Young Moms who didn't plan their kids (current and former members)

[crazyeight]

I am guessing this is the right place because its more of a Money prob/whine than a parenting issue.

I am 21 (22 in may), DH just turned 22. We have 2 kids both VERY unplanned. Long (sweet) story short; DH and I married on a whim after ds was born and no planning (including financial) was ever discussed. We started out with an apt. a broken down car, a negative bank account (it was dh!!), and hand me down stuff.

I compare out lifestyles to so many people except the ones who matter. Friends of DH are childless (and more the norm non-married but "partners") they have nice (High enough rent they could own) houses, fairly nice cars, double income "homes". My mom friends (mostly 30-40yr olds) have the decent cars, large (owned) homes, extra monies for this and that, nice swing sets, ability to go on vacations with or without kids etc. I guess you get the idea.

Although I understand both situations and why we aren't in them and the fact that I am looking at this as a "grass is alwasy greener on the other side of the fence" view I still just wonder. As a specific example one of the women at the moms group has a BEAUTIFUL house (huge house) they spent $235K to buy, $200K to renovate (over a few years) and now have a $750K home. : Although we don't even HAVE that kind of money I just feel like even if we did we would not be able to do that...just like I/We have bad luck or bad timing or both I guess. At this point we have pretty much nothing still; 3 credit cards with only ONE (military approved and useable only on the base) above $1000, 2 car loans, and pretty much zilch in the house could ever be sold for much of anything. I just feel that when we have to move we are going to be so far into debt replacing everyday items that wouldn't be cost effective to move. KWIM?

So point of the post:
Are their any other moms out there that can vouch that it does get better? That putting in my time will somehow let me raise my kids in a home that I love, that they will have a nice swing set? When we reach 30 or so will there be some "spark" in the universe that gives us the ability to be at least middle class (or better)?

We don't have a lot left every month after normal bills and food. We are getting a new car but mine is so cramped with 2 it seems more expensive to keep it than get one that (if we stay here for a while) we can run into the ground. I look at my budget all the time and there is NOTHING we can cut without us going crazy (read: cable, internet and cells which are our only phones). I don't even UNDERSTAND how poeple save $10000 for a down payment on a house. We scrape to save $100/month (which we are only now starting to do). We have ZERO savings.

[Mama Dragon]

Having had my first and married at 16, moved to a Navel base at 17 and had my second at 18, then separated at 19, divorced at 20 and remarried at 21, with bad, horrible credit, and abusive husband and NO HELP (meaning: I had it pretty freaking bad), I can say it definitely gets better. Main thing is to get out of debt and stay there. Apply for food stamps. And quit looking up to other people. Happiness cannot be found by trying to impress other people. Took me many years to learn that. Many miserable years. Sure, I still dream of winning the lottery, but I don't wish I had any more then I do now, except DH to keep a freaking job

I rambled a bit there, sorry. What I mean to say, it yes, I was a very young mom and I can say it does get better!

[*clementine*]

What Synthea wrote pretty much discribes my early years of parenting as well.
I was a single mom on food stamps, assisted housing, and had student loans up the you know what.
I didn't know how to drive, and didn't think I would ever have a car- it was that bad.
I remember one Mother's day my sister and I (she was in the same boat) drove around looking at cool houses and we both ended up crying because we thought we would never be able to have that for our girls.
I would never in a million years have guessed that I would be where I am today. We own our home and a business and though we are broke a lot, we are a far cry from where I was.
I didn't do anything special either.....it just got better.
I think you just have to want more and you'll gravitate towards that.
Sorry about the spelling.....I'm half asleep and can't tell if the words look right or really off lol.
I guess my point is, it did get better for me and I honestly don't know how except that I got older and life kept moving forward. I still have a ton of debt etc....but we're living much larger and I'm able to get a lot of what I once thought was impossible.
In a way it's good that you envy others- because you know what you're aiming for.

[GoddessKristie]

I am a young mom who got married on a whim and I totally sympathize with you. DH and I eloped last spring and thought we'd have pleanty of time to get things in order before we had kids. Boy were we wrong! We got pregnant on our honeymoon and here we are a year later with a baby in a 900sqft 1 bedroom apartment. Every wall is lined with furniture, the baby's "room" is our dining room which is completely open to our living room. We both drive old cars (mine is 17 years old) that have problems, and we also only have a little money left after our bills every month.
Because of a windfall we'll be buying a house soon, but for now things for us sound just like they do for you. (we were even doing the high speed internet, cable cell phones, but just this month cut out the phones and switched to Vonage which freed up some cash)
I don't know if it helps, but I just wanted to let you know that you're not alone in your situation.

