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Thoughts on Disney movies? - Page 2

post #21 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by amcal View Post
Well, now she's obsessed with reading Cinderella books and wants to watch the movies. Her friends talk about Cinderella and other Disney movies and she really wants to see them..... Am I reading too much into these books and movies?
Personally, I don't think that you're reading too much into this, and am also really concerned about this with regard to my own DD. Yes, she's totally into the Cinderella's *dress* at this point, but as a pp mentioned, she is also absorbing the message that she needs a man to be complete.

I wonder whether banning the movies now would just lend more allure/value to them...if it were me, I would probably watch it with her, and discuss it. Maybe work on expanding this interest beyond Disney princesses into castles, history, real life princesses (then learn more about their countries), other stories (like The Paper Bag Princess), cartoon drawing - whatever floats her boat. Make the view a little more balanced than what Disney offers.

Hope this helps - keep us posted!
post #22 of 124
We have not decided firm guidelines on this either. The only movie she has seen is Cinderella. She gets excited about seeing Cinderella on products everywhere but doesn't end up begging etc. I hate the commercialism and the Disney princesses on everything in the stores. In general we do not buy anything with characters toys, clothing whatever so that helps. We have read non disney stories with princeses and Cinderella stories.

-Pam
post #23 of 124
My dd is now 7 and really liked Cinderella, and the princess stuff. She is still into princess stuff a little but has gone on to other things. It was like a phase she went thru. We don't watch alot of Disney movies, but they're not completely banned. I think sometimes we read more into things than our kids do. Like a pp stated, I grew up on Tom and Jerry and my brother and sister and I watched it all the time, and not one of us are violent in anyway. I have to admit, I cringe now that I am a parent and see it. My dd has never seen T&J. She is a very emotional/sensitive child and I don't think she would like that. When we went to see Charlotte's Web, she cried terribly when Charlotte died. I almost thought we were going to have to leave the theater.
However, when we watched Bambi one day, I'm the one that cried when the mother died and she didn't. You just never know w/kids.
post #24 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by amcal View Post
What do you think? Do you allow them? Try to avoid them?
We managed to avoid Disney until we adopted a 12 year old who is Disney obsessed. And I mean obsessed. If it's not Disney Princesses, she couldn't care less about it.

So far, this has not infected my 5 year old. However, due to an interest in fairies (because she has a fairy bower hanging over her bed) she has become interested in Tinkerbell. I surprised myself and showed her Peter Pan on her birthday (we talked extensively about the mischaracterization of Indians, which worked well as we have been reading the Native American American Girl books recently).

I do make sure that my 12 year old watches her Disney Princess movies when the younger kids are not around. I tell myself it's mainly because Ramona (5) would be too scared by the witches and bad guys (she gets scared easily).

But when we bought Ramona a Tinkerbell doll for her birthday, I had to admit that Ramona is her own person and she's allowed to have her own interests, whether they thrill me or not.

I was into Strawberry Shortcake as a girl, and it didn't seem to harm me. If Ramona gets into Disney, I'll go with it, although her opportunities will be limited because we rarely watch tv, generally don't wear character clothing, and don't buy our kids toys unless it's birthday/Christmas.

Ramona is not really one to follow the crowd, though, so I don't really see her getting into Disney just because other little girls do.
Namaste!
post #25 of 124
Speaking here from a "having a son" perspective. I'm not really fond of Disney either. When we aren't living with my parents we are normally TV free - DS did have a fw videos at our place, but DH and I pre-screened them. I guess we are pretty particular about what DS gets to see. I second what a pp said about doing what you are comfortable with - TV/movie issues will vary from family to family and you should do what works best for yours.

I'm just not crazy about a lot of themes in Disney - as well as a lot of fighting that takes place in them. Peter Pan, for example - lots of fight scenes there. I'm probably making a big deal of it, and I know I can't protect DS from these images forever, but it bugs me to see characters fighting it out rather than some other means of resolution.

In lots of early Disney, there's quite a bit of slap-stick humor and gag type things. For our family, we just prefer DS not learn about all of that at such a vulnerable age.
post #26 of 124
My play with Barbie was more directed to acting out fantasy situations...my barbie was the lead singer in a band and toured all over the world I created in my room. At other points she was a dancer, a mother (a frequent theme), a foster parent, ran a school, ran a daycare centre....basically she did all the things I hoped I would do when I got older. I do not have body issues related to Barbie.

