Blimey, Nov 05 Mamas - It's March! - Page 2

[spughy]

Originally Posted by barcelona

spughy, i'm curious...what's the CLO for? i'm glad that you at least got a good night's sleep last night.

I'm glad too! The CLO is for the vitamins and EPA. I use a high-vitamin, all-natural CLO from Dr. Ron's. And yes, I'm aware that most peds say not to give CLO to children, but I believe that there is a big difference between the CLO that is mostly available today that's been heat-processed and had vitamins stripped out and then synthetic forms added in, and the CLO that occurs naturally with the correct balance of naturally occurring vitamins A & D. Here's an article about that if you're interested.

[MelW]

Kavita~ I'm glad you guys will be out of limbo with a job offer soon!

Gunter~ What an exciting adventure! I hope you'll have some occasional internet access to update us on your work

I may have said this before, but Neela is confused about gender. I think it's my fault- she calls men "man" (usually) and women "people"- which I realise is the way that I point them out. So we're working on "woman". And then yesterday when my MIL asked her what she was, she said "boy". MIL said "no, you're a girl", and Neela shook her head and insisted "boy". They went back and forth a couple of times, until MIL gave up and said that it's futile to argue with a toddler.

[Queen of Cups]

Gender awareness is not really expected to be developed until 2-3 years old. Killy will be 3 in May and calls waitresses and cashiers "big guy" - which is a bit embarrassing and I have NO idea where he got that from! But, he and I have long discussions about who has a penis and who doesn't, so he does have a pretty good grasp on gender (or at least anatomy!).

Ellie's so precious lately! Except that she's developed the habit of shrieking when she wants something. She keeps adding new words, too, but is so much less talkative than Killy. Even when Killy was diagnosed with a speech delay at 20 months, he still babbled constantly! Ellie's just very quiet a lot of the time. And, since we're working with Killy so much on articulation (he has some articulation delays/issue and so is still in speech therapy), he's really bothered that she doesn't enunciate the end of her words. Today, she held up a toy duck and said, "DUH!!" and I said, "That's right! Its a duck! Duck!" and Killy said, "Ellie said 'duh,' not duck!"

Did I tell ya'll that I finally switched Ellie back to cloth diapers? I'm so glad, my inner environmentalist-voice has finally stopped yelling at me!

[flapjack]

Well done I felt so guilty the week that we did the kitchen, because Skye was in sposies the whole time. I forgot to mention that she shrieks too Not so precious.
See, you just have this image of a wailing banshee on my shoulder now, don't you? Screaming when she's put down, shrieking when she's happy- it has to be said, it's a very noisy house.
EVERY single one of dad's carers has walked through the door, looked at the bedlam (3 kids, one dog, three adults, one wheelchair, a hoist, a commode and a couple of carers) and gone "blimey" In an odd way, though, it's strangely peaceful. We know that the decision to help keep dad independent is the right one for our family, and that makes everything seem worth it.

[Kavita]

Originally Posted by Queen of Cups

Gender awareness is not really expected to be developed until 2-3 years old. Killy will be 3 in May and calls waitresses and cashiers "big guy" - which is a bit embarrassing and I have NO idea where he got that from! But, he and I have long discussions about who has a penis and who doesn't, so he does have a pretty good grasp on gender (or at least anatomy!).

We've already started with anatomy here. It's hysterical because Ella can't say nipples, but she can point to hers. And has taken to sometimes pointing to her nipples when she wants milk! (Partly because we sometimes call breasts milkies, as well as calling the milk that comes from them milkies. Now that we've added some goat-milkies to her diet, I'm sure she's totally confused! Yes, I swear that I do speak regular adult English to her most of the time. With a few exceptions!!)

And, midwife's daughter that she is, she knows where her "Nye-nah" is and will happily point it out and tell you what it is. DH was sort of traumatized by me teaching her this and her mastering it so quickly, so I tried to teach her to say penis just to totally freak him out, but it didn't take. Probably just as well!! As much as I am not into the vagina term, I just can't get into "yoni" either and then "vulva" just always sounds weird to me. So we'll stick with this until it's time to get more detailed and anatomically correct!

