I know my hubby was super supportive of me and my attempt to breast feed. He's understanding when it comes being upset with infertility issues. He gets it, which helps a lot!

How do you try to explain to mothers with bio kids that formula is our ONLY option?

Why bother explaining! If someone gives you a bad time, just say, "I tried inducing lactation...it didn't work". Then they'll ask why and you can say because my child is adopted. Normally that shuts them up.

Am I just too sensitive about this? Are you too sensitive about this?

I don't think we are too sensative, we just are what we are. I am dissapointed in not being able to provide my son with breast milk. I'm also dissapointed I didn't get to carry him in my womb. But I'm so thanful for what I do have that I don't dwell on what I don't have.

For baby #2 we are going to try IVF (we didn't the first time TTC). Hopefully I can have those experiences with the next child. But it won't make the next child any more or less mine than my beautiful Ds, Jake!

[Diane B]

Originally Posted by BCFD

My question to all the adoptive mama's here that don't have bio children, has this ever happened to you? HOw do you handle it? How do you try to explain to mothers with bio kids that formula is our ONLY option? Am I just too sensitive about this? Are you too sensitive about this? LOL! Please tell me I'm not alone. I have posted similar questions on a couple of other boards I frequent (not on MDC), but nobody really says much. THey just throw out the "big hugs" or "hang in there's". Thanks!

OK, I'll take a shot at this. First of all, I think it helps to remember that by the time your children are toddlers and older, this will be a moot point. Even by age 2, most extended-breastfed children are not breastfed in public anymore - maybe before bedtime or naptime - so it really stops coming up so much. Also, I have noticed that after about a year, people do stop yammering on endlessly about their pregnancies and births and are more interested in talking about the challenges of parenting toddlers! So please know there's light at the end of the tunnel on this one.

Secondly, I ran into a lot of negative opinions on MDC about formula and it made me really cranky for a while. Once I actually was feeding my daughter, the whole process was so bonding and lovely that I really did figure people just didn't know what the heck they were talking about. It also helps that my daughter is one of the healthiest children I've ever met - her immune system is amazing, she hardly ever gets sick, etc. I think I also didn't get comments because my daughter is obviously adopted.

The only time I feel angry is when I hear about good moms like you getting crap from people for formula-feeding. Is starvation a better alternative? I will say that I didn't bend over backwards to search out "AP" focused mom groups due to my unwillingness to go through some of what you mentioned. I have developed friendships with other adoptive parents, maintained relationships with friends I already have who have kids, and now that my daughter is older, we are connecting with other families at our day care - but since almost no one is still nursing at the ages our kids are, it's no longer an issue.

[BCFD]

Love the comments!! Diane, you are absolutely right. I actually have been posting on some of the MDC boards here and when I hear the FF stuff it really just gets on my nerves. Your advice is great! Thanks to both of you for commenting!!

I do think there is a light at the end of the tunnel. And I will NEVER join another AP moms group. In fact, I am no longer reading some of the other boards on MDC. It's really hard to find out where you fit in sometimes. I mean, even MDC has a birth stories sub board, but where is the adoption stories sub board? All the bf'ing and birthing smilies, but not ONE for adoption? It's just little things like that that really make me angry and then in the end I get really hurt by it. Maybe Mothering Mag and MDC really just aren't the right boards for me. But I do love this board.

[Laurel]

I haven't gone through IVF, but I did have 7 years of infertility before adopting our son 4 years ago.

I never thought in terms of "my biological child" either. "Blood" connection has no importance to me whatsoever, and was never an issue when it came to deciding to adopt. Being able to see mine and dh's faces reflected in a child was something that would have been nice (in a curious sort of way), but it was pretty far down on my list of things that were important to me.

However, certain experiences have been hard to lose. Pregnancy and birth were two of those, though I left those behind years ago and am fine with that. The adoption process and the actual placement experiences I've had were both very difficult and very "special" in a spiritual sort of way, so I feel like I've had the difficult journey to get my children (which I think builds bonds) and also the sweet experiences associated with meeting them and their birthmothers for the first time. To me, those have been pregnancies and births of sorts.

