Should I live where you live??

[mackysmama]

I'm a New Yorker at heart but have lived in Houston, Texas for the last 13 years. My partner and I are planning on moving back to the northeast/new england area. We are trying to find the "perfect place" for our family and we'll job search once we have a destination (or a few places to choose from). So, I am starting to research places for us and I'm asking for your help. Do you live in a great place and do you think it would be great for me? Do you know of a place that would be great? Here's what our "utopia" would look like.

State civil unions or marriage for same-sex couples OR a very liberal area where it will be easy to find a job with domestic partner benefits.

A small city or suburb of a larger city. We want diversity, especially an area where our children will see families like their own (same sex parents) and where we can find a community of families that share our AP parenting values. Size wise, we're thinking an area like Burlington, VT or Ithaca, NY, as examples. But, we'd also consider suburbs or larger cities like Boston. Think crunchy.

Affordable housing. By this, we mean we would be able to purchase a house (1500 sf or more) in a nice, safe, cozy, liberal neighborhood for about $200,000 (we'd prefer less, of course, and might be able to swing a bit more).

Good job market and reasonable cost of living. We want to be able to continue to live on one income. My partner works in non-profit so we need an area that pays well and has good support for social service work.

Good schools. Either VERY good public schools or a selection of affordable private schools with a montessori or waldorf focus.

Beauty. We want our kids to play outside in nature. We want parks and playgrounds and green space and mountains and lakes. I have visions of my kids playing in our backyard with the neighborhood kids and riding their bikes through the safe streets.

Okay, does this place exist? Do you know where it is?

[TheGirls]

Well, I lived in Pittsfield, MA for awhile. The area is liberal, for sure, with gay marriage because it's in MA. In Pittsfield (a very small city), housing would be around what you're looking for. I have no clue about the schools, I know there are private schools, but I don't know what the quality situation is (no kids yet). Job market is weak though, and the city itself is not too attractive, though there are plenty of playgrounds, parks, lakes, and mountains nearby. Smaller side streets are often filled with kids biking or otherwise playing. If you widened the search a bit to the rest of the Berkshires, you could probably find places that fit all your criteria.

I also know people in Albany, NY and it has more employment options, though it is less crunchy. It's a much bigger city, so it has more options for everything really. No domestic partner laws yet, though. I don't know the neighborhoods well enough to recommend anything specific, either.

I grew up near Burlington, and that seems like it would have everything on your list, except maybe housing within your price range... It's hard to get crunchier than Burlington (one of my favorite cities).

[ima2simcha]

We're looking for the same area I think! Though we currently live in Olympia WA which is very crunchy and ap friendly and we have been really happy here we are wanting to move to the east coast to be close to family. We are looking at the Northampton, MA area which is a bit expensive on housing it seems unless you get out of town a bit but has much of the rest of what you are looking for I think. I'd love to hear what you know about Ithaca though - we didn't really look there when we were researching areas but it's closer to our families. I think though that we will end up in Northampton or near by.

I hope that helps! When are you planning your move? I suppose it depends on jobs and such. I am going to start job hunting in the late summer with the hope of selling our home and moving by late november/early december of this year. Good Luck!

Juli

[mackysmama]

Thanks! Yes, we are interested in Northhampton but the cost of living and housing is very intimidating! I'll look into Pittsfield.

I can't do Albany - that's where I grew up and where my family lives. I want to be closer but not THAT close I do love the area, though - it's beautiful and just about the size we're looking for.

[canadianchick]

We live in Bangor, Maine and love it. It's a small city. The gay population is small but the city itself, I feel, is very welcoming. I have friends who have put their partners on their health plan. It's very acceptable. We belong to the UU church and that is a very gay friendly atmosohere. Not sure about buying a house because I rent. Schools are ok, but I have nothing to compare it to as we have only lived here since dd started school. There are a couple of private schools however. What type of work would you be looking for? And as far a beautiful... The coast is less than an hour away and it is, without a doubt, the most amazing place on earth. If you are interested, I can put together some pics for you and send you a link.

[bookwormommy]

I was going to suggest Olympia, WA except you're looking for NE, but then I saw you'd also posted on the NW forum looking for suggestions. WA doesn't have state civil unions, though, but is a pretty fantastic place to live.

I live in Seattle, but maybe the PP from Olympia could speak to quality of life there. My impression is it's gay-friendly, very crunchy, and more affordable than Seattle.

Good luck with your search!

[gargirl]

Hi, I need to admit that I am not a lesbian mom, I just saw the thread and wanted to say that I live in a very liberal area and have been a "domestic partner" and gotten benefits for me and my kids through my then BF. We lived in Amherts at the time and he worked in Northampton.