[happyus3]

Yes, it does get better, but you have to work for it.
We had our first (unplanned me 20 and dh 22), no plan, moved out of my mothers house 7 days before DS1 was born, into a trailer we bought with out really thinking about (never buy a mobile home!),we made less than 20k a year, didn't qualify for any assistance, and felt very trapped. I bagan watching a child to make extra money and we tried several "work at home, Own your own business (Discovery toys, Amway...) stuffing envelopes..none of it worked. We owned one car, which we shared, I cared for the child in their home (but my son was able to come with me, I didn't want to leave him). Things really didn't look so good for us. Then DH got a better job. That was our turning point. We had gotten into credit card debt- you say that none of your credit cards have a very high limit-that's good. Stop using them if you can! We had too much credit card debt and a trailer that we couldn't sell, we eventually realized we were never going to get out of it and filed for bankruptcy. We had no cable, no computer,no cell phone, barely any money for groceries, one car that were able to keep because it wasn't worth much and went and rented a house. I eventually began taking care of a child full time in our home, and DH kept working long hours and moving up in his company. Neither of us have any college education. He has taught himself about the stock market, by reading books(Rich Dad Poor Dad series), researching online, and watching TV (CNBC or Bloomberg). Anyway, our extra money goes into the stock account now, and he's doing a pretty good job of making it grow for us. He also contributed to the 401K plan at work(one of the ways people save for a house, it comes out of your check before you see it), so we have a savings. We are 28 and 30 now and have two more planned children. The majority of our friends are much older than us and in pretty much the same, if not worse financial situation. We do not own a home yet, but only because we aren't sure if this is where we want to buy, and we're hoping for real estate to take a plunge. We live pretty comfortable,do not use credit cards, but have learned how to buy things cheap, look for bargain, and because we have clawed our way to where we are, we have a better understanding of money than most of our friends/relatives. As far as for having unplanned kids, young, I would do it all over again. I think that people wait too long to have kids now a days. I am happy to be young with them, to have the energy for them and look forward to still being young when they are old enough to be on their own! We have made many stupid mistakes, by thinking that we know it all, and not asking questions. Best advice.. never buy a mobile home( we drive by ours now and then, it has been a little over four years and they still haven't sold it), never buy a brand new car (they depreciate so much and if you have to sell it, you will owe more than you can sell it for!), and don't use credit cards (you will never pay them off!), garage sales are great for kids clothes and toys,and most importantly -enjoy your kids, poor or not, try to have as much fun as you can with them - the money thing will work itself out!
Also, surround yourself with people who are where you want to be, and people who don't bring you down- don't be afraid to want more or expect more out of life than your friends (or family). It's easy to only see what others have - and what you don't, instead of letting that discourage you, make yourself work harder for what you want.

[kijip]

I was 22 when I got pregnant. I am married and at that point, we had only been married about 6 months or so when I got pregnant while of the bcp. Needless to say, it was unplanned as we had been actively attempting to prevent a pregnancy. I was in college. We were not very low income but we were not well off by a long shot, especially in an expensive city with 3 bedroom bungalows selling for $400K++++ .

We had just moved into a studio loft. A small one. We changed our plans considerably to accommodate becoming parents- I did not finish college and start grad school right away, my husband did not go to grad school, my husband kept working a retail job for the medical benefits, our day to day life changed a fair bit but we have never, ever regretted the changes we made. It has worked out pretty well for us over the last 4 years. Having a kid forced us to solve some personal and marital issues, we learned the ins and out of running a home pretty quickly, we both grew up a lot more than I think we would have without kids. We did worry for a tiny bit of time that our son was not going to have a lot of perks like the yard and swing set. But that worry passed and was replaced with the reassurance to ourselves that free library story times, city parks, play groups and the like offered as much if not more than a big old cedarworks swing set in the non-existent backyard.