Breastfeeding has been a very emotional issue. I am currently bf'ing my dd, but am making very little milk. Even though I am a nursing mother, I often don't feel like one. Seriously, I feel like an imposter or a fake. I haven't had your experience with other AP moms in real life. Actually, everyone is thrilled for me and when I say I am making almost no milk, they go on and on telling me how amazing it is that I am even making anything. It doesn't help me feel better, not when I can see that they are providing everything their baby needs and I am not. Part of me wants to go to LLL, but I am embarrassed to be using a lact-aid filled with formula and then to subject myself to all the sort of talk that you mentioned in your OP. I have had several opportunities to get together with AP mom groups, but I resist because I'm afraid I will feel out of place and that they won't understand the reality of my life. My bf'ing experience is so different from theirs.

I think as far as bonding and adoption, you can't understand what you haven't experienced. I don't know if any of you followed that Angelina Jolie thread in TAO a few weeks ago or not, but it just made clear to me that people who have only followed one path to their children and one path to bonding with them just don't understand that there can be other ways that are just as strong. Even if certain avenues, like breastfeeding, are powerful experiences, there are other experiences that can be just as powerful. Sure, pregnancy provides the opportunity to feel the baby kick, and then the physical experience of birth follows, and there are hormones along the way to help things out. But I think most adoptive parents are primed to bond with their children because of all the things they've experienced on the way too. I always say that a physical pregnancy is characterized by the presence of one's child, but an adoptive "pregnancy" is characterized by the absence of your child. That absence is a very powerful, life-altering thing!

I think that even with bio parents, there's a lot more emotional and psychological stuff going on underneath that they aren't aware of, because they are so focused on the biological part of it. I have always believed that the mother-child bond was primarily a spiritual thing. (I hope that comment doesn't offend anyone, that is just my belief....there is more to it than just the physical, even when it's a bio bond.) A friend told me that she read a study that found that adoptive moms with Post Adoption Depression had hormone levels similar to post-partum women. Another friend told me that with her second dd (adopted), whenever her dd would cry, she would have such a physical reaction within herself that she swore if she could lactate she would have been leaking milk. I once saw a news show on TV where a study was done that showed that when people daydreamed, their brains processed the daydreams as though they were actual events. So anyway, I just don't buy a lot of the argument that bonding is all about biology and the functions that accompany it. There is more to it! There are connections between the mind and body that we don't understand.

For me, it has helped to deal with others by being assertive, standing up for myself, and correcting people (like my friend who is 8 months pg who keeps telling me I did it the "easy" way). I am not as sensitive as I used to be, at least not about bf'ing. I'm not sure what changed....maybe it was just seeing my ds grow up so bonded. He and I have a really close relationship, and he is a child who needs a lot of touch, so it's obvious to me that you can have that kind of closeness without having bf'd.

Not sure if this helps at all. I think I rambled a little bit.

[blessed]

I honestly don't think much about pregnancy, birth or breastfeeding. For me, it's all about trying to protect dd from experiencing sadness or grief - or at least to the degree that I can soften it for her.

The first time I talked to dd about pregnancy we were reading a book with a pregnant character. I said 'look honey! There's a baby growing in this mama's belly. Soon the baby will be born." Dd mulled over the idea for a moment, then suddenly turned to look up at me, reached to put her hand on my stomach, saying "I grow in your belly, mama?" in this excited, hopeful voice . I said "no sweetheart. You grew in a different belly. But you grew in my HEART, and you live there still" and hugged her. She's used to that phrase because, from the moment we first met, I wear a locket around my neck with her picture inside.

My sweet, sweet girl.

It's clear that she remembers parts of her first year and has a sense of sadness and loss about it. I just wish I could somehow grant her an uneventful, pain free childhood, one that didn't leave her with questions and doubt. But obviously she and I have to deal with the cards that life has dealt.

I guess that's really my only concern about the early childhood experiences - worrying about her sense of loss, rather than my own.

