Healing the Gut Tribe-February - Page 10

[Kundalini-Mama]

Hey Mamas

I was just wondering if one of you could jump over to this thread and help me explain myself re: bfing/leaky gut/food particles. I don't have any good links either. Unfortunately I am the type to read things, understand it, & then forget it I just don't want to give out bad info.

[SAmama]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

My DD used to have blood in her stools and that stopped within a week or two after I started giving her probiotics (I used a HFS brand at the time). So probiotics have helped her some, but I was hoping a super high dose with custom probiotics would help more, but I haven't seen any more improvement. But I'm still going to get them for her as I can give her a high dose of those for the same price as about 1/4 of the dose of a HFS brand.

They have no fillers. Here's the phone number:
[phone] I belive they do ship internationally but you would need to call and find out how it works. In the States they just send them 2nd day air and they are not refrigerated but I don't know how long they can go without being refrigerated.

Thanks! I will go ahead and contact them to see what I can do about getting them here "alive". I am pretty sure that dd reacts to dairy, but hopefully she is not that sensitive. I just gave her a dose of a probiotic that a friend brought from the US, which they warn about possible trace dairy. Not the strains that I want, but that one dose seems to have helped. So I think we will be fine with the trace dairy in custom probiotics.

[formerluddite]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

I use NOW magnesium citrate--there's 450 mg per tsp. I think it's around $9 for 8 oz at www.iherb.com.

so i hit the big hfs on the way home from work last night (my usual post-work saturday or sunday routine, ooh, the olive oil section...), and picked this up, thinking that, as many have said, most people are magnesium deficient, i should try it. i took a 1/2 tsp in water after i got home and an hour later had the worst abdominal pain and cramps i've ever had. i also felt faint, in fact it felt remarkably like transition, and i ended up lying on the bathroom floor for a while with my tummy rumbling enough for things to rearrange themselves enough to stop the pain, and feel less dizzy, and took a dose of podophylum peltatum to help settle things down. then i went to the couch and fell asleep. today i still feel a little weak (and slightly rumbly, with one small watery bm), but we're also a bit achey/tired/flu-ish around here, and this is my day to veg anyway, no work or driving kids around to rev me up.

i had no bowel reaction at all when i took the natural calm trial envelope a few days ago. nobody's posts mentioned such a violent reaction to magnesium.

i honestly wasn't thinking with my whole brain about this. i think i assumed the bowel tolerance thing was based on when the mag got to your bowels, but while on the floor i made the "gigantic" leap of "oh, yeah, milk of magnesia for constipation..." and realized it affects when it's absorbed.

so, advice?

does this mean i have enough magnesium already? (from diet, trace minerals supplement in the water). or maybe the natural calm was more "gentle" somehow?

i'm hesitant to put any in my mouth ever again... anybody want a bottle of NOW mag citrate missing one 1/2 tsp?

[bluets]

Originally Posted by formerluddite

so, advice?

does this mean i have enough magnesium already? (from diet, trace minerals supplement in the water). or maybe the natural calm was more "gentle" somehow?

i'm hesitant to put any in my mouth ever again... anybody want a bottle of NOW mag citrate missing one 1/2 tsp?

i've read the mag gluconate is better absorbed. but in general, my dh notices that mag is quite brutal on his bowels. i don't notice the cramping myself. i find that afternoon doses of natural calm are useful - any later and they don't help at the appropriate time. i've never tried any other brand.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by formerluddite

does this mean i have enough magnesium already? (from diet, trace minerals supplement in the water). or maybe the natural calm was more "gentle" somehow?

i'm hesitant to put any in my mouth ever again... anybody want a bottle of NOW mag citrate missing one 1/2 tsp?

Sorry! I've reached bowel tolerance with it a few times and just had one episode of diarrhea each time--no cramps, no gas, and if I can't get to the bathroom for a while it's no big deal at all (sorry TMI!). I was thinking it's a much gentler laxative than vitamin C (I've had horrible cramps and gas a few times with bowel tolerance vitamin C) but apparently it affects everyone differently. I guess either you're not deficient in magnesium, or the natural calm was different somehow...I think my vote would be that you're not deficient.