Oh, speaking of midwifery and my DH, I had to laugh at my husband the other day. I have definitely converted him to the dark side. He already had quite an education about normal birth while we were dating and married before I ever got pregnant. But I think the pregnancy and homebirth finished him off. If he ever leaves me for another woman it will have to be for some AP/NFL alterna-chick, he is ruined for any mainstream woman. Here is a snippet of the conversation that we had at dinner the other night about his colleague whose wife is pregnant:

DH: Remember I told you that Joe's wife is pregnant? Well, Joe and I were talking today, and she's due any time now.
Me: Oh. That's nice. He must be excited. Where are they having the baby?
DH: (humphing somewhat.) At the [local-huge-university-teaching hospital].
Me: Umm. (Takes bite of dinner.)
DH: Yeah, apparently her doctor is freaking her out, telling her it's a really big baby. They say the baby is about eight pounds.
Me: Oh, yeah?
DH: Yeah! I told him that they can't exactly accurately predict the weight of a baby before it's born, that ultrasounds are not entirely accurate at determining weight, and that anyway eight pounds is an average size baby. I mean, my mom had two ten-pound babies vaginally! (Pauses, continues gravely) I told Joe that it's a set-up for a c-section! I told him that they should get a doula, but he said that it's too expensive. And apparently she's totally scared about labor and wants to have pain meds as soon as she walks in the door. They took a Lamaze class but Lamaze doesn't work that well, does it? Isn't slow deep breathing better? (Shakes head.) So many women have already decided before they ever go into labor that it hurts too much and they are going to get an epidural. Between that and the doctors convincing people that they can't have an eight pound baby vaginally, no wonder the c-section rate is so high! I said, well, my wife must be some kind of superhero then! She had our baby at home! (Beaming at me.)
Me: Well, I'm not going to say that it doesn't hurt at all--it did! But it's not an unhealthy kind of pain.
DH: I told Joe that I caught the baby! He couldn't believe it!
Me: Well honey, keep in mind that these people have already made their choices and they are due any minute now, they are unlikely to change their minds or accept too much new information at this point, so try not to scare them about things they aren't going to change anyway, it's just disempowering. Why don't you just give him a little information that in the hospital they have choices, and can refuse or question things? Like if they want to give the baby its first bath themselves and not have the baby bathed in the nursery, they can request that. Also, if she is planning on breastfeeding they should keep the baby with them as much as possible and make sure to tell the nursing staff and also put a sign on the bassinette that says no bottles, no pacifiers, no supplements.
DH: Okay. That's a good idea.
(Pause for more eating.)
DH: I told Joe that they should try cloth diapers . . . .


How hilarious is that????

[spiritmomma]

Originally Posted by MelW

I may have said this before, but Neela is confused about gender. I think it's my fault- she calls men "man" (usually) and women "people"- which I realise is the way that I point them out. So we're working on "woman". And then yesterday when my MIL asked her what she was, she said "boy". MIL said "no, you're a girl", and Neela shook her head and insisted "boy". They went back and forth a couple of times, until MIL gave up and said that it's futile to argue with a toddler.

Before you argue, watch Ma Vie En Rose. You never know how she's feeling on the inside! Besides, I personally have gone through many phases in my life where I have identified with the males aspect, then felt very strongly feminine. Maybe she's feeling tomboy today

Originally Posted by Kavita

And, midwife's daughter that she is, she knows where her "Nye-nah" is and will happily point it out and tell you what it is. DH was sort of traumatized by me teaching her this and her mastering it so quickly, so I tried to teach her to say penis just to totally freak him out, but it didn't take. Probably just as well!! As much as I am not into the vagina term, I just can't get into "yoni" either and then "vulva" just always sounds weird to me. So we'll stick with this until it's time to get more detailed and anatomically correct!

We say yoni at our house. It's a sacred word and doesn't include any aspects of sexual oppression. She can point to her yoni (and mine ) and often points at papa's lingum. Since these words represent a worldview that sees masculine and feminine as holy and worthy of worship and honor, I figure why teach her a word that perpetuates the oppression I'm fighting against? She'll be receiving a copy of Inga Musico's CUNT as soon as she's able to read. Okay, maybe I'll wait until she starts her period...

HAPPY BELATED FERN!

I hope you had a wonderful birthday!

[flapjack]

One of my sons proudly told his teacher that the new baby (Skye) was going to come out of mummy's cunt. That was an interesting discussion to have at parents evening...
I've set up a google spreadsheet for contact details, btw. PM me your email addy for an invitation thingummy. Is it OK if I invite those people who defected to the yahoo group and don't post on MDC any more?