The Bratz dolls are frankly disgusting and will never be allowed in my home. I do not care if Grace is the only child on the planet to not have one, she's not having one. I might not feel as strongly about the regular Bratz, but with the introduction of Bratz Babies I simply will not support that line of toys and if my daughter ever recieves any from other people I will politely inquire where it was purchased so I can exchange for somethingmore appropriate.

As for the Disney princesses, I enjoyed a romantic story from a young age, I still enjoy a cheesy romantic comedy or a silly romance novel. I found Snow White to be a complete idiot, and that movie will not ever play in our home. My fav is Beauty and The Beast...Belle is a strong independant woman who definitely does not need a man to complete her. I think she's a great role model.

I think the whole Disney thing is something that you need to approach with your kids in the same way you'd approach any other work of fiction...as just that. When the disney version of Hercules came out I was taking a course on Children's Literature and was actually in the section on Mythology. My younger brother (age 7 at the time) was totally into the film, talked about it all the time. If you've seen it then you know how badly they botched the old tales. So I read to him from the mythology text, and we talked about the differences between the original tales and the Disney version. It didn't take anything away from the enjoyment of the movie, and he frequently came to me to ask for more myths and legends and to re-tell favourites. It's all in your approach.
post #27 of 124
The only Cinderella movie that I liked was the one with Brandi as Cinderella. It seemed to get the message across much better about believing in yourself.

A good animated movie that is great for girls and boys alike is Kiki's Delivery Service. I love, love, LOVE that movie! (and so do all the kids that I know).
post #28 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by mommy68 View Post
She loves all kinds of toys and movies and who am I to say they aren't good for her if they are rated G and meant for audiences of her age.
We are their MOTHERS! It *IS* up to us to say what's good for her. And whenever I see a rating by the MPAA I always add at least one rating to it, ie G=PG, PG=PG-13, PG-13=R, etc. There's a lot of stuff that's not appropriate for children that's marketed to children. (ie SUGAR CEREALS and TOYS and MCDONALDS commercials!) IMO.
post #29 of 124
I am so glad to even see this discussion happening here. My family doesn't get it at all. I feel so alone a lot of the time when it comes to isuses like these. They are actually disney obsessed-adults and children alike. In our house, we limit Disney movies, and we do not have many (if any, come to think of it) Disney products outside of a few movies given as gifts. At the very least, the family tries now to respect our wishes that we don't receive Disney or Barbie as gifts. I have found a great substitute for Barbie, called the Only Hearts Club. It's bendable figures, much like barbie, but they are actually girl-like and wearing clothes : .http://www.onlyheartsclub.com/


My problem with Disney and Barbie are also the image issues, the misrepresentation of history, the clash with our values (the whole princess must find a prince thing), and another issue that is very personal--Disney is one of the largest financial backers of the Republican party and that indirectly funds a war (and lots of other stuff) that I am wholeheartedly opposed to. I would actually feel as if I was buying warheads if I purchased a Disney product. I realize that is a personal and political view, and it is not meant to offend, but to offer a reason.
post #30 of 124
We do not have a TV and so our kids (ages 5 and 2) do not know what Disney even is. I personally think there are a lot of reasons to question Disney. The company's main goal is to make money via marketing to children (let's not even think about all of the Disney garbage going into the landfill or all of the stuff being made in China). So, if you have to set your kids in front of a movie then look for something of quality. Read classic fairy tales to your children and let your children form pictures in their heads of these stories.
post #31 of 124
I am ABSOLUTELY SHOCKED AND HORRIFIED at all the mamas that are saying that Cinderella/Barbie/Disney Princesses aren't such a big deal!!!

Now I realize that I am coming off as a flamethrower here but...WTF?!?!

Having a sister that is currently dying, DYING of anorexia because of all of these "harmless images", I seriously beg all mamas to question this line of thinking.

I invite anyone questioning whether these movies/images are harmless to please, PLEASE spend an hour talking to my sister and her treatment buddies about the impact that these images have on our impressionable little, precious girls and you will go home and purge all of these implements of self-image erosion from your childrens lives.

FWIW, we do not allow any princess image or anything resembling a princess in our home. No fairies, no ballerinas, no barbies, no dollies. I will not allow them to see that sh!t in our home and if they see it in other places I explain how these images are don't show womens strength and inner beauty. We don't say that our daughters are pretty either...they are beautiful and so is our son.

The only movie that we have allowed in our home with a girly portrayal in it is Shrek, but only because princess Fiona kicked butt in it and has the message is that "looks don't matter".

Really, with all of the positive alternatives out there, why are we allowing this crap in our girls lives? Please ask yourself if you want your daughter to become one of these unfortunate statistics....85% of women do not have a positive self image...85%!!!!