We brought our son home to the studio loft and after a failed co-sleeping scheme, his first bedroom was a 3 in 1 Graco Pack N Play. In order to fit into the studio with baby, we had to loft our bed entirely off the ground. So we spent much time carefully passing our son up and down the ladder to the bed. It worked out just fine. I went back to work basically ft shortly after he was born but we had alternating schedules and family babysitting help so we had no childcare costs. I worked as an admin at a non-profit and he worked retail. We certainly could afford to eat and save something but not as much as I would have liked. A lot of our money went to pay for medical insurance. And we were living without a lot of frills that many people take for granted by choice- no cable, one small and paid for car, no cell then 1 cell etc. Frankly, not having some of these things was (and is) our choice and it helped make more room in the budget for the zoo and other things for our son. Lots of garage sales and craigslisting for cheaper baby items and diapers etc. I went to work in 4 year old suits, jeans and stretched out baggy maternity clothes.

From a money side, I think it is fair to point out that incomes do most often rise as you age and get more experience. 22 year olds rarely make a lot of money or as much money as people 5-10 years older in the same field. I am managing a non-profit now and still can't quite believe the jump in my pay from 2 years ago. I blinked hard this very afternoon when I saw what my recent raise meant to my take home. heck, I already knew what it was going to be take home but actually depositing it was still odd. We are not wealthy but we reached the point where we can save more of our income, afford preschool without worrying and where my husband started school again full-time and I am finally wrapping up my education and polishing my professional skills. We can buy all organic groceries now and I have a nice work wardrobe now (actually, I think the wardrobe contributed to the raise so it was an investment in my case, LOL). We are buying a townhouse (which while made easier by a small inheritance is possible in the absence of that extra, unexpected income).

That said, even if my income was well below what I was making when my son was born I would not regret being a parent at all. And my son still has to go to the city park to use the swing set and after we move into the townhouse it will be no different, the yard will be the size of a postage stamp. big enough for a sandbox and tomato plant container though and still in walking distance to a city park.

A quote I have often remembered over the last 4 years is:

"The beauty of marriage is not that marriage creates children but that children create adults"

Replace "becoming a parent" with the m-word and you have a sentiment that I think applies to a lot of people of all different ages.

We would very much like another child and I have to say that even though we have more money to spend, I will basically be repeating the same garage sale/city park thing we did the first time around.

Sure, we could have waited until I was done with school and my husband was done with pharmacy school and had kids. That was the plan (both be out of grad school and established in careers *if* we had kids at all). And we certainly would have had things like a house and yard had that been the case. But I am very glad it did not turn out that way, despite out best efforts to delay becoming parents in the first place.

[kandkrose]

i seriously could have written your post except that we've managed to slowly SLOWLY attain some things we've been dreaming of.

one thing that helped us when we were 19, newly married with a new baby, and living with my father-in-law because we couldnt afford rent, was setting up a 5 year plan. we made goals and we made paths on how to get there.

the important thing is to choose goals that are attainable to you, and to focus on positive ways to get there. realize that every goal you reach is a benchmark on getting closer to yet ANOTHER goal.

someday you may have that fancy house, the great vacations, etc.

I know for us, all we really DESIRED at that point in our lives was a NICE place of our own-- someplace that wasnt in the ghetto or a one room apartment in a refurbished radio station (yes - i'm serious lol).

That was 5 years ago.

Today we own a 2000 square foot house. We have 2 cars in very good shape. We have a computer, the internet, 2 cells, and a home line.

We are still paying off some debt but the point is we're *paying it off* (not acruing any more - havent for 3 years)

we are just starting to be able to save $100 a month. So in the scheme of life you're ahead of where we were.

You said you have a military credit card... i'm assuming then that either you or dh are military? if so - when you use the VA loan you wont need a down payment on a house! So - you can rest assured on that. As long as you or hubby have a steady job, you'll qualify for a house (of reasonable price - up to i think 235,000 based on your income)

You may also want to talk to a financial advisor. They can help you look at your finances, and make a long term plan to help you actually reach those goals. For us, its just empowering to have a professional confirm that we really CAN meet our goals.

I do know how discouraging it is sometimes. we have 2 kids 5 and under, we homeschool, and we dont really have much leftover at the end of the month (okay so like none)... but I can stay home with my kids, and only work part time doing what I love (photography) for spending and savings. We filed right at 25k last year. When hubby first joined we were at 17k.

it DOES get better. One thing I have found encouraging is that most of the people I know who do live those fancy lives started out just like we did and worked their way up. I can see now (now that i'm a step or two distanced from it) that the hard times we lived through then were kindling in the fire to helping us propel forward to our future. Its also ironically, a time I look back on with a LOT of fondness and good memories.