[Kavita]

Personally, I HATE HATE HATE the word cunt. It just sounds disgusting and no matter how it is said it almost always carries a sense of a degrading epithet. And yes, I am all aware about reclaiming the power of language, etc., but I'm just not into it.

I don't like the word vagina either, but it's also basically a standard medical term. And if we go poking around at etymologies, there are a lot of words that have origins/original meanings in latin that we would be suprised at/dismayed by, but I don't think that we necessarily connect to that origin every time we use a word. And women in India (home of the sanskrit term yoni) aren't necessarily respected and revered either based on the language. I agree that there is some benefit on having a term for the whole enchilada of the female genetalia, rather than dividing it linguistically into a number of separately named parts which makes calling it a vagina really inaccurate and glossing over the reality, but at 15 months I'll settle for that because to some extent, I am aiming also to teach my daughter language that will allow her to communicate with other people and understand/be understood, so that is what I will call it for now. Once she gets old enough to really be interested (which she isn't right now, she just wants to check out her poo) then we'll start getting more involved. For right now it's enough that she can point to her nose, her eyes, her ears, her tummy, her belly button, her feet, her toes, and her nye-nah!

I liked the movie "Ma vie en rose" but also generalization is a hallmark of this age/stage of development--Ella at this point calls anything with four legs and a tail a dog--so I wouldn't make any assumptions about Neela's gender identity just yet!!

[spiritmomma]

Kavita: Sorry if my post offended. Sounds like I may have hit a sensitive issue for you. I agree that at this age, it's not as important to fill my child up with my politics as much as it is that she is understanding concepts and understood when communicating. In the same vein, yoni is easier to pronounce than vagina... Not that Isa is really talking at all. She's still stuck in sign land!

So this weekend I had a breakdown/ breakthrough...
I haven't had the time to post about it until now. But the news is that Isa and I are working on a cooperative weaning process. It's not necessarily being left to her to decide whether or not we are weaning, but I am eliciting her voluntary cooperation, and in return, I am cooperating with her wishes to nurse when she asks. I had a great fear that I would be ostracized from all my "villages" and mama support groups for having this desire to wean. But so far, all the mamas I've shared with have been very supportive and understanding. I don't have any deadlines or feelings of urgency to wean by a certain age or date, etc... but I am actively working on nightweaning as a priority, and then as it seems right, weaning in general. Isa is doing pretty well with the adjustment. Though, she seems confused about the role of food vs. milk. Sometimes when she is hurt (having stumbled or whatever) she signs for food in the same way she used to sign for milk. I cuddle her and snuggle her and then finally, if she's still signing "food" I try to help her find a healthy snack. I figure she will grow out of this need for comfort eating, but since that is what she is asking for right now, I am cooperating with the request. She usually only takes a few bites anyway.