[bluets]

"dairy allergy"

a bit of an ongoing discussion about dairy allergy in one of the mailing lists i'm on.... it got me thinking and i thought i'd share...

dairy allergy could be one of many things:

(1) lactose intolerance
(2) reaction to beta-casein though more likely its breakdown products
(3) reaction to amines in fermented milk products
(4) true IgE allergy to casein
(5) reaction to glutamates (in UHT milk) in glutamate-sensitive individuals

i'm thinking about (2) because that is most likely near and dear to me. so i've been perusing the literature about beta-casein and its derivative products: opioids. yes, THOSE opioids. it turns out that beta-casein gives rise to beta-casomorphin, an opioid peptide (short little chunk of a bigger protein).

the cool thing is that there may become a test that can be done for breastfed infants showing signs of allergy. details on the science only:

Serum activity of dipeptidyl peptidase IV (DPPIV; EC 3.4.14.5) in breast-fed infants with symptoms of allergy

abstract:
β-Casomorphins, opioid peptides present in mother's milk, are a good substrate for DPPIV (EC 3.4.14.5) which is a major factor limiting the half-life of biologically active peptides. Serum DPPIV activity of two groups of infants (healthy and atopic dermatitis) and contents of β-casomorphin-5 and -7 in their mothers’ milk were determined in the study. We have found correlation between those two parameters in the group of children with atopic dermatitis syndromes, while no such a correlation was found in the control group.

translation:
Beta-casomorphins can act as a fuel for a protein called DPPIV, something that maks biologically active proteins breakdown rapidly. One can look at DPPIV activity in healthy and atopic infants, along with the amount of beta-casomorphin-5 and -7 (different forms of BCM) in mama's milk. In atopic infants, there is a correlation between the amount of BCM-5 and /or BCM-7 in their mama's milk and the level of DPPIV activity in the infant. Presumably, this is a negative correlation (the more BCM there is, the more fuel for DPPIV, the less DPPIV there will be).

there are papers about lab tests for both DPPIV and BCM though i haven't quite finished searching for companies that actually DO those tests. it would be a sweet way to confirm an allergy (or not).


beta-casomorphins, because of the amino acid content, are not broken down in the GI tract and contribute to increased mucus production in the backend of the small intestine, in the large intestine and perhaps in the colon. (which led one group of researchers to conclude, a few years ago, that perhaps dairy products would be a good way to boost one's immune system because this enhanced mucosal layer in the gut prevents other bugs from penetrating the intestinal lumen - a duh moment i guess).

there are 2 forms of beta-casein, A1 and A2. the A2 milk corporation (in NZ) would have us believe that cows carrying the A2 form of beta-casein are better than cows carrying A1 -- science is debating this claim. however, it is clear that some people do respond differently to these different forms of beta-casein. apparently jersey cows tend to be A2 more often than A1...

and another thing... Lactococcus lactis (one of our probiotic/yogurt/kefir friends) breaks apart beta-casein - demonstrated quite convincingly in the lab.

back to opioids.... i react BADLY to codeine (another opioid) which now makes sense in light of my new understanding about casein.

[caedmyn]

Well I took DD to a naturopath today because I suspected that she had an ear infection (she does). The naturopath gave me some homeopathic pulsatilla to use and told me to use the garlic mullein ear drops I already have. I also asked her a bunch of questions about food allergies and yeast issues. She seemed to think DD's butt crack diaper rash wasn't yeast related. Does anyone know of anything else that could cause it? It always goes away if I put Burt's Bees diaper rash cream on it but then comes back in a day or two.

I also asked her how she recommended treating system candida in adults. She said she always prescribes a three month course of Nystatin because she's found it to be far more effective than herbal anti-fungals. I'm sure it's been discussed before, but does anyone have any thoughts on using Nystatin? A couple of my candida symptoms (brain fog and itching) came back a bit when I started eating 2-3 servings of grains a day, although I'm not sure whether it's a candida issue or an amine issue due to the massive amounts of amines I'm consuming between the beet kvass, kombucha, and water kefirs, not to mention all the grass-fed (aged and amine-filled) beef I eat.

[moonshine]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

: Wow, you do have a lot going on! Have you tried PM'ing JaneS? She might have some ideas for you.

Is it possible that you could have yeast issues? I know hypoglycemia and digestive issues are really common with candida overgrowth. In any case, it seems like a meat and veggies diet might be helpful as they tend to be easier to digest than dairy, grains, legumes, and nuts.