To this day my favorite Christmas was spent in a little house in the ghetto- under an overpass, with the highway at the edge of our back yard, and train tracks not 30 feet from our driveway. There were 4 different kinds of linoleum in the kitchen, and all we had was a barely running little rice burner of a mitsubishi mirage to share between us. We made the most out of it, and I think were really able to focus on what was important.... it certainly wasnt (and isnt) the physical commerical stuff... its family, relationships, memories, and just being together.

love is what its all about.

[justmama]

Danielle, I don't know if it gets BETTER per se, but it changes. I had my first daughter by accident(NOT mistake mind you, just a delightful accident) at 19. I struggled as a single mom and got pregnant with dd2 at 23. We married and had the same situation as you. Military, no money, struggling month to month, barely eating, broken down cars, cruddy house, etc. Things got a lot better financially for a little while and then we got out. We are now civilian and struggling again financially. I'm working two jobs, he's picking up hours on base(air guard) and trying hard to find a civilian job but failing miserably. So while we are doing OKAY financially, I personally think we are better off than we were nearly 3 years ago. Our marriage is a million times better and we are happier but we are still pretty broke. It's different bills and different stressors. So it may not be better but it changed and I think we are happier for it. You just have to look at the situation from afar I think and start to strap down financially and cut back on as many bills as possible. What can you live without?????? If you can save more, do so. I know it's nearly impossible to financially fare very well in the military(my hubby was an e-4 when we got married, so I know!) but things like the commissary and the library and wic programs and activities at the youth center are there to help out. Utilize them. See if your family support center has listings for a part-time night job for you or maybe see if your base supports a family child care program(where you get certified to watch kids in your home) or maybe even has a financial counselor to help you see where you can change your finances to save more or have more money. The resources are out there even if they aren't advertised. YOur husband's supervisor or first shirt should be able to direct you to them. Best of luck to you. I know how it is, I've been there as part of a young, completely broke military couple with kids. If you ever want to chat, PM me.

Meg

[KariM]

Originally Posted by dhinderliter

So point of the post:
Are their any other moms out there that can vouch that it does get better? That putting in my time will somehow let me raise my kids in a home that I love, that they will have a nice swing set? When we reach 30 or so will there be some "spark" in the universe that gives us the ability to be at least middle class (or better)?

First, a great big hug for you!

I'm not a young mama, but both of my kids were wanted, but surprises.

The real commonality, though, is that I have rarely felt that I'm in the middle class. For years I wondered if I'd ever have the nice house that my peers had, or would drive new cars like they did, or would be able to buy the boutique clothes they can buy, etc.

Then I realized that THINGS don't bring me happiness. I see so many of my friends working long hours, rarely spending time with their children, and they seem to use money and things as a replacement.

Once I let go of the envy I began to feel peace. I still long for a bit more financial security. It would be a relief not to count every penny and double check to see if I can buy another bag of flour.

As for the nice swing set, we use public parks. When I was living in an apartment and feeling guilty because my son wasn't growing up in a suburban house I realized he had more friends because of our community living AND a great playground in the apartment complex.

When I didn't have a car and was taking the bus all the time I felt awful for having to tote my son along on grocery shopping trips and hated carrying all those bags. Well...I lost some excess body weight and became healthier as a result (who wants to lug extra junk food home on the bus).

I realized I was longing for things that ultimately didn't matter and the lifestyle we had was really very good and RIGHT for us.

I hope you can find some peace and that you're blessed with a little more security as well!

[birthjunkie27]

You said that you have low limits on your credit cards. That is a GOOD thing, although it may not seem like it to you. My dh and I got married young (I was 19, he was 22), had a baby a few months later ( I was pg. when we got married) and when we got our first credit card we were over the moon excited that it had a limit of $3,000, which seemed like $3,000 worth of free money at the time! We charged and charged, got more credit cards over the years, and we became dependent on the cards. Not enough money that month? Put the rest on credit! We are now at the point (6.5 years later) that our stupid credit habits have come back to bite us in the A$$ with our minimum monthly payments being $950 combined amongst our 4 cards. Yikes! Credit can be evil, evil, evil....so please don't make the same mistake we did and covet higher limits or more cards. Keep things low and simple!