The hardest part is the emotional loss I feel coupled with the new sense of creativity and adventure that this new kind of parenting forces me into. I have felt ready for this for a while and only now am giving myself permission to try it. The truth is that nursing had turned into a chore that I didn't feel good about most of the time. I felt ready to Love Isa in a new way. I HATE that so many metaphors I come up with for nursing relate to sexual relationships, but the fact is, our culture's ideas of Love often fall into a sexual category. But the metaphor that best describes why weaning feels like the right thing to do is this: When one first falls in love, it involves a lot of making out and physical affection. One is sleeping less, but elated. One willingly enters into physical expressions of Love frequently and enjoys it. But at a certain point in the relationship, it becomes apparent that in order to stay together, there needs to be more to the relationship than the physical. The two need to Love each other in a way that invokes their spiritual, emotional, and intellectual connections.
The good news is, Isa and I will not be "breaking up"! But I do feel a strong desire to replace some (not all) of the physical affections of nursing with other expressions of Love. Sometimes I just want to snuggle and cuddle or even play wrestle (which involves her climbing all over me and me sometimes tickling or otherwise playing back) but not nurse. I am no longer game for an hour of non-stop nursing. It just doesn't feel right anymore. I feel like I have SO much Love to give her and so many new ways to show her my Love. Now, though, there is an adjustment for her to pick up on the game. When she first asks to nurse, I offer to hold her, to get her a snack or drink, or to play. This depends on whether I think she's aksing to nurse because a) she wants my physical affection, b) she is hungry or thirsty, c) she is bored. If none of these satisfies her and she still wants to nurse, we nurse. That's option d) Hey, mama, I just want to nurse.
Part of our nightweaning has involved my saint of a husband beginning to cosleep with Isa while I sleep alone. This has helped trememdously. He and I had a long discussion on how to help me stop being a total all the time. He asked what did I need to stop being so angry and so tired all the time. I answered unflinchingly in one word: sleep. So then we talked for hours (while Isa ran around the house naked and hyper and playing and singing and checking in with us, then running around some more) about how to make that happen. We voiced the unspeakable options ("Let's tranquilize her! ) and then tried to find options that didn't smack of child abuse. We came up with nightweaning and Joshua cosleeping with her. She sleeps longer when someone is sleeping near her, but she keeps me awake. Joshua was always willing to get up with her, but didn't wake up unless I woke him. But for three nights now he's been sleeping in her room and getting up with her when she wakes. She is already waking less often and getting to sleep more easily when she does wake. I have only needed to nurse her once a night (!!!) and am feeling like a million bucks when I wake up in the morning after having had at least one 4 hour stretch every night. Ahhh.... I feel so much better. Isa is getting better sleep too.
I feel like I know all of you so well. And I absolutely depend on the support of this group when I make decisions. I felt it necessary to tell my story in case anyone else is feeling the horrible guilt I was feeling about it. Or just so you'll know what may be coming for you when you do feel ready to begin weaning. In any case, I would appreciate any feedback you may have. I just felt like I needed to be honest with all of you on what Isa and I are going through right now. Thanks! And Lots of Love to those of you who made it through this long-winded post!:

[flapjack]

You know that both my boys weaned/ were weaned by 18 months, right? Alex self-weaned at 17 months after many, many nursing strikes starting from 8 months onwards, and it was a battle to keep him on the boob. OTOH, Isaac would happily have continued nursing a while longer, but I wanted my boobs back, my body back, my bed back- this happened at the same time as his dad and I split up as well, and after over two years of celibacy I gave myself permission to feel sexual again, which was part of it.
With Isaac, we went with "don't offer, don't refuse." His verbal skills, even at 17/ 18 months, weren't good enough for me to feel able to reason with him. He went from nursing 5-6 times a day, to 1-2 a day (middle of the night, mainly) to not waking at night. You may not want to hear this, but for both boys the midnight feed was the last one to go.
With Skye, we're DODRing now, and she's cut the amount of times she's nursing per day to 5-6, which is a level I'm happy with, including 1-2 night feeds. I'm not intending to wean her any time soon (particularly since I suddenly seem to be back to a "normal" menstrual cycle, so TTC, when we do, won't be an issue) but CLW isn't a goal of mine either. I figure there will be a time that seems right for us, but now isn't it.

[Queen of Cups]

I think every mother has to do what she had to do in order to be the best mom possible. If that includes gently weaning... then that's what you do. Do you go to LLL? One of the four series (one series is done each month) is on nutrition and weaning, and a LLL Leader can be a great help in finding weaning techniques that are gentle and non-traumatic.

Having said that, I really can't relate to the desire to wean... (and I'm not saying that at all judgmentally, just honestly) I've been tandem nursing for 15 months now, and while there are moments I'd like to get down to JUST ONE nursling, I don't feel comfortable weaning Killy. I love the closeness that come with breastfeeding (and I still get to cuddle and wrestle and all that stuff, nursing doesn't replace that for us), and most of the time I even like tandeming. When I have both children curled up nursing, it can be pure bliss. Ellie still seems like such a baby to me that it never even crossed my mind that she's a nursing toddler until I was telling a friend about how I saw a couple at church pointing when I was nursing Ellie. My friend said they were probably just surprised to see such a big girl nursing, and it blew my mind - I had never thought of Ellie as anything but a nursing baby! Oh, and I stopped offering mommy-milk to Killy after his second birthday (my goal is to nurse each of my kids to the 2-year mark recommended as a minimum by the WHO), but he still asked a ton of times every day. I will distract him sometimes, though, since he has a very "chompy" nurse that is uncomfortable if my breasts aren't really full. Luckily, I have over-supply issues, so I'm often plenty full! I'd say he nurses 2-3 times a day, and Ellie nurses at least 6-8 times a day and once during the night. I'm working toward gently night-weaning her, as everyone I've ever known who still nurses their 2+ year old at night deeply resents it. I don't want to end up there!