I've read that adrenal fatigue can cause hypoglycemia, and also that 90% of the vitamin C in your body is used by your adrenal glands. I mega-dosed with vitamin C for a while and I think it helped my adrenals as I have nowhere near the hypoglycemia issues I used to have, even when I don't eat well. My bowel tolerance for vitamin C was 40+ grams/day when I started, I took 20 grams a day for a while, then dropped it to 10, and just a couple of weeks ago dropped it to 5 grams a day as 10 was bowel tolerance. So I'm guessing my adrenal function has improved.

I would agree that the constant-nose-blowing sounds indicative of a dairy issue. Have you thought about trying an elimination diet to see if there are particular foods you're reacting to?

Okay, this probably isn't much help--I'm just throwing out whatever I can think of on the off chance something will ring a bell for you.

Thanks for your thoughts. Still struggling along here. Since I wrote that update, my gastritis seems to have come back, causing lots of nausea. I did the baking soda test to see if I did indeed have too much stomach acid (and not too little, as I suspected before) and yes, I burped almost immediately. So I am trying to get back to a form of the detox diet I did a few weeks ago, which seemed helpful. Essentially, I am trying to cut out most of the foods that I have been eating a lot of (grains, fruit, dairy and nuts) and replace them with veggies and meat, precisely what I was not eating. And cutting out coffee again. :

I have been really resistant to the idea that I have candida. : I did the saliva test last summer and passed with flying colors. It just doesn't feel like yeast, if that makes sense. As for hypoglycemia, I think I have a touch of it, but I think I always did. I presume that it is sometimes worse than others. I am trying to be more mindful of getting in protein. The problem I have with megadosing on SA is that it really causes a lot of tummy rumblings and bloating, long before I reach the point where I need to get to a bathroom. Need to take increases more slowly?

And what would it mean if I feel nauseous after eating a salad?

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by moonshine

The problem I have with megadosing on SA is that it really causes a lot of tummy rumblings and bloating, long before I reach the point where I need to get to a bathroom. Need to take increases more slowly?

And what would it mean if I feel nauseous after eating a salad?

I had the same problem with the SA...I PM'd MT on it and she said that's where she doses, right below the stomach rumbling/gas point. So I lowered my dose to the point where I don't get gas and it seemed to work okay as I eventually got to bowel tolerance with that dose and lowered it again just recently.

As for the nausea...food chemical sensitivities? Depending on what you put on it, your salad could have been high in salicylates or maybe some other food chemicals. If this hasn't already been recommended, you might try posting your symptoms on the FailsafeNT yahoo group and see if they have any suggestions for you.

[Panserbjorne]

I have no problem with Nystatin! If the herbs don't work it is a good place to go. There is a place you can get it (ordered from the UK) where it is in powdered form and you can mix it yourself. This is by far the best AFAIK. I don't know how that works with your insurance though. I know it is covered for some...IF you want the lab info let me know...

[Punchy Kaby]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

A couple of my candida symptoms (brain fog and itching) came back a bit when I started eating 2-3 servings of grains a day, although I'm not sure whether it's a candida issue or an amine issue due to the massive amounts of amines I'm consuming between the beet kvass, kombucha, and water kefirs, not to mention all the grass-fed (aged and amine-filled) beef I eat.

Brain fog and itching are also indications of salicylate/amine sensitivity. My brain fog has completely gone away as has my itchy/scaly skin. I am not using any lotion and it has been dry and cold here, normally I would be in pain even with slathering on tons of lotion.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by Nolansmum

Brain fog and itching are also indications of salicylate/amine sensitivity. My brain fog has completely gone away as has my itchy/scaly skin. I am not using any lotion and it has been dry and cold here, normally I would be in pain even with slathering on tons of lotion.

I know...or rather, I don't want to know! Hmmm...I've noticed that my skin has been really dry lately, although it is very very dry here and cold. I thought it was because I stopped using coconut oil because my skin was fine before that but maybe not...

Do you know if salicylates can cause gas? I've noticed that drinking nettle infusions occasionally cause gas and I'm sure they're high in salicylates.