As for buying a house... we bought our first house at ages 21 and 23. We didn't have $$ for a downpayment either, and we never would. We just didn't make enough to save for a downpayment. What we did was use the Nehemiah program. http://www.getdownpayment.com/buyers/ Our realtor was AWESOME in dealing with potential sellers, and she could get almost any seller to agree to the program. They really don't loose anything. Example, if a down payment is $10,000, Nehemiah donates $5,000, and the seller of the home donates $5,000, except what homeowner is really going to do this?? LOL! So, what we did was tack that $5,000 onto the selling price of the home, so the owner looses nothing, and we get to buy a house with NO downpayment! So, if a home is listed for 120,000 your mortgage amount would actually be 125,000 (this is the sellers way of participating without actually loosing anything). I may have explained this wrong, but that's the gist of it.

[LilMomma83]

Hi bare with me, because I have to angle's - a child's and and an adults....(I will try not to be TOO longwinded)

From a child's eyes:
My parents probably could have baught a house but did not feel the need because their housing came with their jobs (before I was born) when they were expecting the 4th (of eventually 8) children my father lost his job and my parents were without a place to live. We were blessed over the next few years as my Dad worked various parttime or fulltime jobs and with always having a roof over our heads, food on the table and a at least one car to drive - but in talking to my parents now and thinking back on things did not have a lot of extra. I know it was especially rough on my Mom... about 5 years ago they were able to buy a house (which needs a lot of work even now - but is a house!) and moved into it when I was 19 and the youngest was 4.

My point with that story is that thinking back on my childhood - I don't feel like I missed out on anything. I have loving parents who made things work - and did not (at least in front of us) focus on what things "could be." They also found alternative ways to accomplish things. For example, we had a nice swing set - my Dad built it. But you know what? We also had an old one, that was set on the street with a "free" sign that worked just as well!! We made home made gifts and toys for each other as gifts and my Mom was forever watching the streets for giveaways and hitting yard sales for toys. My parents had us fill out scholership forms and we were able to attend summer camps, they helped me file financial aid forms for school - it never bothered me that they are not paying for it because they support me in every way they can...emotional support and life lessons (SERIOUSLY!!!!) mean so much more to me.

But I don't rememember the toys...I remember riding around with Dad while he was doing work erands, Mom reading aloud (we never had a TV - and now by choice they still don't!), Making elaborate imaginary games with my siblings and neighbors that would last for days on end - we had "dress up" clothes that were real clothes bought from yardsales or passed along to us. I remember freezing peaches and tomatoes (and even though this sounds lovely - it was a source of saving money!) I remember that as I got older my parents would make time to listen to what I was doing in life (Mom still invites me to sit on her bed while she folds laundry - although now we can relate on a whole new level!) I could go on...but you get the idea.

From an adult's eyes
Many people critisized DH and I when we got engaged 2yrs ago. We both had some past financial mistakes and debts to pay off (my husband actually had another small mistake that put him in about $50,000 of debt 4 days after we got engaged!) *We got some advice to write letters to anyone we owed $$ to asking them to lower the amount and put us on a payment plan...this worked well, they have really worked with us and our payments are low and when we can't make them they let us take a few months off (the chunk of debt that was $43,000 they have stopped trying to collect on after we wrote the letter - asking them to lower it and put us on low monthly payments).

Anyway, we got married this past June (2006) at ages 22 and 27; and we know so many people (even his twin brother and wife!!) who have just "waited until everything is right" and then regretted waiting because they were older and could not concieve or did not have time to have as many children as they wanted. My parents told us "if you wait to be ready, you will never have children."

We (by choice) got pregnant in July. Do I ever worry? Of course!!! But I know things will work out!!! We have a roof over our heads (we are still renting - but I know someday we will be able to buy; and even if not - we'll be alright.) We have money coming in - and I can certainly relate that it just goes right back out; but we can pay our monthly bills...we have made a few changes in prep for when our little one comes, and I expect to make more - but WHO CARES?? We are a loving family and that is more than a lot of people have...and I know from the situation I grew up in that my child will be more than fine with that. I also know that things will get better.

Do you know something else? My Dad makes decent money now and my family still lives frugally - by choice; there is money saved or that can be spent on other things like family vacations-- I plan to follow in their footsteps in that regard.

***
Alright-- I guess I ended up being longwinded after all...but I hope I said at least one thing that was encouraging.

[root*children]

(((HUGS)))

I've been where you are and I think you have to get really proactive about it, and it can get better!

I was 19 and pregnant with my first. I was actually living in my VW van, my seasonal job was coming to an end, and my van broke down (major break down - not worth fixing). That SUCKED! (to put it lightly)

I begged my mom (who had kicked me out at 17) to let me move back in and get my self organized. I basically worked enough to raise money to buy a bike and have about $500 in savings. Then a month before the due date I moved cross-country to be with baby's daddy, and I found us a house and found us 2 roomates. That helped ALOT. I had the money to put for the deposit, but we never could have lived in such a big house/good neighborhood without roomates (we definatly could have only afforded a studio - but with 2 large dogs, that was out anyhow).

