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If you religiously oppose masterbation... - Page 9

post #161 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by fericito View Post
Will you expound? How is that passive aggressive? I'd really like to know as I agree with her.
How to explain that I find placing a pleasurable temptation in someones hands yet telling them if they really love you they won't use it? I'm not sure I can explain *how* I find that passive aggressive, I simply do.
post #162 of 472
new response from my mate Evan-san:
Quote:
If G-d opposed masturbation, why did He give us thumbs???

post #163 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by momma2emerson View Post
Many (most, perhaps almost ALL) people feel the need to masturbate at some point during their lives. Circumcision isn't going to prevent that need/desire. Perhaps, the child's religious convictions will prevent them from doing it, but cutting off a body part (unless it's the hands) isn't going to stop it.
YES that. thanks for bringing the thread back to center.
post #164 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by artgoddess View Post
How to explain that I find placing a pleasurable temptation in someones hands yet telling them if they really love you they won't use it? I'm not sure I can explain *how* I find that passive aggressive, I simply do.
P-A and verging on emotional abuse.
post #165 of 472
yes, but isn't that the whole point of the garden of eden story? so it goes on from there, i guess.
post #166 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by artgoddess View Post
Seems a little passive aggressive to me.


Hey you! Pregnant lady! There is a moist delicious chocolate cake on the kitchen counter, now to prove you love me I want you to not eat it.
it goes beyond proving love or loyalty. it's about personal growth as well. so asking your SO not to cheat is passive aggressive and wrong? we are asked within our lives and/or for spiritual reasons not to do a lot of things.
as for your example oh boy that would be tempting! but beyond the 'if you loved me you wouldn't eat it' there are many a reason not to indulge in a sugar filled chocolate cake while growing a new life in my womb. but who cares. i'm off to buy one. :
post #167 of 472
No, I can follow that line of reasoning; ie. look at Lent. I was brought up that it's important for us to give up something important to us so that we have some small appreciation of Christ's suffering. And, I do believe we need to teach our kids some self-control; ie. sure, go ahead and eat that entire box of doughnuts but you're going to feel really ill afterwards....
But, I guess I still don't understand why masturbation itself is wrong. Okay, it's the natural man/body. I get that. But, so is self indulging on food, alcohol, clothes, cosmetics, etc etc. So...I suppose that if one valued a spartan, simple, lifestyle w/denial of physical pleasure then that would make sense to me; ie. it is simply one more pleasure we're not allowed to enjoy.

BUt, in and of itself...nope, doesn't make sense if it's just b/c it has a sexual nature.
post #168 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by BusyMommy View Post
No, I can follow that line of reasoning; ie. look at Lent. I was brought up that it's important for us to give up something important to us so that we have some small appreciation of Christ's suffering. And, I do believe we need to teach our kids some self-control; ie. sure, go ahead and eat that entire box of doughnuts but you're going to feel really ill afterwards....
But, I guess I still don't understand why masturbation itself is wrong. Okay, it's the natural man/body. I get that. But, so is self indulging on food, alcohol, clothes, cosmetics, etc etc. So...I suppose that if one valued a spartan, simple, lifestyle w/denial of physical pleasure then that would make sense to me; ie. it is simply one more pleasure we're not allowed to enjoy.

BUt, in and of itself...nope, doesn't make sense if it's just b/c it has a sexual nature.
i totally see what you are saying. i guess for me it comes down to that pleasure is meant to strengethen the bond between couples. it's something in my life that only my husband and i share and that is what i will teach my children. that being said no one can deny that it feels freaking great and that its hard not to take maters into our own hands at times. if you masturbate you're not going to be condemned to hell forever, IMO. it's a sin, again IMO, becuase God has asked us to refrain from it because it takes away from the point of that pleasure and drifts into indulgence. that's my thought on 'why not'. and it's a personal 'why not'. i don't expect everyone to follow my spiritual mindset.
post #169 of 472
the way i see masturbation is it is not just something that feels good. it is a way that i can take care of myself. masturbation can be beautiful and wonderful it can be a form of self love, a way to know one self and what feels good so that you can show your partner new ways to help you feel good. i can't really comprehend how a way of caring for and loving oneself by doing something that can be healing and soothing can be a sin. i don't understand how a god could think that masturbation is wrong? my experience has been that it isn't just something pleasurable it is something that is so much more. i very much hope my children will never feel ashamed of masturbating or think it is wrong or sinful. i would be very sad if they ever felt that way.

