Last name issues

[deuxceleste]

DP and I are not married.

We haven't talked too much about last name for this baby... But he's always assumed we'd give it his.

Today I asked him why we'd never talked about giving him/her BOTH our last names, either as a hyphenation or as just two names...

He said, just about outright, NO. His exact words were "I'm not crazy about the idea." I asked why not. Him: "I'm just not."

Then he went back to watching basketball, no further discussion.

After the game, I asked him again, why he wasn't crazy about the idea.

"I'm just not."

He apparently has no reasons. But the really screwed up part is that my sister called, and we were talking about names. I named off a few names that she suggested, and finally he just said "I don't care"... all this was BEFORE the last name conversation.

How can you NOT CARE about a first name, or even just SAY you don't care, but be so adamant about the last name. I'm not taking his name OUT... I was just suggesting we add mine IN.

I told him (once I was good and pissed) that if he really KNEW me, he'd know that I'm not even the type to take a MAN's last name if I MARRY him. I'd keep my own or hyphenate. In fact, before I met him not-so-long-ago, I was considering changing my last name legally to my mother's maiden name. Because that's the family with which I associate myself. That name is Medeiros... full blown Portuguese. DP is Irish. The name we have chosen for a middle name (which I'm actually not crazy about) is Irish. The FIRST name I suggested is Irish. They're all effin' Irish. So if this kid is to be named "Hisheritage Hisheritage Hislastname", then where the hell do I fit in???

Can you lead me through the thinking-this-out process, ladies? I'm really starting to get pissy about this.

[karen1968]

OK, the snarky side of me says, "You're the mom; you arent' married...you get to fill out the birth certificate any way you want!"

Probably not helpful.

Whenever DH and I came to a sticking point, whoever felt the most strongly and had the best arguments "won." This is what happened with circumcision - he had no reasons, just his belief that it was better. I had reasons AND a strong belief that it wasn't. So our son is intact.

So, if your DP has no reason...that's no argument. He "loses." I would, however, suggest compromise is in order on such an important issue.

I was always certain I wouldn't change my last name, esp. since my maiden name is so unique. But when it came down to it, I realized that we would be a family, and I wanted all of us - me, DH, any kids - to share a last name. Because DH is a teacher, changing his last name would cause all sorts of difficulties, so I changed mine...and kept my maiden name as a middle name.

[kennedy444]

I don't have personal experience but my good friend was not married to her now husband when their first child was born. The child was given both ln, hyphenated. When they got married, mom hyphenated her name. Their next two children also now carry hyphenated ln.

You could use your ln as child's mn as a compromise but I think your dp would have to give a better reason than "because" before I"d compromise.

[seeing_stars]

I think that the last name is a pride thing for some men.

When my son was born in 12/04 I was single and gave him my last name, it just made sense. His father eventually got involved and requested that we change our son's name to his last name. I said no. My son was born an Allen and I had worked hard to raise him on my own for a year, dropping my last name would have been bad symbolism. We decided to hyphenate it my maiden name-dad's last name and it works out well.

I don't know that that whole little story helps you any since you and the father are together, but I would say that if it is important to you, you need to fight for it. Maybe two middle names? If you think that you'd keep your maiden name if you got married it makes a lot of sense to me to hyphenate the last name that way both of you are "connected" for parent/teacher conferences and so forth at school.

[AngieB]

This is just my two cents but I don't like the idea of hyphenated names. I think it just makes things confusing and harder on the person with the two last names. I think giving the baby DH's or DP's last name is a good way for him and his family to feel connected to the baby. You are it's mother, you have carried it inside of you, you will give birth to it, ect...., but your DP does not have that connection yet. What he can give the child is his family name as a way of say in a public and private way "you are my child!" If you want your heritage include give the child your family name as the middle name or as I've done I've named my children after my family members. My oldest DD has my grandmothers Maiden name as her first name and GM first name as her middle.

As a side not (i'm not trying to lecture or anything) probable bring up a touchy subject while DP is trying to watch a basketball game may not be a good idea. I would get about the same responce if I did that to DH.

[lunabelly]

Dh and I are going through something like this. When we got married we took each other's last names, so both of our names our hyphenated. We had agreed that the baby would also have a hyphenated last name-- until two nights ago. Now he says if the baby is a boy he wants him to have just his last name because he thinks the hyphenated name will upset his parents. But it won't upset his parents if it's a girl because girls don't carry on the family name anyway??!! wtf? His parents are old and traditional, so I see where he's coming from, but I totally don't agree and have been putting off the discussion.

just fyi-- My ex and I weren't married when my dd was born, and I gave her his last name because I thought it would help him feel bonded in some way. Now I wish I'd hyphenated her last name, too, so our blended family would all have at least one last name that was the same. She doesn't seem to be bothered by it, though. She's 10 now. I don't know if that's any help.

[Arwyn]

Hyphenate. I grew up with a hyphenated last name, and I loved it (we seriously considered hyphenating when we changed our names, but went with a blended name instead. I actually miss the hyphen). If you feel strongly about it, don't just give in.