Having those roomates brought our rent down to $300-ish per month. I started just MAKING myself figure out finances. I studied Larry Burkett's financial stuff and we started using the envelope system. I also took in a neighbor child for some extra money with childcare. DH and I got married, but he was trying to make it as a non-experienced 20yo carpenter and only was getting paid $8/hr

Fast forward 7 years - we've moved around the country a bit, and have 2 beautiful boys. DH now makes $18/hr (low income area, unfortunatly - in Colorado, he made $25). I've extensively studied and put to practice the financial teachings of Dave Ramsey, as well as everyday frugal living tips from The Complete Tightwad Gazette.

We're getting ready to buy our first house. and in all the times we've moved cross-country, we've NOT spent money to refurnish houses. In fact, I've been told in our first few weeks of living places, that people will come to the house, peek in the window and assume noone is living there because it's so empty! You can get SO many *things* free or dirt cheap from yardsales. Check out freecycle.org to find free stuff galore in your area!

So, the point is, it can get better, but you have to actually *do* something. you've got to work for it. You need to bring in some extra money (childcare? ebay? GPT's? - I do all of those currently and bring in about $1K/month extra) on top of your DH's small salary. You need to work to become debt free... having credit cards at all are no help! It's not been an easy road, and we don't have many luxuries, but I don't really care! We have a great life, our kids get a stay-at-home mom, we are becoming financially independent (s-l-o-w-l-y), and I'd rather have our meager home and lifestyle and be debt free, than be living it up and maxing credit cards at the same time, you know?

Much love!

[velochic]

I wasn't a young mom (and to be honest with you, we're technically old enough to be your parents ), but I wanted to say something.

All those things.... they are just that... THINGS. Things clutter our lives and they don't matter to a hill of beans. American society tries to make us feel like Scheiße if we don't OWN "THINGS". What really matters is being partnered with someone you love and loves you and raising kids in a loving environment. Don't let "keeping up the Joneses" get you down.

I'm 37 and dh is 52. We have been where you are (I was in college at your age and struggling to buy food and pay rent and I didn't even have kids, so I know where you are coming from to a certain extent). Getting older and richer doesn't solve any problems. Getting older and wiser does.

Hopefully when you are in your 30's you'll be thinking about saving for retirement and college for your kids instead of acquiring things like expensive homes and nice cars. Just keep in mind that as you get older, things may not get "better" but your priorities WILL change.

Good luck... I know it's hard to struggle financially. The struggles don't end (even if you win the lottery), they just change as you get older.

ETA: I peeked into this thread because I have a niece (my oldest sister's dd) who had her first at 17, got married, divorced, then had twins by the same father at 19... she is now 26 and still struggles financially... as does my sister (who is 46 years old and gave birth to said niece when she was 20). For some it gets better and for some it doesn't.

[~Megan~]

I feel like a lot of people are in similar situations. You just do the best you can with what you have.
Even cutting back a little and saving a little is good. It adds up over time.

Don't expect to be buying $250K homes at this point, or ever.


I know it might seem easy to say but we are much of the positions.

We didn't choose for me to stay home because we could afford it, there just wasn't another option for us to consider.
We get by most months. We have a little savings. It seems like every year our tax refund saves our butts so we can keep on going.

It can be really frustrating.
We just had to leave our rented house because the owner wants to remodel and live there. We couldn't find any other rental houses in safe neighborhoods (or really even unsafe ones) in our price range and we are back in an apartment. I feel like we've outgrown the need to live in an apartment. dh has a professional job, etc.

Its the debt we have though. Some months trying to make things fit a bill or two goes on the credit card and that adds up really fast.
If we got rid of the credit card payment then we could just make it by with a litle to put in savings.
Sometimes it feels like it will never get better.

I try to remember that I have a good marriage and my kids are healthy, loving, smart....its so much more than what some people have and its the most important part.

[crazyeight]

Thanks for the quick replies!