Where does this start???? Unfortunately, in your home....
post #32 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by cdnmom View Post
I am ABSOLUTELY SHOCKED AND HORRIFIED at all the mamas that are saying that Cinderella/Barbie/Disney Princesses aren't such a big deal!!!

Now I realize that I am coming off as a flamethrower here but...WTF?!?!

Having a sister that is currently dying, DYING of anorexia because of all of these "harmless images", I seriously beg all mamas to question this line of thinking.

I invite anyone questioning whether these movies/images are harmless to please, PLEASE spend an hour talking to my sister and her treatment buddies about the impact that these images have on our impressionable little, precious girls and you will go home and purge all of these implements of self-image erosion from your childrens lives.

FWIW, we do not allow any princess image or anything resembling a princess in our home. No fairies, no ballerinas, no barbies, no dollies. I will not allow them to see that sh!t in our home and if they see it in other places I explain how these images are don't show womens strength and inner beauty. We don't say that our daughters are pretty either...they are beautiful and so is our son.

The only movie that we have allowed in our home with a girly portrayal in it is Shrek, but only because princess Fiona kicked butt in it and has the message is that "looks don't matter".

Really, with all of the positive alternatives out there, why are we allowing this crap in our girls lives? Please ask yourself if you want your daughter to become one of these unfortunate statistics....85% of women do not have a positive self image...85%!!!!

Where does this start???? Unfortunately, in your home....
I do not think eleminating princesses, fairies, dolls completely in all forms from ones home is necessary. Playing with these things does not automatically equal poor self image of oneself and of women. Your reaction seems extreme. We do not allow Disney princess toys, Barbies, Bratz etc. But I do not understand your desire to eliminate all the things listed from your home. Ballerinas are thin but so are gymnists and athletes. My DD has a fairy doll from Magic Cabin. I don't see anything sexual about it or how it would effect her self image in anyway. By dollies, do you mean you do not allow any type of doll? If so, what is the harm of baby dolls or child like dolls? What is the harm of pretending to be medevil knights, kings, queens, princesses etc? I think we need to make concious decesions about what we allow are children to play with, read, watch etc but am trying to understand where you are coming from.


-Pam
post #33 of 124
I think Bambi is a must see movie to bring emotion to the young
post #34 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by OdeToJoy View Post
A good animated movie that is great for girls and boys alike is Kiki's Delivery Service. I love, love, LOVE that movie! (and so do all the kids that I know).
I second that! Another great one is "My Neighbor Totoro" by the same director. My dd LOVES this movie (and so do we). We have the soundtrack as well, which is absolutely beautiful, and listen to it over and over.
post #35 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaPam View Post
Playing with these things does not automatically equal poor self image of oneself and of women.
I agree, I don't think that if my dds pick up a Barbie and start playing with it, they will immediately get a "poor self image" ......B U T....I DO believe that extended exposure will erode their perceptions of achievable beauty.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaPam View Post
Your reaction seems extreme.
Reeeally?

Soon, I will be burying my 32 yr old sister because of societys' f*cked up image of beauty....one that SHE (and those with her in this disease) attribute to forming in their childhood because of Barbie/Princesses.

With all of the other more positive toys/movies out there, why would I play Russian Roulette with my dds self-image by exposing them to something that could potentially end up putting them in the grave at 75 lbs?

Really, explain to me what the big deal is with Barbies/Princesses that I would ALLOW my children play with them?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MamaPam View Post
What is the harm of pretending to be medevil knights, kings, queens, princesses etc?
FWIW, mediveal society was based on the notion of royalty being better than everyone else by blood (kinda sounds a little racist to me) and was patrilineal with the daughters only becoming queen upon a death of an older brother or if they were an only child. IMO, not really values that children should learn...

All of my dc have babies (anatomically and proportionally correct) and children-like figurines for playing make-believe.
post #36 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by MtnCanary View Post
Others I don't like: Pocohantas (um, not how it happened),
Agreed...not even close to how it happened, beginning with the fact that Captain John Smith was about 20 years older and Pocahontas about 10 years younger than shown in the movie.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MtnCanary View Post
Lion King (Nazi imagery), Chicken Run (more Nazi imagery),
Nazi imagery? Did I miss something in both these films?

