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Did Feminism Go Too Far? - Page 3

post #41 of 602
I'm not sure if feminism has gone far enough! I haven't read the whole thread yet, so maybe someone else has brought this up. I think a big part f the problem now with people expecting that women will go back to work right away is that the work that women do in the home, nurturing and raising children, creating a peacful place for the family to live, feeding the family and so on is still not valued as realy work. IMO the feminist revolution won't be over, women won't truly be valued as equil to men, until women's work is valued as equil to men's.
post #42 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy and Cheerful View Post
Does anyone have any recommendations for good books they've read on the subject of motherhood and feminism? Or SAHMism and feminism?

Thanks!
I really like Mother Outlaws by Andrea O'Reilly. Also, the Association for Research on Mothering (York University) has a lot of info on the topic.
post #43 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by lolalola View Post
I really like Mother Outlaws by Andrea O'Reilly. Also, the Association for Research on Mothering (York University) has a lot of info on the topic.
Thank you! I'll look into your recommendations.
post #44 of 602
Throwing in my .02 before this thing gets pulled.

I think feminism has gone off track from its origins. I think if organizations like NOW are REALLY going to support womens' choices and rights, then they need to stand up for women who CHOOSE to have their babies and support those womens' birth choices. No one should have to be scared that someone is going to take their baby away because they chose to give birth to it in their living room. But NOW doesn't support those things. NOW also needs to stand up and support breastfeeding mothers and put an end to the harassment and shame some mothers encounter just for nourishing their child on a park bench. To me, these things are serious womens issues and I feel they are being overlooked.

I agree with a pp who said that consumerism is largely to blame for our country's problems. People in a nation as wealthy as ours have always been about gimme gimme gimme, "gotta have", I want something bigger, better, faster, etc...Just look at the popularity of big screen TV's and SUV's. We are NEVER satisfied. Feminism has nothing to do with that.
post #45 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mama Poot View Post
Throwing in my .02 before this thing gets pulled.

I think feminism has gone off track from its origins. I think if organizations like NOW are REALLY going to support womens' choices and rights, then they need to stand up for women who CHOOSE to have their babies and support those womens' birth choices. No one should have to be scared that someone is going to take their baby away because they chose to give birth to it in their living room. But NOW doesn't support those things. NOW also needs to stand up and support breastfeeding mothers and put an end to the harassment and shame some mothers encounter just for nourishing their child on a park bench. To me, these things are serious womens issues and I feel they are being overlooked.
Does NOW have positions against home birth? I wasn't aware of this. I will look into it. Does anyone have information on whether NOW has a home birth policy, either pro or anti?

Also, does NOW not advocate for breastfeeding laws?

Also, feminism is larger than NOW. NOW is just one organization.

And membership on the NOW board changes as new women come and I'm assuming membership also drives the policy issues. So, maybe that is a reason moms should consider being feminists and be proud of that fact!

post #46 of 602
Ok I am returning this thread

Please keep the UA in mind when posting.
post #47 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kimmiepie View Post
I think that once you become a mom you should put your dreams/goals second to your family. :

You know that feminism hasn't gone far enough when you are still only saying this about mothers and not also about fathers.
post #48 of 602
No I don't believe feminism has gone far enough.

I think if a woman or a man wants to stay home with their children, our society should be supportive of that. Truly supportive along the lines of the MOther's Manifesto in Naomi Wolf's Manifesto. If a parent wants to work, they should have flex time, quality day care near their work or on site, etc.
post #49 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_lissa View Post
No I don't believe feminism has gone far enough.

I think if a woman or a man wants to stay home with their children, our society should be supportive of that. Truly supportive along the lines of the MOther's Manifesto in Naomi Wolf's Manifesto. If a parent wants to work, they should have flex time, quality day care near their work or on site, etc.

Martha Fineman's book The Autonomy Myth is excellent in this regard.
post #50 of 602
I don't feel that it's *my* place to be in the home. I do feel that our kids need a parent at home and not be put in daycare, to me it doesn't matter who it is. DH use to SAH and soon he will again. When we both had to work to make ends meet I worked the weekends so one of us was always home.
post #51 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy and Cheerful View Post
Does anyone have any recommendations for good books they've read on the subject of motherhood and feminism? Or SAHMism and feminism?

Thanks!
Anne Crittendon's The Price of Motherhood. Also, more recently, her book If You've Raised Children, You Can Manage Anything (or something like that).
post #52 of 602
I like that I have the choice to work or stay home.
I know that some feminists think it's wrong to be a stay at home mom, that feminism fought for the right to work and by staying home we are doing all women a disservice.
I don't think that way and I consider myself a feminist (ie, equal rights). I see how much my daughter needs me and I love being able to stay home and take care of her and raise her to be a confident woman. I think feminism has done wonderful things for women and I'm so glad to have the choice to either work or stay home.
Feminism means different things to different people.
post #53 of 602
Quote:
Also, the Association for Research on Mothering (York University) has a lot of info on the topic.
I just wanted to add that this is a fantastic publication.

