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Which is harder, dogs or kids? - Page 5

post #81 of 107
ITA. I thought I loved my cat til I had kids. If you have both and want to offer up that opinion, that it's the same amount of involvement or love, then I don't really care. (although without the need for daycare or a sahp, you'd have trouble convincing me ) But I really hate when people who don't have kids make the comparison and then get all whipped up when people with kids tell them how offensive that is. I'm not telling you you don't love your pet and that they're not a lot of work But ime it's always the pet people making the comparison in some effort to justify their pet love, and I find it a pointless and even offensive comparison.

Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
OMG. I hear this a lot from childless people. "Oh but I have pets, it's sort of like kids."

Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.
post #82 of 107
Maybe it's all in people's definition of "harder". I took it to mean "a greater spiritual challenge, a bigger responsibility, deeper and ever-evolving committment". Others are thinking of "more hassle, more frustrating".

To me, the offensiveness of the dog/child comparison is NOT about the love or the bond or the nurturing. It's about the recognition that children should never, in any way, be owned or subjected to the inherent and permanent inequality of a person/pet relationship.
post #83 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mountaingirl3 View Post
Maybe it's all in people's definition of "harder". I took it to mean "a greater spiritual challenge, a bigger responsibility, deeper and ever-evolving committment". Others are thinking of "more hassle, more frustrating".
By either of those definitions, I see kids as way harder.
post #84 of 107
i find it offensive when people who dont have kids compare having a dog to having a kid, because there is no way they could know. even if they have babysat for five million hours, it is not the same as having your own kid.
i dont think id be very bothered by someone who has kids saying their dog is harder, because they are speaking for themselves, and thats ok with me. but really, i have never known anyone irl who has kids and claims their dog is harder.
and i honestly dont think its about a deeper bond with child/parent vs. animal/human. i had a really deep bond with a cat for 17 years, and y'all are going to think i've gone off the deep end, but i'm not sure i loved him less than i love my kids. but kids are way more complex, and their lives will last longer and have a greater impact on the world than any other animal i can think of. and stuff like, a cat i can leave with my mom for a year, and he might really miss me, and i him, but i think once i return, he will be the same cat he ever was. not so with a kid. those kind of choices shape them forever, and they are my resonsibility, and will effect my grandkids, and their grandkids,etc. hmm, maybe that is the deeper bond pp mentioned. not exactly just a love bond, but a biological bond, too. yep. way harder.
post #85 of 107
That is the best sig I've seen all day.
post #86 of 107
Most dogs i have had have been harder than my child (who is 10 now) at any point in his development. Esp when he was a baby....soooo easy to tote him around in a sling, nurse, etc, i didnt really find it much of a challenge at all. Toddlerhood/preschool age was a lot more challenging than his babyhood, but in retrospect it was because i wasnt parenting him properly (didnt really respect his high energy "spirited" ways)...now, at age 10...i would say its very easy.

I found housebreaking a dog, having to be home at a certain time each day to make sure it got walked, keeping the dog from getting into the trash or eating the couch, coping with the crying if the dog wasnt crate trained and i was trying to do that, peeing on the carpet, etc etc.....just so much harder than anything i've had to do as a parent.

Honestly, i read on an email list recently (for hopeful adoptive parents), someone wrote "Whether its a bio child or an adopted one, parenting is hard..." and i was scratching my head. I dont find it hard at all. Maybe if i was juggling several children spaced closely together or something...ok i could see that....but as it is now, no. Not hard. And i'm a single mom too!


Katherine
post #87 of 107
I could be wrong--you might find more kids just as easy--but I'm going to say that easy parenting stops with the second pregnancy or second adoption process. (ftr, I personally found just one child challenging, but she was high-needs and I got pg when she was 10 months.)