So, I looked at the pictures of Isa and I think she looks a lot like Ellie! I don't think I'd looked at her pics in a few months - her hair is really similar to Ellie's, and her face shape, too. Wild! She's very cute, of course! (and not just because she reminds me of Ellie!)

Ellie's saying more and more words! New words every couple of days! Yay! I can't wait till she can tell me exactly what she wants, and what she's thinking...

[MelW]

Originally Posted by spiritmomma

Before you argue, watch Ma Vie En Rose. You never know how she's feeling on the inside! Besides, I personally have gone through many phases in my life where I have identified with the males aspect, then felt very strongly feminine. Maybe she's feeling tomboy today

Yeah, I have no problems with whatever she wants to be. But also certainly not making assumptions about gender identity- in either direction. And her godfather (or faery godfather as he likes to be known) is a sometime drag queen, so she has people around that can offer a lot of insight into the many facets of gender identity. One day.

Jaymi~ I'm glad that you and Isa are working things out (and not breaking up ) Thanks for sharing your story with us, which I know can be risky in some places on MDC

I never had a "goal" for how long I would breastfeed, other than promising one more day at a time in the early agonizing days. I still don't; I sit on the fence about nightweaning, DODR, etc. I refuse sometimes on days when she asks every 15 minutes, I offer on days when she gets really distracted. We don't do cows milk, and only a little soymilk when my pumped stash is low. I'm kind of surprised that I don't care more about it, though I do have nights where I fantasize about night weaning at three am!

[MelW]

P.S.- QofC~ congrats on switching back to cloth!

[kaspirant]

Okay..i seriously have less than a minute...

I'm in for an address swap...I think it would be great! I also think we should do a birthday database too

okay i have to run again...I'll try to catch up soon...

But the wedding is ONE MONTH away...and Friday is the end of the 2nd trimester at school so grades are due once again...

*hugs* mamas~

[flapjack]

kaspirant, I put a section in the google spreadsheet for mamas to stick their DOB's. I had a fiddle, and I can't get into the spreadsheet when I'm not logged into google as me (if you see what I mean?) but the chances are that someone with talents that way could.

[MamaFern]

i met up with sarah and rowan today!! rowan is the sweetest little munchkin. the kids didnt really play together but they did kiss a few times . it was ever cute. sarah took some pictures, so she will probaly share them when she gets home.

ill write more later

[spughy]

Hi Mamas! We had an awesome time in Vancouver on the weekend. We met Fern and Ngaio and Elwynn (yay!) at Science World and the kiddies had a good time playing although Rowan was zonked out asleep when we got there. She woke up in time to play with the balls though - her favourite thing ever - and to be kissed by Ngaio. I got a picture of that - DH will post it sometime today. I wish I'd left more time to play at Science World - we missed a whole bunch of cool stuff and I'd really have liked to spend more time with Fern & co, but oh well - next time!

We also had fun at the aquarium on Saturday. Rowan was a little startled by dolphins leaping WAY over her but she really liked the big fish in the tanks - the sharks and the huge amazonian crazy-fish (ok, mama just forgot what they're called, but they're cool!) and the BEST part of the weekend, for her, was that the friends we were staying with had not one but TWO kitties who decided that being pawed by a toddler was preferable to hiding away from all the humans so Rowan got a whole lot of kitty love all weekend. And my friends got first-hand experience with toddler determination. (They're expecting a baby. It's good for them.)

Rowan also really loved the kiddie slide on the ferry. She spent the whole trip, both ways (when we weren't lining up for food) just climbing up the stairs and then sliding down. Totally ignored the other kids on the slide, to the point of crashing into them as she slid down, but they didn't seem to mind and nobody got hurt so that was all ok.

Oh and Amy - you'll appreciate this - Rowan slept the ENTIRE night through on the little trundle bed in my friend's guest room (I slept on the twin bed above it). Not one wakeup from 9 pm to 6:30 am. It's the SBS (strange bed syndrome). Weird huh?

[*Amy*]

Fern and Spughy - how wonderful that you got to spend time together! I am jealous! And Spughy, it figures, doesn't it??! I'm starting to think that it's just all of the new sights and sounds that wears her out when we travel - so much stimulation!! That's wonderful though; you must have felt like a new woman!!