I know that we are fortunate to have what we have. On the owning a home front its just been drilled into my head that owning a home is much better and I feel like we are "wasting" our money on "rent" which we technically don't pay since we live on base but living off base we get BAH which at this point is just under $900 which honestly doesn't get CRAP around here. I have been thinking that we should get a VA loan on a fixer upper, fix it up quick (4 weeks or so) and then either try to sell it or move into it. I have always been interested in Real Estate so this just makes me excited but I have no real idea on how to get started or protect ourselves financially. Basic thought is that we could afford a POS $125,000 put in $20K renovations to make it nice and comfortable and still (possibly) afford the mortage and utilities if we couldn't sell and if we could sell then we would at least have made something to put down onto a home that we really wanted (most likely another fixer upper i would hope). Or possibly pay off all of our debts so that we can save when we are ready (read in one place for a long time) to buy.

Yes DH is military if you couldn't tell!

Its not that I want to rack up debt on larger credit cards but that I am measuring whether we are the excellent, fair or poor credit based on whether we can qualify for those kinds of cards. Our FICO scores around the upper 600's right now and I guess its because we are young and haven't had a long credit history although 90% of it is GREAT (1 bad thing on DH that I need to straighten out).

Its funny because DH wants a home for different reasons than me and together we want a home for all the right reasons. I want to provide a home to DH even though he brings in the money . Its just funny because he brings in the money but has no idea what to do with it, i am the one who provides good cars, savings, choices on what to buy, food etc so essentially i would provide a home because he isn't allowed to buy one unless I say so .

I do want to clarify that alot of this isn't about "things". The only thing that falls under that is clothes. When my sister and I were growing up we rarely ever got new clothes, I was teased horribly at school and never had friends etc and I feel that alot of that stemmed because we were poor and wore thrift store clothes. I HATE it. I will buy SOME thrift store clothes for the kids but myself I can't bring myself to buy used very often unless its PERFECT. It just feels icky to me KWIM? The swingset or climbing thing in the backyard is so that ds learns motor skills it takes him some time to get used to other peoples stuff and the playground (not to mention the time it takes to get there etc) and then it takes him a while to figure out how to work that stuff and I feel like he won't learn how to use a swing or climb like a normal child. Theres a (very small) park about 15-30 minute walk from here and I haven't found a good time to go.

Every time I look at my finances I just kick myself. I tell myself that we should own a home so that we can benefit from home ownership, make the home better or even make a nice profit if we sell it, that we should be saving money for retirement now, that we should have a savings account for emergencys etc. I just feel like somehow I can't do it all and I wonder how anyone does.

Also I know that many americans live with lots of debt and out of their means. Do they even get repercussions from that? Or do they just wait until they get older and pay it off all at once? Do people who stay out of debt for most of their lives actually live better than people who have what they want when they want it etc? Like I see commercials for the debt consolidation and reducing debt just by asking. I really don't feel thats fair, here I am working my ass off to keep our family pretty much debt free and here is some other people who just did and got whatever they wanted and they get a discount on their "objects" they bought (which is really what it is) and I have some of the same stuff that I had to pay full price for, save for, sacrifice for. I just don't see how thats fair. Why can't I go out, rack up $10000 worth of stuff (in my case it would be stuff like home supplies or paying off debts or paying all our bills in advance or something like that) and then paying minimums for 6 months and then calling and saying we're getting behind, get the debt reduced and pay it off in 3 years? In the meanwhile saving that $10K worth off stuff I didn't have to buy and earning 5% interest on that!!! Does that make sense? It prolley doesn't sorry....

[kijip]

Originally Posted by dhinderliter

Also I know that many americans live with lots of debt and out of their means. Do they even get repercussions from that?

YES. The inability to qualify for a mortgage, the risk or reality of losing their home because they could only get a loan from a predatory lender (1 MILLION foreclosures are estimated for the next couple of years by some economists). Not being able to vacation, retire, or stop worrying about if they can meet thier monthly finance charges. 30% of a credit score is the size of the debt relative to available credit and income. High 600s for two people in their early 20s is pretty good. Another 30% is payment history and length of creidt history. The best thing you can do to keep that score up is to not get into much consumer credit debt. No more than 1/3 of your credit limit should be in use if you carry a balance.

When people have their debt reduced (which is not all that common- most place just lower the interest rate) they are still paying for more for their previous spending than they would ahve if they had paid cash, both in interest and the opportunity cost of being totally indebted to some credit cards.

People in a crushing amount of debt (relative to their income) without savings are more likely to have problems in their marriage or other relationship, more likely to become homeless if they lose a job (because they have no safety net), more likely to work past retirement age and generally report higher day to day stress levels. They will pay more in interest rates as they miss a payment or have a massively low credit score.

