Intrusive Thoughts

[Demeter9]

I've had post-partum, and with my second daughter I had depression starting in pregnancy too.

My son is 3 months old, and I've been actually feeling pretty good.

My PPD symptoms are irritability, rage, anxiety, aggressiveness. Oh and hypervigilance - I would awaken paniced at night trying to find my baby.

I don't have any of that. I'm not sad, or upset.

But I do keep having recurrent thoughts that my son is going to die. Not by me. Not horribly. Not some nasty scenario. Just die for no reason. I told my husband today about it.

I was pregnant for like 12 months out of 14 months in the time before he was born. I was pregnant and miscarried, - I knew the night that it happened even though it was a silent/missed miscarriage. I had to wait a month after the ultrasound for a D&C to remove the fetus. After the bleeding stopped and I had my first ovulation I got pregnant again right away. It wasn't even my first miscarriage, it is at least my second miscarriage. I am quite certain that is playing a role in the recurrent thoughts.

I don't react well to the drugs - I develop all manner of interesting side-effects from headaches, hyperhypervigilence and excitability, to flattening and explosive rage. Fabulous fun.

Has anyone here found a way to deal with this sort of recurrent thought? My son is healthy other than a cold - like SUPER healthy. He's like 28 inches and 15.5# already at 13 weeks. He's an easy going baby. He lets me sleep even (do you hear the angels singing?) So I know that what I'm feeling isn't totally rational - other than some babies really do just die.

Anyone had some success in dealing with intrusive thoughts?

[mom0810]

I'm right there with you. All I can say is, it gets better.

It's actually a form of OCD, which ties to depression. The therapist I have now is helping me with CBT and relaxation. You have to do the relaxation (meditation) in order to let your brain just "shut off" for a period of time. My problem is/was that I can't ever shut off my brain. I'm sure you know what I am talking about.

A really good book to read that might help you is STOP Obsessing, or Brain Lock. I don't know the authors off hand, sorry. Those helped me.

Trying to get daily exercise (I know, it's impossible some days) will help, too. Light every day helps, too, and eliminate caffiene and sugar (I haven't got there yet!) It's all about getting your brain to turn off and relax.

It helped to realize that the thoughts are irrational, which I know you know, but it sometimes helps to hear someone say it.

There are Cognitive Behavioral Workbooks out that can help with the depression aspect, too.

I am trying EFT this Friday, and that is supposed to really help, too.

Good luck, mommy! I know it's so hard and it's torture to have your brain do this to you. It WILL get better. You have a beautiful, healthy baby and he is going to grow up just fine!

[tsume]

Hey momma - Good for you for trusting your husband with this.

I had PPD_OCD wicked bad with my first it was horrible. Talking helped tons. Sharing my feelings, not feeling like a freak for having those thoughts, being able to release them verbally and in a journal (free form just write it all out ).

With my third I have this fear of losing her. Really have no idea why but there is some uneasyness there. Talking again has helped. In counseling I was asked if there was a physical feeling and where that was when the thoughts happened. I could feel my throat tighten and it felt like the feeling was located there. I was then asked to make a noise that sounded like that feeling and I made a high pitch fluttery tight noise.

Crazy as all that sounds it really helps. The feelings create this energy and making the noise helps to discharge some of the tension.

Sorry it's choppy - NAK

[misseks]

Try journalling. Write down all your feelings, especially when they seem to contradict. It's good to stop and process each one seperately, even if it is just long enough to write them down.

Feel better. Hugs, Mama.

[Demeter9]

huh! I would have never thought about ocd type of diagnosis. I'm don't consider myself a particularly obsessive person - okay, maybe with the phantom mouse clicking. :>

Thanks. I appreciate the suggestions. Such an odd thing - irrational thoughts.

[lolalola]

Just wanted to lend my support here.

I have totally been there. After my dd was born in '99, I began experiencing what you rightly call, irrational thoughts. They were so intrusive that at times, I couldn't leave the house. I would think about death all the time, dd's and mine...terrible!