[queencarr]

If it helps, I have a 19m old that is adopted as well as an 8 yo that is bio, and I did bf him, and the comments still sting. I did attempt to bf my adopted child, and we actually did with the Lact-Aid/formula (I had a few drops of milk) for about 2w, but then he got teeth early and I couldn't break him from biting and teach him to nurse at the same time. I did miss having the experience with him, but most of all I found that I had to find way to proactively create that bond instead of just waiting for it to happen, and other AP mama's (mainly on here, as I don't have any AP mama's locally IRL) sometimes don't get that. The experience of formula feeding did reinforce my feelings of "why would anyone do this intentionally when they have another, easier choice". It was a lot of work and $$$! Something that I did a long time ago, was to assume every woman I saw with a bottle was feeding an adopted baby/had a particular reason that made it necessary (that still sounds more judgemental than I mean it to be, but I hope you know what I mean). It freed me from thinking that I had the responsibility of deciding for another person what decision they should make and silenced that inner judge.

Having said all that, it was extremey wierd to bottle feed my baby. My bio child was a preemie, so I pumped and bottle fed for 5m, but it was a very different experience. I usually had dh buy the formula because I secretly felt judged every time I checked out and at our baby shower, we asked for formula, since we had baby gear and that was what we really needed, so that was really strange, too. But in my case, I don't think I was really being judged IRL, it was my own feelings that interfered. To have others be so insensitive as you had would have upset me very much, too. I am really sorry they were so self rightious. If you haven't read the feeding your adopted baby sticky at the top of the forum, there is a very well crafted note to posters about how we came to our feeding decisions and choices, and criticism is not allowed in this forum, and we are allowed to talk about ff openly.

Not sure if this really has anything to do with your questions, but wanted to at least commiserate with you

[Starr]

I admit to have gone a little crazy and become defensive against all the negative FF stories here. I do think people don't realize that it isn't a choice. That and for me personally even if I did BF, when DD arrived she wanted her bottle propped and didn't want the physical closeness. It took a long time for her to get comfortable with me and let me feed her. If I would have forced on nursing I see it doing more harm than good. Just try to remember that they have never been in your shoes or position and it might be easy for them to saysomething without ever having gone through it.

[thismama]

I'm not an adoptive mama, but wanted to weigh in if that's okay. My bff and another friend were both unable to bf their children, and both had huge feelings about that when their children were infants. But as the kiddos have grown, both say it is now a non-issue for them.

As a mama who is bf'ing a 3 year old, I see both sides of this. It is nice to talk with other bf'ing mamas about how nice it can be, becoz there are a lot of cultural obstacles and cultural disapproval of bf'ing. Sometimes I find myself talking about this in front of ff mamas without thinking about it. Then I stfu, but sometimes I have been clueless for a few minutes already.

I also suspect that bf'ing is overrated among bf'ing mamas as a tool of bonding. My bff bottlenursed her son, and I really don't see any differences between that and nursing. Her son always was fascinated when I nursed my daughter, and my daughter was always fascinated by his bottles. Grass is greener, I suppose. Both were held closely and nourished by their mamas. I think nursing where possible is a really important thing, becoz yeah it's better nourishment and I think it's important culturally to re-centre the social conception of the mama/baby bond, but on an *individual* level I don't think it has to play a significant role in individual mama and babe relationships.

[pumpkingirl71]

Originally Posted by BCFD

Maybe Mothering Mag and MDC really just aren't the right boards for me. But I do love this board.

Most days I feel like this part of MDC is the only part that is for me! I am very proud that I had a letter to the editor published in Mothering about meanness to formula feeding moms. It was before I adopted my daughter. I was also unable to breastfeed my son, so some days I feel like I got left out twice. When I wrote the letter, I asked if Mother would consider doing an article on AP moms who were unable to breastfeed. I gave a list of readers who would benefit, but they edited adoptive moms out. I am really not sure why they would do that...

But really, I think much of the information that gets passed around MDC about breastfeeding is flawed because it is based on this goddess mother idea, but dressed up as science. I am so all about deifying motherhood, but motherhood is a million other things besides breastmilk. When people get all nasyt about formula being poison, I wonder if it is because they are lacking in other areas of motherhood and they have to make themselves feel better.