Those 2 towns are EXPENSIVE. We live out in the hills now where it is cheaper. You might want to look into living near Northamton but not in it. Housing gets cheaper if you go a few towns out and it is nice to be near a great place like that. There are some towns that are becoming quite nice like Eashampton, cheaper than Noho but next door or you can move all the way to Heath, like us. We got a 3 bedroom house out here for... less than $120,000.

Just my 2 cents, sorry if I am butting in. I may not be gay, but I am very liberal and totally in favor of benefits and rights for all couples. Just wanted to let you know that lots of folks in my area feel that way.

Good luck to you and yours!

[mackysmama]

Thanks everyone. Gargirl - thanks for responding. I posted this thread ALL over MDC to get as many replies as possible.

Right now, I think we are looking at Oregon, Mass, and VT. I am really concerned about housing costs. Houston is VERY affordable. We live in the city limits, though not in the "inner loop" but within the "outer loop" and have a 3 br/2 bath 2000 sf house. We bought for about 170K and will sell for about 200K, 215K if we're lucky. That's the thing about Houston - it is full of people who never meant to live here long term but the cost of living keeps us here.

Northhampton sounds perfect for us, but the housing! How far outside of the city would we need to go to get a nice house for $200K. How long of a commute would my partner have?

[mishmish]

Hi. I'm a quiet lurker, but your thread intrigued me because I have lived in most of the places you have listed. I would also recommend the Northampton/Pioneer Valley area. If you are currently living in Houston be comfortable with, IMHO, the fact that what you feel is a long drive and what New Englanders would feel is a long drive is very different. I learned that my first year in Northampton when people would balk at a 1-1 1/2 hour drive to visit or tour something because they felt it was way to far to go without mush advance planning. I had just come from Arkansas where a quick trip into town was a minimum 1 hour round trip. You could easily find some very affordable housing options just 15 to 25 minutes out of town. I have friends in Florence, Goshen, Sunderland, Easthampton, South Hadley and Belchertown that all commute into Northampton without any real issues. I absolutely love the area and can't wait to move back one day. I'm currently in Providence, RI and travel out there at least once a month. Rhode Island is actually a great place as well and the laws seem like they may be changing for the better. There is a strong community and outside of Providence it seems that housing prices are still pretty decent. I don't know what your partner does but there are good job options both in Providence and in Boston which is a long, but easy and doable commute by train.

I don't know where in Oregon you are considering, but I lived in Eugene for 3 years. While it is an nice community it was not the "Northampton of the west coast" that people described it as before we moved out there. I did find it a mostly welcoming community, but did not feel the same acceptance in Springfield, which is just next door. I always got the feeling that you really had to watch yourself for safety anywhere outside of the Eugene, Portland and Corvallis. One thing that I do miss about Oregon is how much cheaper it was to live there than here.

good luck and PM me if you want any more details from my experience.

[mama2rey]

I live in the MW-near Chicago but I want to make a plug for Oak Park, IL. I love it here. The schools are great, there is a domestic partner registry-and second parent adoption. Oak Park has tons of queer people and so there are lots of same sex parents. We are right outside Chicago, so you are about 15 minutes away from downtown.

The only downside to Oak Park is the property taxes, and the home prices. However, my partner and I bought a house that needed a little work and only paid 200,000. Many folks are going to Berwyn which is just south of OP and developing a HUGE queer community. The average price for a single family home there is 249,000.

[gargirl]

Well, we are about 1 hour maybe 1 hour and 15 mins tops, from Northampton and we have a 3 bedroom house with one bath, big yard etc, for 117K. We are in Heath, a town of about 900, but there are larger, cooler towns closer in where houses are still reasonable. Greenfield isn't my favorite town but it is pretty cheap and only 30 mins from Noho. There were plenty of houses there around $130K - $200K when we were looking 3 years ago. I wanted to live somewhere smaller and have a huge yard though, so we are here.

[FtMPapa]

Northampton!

Lots of people have suggested Northampton, MA already, and I quickly skimmed before butting in with my two cents.

I have tonnes of friends in NoHo and I'm thinking about moving there myself, from Toronto, Canada, but it's kind of up in the air at the moment. I love NoHo and area, but the employment market is, um, bad. Really bad.

Housing is expensive for a town of its size in NoHo and Amherst, but if you go about ten minutes from downtown NoHo to Florence or even slightly beyond, it gets much cheaper, quickly. Same thing just outside Amherst, toward Belchertown or Sunderland.