BTW, if you're not married, the default is/should be the kid gets YOUR last name. Tell him you want to hyphenate out of love for him, because the other choice is his name isn't a part of it at all. :

[habibekindheart]

I had the same situation with my first...wasn't married, etc. My parents threw a fit and I ended up giving her my last name.

The next year, DP and I got married and I went with a hyphenated name for a few years. Even with the hyphenated name for ME, when I tried to get services for my daughter (who was extremely disabled) people wanted proof of adoption or other proof that she was mine/ours. It was frustrating.

After a few years, I dropped my hyphenated last name and just went with my husband's name. I always wished I could change Ashleigh's name to my husband's, but it would have been too much grief and aggravation considering the programs she was on, etc.

As for me, my philosophy on names changed over the years, and now I'm offended when people don't call me "Mrs. Myhusband'sname" because I married him and have put up with him for almost a decade and a half. I deserve the title and it WILL be used. I get sick of people calling me 'Mizz' in a snide way.

[EvolvingMama]

Wow. There are so many thoughts on this issue! Here's my experience:

My first child, who's now 11, has a hypenated name. His dad and I were married and each kept our family names, and agreed to hypenate our son's. Later on, I hypenated my name. Now we are divorced. My son still goes by his hyphenated name....it's really no big deal. Sometimes I notice him playing around with his name, using mine as the last and at other times, his dad's. It's just fine, easy.

I am almost ready to have another son, now, and I'm single. I was with the father for several months, haven't seen him since I conceived/broke up! We talked for awhile, then I requested that we keep it in writing and work toward a legal arrangement to co-parent our son. He lives 5 hours away. Since I put my foot down, said I am not interested in being with him in a relationship, and have insisted on going through legal channels to include him as the father, he has NOT RESPONDED. It's been almost 4 months now.

At one time, he was insistent that the baby have his last name. Now, he's just disappeared. Sure, (as with another poster), he may show up later and step up to be involved. For now, I am planning on my son having MY family name, because this pregnancy has totally been my own gig....I have made this baby, my family has been very involved, and neither he NOR his family have said anything to me for 4 months!

So, there are 2 different scenarios. The first probably pertains more to you, deux, because you are WITH the father. Just know that my son's dad did NOT feel slighted at all by hyphenating....

[deuxceleste]

Originally Posted by AngieB

As a side not (i'm not trying to lecture or anything) probable bring up a touchy subject while DP is trying to watch a basketball game may not be a good idea. I would get about the same responce if I did that to DH.

agreed... but the convo actually started before the game, which was TiVo'ed

[deuxceleste]

Wow. You all have such interesting and heartfelt stories, and I'm glad you understand that this isn't just about a NAME...

We haven't had too much conversation about it today... about much of anything, really, but as with the circumcision and other issues, I'm holding strong to this one. He is NOT happy about this but it seems that his problem is more with the hyphenation than with my last name.

I'll keep you all posted, and I'm still really interested in hearing all your stories. They've helped a lot.

[attachedmamaof3]

I was hyphenated at birth...mom's-dad's....ended up using dad's...it's just easier. Got preg w/DS#1 unmarried...he has my last name...6 yrs later married DP (yes, I'm THAT hard to get hahaaa) now have DS#2 and DD who have DH's last name. I kept my last name, so DS#1 having a different last name than his siblings hasn't caused any problems and if it does, we'll address it at that time...I agree with PPs who stated that whoever has an 'actual reason' and strong feelings to back them up should 'win' (for lack of a better word)....

completely OT but that's exactly how we ended up:
1) getting married: DH had reasons and felt strongly about it
2) having homebirths: for the 1st I had reasons and felt strongly the rest were mutual
3) have intact, non-vax children
4)etc etc etc etc

[deuxceleste]

Originally Posted by attachedmamaof3

completely OT but that's exactly how we ended up:
1) getting married: DH had reasons and felt strongly about it
2) having homebirths: for the 1st I had reasons and felt strongly the rest were mutual
3) have intact, non-vax children
4)etc etc etc etc

Nope that's not OT at all... That's how we ended up with a homebirth, with plans to NOT circ, and plans to at least delay vaxes, among other things.

He complains that I have an argument for everything... well yes. But I do all the research. Huh. So yes, I'm with the PP who said that, too.

[Nicole77]

I am married so I have a slightly different situation but here is what we did anyway. When we married I kept my name and he kept his. Our children have a hyphenated last name (my name-his name) on their birth certificates. However, that is the only place their names are hyphenated. On their social security cards, school records, every day stuff they use only my name. This way his name is there legally and if they choose to use the hyphenated versions as adults it is there for them but their daily name is the same as mine. Dh is the one in our family with a different last name. I could not imagine my children not having my last name since I carried them in my body, birthed them, kept them alive with my body for the first year, and am the one who is with them in their world/school/daily activities most of the time. I also could not imagine having changed my name when I married since it had been my name for twenty-something years and was a part of my identity (same as dh couldn't imagine changing his). But, I am a pretty big proponent of matrilineal naming traditions so maybe I am just freaky!