I don't have any real advice for you as I ended up taking Zoloft for about a year. The drugs worked for me, apart from leaving me exhausted most of the time.

I did start going to the gym around that time though. The exercise probably helped, as did researching ppd, and realizing I wasn't completely nuts!

Anyway, I wish you all the best. I know how awful these thoughts can be.
Lola

[katiedidbug]

I am with you. Since DS was born, I am constantly worrying about him dying. I have recurring thoughts, some are scarier than others - believe me. Last night I even thought that this would be the last time I would see him alive as he dozed off next to me. How irrational is that? I'm scared to death of feeling like that, so I totally understand how you feel, mama.

[Demeter9]

Originally Posted by katiedidbug

I am with you. Since DS was born, I am constantly worrying about him dying. I have recurring thoughts, some are scarier than others - believe me. Last night I even thought that this would be the last time I would see him alive as he dozed off next to me. How irrational is that? I'm scared to death of feeling like that, so I totally understand how you feel, mama.

yes, exactly like that. It is ridiculous.

[mom0810]

I know, when I got the diagnosis of OCD, I was totally surprised, as you think of ocd as only being "germ" related. But it's actually about having intrusive thoughts, thoughts that you know are irrational, but can't stop having them, anyway. Then there is a certain amount of shame that comes because even though you KNOW the thoughts aren't logical, you can't stop yourself from having them.

I really suggest Brain Lock, as it helped me to see how my symptoms were really ocd and not so much GAD, which I was originally diagnosed with. Sometimes it takes a while to be properly diagnosed with OCD, as many therapists wrongly label it as GAD or depression or worse! It helps so much to know that it's OCD and that it can be fixed with Cognitve Behavioral Therapy, which is actually MORE effective than meds. (although meds AND CBT are the most effective).

I really hope you both are helped by my experience, as it took me 7 months to find the RIGHT diagnosis. I hope I can save you some time and some of the awful feelings that I know you are going through right now.

[woolywahm]

I had that too with my newborn son 7 years ago upon his birth. I would wake up anxiously, listening and feeling for his breath. I still go through spells of it. It's awful.

Now though it seems to be more about him losing me that I fear so much. And I had a dream about it recently too. Maybe moving to a new country may have started me off on it all. Up rooting myself really got me in touch with how alone we all can be, and realizing my own vulnerability/mortality.

The emotional/intuitive connection I have with my child is, for lack of a better word, genetic, in my mind, call it a 6th sense. I can't explain it very coherently, except to say that I have a protective nature or feeling around him more than I ever experienced before having a child.

I am more of a feel-it-in-my-body kind of experiencer. Where do I feel it in my body? Can I think of an earlier time when I felt this way? Talking helps me a lot, too. I am feeling a lot better these days through my work with a counselor now on healing my own childhood abandonment issues. It seems to help me find flexibility, courage and strength emotionally. And I can be for myself, the parent I needed but maybe didn't have at that time when I was little. I used to turn my nose up to anything resembling that "inner child" revolution in the psychoanalytical world, but hey, this "old horse" can still learn a few new tricks.

[mom0810]

What a wise and insightful mama you are. I know so much of what you just wrote rings true for a lot of us.

[doula mary]

As a mom of three, a doula and someone who works with breastfeeding moms...I have done a bit of a survey..and found weird thoughts to be really common. AT any given group....which might have up to 20 moms...most shared at one time or another they had weird thoughts....so, I'm convinced it is a non-studied, non-discussed phenomena..that may occur postpartum.

I definitely had them with baby # 3, thought I would drop her...walking down the stairs....

Take care, I do think this is more common than we realize.

Mary

[katiedidbug]

It's good to know I'm not that crazy and that there are other mamas out there who feel my pain!

[Chicky2]

Oh my. I've been thinking it was just me. I keep just seeing her falling, or being dropped, that sort of thing. I keep seeing my dh in a car wreck or some other accident. I sometimes lie there at night and worry that I might not wake up and my dh won't notice I'm dead when he gets up to go to work and my baby will just lie there and cry all day. I haven't told anyone because I figure it's hormonal. So I'm not nutso?