Easthampton is similarly cheap, and Greenfield, though Greenfield is a bit of a jaunt down the interstate from NoHo - about 30 minutes if I remember right.

Good luck!

[FtMPapa]

Oh, and...

It seems to me like there are lots of social service agencies and a large non-profit and educational sector in NoHo/Amherst/Holyoke/etc area. Also, nobody bats an eyelash at queer families there - it seems like most of the town is queer, including lots 'n lots of transfolk.

If you really want the scoop on NoHo, read the book Hometown by Tracy Kidder (I think) it's just like being there, but a lot cheaper than visiting.

[mackysmama]

No one has mentioned New Hampshire. What's up with that state? Liberal? Affordable? Crunchy?

[kands]

x

[lexbeach]

While surely there must be some cool towns in NH (Keene seems to be all right), in general I think of it as a fairly scary state, politically. I wouldn't want to live there. Certainly no chance of civil union/marraige, I don't think.

We live in Goshen, MA, 20 minutes west of Northampton. We LOVE it here. We feel like Northampton is our town, even living 20 minutes away (the kids go to school there, so we're there everyday). You could definitely find a house for $200K somewhere within a reasonable distance of downtown Noho, just not IN downtown Noho (where I wouldn't want to live anyway). We are renting right now, but we look at the listings a lot. You could definitely get something pretty great for $250K close to town (i.e. in Easthampton, Florence, Amherst, Hadley, Leeds). Goshen actually has the highest number of lesbians per capita in MA. But our total population is pretty small, like 1000 or something. Still, it's cool to live on a dirt road in farm country and have 3 other lesbian families on our road!

I'd definitely not want to live in Pittsfield. Greenfield is better, and has more of an "up and coming" feel about it. You could certainly afford something there.

Another option for you to consider if you really wanted to live in downtown Northampton would be to buy a 2 or 3-family home, and rent out the other unit(s) to help with your mortgage. There are a ton of 2 and 3-family homes here, and usually at least a few on the market at any given time. They usually are listed in the $3-400K range. Sometimes we fantasize about buying one and renting out the other units to cool, like-minded families and having a little mini-co-housing type situation. But we really want to live on a farm, and that's not happening in Northampton.

I don't think you'll find anyplace else that's quite as perfect for lesbian families as the Northampton area is.

Lex

[kands]

x

[andimama]

Shelburne !!

my partner and i and our 15 mos old dd live in shelburne mass which is about 20 miles nw of northampton. we love the country living that shelburne has to offer and we're still so close to everything. northampton is still, in my opinion, thee best place for queer moms but the real estate has gotten out of control there. we're always checking the market and it seems you can't touch anything in hamp for less than 250k and that will get you a house that is either way out of town or a fixer upper!! in-town your looking at 300plus.

this is truly the happy valley though...whether you live in hamp or the hill towns (ashfield, shelburne, conway, goshen, buckland...) we're in a progressive pocket and queer support is abundant here!! shelburne is still rather affordable and since we don't live in the actual village of shelburne falls, the real estate is less expensive. greenfield is great too and getting better, i hear. they have a wonderful coop (greenfields market) and more and more lesbians seem to making a move there!

the hartsbrook school is a waldorf school in hadley mass and is wonderful. there are great schools in this area!

the job market is another story ... i'm lucky to be at home w/ our babe and i would not want to have to get out there looking for a job! but depending on your skills i think this area has a lot to offer!

we love this area!!
good luck!

[mlrohde]

i am on a short break from chasing my kids around the house, so i won't go in to detail right now, but have you considered new paltz, ny area? we live one town over- ulster county as a whole is pretty open and aware, good schools, our daughter goes to a fabulous private school, but there are others to choose from- waldorf and montesorri among them.

[Learning_Mum]

Come to New Zealand!

We have civil unions, gay pride parades, Montesorri schools (don't know about Waldorf), wide open spaces, schools without metal detectors (I've never heard of any violence in schools), only farmers have guns (the police don't even have guns). I have two different friends who have gay fathers, and infact on our longest running home-grown soap there is a gay couple trying to have a baby at the moment, so I guess that means we're a fairly tolerant nation!

Kids still ride their bikes, and play outside with their friends. Schools have big fields and playgrounds and aren't all fenced off (they do have fences obviously, but more as a boundry for the kids rather than for security).

The cost of living is pretty good. Depending where you go you can get alot of land and a big house for not much money. We can afford for me to SAH with DS even though DH is reeeaaaallly underpaid. And the government gives us money every week for 'family assistance' which helps too!

Anyway, I'm sure you don't want to move half way across the world, but I thought I'd put that 'out there'!