Speaking of sleep, I am glad you shared your feelings about your situation, Jaymi, and I don't think it's anything you should feel bad about! After everything we've been through, I can 100% relate to your need for better sleep and for some transitions. We are still doing so much better with Brynn sleeping in her own space, and even though she still wakes ~3 times per night (and yes, I'm still getting up and nursing her in her room), everything is just so much more peaceful and we are all sleeping much better. But I can totally relate to the feelings of wanting to wean; before we reached this point a few weeks ago, I was having *serious* feelings of wanting to wean. Since things have settled down though, all of those feelings dissipated on their own, and I now really enjoy and get a lot of pleasure from our breastfeeding relationship. So however you all work it out, I hope you find peace and happiness! As we've all said a zillion times, you can be a much better mama and partner if some of *your* needs are being met too! (And PS: Yay to Joshua for being such a great partner to you right now!)

I'll jump in on the whole anatomy discussion here. We just call it her vagina, and I've tried to also show her where her labia are. She calls it her dye-nah. I am with you, Kavita: I just can't go there with cunt, mainly because that's what my alcoholic abusive step-father called me when I was a teenager. So, yeah, probably not going to get over that anytime soon! Also, I just think it's good for her to know the standard medical terminology for all of her parts, and hopefully that will keep her from feeling embarrassed or ashamed about it when she's at an age where she has to talk about those parts!

Oh, and Kavita, that conversation you and your DH had was *hilarious*. That has happened to me, too, where I have heard my own words coming out of DH's mouth as he has a conversation with someone else. It's so awesome.

So our news is that DH still doesn't have a job offer yet. The job in Nebraska seems to still be a possibility, Detroit is out (YAY!!!), and looks like he's also being considered for a job that may take us to either Oregon (where I grew up, and where my family still lives) or Atlanta (where my BFF lives!). Which, can I just say: HOORAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm keeping my fingers, toes, and eyes crossed!

Oh, and my MIL is coming up this weekend. : So not looking forward to that. Whatchya gonna do though? Sigh.

Well that's it for me. Brynn's been keeping herself entertained here in the office while I caught up. She's now flicking a rubber band off her teeth, so I guess we've entered the "negligent parent" mode.

[spughy]

Lovely pictures of Fern & her little mini-me, Ngaio, and my little solemn girl are up here: http://gallery.fishbc.com/gallery/vi...684&id=pic_017 Just click the arrow at the top right to see more!

[Kavita]

Originally Posted by *Amy*

I'll jump in on the whole anatomy discussion here. We just call it her vagina, and I've tried to also show her where her labia are. She calls it her dye-nah. I am with you, Kavita: I just can't go there with cunt, mainly because that's what my alcoholic abusive step-father called me when I was a teenager. So, yeah, probably not going to get over that anytime soon! Also, I just think it's good for her to know the standard medical terminology for all of her parts, and hopefully that will keep her from feeling embarrassed or ashamed about it when she's at an age where she has to talk about those parts!

So our news is that DH still doesn't have a job offer yet. The job in Nebraska seems to still be a possibility, Detroit is out (YAY!!!), and looks like he's also being considered for a job that may take us to either Oregon (where I grew up, and where my family still lives) or Atlanta (where my BFF lives!). Which, can I just say: HOORAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I'm keeping my fingers, toes, and eyes crossed!

Hey--don't knock Detroit!!! (My hometown!) Of course I don't actually live there now, but there are some hip areas of metro Detroit that you actually would probably like living in, so if you did end up there it would be okay. And they have an awesome symphony orchestra that does concerts for tots (I took my nephew when he was about 2 and he loved it) and the Detroit Institute of Arts is great--it is the fifth or sixth largest (depending on who you ask) fine art museum in the U.S., and has quite a few original works by the who's who in art history--including a huge area which has original murals painted by Diego Rivera. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit_Institute_of_Arts
And you could hang out with my sister and her kids too!

I like "dye-nah"! This probably dates me as the fossilized old lady of the group that I am, but it reminds me of J.J. in the show "Good Times" and his trademark tag line--so I think I am now going to rename my anatomy, my "Vagin-O-MITE!!!"

Spiritmomma, sorry if I was sort of a crankypants in my previous post! (Can I blame it on PMS? : ) This whole discussion definitely made me think about some things a little more deeply, so I appreciate that.