Now that my children are two, I almost never think aobut my loss. But I admit that I want to have another biological child and I wonder if this is why.

[BCFD]

Laurel, your post brought me to tears. I just want to say thank you for those beautiful words. If you don't mind I may even copy and paste them on my blog so that I will forever be able to read that and feel so much better about this situation. Thank you everybody. You are all incredibly mothers and I am so glad I have this board to come to. There are so many words of wisdom here. Again, thank you! You all have made me feel so much better today!

[Sarahbunny]

Originally Posted by BCFD

My question to all the adoptive mama's here that don't have bio children, has this ever happened to you? HOw do you handle it? How do you try to explain to mothers with bio kids that formula is our ONLY option? Am I just too sensitive about this? Are you too sensitive about this? LOL! Please tell me I'm not alone. I have posted similar questions on a couple of other boards I frequent (not on MDC), but nobody really says much. THey just throw out the "big hugs" or "hang in there's". Thanks!

We did 8 rounds of artificial insemination and 2 rounds of ivf, without success the entire time. Never one pregnancy! And that was with donor sperm, as my dh is sterile (unknown cause). Clearly, I am infertile as well, after all that and never conceiving. So, we knew our baby wouldn't be biologically OURS anyway. Which didn't bother us, as we were both adopted anyway. that's a little backstory to let you know where we were coming from.

As far as people being unsupportive of formula fed babies, yes, you do hear it often. And some people are kind of...jerks, shall we say? On both sides of it. I don't explain anything to anyone about why we formula feed. I really don't think it is their business, to be honest. Most people, when they realize that dd is adopted, don't bother asking about bf to us. Now, dh's aunt did ask if we knew we could induce lactation - she is VERY pro bf. And we knew we could, but to be honest, that doesn't really interest me. I know bf is a great choice if it IS a choice, and I encourage mama's that i know to bf for as long as they can. But - frankly everyone that I know that I brought inducing lactation up to was disgusted by the idea, which totally angered me and irritated me, but what can you do? So maybe I have had a opposite reaction, with people being horrified by the idea of a adoptive mama breastfeeding. Humph. I guess I think that people do what is right for their families and everyone else should just myob, know what i mean?

I will say my mom is vehemently against bf no matter what the situation. So, then I sort of do want to try to induce with the next baby, just to irritate her.

I think each family is going to be sensitive to some issue or another. The ff vs bf isn't my issue, i guess. Now...people comparing my daughter to a concrete driveway they had put in, with regards to how expensive things are, totally puts a bee in my bonnet. That is a issue that I get REALLY upset with, or really anyone saying anything about "buying babies". :

If I start to get too irritated with the group that I am hanging out with, I switch groups. Is that a option for you? If you dont feel supported with the friends you have made, or feel like they are purposefully hurting your feelings or making digs, then maybe look for another playgroup?

I wish mamas would lay off the ff vs bf wars. Really, different things work for different families and I personally don't think there is much of a difference between formula fed and breast fed babies. :

[Sarahbunny]

Originally Posted by BCFD

They were always very supportive of me, but I always got those, "you poor sad mother..you'll never know what it's like to nurse your child or sustain her life from the milk of your breasts" looks.

Oh, and I had to add...if someone said something to me regarding sustaining my dd's life with the milk of my breasts or anything lke that, I would probably die laughing at them. I think that is hilarious and just too dramatic. In fact, I am laughing at the whole idea right now.

[fenwickmama]

Originally Posted by Laurel

But I think most adoptive parents are primed to bond with their children because of all the things they've experienced on the way too. I always say that a physical pregnancy is characterized by the presence of one's child, but an adoptive "pregnancy" is characterized by the absence of your child. That absence is a very powerful, life-altering thing!

well said!

(and i have one bio son, one adopted-both happened at the same time for those not already familiar with our story). i am bf bio son (ds2) and pumped for ds1 for about a month-then we moved in with family and lost all privacy, he popped out a mouthful of teeth, developed lactose intolerance and essentially life got in the way of my intentions but we are still VERY bonded!

anyway, no words of wisdom, especially since bf'ing my son-hope it doesn't offend you that i chimed in a little...

oh and i agree about needing a place for adoption stories and an adoption smiley or ribbon thingy...

kel

[hhurd]

Originally Posted by Sarahbunny

...and I personally don't think there is much of a difference between formula fed and breast fed babies. :

You mean bf babies can't leap tall buildings in a single bound???