For what it is worth dh agrees with me completely and has never felt like he is not just as much a part of the family just because he has a different last name. But if he had had a big problem with them having just my name then we would have used the hyphenated version, not just his name. I am glad that dh was so cool because I am not a fan of a long, hyphenated name for daily use. It always seemed a bit cumbersome for little kids and then what do they end up naming their kids someday?

[Mummytwice]

When it came time to discuss last names with my x when we were still together- he was all about the baby having his last name. He didn't have any arguments other than 'it's MY baby'. Hmmmm, try again.

He was all about the pride and sperm.

I offered to hyphenate- we semi-agreed. It became a moot point b/c we split before DD was born.

I would not give the baby *just* his last name- if there was ever a split between the two of you, it could cause some problems.

My sister grew up with two last names- long story- and ended up hyphenating b/c on some of her documents she was Y and on others she was Z. So if you do choose to hyphenate, be consistant.

[PiePie]

I AM married and giving the babe-to-be MY last name (which is not the same as DH's).

I am curious as to why you suggested Irish first and middle names if you feel like they are "his heritage"?

[marnie]

i have a friend who has 2 children with her partner of 20 years - they are unmarried. though they are both american, and not of spanish heritage, they use the Spanish system of name patronym matronym

meaning if i'm jane smith and my partner is john doe my kid is susie doe smith.

Some people, for ease of use, use the father's past name (as they do in spain). Some people use the mother's, since it's the name written last.

Legally, both parents are represented, they don't care what people choose to use casually, and the child can introduce him/herself any way s/he likes when older.

[Yo Becca]

DP and I are married, but both kept our own names. We discussed hyphenating, but neither of us was excited about it - so we just kept our own. When we got preg w/ DD, we again discussed hyphenating, but ultimately decided to go w/ a 4-name system - each kid will have their own first and middle name, then my last name as a 2nd middle name and his last name as a last name. It works for us, and if the kids ever want to use both names of hyphenate, they can.

Yes, there are *many* people who refer to me by DH's last name - I correct them most of the time, but gently b/c it's usually confusion, not bullying. we get lots of mail to "mr and mrs. x", but when we write back, we always put our correct names. ANd when we handwrite return addresses we use a / as in Smith/Doe or Smith/Doe Family.

We made a bunch of copies of our marriage cert. and I carry a copy and copy of DD's birth certificate if I'm trying to enroll in something or anytime we travel. So if there's any question that I am her mother, or that I am DP's spouse, it's easily answered (b/c the main reason we got legally married was to receive the heterosexist benefits of legal marriage - so I won't give them up easily : ) I have less greif from mine and DD's names being different than I do from DP and I having different names.

I have a friend with a hyphenated name, and she would have it no different. She uses just the last name in casual conversation, but the full version for anything formal.

[deuxceleste]

Originally Posted by Yo Becca

DP and I are married, but both kept our own names. We discussed hyphenating, but neither of us was excited about it - so we just kept our own. When we got preg w/ DD, we again discussed hyphenating, but ultimately decided to go w/ a 4-name system - each kid will have their own first and middle name, then my last name as a 2nd middle name and his last name as a last name. It works for us, and if the kids ever want to use both names of hyphenate, they can.

That was my idea too!

But his argument to THAT was that when the kid gets married which name will he choose and what will the wife choose if it's a boy and yadda yadda...

In all honesty I thought that was a silly reason. Didn't tell him so, but I also didn't have an answer, so that could have been mistaken for agreement lol

[Arwyn]

Originally Posted by deuxceleste

But his argument to THAT was that when the kid gets married which name will he choose and what will the wife choose if it's a boy and yadda yadda...

In all honesty I thought that was a silly reason. Didn't tell him so, but I also didn't have an answer, so that could have been mistaken for agreement lol

Yes, it is a silly reason. Let the kid choose! I was Arwyn Smith-Doe, partnered G Jones, and we had a multitude of options. My second choice, and the one my mother advocated for, was Arwyn and G Smith-Jones. Part of me still wishes we'd done that, but what we did instead was Arwyn and G Smones (well, more complicated than that, but you get the idea).

My brother married a Roberts (not really, but privacy and all...), and really wanted to be Smith-Roberts, or Roberts-Smith, and the only reason they didn't is because his wife (my SIL ) has Opinions, so even though he WANTED to change his name, she took on Smith-Doe. What will their kid do? Who knows? Maybe drop her name all together, maybe be a Doe-McMichael, maybe keep her name, maybe she'll even decide to go back to Roberts, or be Roberts-McMichael. All are legitimate choices, and in any case none of it will up to you. Your kid's going to do what they want with their name either way, and you'll have basically no say in it. The only thing you can do is attempt to pass on your values by what name you choose for yourself, and what name you give them. The values will be heard and internalized, whether they (and the name) are ultimately kept, or rejected.