and back to the topic
it is very sad that anyone would circumcise a child to try and prevent them from doing something that can be so healthy and good.
post #170 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by moonfroggy View Post
the way i see masturbation is it is not just something that feels good. it is a way that i can take care of myself. masturbation can be beautiful and wonderful it can be a form of self love, a way to know one self and what feels good so that you can show your partner new ways to help you feel good. i can't really comprehend how a way of caring for and loving oneself by doing something that can be healing and soothing can be a sin. i don't understand how a god could think that masturbation is wrong? my experience has been that it isn't just something pleasurable it is something that is so much more. i very much hope my children will never feel ashamed of masturbating or think it is wrong or sinful. i would be very sad if they ever felt that way.



that's EXACTLY how i feel about it, and it took me YEARS to get past what i went through growing up to reach this state of mind (which by the way were totally worth spending on this particular getting-over-ness...).
post #171 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by klg47 View Post
I'm about 3 pages behind on replies, but I'll try to get to them eventually. . .
Never mind about getting to the replies - it seems that this thread has turned into "If you oppose those who religiously oppose masturbation. . ." instead of "If you religiously oppose masturbation. . ."
post #172 of 472
I have a few thoughts. First, for many women orgasm is difficult and without masturbating I'm not sure how a woman can learn to have an orgasm. I think of masturbation as "self-care."

I also do not think it's possible to discuss the sinfulness of masturbation with children without damaging them with unhealthy shame. Children have sexual feelings which they explore. This is normal and natural and (I think) a positive thing.
post #173 of 472
To the OP - why does your friend think uncircumcised men masturbate more than circed men? What evidence does she have?

Believe me, MOST the men I've known - friends & boyfriends - have told me they religiously masturbated (hee hee) during their teen years, and 95% of them were circumicised. Please do not let your friend think that circing her son will prevent masturbating. !!
post #174 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by klg47 View Post
Never mind about getting to the replies - it seems that this thread has turned into "If you oppose those who religiously oppose masturbation. . ." instead of "If you religiously oppose masturbation. . ."
I don't think that is true at all, and I find the assumption that people who don't understand why a person would be opposed to masturbation are opposed to the person rather than the idea it's a sin insulting and offensive.
post #175 of 472
Just wanted to recommend a book for Moms of boys about to go through puberty...or going through puberty... "What's Going On Down There" by Karen Gravelle (she wrote "The Period Book"). A friend of two sons highly recommends it.

http://www.amazon.com/Whats-Going-Do...5139183&sr=1-1
post #176 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by artgoddess View Post
I don't think that is true at all, and I find the assumption that people who don't understand why a person would be opposed to masturbation are opposed to the person rather than the idea it's a sin insulting and offensive.
I'm 97% sure you knew exactly what I meant, but just in case, I'll rephrase it to "If you oppose the ideas or beliefs of those who religiously oppose masturbation"
post #177 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by klg47 View Post
I'm 97% sure you knew exactly what I meant, but just in case, I'll rephrase it to "If you oppose the ideas or beliefs of those who religiously oppose masturbation"
Actually no, I am not in the habit of assuming people mean something different than what they say. Nice way to try make a dig at me for letting you know I was offended by what you said though.
post #178 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by artgoddess View Post
Nice way to try make a dig at me for letting you know I was offended by what you said though.
In that case, just remember the famous quote: "He who takes offense where none was intended is a fool. And he who takes offense where it was intended is a greater fool." I think MDC would run more smoothly if EVERY member would keep this in mind, me included
post #179 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChasingPeace View Post
I have a few thoughts. First, for many women orgasm is difficult and without masturbating I'm not sure how a woman can learn to have an orgasm.
I hear this from many women and it always makes me so sad. Dh has been my only sexual partner and maybe I just got lucky but I find it (fairly) easy and have always wondered why people say they don't.

Maybe it depends on your partner?
post #180 of 472
Quote:
Originally Posted by magstphil View Post
i totally see what you are saying. i guess for me it comes down to that pleasure is meant to strengethen the bond between couples. it's something in my life that only my husband and i share and that is what i will teach my children. that being said no one can deny that it feels freaking great and that its hard not to take maters into our own hands at times. if you masturbate you're not going to be condemned to hell forever, IMO. it's a sin, again IMO, becuase God has asked us to refrain from it because it takes away from the point of that pleasure and drifts into indulgence. that's my thought on 'why not'. and it's a personal 'why not'. i don't expect everyone to follow my spiritual mindset.
Okay, that makes sense to me. : I don't personally agree but I respect that reasoning. It is a personal choice btw couples and as long as you're on the same page, that's healthy.
I would think the teen issue is murkier, though. I would just hope that "abstaining" as a teen doesn't make one rush into marriage just for the sexual gratification; ie. perhaps mast. serves as an outlet so kids can hold off and look for their "soul mate" longer.
This reminds me so much of the "purity ball" thread but I honestly can't remember how it ended. ahhh sweet senility.....
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