[Diane B]

*

[lauren]

I am amazed at the words and experiences you are all sharing. I am so glad that the Adoption forum is here for those who feel most comfortable here.

It is early so I haven't had coffee yet, but I want to post a gentle reminder to be mindful of UA #1 and 8 when discussing this. I realize no one is intentionally trying to be sarcastic and criticize, and there have been some deep hurts around this issue. Q&A can be a good place to raise direct suggestions for how to address this issue around MDC. Thanks. PM me if you have questions.

[EFmom]

I went through some IF work-ups and did a couple of cycles of Clomid. But we jumped off the IF bandwagon pretty quickly and went on to adoption. The whole pregnancy thing was never important to me--I wanted to parent.

I don't really seek out AP folks for friendships. Most of my really close friends are parents through adoption, too. I do find some of the religious anti-formula zeal here a bit offensive sometimes, but I try to let it roll off my back as much as possible. I tend to be pretty thick skinned about a lot of things.

The way I view it, bonding with adopted children, especially if they aren't tiny infants when they are adopted, takes a different bag of tricks. I choose to think that really being AP is less about which of those tricks you use, and more about listening to your child and responding to what he or she needs to be comforted, happy and nurtured. So, I have done some things that would and have earned me a rap on the knuckles from the AP police, but were genuinely what my kids needed at the time. I would do those things again in a heartbeat.

I didn't try adoptive bf. For those that have tried it, I think that's great. For my kids, who were about a year at the time they were adopted, it would have been a barrier to bonding, rather than a help. I have gotten nastygrams about that, but I'm confident enough in my abilities to parent my children that it didn't bother me.

Oh, and I had to add...if someone said something to me regarding sustaining my dd's life with the milk of my breasts or anything lke that, I would probably die laughing at them.

Me, too. I must not have much of the earth-mother or the poet in me.

[Buddhamom]

Well let me start by saying I am sorry you are hurting!!!!! I am a Mom who has given birth and adopted and breastfed ALL three! I am also a Mom that went through years of infertility which sucks. Have you considered just comfort nursing even if you don't produce anything? I mean if you want nurse and don't care about them not getting milk you can do that. I am NOT saying you can only bond by nursing either, I just got the impression you would like to nurse (?) and wanted to let you know that a LOT of Moms just do comfort nursing.

[RasJane]

I too have a bio and adopted. We decided to adopt after being diagnosed with 2ndary infertility. It did not bother me to not be pregnant again, although I would love to be, but I missed bf. I did try to induce and used the Lact-Aid. I too felt afraid (?) to go to LLL meetings with formula flowing through those plastic tubes.
I used to be very anti-big formula. And I think I still am in some ways. What I wish is that people would take their passion for formula hate and direct it in a positive way. Why can't we get accross to formula companies that there are better options for ingredients than high fructose corn syrup for example. Maybe if it was made clear that we could all work together instead of fight there would be more positive outcomes.
I also agree with a pp that if I learned anything about bf from this experience of adoptive bf, it is definitely that it is madness to choose bottles for "convenience"!! Holy Cow, I have never expended so much energy in feeding anyone! And my older ds has multiple food allergies!
As for an answer to the op's questions, I never had too much problem because ds is very obviously adopted. I do feel sad sometimes that I didn't get to give birth to him and nurse him with lots of fresh mama milk. But I spend lots of time feeding him all cuddled up with a big ol' bottle. I carried his teeny body in a sling all day. I held him and looked into his eyes and got to know him. I think he is one of the most amazing things I have ever been a part of. I don't think it would have been changed much by nursing or not nursing.
Sooooo, cuddle that angel. Play and enjoy and find a new group of friends. Very soon you will be much more concerned with how to keep a pantry stocked enough to keep your children fed than how to actually provide that food!