[katiedidbug]

Definitely no nutso, chicky2.

[wasabi]

Originally Posted by doula mary

As a mom of three, a doula and someone who works with breastfeeding moms...I have done a bit of a survey..and found weird thoughts to be really common. AT any given group....which might have up to 20 moms...most shared at one time or another they had weird thoughts....so, I'm convinced it is a non-studied, non-discussed phenomena..that may occur postpartum.

I definitely had them with baby # 3, thought I would drop her...walking down the stairs....

Take care, I do think this is more common than we realize.

Mary

Yes I used to worry about droppping my babies down stairs, in parking lots that kind of thing. I would hurry about them being hurt horribly. Not by me but just that bad things would happen to them. With my first I'm not sure I was all the way to PPD. I didn't feel depressed but I did have those bad intrusive thoughts. With DD#2 there was definitely PPD and this was part of it. Zoloft helped me a lot. I only got on that though when I started thinking about all the ways I wasn't going to kill myself. Like I wouldn't shoot myself because we don't have a gun and I couldn't take pills because we didn't really have any and I didn't think I would slit my wrists becuase that would probably hurt and DH would have a big mess to clean up. At a certain point I had to recognize that thinking about not killing yourself so much was probably suicidal in a different form than we normally think of.

[jennica]

Originally Posted by Demeter9

My PPD symptoms are irritability, rage, anxiety, aggressiveness. Oh and hypervigilance - I would awaken paniced at night trying to find my baby.

I know these aren't the symptoms you are experiencing this time, but to me this set of symptoms sounds like PTSD. I have PTSD, and I did experience intrusive thoughts for probably the first four months of ds's life. Did you experience something traumatic when you got the symptoms above? The birth experience, a post partum issue, a trigger of a past event? Trauma usually doesn't go away on it's own, and it could be resurfising in a new form this time around. Or I could be way off base here, I don't know, but your symptoms sounded a lot like mine and I had PTSD, and instrusive thoughts, but not OCD.

[mom0810]

Wow, I keep checking this thread because I so identify with the OP, and I have to agree with the above post, too. PTSD is also something that I am dealing with, and I wonder if that has made my tendency toward OCD even worse.

It's really hard to get the right diagnosis, because so many of these disorders are comorbid, and they also have some similar symptoms. I could buy the PTSD theory, though. Totally.

I had a VERY traumatic birth experience, to the point of if I see those striped hospital baby blankets, I cry and freak out. I get really scared and upset. Same thing if I think about the hospital, or having another baby. Perhaps that is where my OCD started... as a result of the PTSD?

I don't know... we are all in this together and I wish the best for all of you!

[Demeter9]

Originally Posted by jennica

I know these aren't the symptoms you are experiencing this time, but to me this set of symptoms sounds like PTSD. I have PTSD, and I did experience intrusive thoughts for probably the first four months of ds's life. Did you experience something traumatic when you got the symptoms above? The birth experience, a post partum issue, a trigger of a past event? Trauma usually doesn't go away on it's own, and it could be resurfising in a new form this time around. Or I could be way off base here, I don't know, but your symptoms sounded a lot like mine and I had PTSD, and instrusive thoughts, but not OCD.

I got married while I was pregnant to my husband. The experience of all the new things probably would have been enough to trigger past traumas. My childhood has enough of them that it would be hard to tease one out as being the resurfaced one.

The likelihood of my having undiagnosed PTSD is high. I do not hide my past, but I am a pretty together kind of person so most people would not suspect even professionals. I can delay an anxiety attack and look like nothing at all is happening and interact with people while it is happening for example. Even *I* was not aware that it was anxiety attacks for a long time.

[Surviving]

My baby is 7 months old and I still worry about something happening to him. I can't even walk through a doorway without worrying about his head hitting the door frame. It seems to have gotten worse with each baby.