I have a friend who doesn't get why I have no left-over energy, or why my life with three kids isn't as organized and Zen as her life with one. I asked her to imagine all the time, thought, effort, concern and nurturing she puts into her daughter and then triple it!
post #88 of 107
1 high need kid is enough to break anybody. At least I can put the dog outside.
post #89 of 107
I gotta say, Prenna's God Mother is The Dog Lady... she works for the county and does animal rescue (I don't just mean rescue from neglect or homelessness, girl is trained to rappel (sp?) down a cliff to rescue a dog/cat/goat...) and has a "pack" of five dogs, 2 ferrets, a cat and a bird. And she has had more trips to the vet e.r. in the 2 years that dd has been alive than any parent I know, with puntured eyes, torn ears, etc.... She stayed up all night "nursing" her husky pups with bottles (their mother, I think, had been killed, orphaning them) for weeks, and then was still up all night, trying to kennel train and poopie train, etc, for months. She regularly has to take some of them, or all of them in to work with her, if it's gonna be a long day, (the doggie version of day care while she's on calls...) and loses more sleep than I do, worrying about them if there's trouble, or whatever. She is definitely a Dog-Mom, and I think she'd chaff at anyone suggesting that her job as Dog-Mom is easier or less rewarding or less valid than being a Baby-Mom. (I smirk sometimes, inside, when she talks about how she doesn't intend to have children, seeing all the animals she sincerely mothers...)

Granted, as artgoddess put it (I think) she's not goona be giving any of the "pack" the keys to the car, etc... but I don't think she worries less than I do... just differently.
post #90 of 107
I find my children far more challenging than my dogs.
post #91 of 107
Um, babies. The level of total responsibility for a human being with 24hour needs doesn't compare with having a dog at all. But I certainly do believe humans are superior to dogs by any measure that I find significant, and though we have pets whom we care for conscientiously, I don't consider them to be 'family members' let alone equivalent to my children.
post #92 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by ccohenou View Post
Um, babies. The level of total responsibility for a human being with 24hour needs doesn't compare with having a dog at all. But I certainly do believe humans are superior to dogs by any measure that I find significant, and though we have pets whom we care for conscientiously, I don't consider them to be 'family members' let alone equivalent to my children.
ITA with this.
post #93 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
Um, no it's not. Not remotely like having kids. I find that whole line of thinking offensive and a bit disturbing.
Huh. How weird. What part of it is disturbing and offensive?

I have three dogs, two of which are Jack Russells, and to anyone who knows the breed, I don't need to elaborate. But for those who don't, they are never ending balls of inquisitive energy. To say "oh yeah but you can crate them and leave them alone for a little while".. HAHAHAHA!! That's funny. Um, no you can't. This is NOT a breed that can simply be crated and left alone. Reliably. They need constant supervision, and to be left alone they need to be well fed, well exercised, well trained, and well stimulated.

My two jack russells are by far harder then having a child. When Rhino was an only Jack I wouldn't have thought so, but two of them.. oh my word!

I can communicate with my child now. I'll NEVER be able to communicate with my dogs. My daughter will eventually be potty trained. I will ALWAYS have to walk my dogs in the rain, both of them tangling me up and tripping me, in the middle of the night. Their life expectancy is 15 years. I'd rather change a diaper that takes all of 3 minutes, instead of walking down the side of the road in the pissing down rain until Rhino finds the "perfect spot" to have a dump, then get down with the flash light, find it, bag it, then carry it back while trying to manage two small, and FAST dogs on a leash while holding a bag of warm crap. Potty training with kids happens around what, 2? 3? Um, yeah, I have 12 years of poop patrol left. Sorry you're offended by that.

ETA: And, my daughter is high needs. Has slept a handful of times on her own, nurses every 2 hours still at a year old, always wants me with her, etc, and I STILL think my dogs are hard work. This is saying a lot about my dogs if I think they are harder then my baby.
post #94 of 107
After reading this thread, I'm sure glad I have cats. And only one child.
post #95 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by North_Of_60 View Post
Huh. How weird. What part of it is disturbing and offensive?

I have three dogs, two of which are Jack Russells, and to anyone who knows the breed, I don't need to elaborate. But for those who don't, they are never ending balls of inquisitive energy. To say "oh yeah but you can crate them and leave them alone for a little while".. HAHAHAHA!! That's funny. Um, no you can't. This is NOT a breed that can simply be crated and left alone. Reliably. They need constant supervision, and to be left alone they need to be well fed, well exercised, well trained, and well stimulated.