So is 'The Mommy Myth' and 'Fruitful: A Real Mother in the Modern World' by Anne Roiphe.

Anyway, really enjoying the discussion here! :
post #54 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by eviesingleton View Post
You know that feminism hasn't gone far enough when you are still only saying this about mothers and not also about fathers.
Excellent point.
post #55 of 602

The Winter issue of Ms. Magazine has an article...

...with a banner on "Moms Jobs and Bias" on the cover. Haven't read the article, but if it's in Ms., well, I'm biased. I love Ms. Even if the article is OT to this thread, I still refer you to Ms. for education.

http://msmagazine.com/store/detail.aspx?ID=29



It is clear that many people are not at all clear what feminism is... if you know what it is, you know the well-meant question here is misdirected, and this is a common occurance, so don't feel badly anyone. If you think that this question makes sense, you don't know what feminism is and you really don't have any idea about the history of women in even just the U.S. I don't mean this as an insult. I mean, I'm about to cry that women in today's world can be so ill-informed about something so pro-YOU.

Feminism is many, many things, but certainly, it is never, ever anything that directs women to think or be anything but what they individually want to think and be, whether SAHM, working mom, single mom, married mom, corporate wife, CEO, childless, lesbian, whatever. Our choice. It does not promote ANY lifestyle over another. Perhaps some people who also call themselves feminists occasionally spout things, that the media jumps on, but it is not "feminism" talking. It is an individual talking, and, feminism supports her right to do so.

"Born for Liberty" is a great college text where you can get started with a history of women in the US (I had a class in 1991 or 2 using it). It's a rich and wonderful history that we were all robbed pretty completely of in our public educations.

VF
post #56 of 602
Sorry, I forgot about this thread, I really need to start subbing

I do know I've heard several men throughout my life give a sarcastic comment along the lines of "I don't dare open another door for a woman, she'll give me a dirty look and snarl that she can do it herself". It is more complicated then just feminism coming into the picture, yes, but it's had some definite repercussions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy and Cheerful View Post
I think it's nice when anyone holds the door for anyone else. That's being polite and displaying good manners. I think it's especially important to hold the door for people who would have a little more of a stuggle to do it themselves (i.e. people carrying heavy items, the elderly, a small child, the disabled, pregnant women (I remember who movement was restricted and how tired I was!), etc. That's not to say they can't open the door for themselves.

But, are poor manners and impoliteness really the mark of feminism?
post #57 of 602
Feminism is just assuming that women are people and can make their own choices. Working or being home are choices, not the policy of feminism.

No, feminism can't go too far. I heart feminism.
post #58 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by RiverSky View Post
I think it hasn't gone far enough, because there are still people who will post threads such as this. :
Are you old enough to remember Helen Reddy singing,

"I can bring home the bacon
Whip it up in a pan
And never, never let you forget you're a man!

What is the man doing? Nothing in this song. The woman is promising to do it all.

That was 1975.

I do not know if it is feminism or who to blame, but I know that many men expect a woman to work as long as possible, during her pregnancy, and then return to work asap. Many men think a strong, powerful woman is sexy, a real turn-on.

Witness the fact that women outnumber men now at most major universities. What are men doing? Many are waiting for a mommy to care for them.

For me, all mothers are working mothers. The hardest but most rewarding job in the world is being responsible for the raising of another human being. To expect the same woman to go out and earn a paycheck in addition to this job is too much. The mom and child suffer.

For the record, my DH stayed home when our older three children went to school, and I went to work...I worked two jobs. I, the mom, got blamed for all shortcomings in the home as my children not doing their homework, not being picked up from school, not being properly dressed for school, and getting injured and needing attention in the ER.
post #59 of 602
Quote:
Originally Posted by Happy and Cheerful View Post
Does NOW have positions against home birth? I wasn't aware of this. I will look into it. Does anyone have information on whether NOW has a home birth policy, either pro or anti?

Also, does NOW not advocate for breastfeeding laws?

Also, feminism is larger than NOW. NOW is just one organization.

And membership on the NOW board changes as new women come and I'm assuming membership also drives the policy issues. So, maybe that is a reason moms should consider being feminists and be proud of that fact!

I don't believe NOW has ANY position on home birth and related subjects. If they do someone please point me in their direction because I would love to see them.
post #60 of 602
Most babyboomer feminists have not had children, so childbirth options is not high on their focus.

While feminists focus on choices for women, childbirth is not a choice many of them have never made.

The only real improvement is the fact that midwives have become a regular choice for many women.

But the fact that many of them are "medwives" shows how limited the improvement has been and how powerful the medical profession remains. Many female obstetricians have proven to be "pelvic pirates" as much as their male counterparts have been.
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