[formerluddite]

thanks for the info, bluets and caedmyn.

caedmyn, have you tried breastmilk on her rash?

rashes can also be sort of a "burn" from allergies or irritating substances (eg acid), esp "target sign," where the rash is bright red around the anus. burts bees might help by being occlusive, and so would only help prevent it if it's still there on the skin when the next BM comes along.

[bluets]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

I know...or rather, I don't want to know! Hmmm...I've noticed that my skin has been really dry lately, although it is very very dry here and cold. I thought it was because I stopped using coconut oil because my skin was fine before that but maybe not...

Do you know if salicylates can cause gas? I've noticed that drinking nettle infusions occasionally cause gas and I'm sure they're high in salicylates.

remember, salicylates are drug-like. how do you react to aspirin? or wintergreen/spearmint? those are very high in salicylates - if you react negatively to those, then you'd probably be reacting in a lesser manner to other milder salicylate-containing foods.

a freebie article on salicylate intolerance in the lower GI tract: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/u...s5_article.pdf

as for Nystatin, it is a super treatment for Candida - stays in the GI tract and doesn't impact other major organs. it can give constipation, but you know obvious remedies for that.

[Punchy Kaby]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

I know...or rather, I don't want to know! Hmmm...I've noticed that my skin has been really dry lately, although it is very very dry here and cold. I thought it was because I stopped using coconut oil because my skin was fine before that but maybe not...

Do you know if salicylates can cause gas? I've noticed that drinking nettle infusions occasionally cause gas and I'm sure they're high in salicylates.

Most definitely.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by bluets

remember, salicylates are drug-like. how do you react to aspirin? or wintergreen/spearmint? those are very high in salicylates - if you react negatively to those, then you'd probably be reacting in a lesser manner to other milder salicylate-containing foods.

a freebie article on salicylate intolerance in the lower GI tract: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/u...s5_article.pdf

as for Nystatin, it is a super treatment for Candida - stays in the GI tract and doesn't impact other major organs. it can give constipation, but you know obvious remedies for that.

I don't know if I've ever had aspirin in my life so I can't say how I'd react to it...certainly I haven't used it in the last 15 years. I always used ibuprofen for cramps and whatnot--is that high in salicylates as well? I haven't noticed a problem with spearmint tea but I use a lot less of it and it's in the water for a lot less time than the nettle infusions so I'm sure I'm getting a smaller dose even if it is higher in salicylates.

[formerluddite]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

I don't know if I've ever had aspirin in my life so I can't say how I'd react to it...certainly I haven't used it in the last 15 years. I always used ibuprofen for cramps and whatnot--is that high in salicylates as well? I haven't noticed a problem with spearmint tea but I use a lot less of it and it's in the water for a lot less time than the nettle infusions so I'm sure I'm getting a smaller dose even if it is higher in salicylates.

have you used pepto bismol? i think it is bismuth and salicylates (very dusty memory here).

[bluets]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

She seemed to think DD's butt crack diaper rash wasn't yeast related. Does anyone know of anything else that could cause it? It always goes away if I put Burt's Bees diaper rash cream on it but then comes back in a day or two.

have you tried sprinkling her probiotic on it?

for ds, when his is just irritation, the rash goes away with a shot of breastmilk or diaper cream. when it is yeasty, it takes a sprinkling of probiotic to get it to go away.

[bluets]

Originally Posted by caedmyn

I also asked her how she recommended treating system candida in adults. She said she always prescribes a three month course of Nystatin because she's found it to be far more effective than herbal anti-fungals. I'm sure it's been discussed before, but does anyone have any thoughts on using Nystatin? A couple of my candida symptoms (brain fog and itching) came back a bit when I started eating 2-3 servings of grains a day, although I'm not sure whether it's a candida issue or an amine issue due to the massive amounts of amines I'm consuming between the beet kvass, kombucha, and water kefirs, not to mention all the grass-fed (aged and amine-filled) beef I eat.

since you're pretty certain you have yeast (and since a yeast fighting diet works for you), why not try the Nystatin, at least for a month?

if you don't see improvement, then start thinking about the whole failsafe route.

[caedmyn]

Originally Posted by formerluddite

have you used pepto bismol? i think it is bismuth and salicylates (very dusty memory here).

Not in the last 15 years...I've never been big on OTC medications.