My two jack russells are by far harder then having a child. When Rhino was an only Jack I wouldn't have thought so, but two of them.. oh my word!

I can communicate with my child now. I'll NEVER be able to communicate with my dogs. My daughter will eventually be potty trained. I will ALWAYS have to walk my dogs in the rain, both of them tangling me up and tripping me, in the middle of the night. Their life expectancy is 15 years. I'd rather change a diaper that takes all of 3 minutes, instead of walking down the side of the road in the pissing down rain until Rhino finds the "perfect spot" to have a dump, then get down with the flash light, find it, bag it, then carry it back while trying to manage two small, and FAST dogs on a leash while holding a bag of warm crap. Potty training with kids happens around what, 2? 3? Um, yeah, I have 12 years of poop patrol left. Sorry you're offended by that.

ETA: And, my daughter is high needs. Has slept a handful of times on her own, nurses every 2 hours still at a year old, always wants me with her, etc, and I STILL think my dogs are hard work. This is saying a lot about my dogs if I think they are harder then my baby.

Your post reminds me of earlier when I said that no one with older kids would say that dogs are harder than kids. They may be harder than your baby but wait until your baby gets older...no comparison.
post #96 of 107
Wow, I must be doing something wrong, because I have two dogs and two kids, and there is just *no* comparison. Every day I go to lengths for my children that I would never tolerate for a pet.
post #97 of 107
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hazelnut View Post
ITA. I thought I loved my cat til I had kids.
Word. But I say this to my friends who haven't had kids yet, but plan to--and who are big time cat people--and they look at me like "omg...she's actually satan, and we never knew." It's seriously like sacrilege to suggest to them that they will not always hold Fluffy in the same regard.

I found that I got (possibly too many) cats as a baby substitute. Now they are way lower on my totem poll. Of course I still feed them, love them, and put up with their infuriating antics, including a raging turf war at the moment. But they are nowhere NEAR as important. When I was pregnant I would stress about what I would do if I had to choose between the pets and my baby. What if she has horrible cat allergies, what if there's a fire...I cringe to think I ever thought it was an issue. My child wins, hands down, every time. Sorry, kitties.

The dog still holds a softer spot in my heart, but still NOTHING like the massive, flaming love and protectiveness for my daughter.

As for ease, phhhhbt. Wow. My dog has never once had a three alarm poop on my sweater at three am while running a fever and biting my nipples and trying to crawl off the end of the bed. We taught her all the commands she knows in less than a month and we can leave her for 8 hours with a water bowl and some toys.
post #98 of 107
Dogs are a total PIA but not nearly as much work as my kids.

My dogs are loved but they are just dogs and if push came to shove I could find them another loving home. My kids are human and will demand from me everything I have until the day I die and I could and would never give them up.
post #99 of 107
The question "which is harder, dogs or kids?" is ambiguous. If the question is who has greater needs, obviously, it's the kids. In that sense, kids are "harder."

If the question is "whose needs are more difficult to meet?" My answer is the dog's--thus dogs are "harder."

Everyone I would trust to care for my dogs, I would also trust to care for my kids. There are many people I trust with my kids, but I'd never leave my dogs in their care.

My mom is an excellent example. She's a fabulous grandmother. She takes great care of my kids. Her dog has only left his backyard chain a handful of times in the past decade. There's no way I'd ever ask her to care for my dogs.

I know so many people who have dogs who shouldn't (like my mom.) I know lots of people who parent differently than I do, but I wouldn't say that any of them shouldn't have had children.

What I'm saying is that its pretty easy to put the needs of a child in an appropriate place in the household heirarchy. Obviously, the kids deserve a high rank. It's much more difficult for some folks to provide appropriate care for a dog. Afterall, it's just a dog. :
post #100 of 107
Okay, I didn't read all six pages of posts.

Dogs never grow up. You always have to feed them. You always have to clean up after them. They never learn to bathe themselves.

I'm not a pet person, can you tell? My DP came with 3 dogs. It's been an adjustment.
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