Quote:
Originally Posted by MtnCanary View Post
Nemo (the whole shark AA thing).
I doubt anyone under 18 would recognize the shark scene as a reference to an AA meeting, but even so I would think it served to illustrate how adults sometimes need the support of their friends to help them break bad habits and stop doing things they no longer want to do. :
post #37 of 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by frenchie View Post
IMO...yes. I watched Tom & Jerry as a child, and every other cartoon that displays some sort of violence, and I'm not a violent person. I played with Barbie and watched Cinderella like most other girls my age, and I have no issues with my body because of it.
I believe the thing that causes kids to have body issues and whatnot, goes much deeper than cartoons and toys. I DO believe they can aggrivate an existing issue, but I do not believe they cause them.
Ditto
post #38 of 124
I have three girls - ages 10, 6 and 3. We absolutely allow Disney dvds. I love Mulan, Aladdin, Beauty and the Beast. We don't do Bratz. I had a ban on all things pink, plastic, Mattel/Barbie for years (have lightened up a bit; they really don't play with them much at all). But we adore Disneyland trips every three years (due for one this year) and allow the dvds.
post #39 of 124
DD (5) has seen many of the Disney movies and enjoys them all. Sometimes she pretends to be a princess and she now owns a barbie (I tried to hold out as long as possible), but she prefers to imagine that she is a lion or a horse or some other animal and most of the time plays with animal figures over her more "princess" toys.

I don't feel that the princess movies or images have affected her in a negative way. She loves to put on a tutu and dance to classical music or play princess fairies, but she equally enjoys building a lion's den and perching herself on the arm of the couch and roaring.

I think they are fine in moderation.
post #40 of 124
Hmm, I am really conflicted about this too.

MY daughter is just two, so its not much of an issue for us yet. She's just too young to watch many movies, esp, Disney at all right now. She saw one movie, Happy Feet, and has seen a video with Elmo, so I know the power of marketing to kids. She points out anything with either one of them on it. Her reaction makes me wary of the Disney marketing explosion, that if she gets into it, it will be hard to go back.

She sees mickey mouse and says "Doggie" still doesn't know who The Maus is. We live near Disney and I admit I like it there, and DH and I went for our own enjoyment on free tickets twice since she was born. I will have to think if we will go now that she would participate more!

My main concern with any thing that goes in her eyes/senses/brain is how it will effect her own creativity. I do not want her replaying the canned stories, but want her play to come from with in. And want her inner image of beauty to come from with in. I remember kids playing what they saw on TV when I was in kindergarten, and was babysitting and teaching preschool when the Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles came out, and it was all the 2-3 year olds would do- Karate chop, etc....that show really made the culture of kids noticeably more violent. I do not want her play dictated in this way. But I do not want her to not get what other kids around her are doing& talking about. We can have our own world and home school, but I also want her to be part of a diverse and real community. Our local school is very diverse, and those kids are going to be doing whatever pop culture for kids is doing. Do I shelter her and feed her just what I see fit like in a greenhouse so she flourishes with my values, or trust that what I instill is stronger than what she gets at school and let her hone her skills of staying afloat and true to herself while out amongst the rest of the world? Today I was fantasizing that perhaps when I movie comes out, we can read the old classic out loud so she gets her own images in her head, and can go from there, relating to the play but not being limited by the image.

I don't know. Its still a ways off so its nice to hear what your experiences are.

I think fairy tales are good, in that they teach a certain archetypal kind of lessons. Blowing a house down, or getting eaten by a wolf is a symbolic experience, but needs to be introduced at an age that is appropriate. But alot of the wisdom of fairy tales is in the rhythm of how a story is told, and other parts that are lost when translated to a movie. I feel like they are old stories, told in a way that speaks to the deep parts of our soul. The Waldorf book the Rainbow Bridge has good suggestions about what fairy tales are appropriate for what age. That might be a good place to start.

We do gingerbread man and Goldilocks as first fairy tales. They learn the emotion and the repetition. This is a neat web site about fairy tales that I got to reading when thinking about this issue previously . http://www.surlalunefairytales.com/index.html

I also have a back ground in women's studies and was so aware of how my self image was shaped by the media, The Beauty Myth by Naomi Wolf was a pivotal book for me when it came out. It will be interesting to see how I approach the female imagery issue, and movies as she grows, cause I am really moderate and can't see banning Barbie, etc, but can't imagine her having those things either.

The whole disney princess thing drives me bonkers- the concept of the princess as its portrayed and the marketing hype for the Dinsey proincesses and fairies is replusive. Yuck.

Fairy tales, medieval tales, concept of a princess- all ok. Co-opting them and repackaging them in sugar coating for a profit is yucky.

I like authentic things, that sums up where my values are. Real women, real tales, real play.

Its just a question of how much of the sugar coating can a kid get before they begin to lose that sense of inner driven play and authenticity? Is one time enough?
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