I am a firm believer in helping people get out of debt and avoid it in the first place if for no other reason than to protect their sanity.

[root*children]

I've never heard of anyone being made fun of because of wearing thrift store clothes, so sorry that happened!! Please don't let it scare you tho, there's ALOT more available to us, than there was 20 years ago for our folks. And my mother had (has) terrible fashion sense! We wore the most ridiculous things when I was a child! I will only dress my kids in nice, but playable clothes, and I have never (ever) bought anything new. A good trick is whenever you go to a big city, find their good thrift stores and hit 'em up!

As far as the debt reduction - those companies that offer debt consolidation are NOT doing a favor to anyone except their own pocket books! To take your bills to one of those places and ask for help WILL negatively affect your credit score. bad bad bad.

Do you have any kind of Affordable Housing Coalition or Neighborhood Housing Services where you live? If you're not sure, you could call you local Habitat for Humanity and they should be able to tell you what resources are out there for first time homebuyers. You can take very cheap 1st time homebuyer classes and ask away with all your questions - and I think you should, since you've got the VA loan to take into consideration. That's really going to help you out. I know several families locally that wouldn't not have been able to buy a home, unless they had that VA loan

[velochic]

A couple of things that I want to mention about your latest post.

About the house flipping (that's what it's called when you buy a house, fix it up and sell it in a few months). You would pay your regular marginal tax rate on the home sale. If you buy a home, you need to make it your primary residence (live in it). If after a year or two, you decide to sell it, you won't face the short-term capital gains taxes on it. If you do pay capital gains, your profit is out the window. Please read up a bit about this before proceeding.

About the racking up debt, then not having to pay for it through bankruptcy/debt reduction. I think that the honest thing to do is pay off debt. Period. If you bought it, you should pay for it. I think there are people who get into a financial pinch HONESTLY, and for that, I think that a clean slate is fine. But most of the people I know that go to bankruptcy court got themselves there because they were not willing to wait until they saved the money to buy things. You have your whole life ahead of you to buy stuff. Your kids don't need a jungle gym in the back yard to improve gross motor skills. Kids have been growing up with great motor skills without any swings or jungle gyms for thousands of years. It's not worth going into debt to have a jungle gym. If you see people racking up debt and then not having to be responsible for it... it's just that - being irresponsible and dishonest.

About buying clothes at thrift stores... my dh and I are in the 96th percentile of wealth (that's net worth, not income) and I still buy clothes at thrift shops. There is nothing wrong with recycling things to save mother earth.

About being debt free... dh and I have always been debt free (except for mortgage) and yes, it is a nice feeling not being in debt to any person. We could pay off our mortgage if we wanted to, but choose not to. There isn't anything I can think of that is worth going into debt for.

Glad to see you're thinking a lot about this. Most people your age are not.

[Krystal323]

it's not what you make, it's what you SPEND

and debt really is THAT bad. pay it off ASAP, however little it is--forget savings for now (yes i really do think that's best)--and then avoid credit like the plague. cut up the cards, whatever. however, credit scores work funny--it looks better to have open lines of credit that aren't racked up than it does to have no credit OR several maxxed-out cards. So don't cancel the cards once they're paid off unless they have some ridiculous kind of annual fee on them. :

i think a LOT of financial success depends on attitude, regardless of how much dollar your job(s) actually bring in. things will get better, so long as you're mindful of the situation and don't try to keep up with the Joneses

[birthjunkie27]

Originally Posted by dhinderliter

Also I know that many americans live with lots of debt and out of their means. Do they even get repercussions from that?

YES!!!!! Dh and I lived for 6.5 years, abusing our credit cards. We saw it as free money, even though we KNEW that it wasn't. We paid min. payments most months, more when we had the money. It has finally gotten to the point (literally just this month) where our minimum payments have gotten WAY beyond what we can pay. So, yes, there ARE repercussions for our actions. We had to call a debt management place. They do NOT eliminate your debt. What they do is speak with your creditors on your behalf to lower your interest rates, which ends up making your mothly payments lower and makes it easier and faster to pay off your debts. We are not going to be able to use credit cards (nor do we want to anymore!!) while we are on the program. I hear from some people that using a program like this makes a negative mark on your credit score, but hey... it'll be a
negative mark on our credit score if we don't PAY our min. payments every month too.

People do not just "live with the debt" and out of their means with no repercussions. ONE DAY it will catch up with you....just like it did us. (and I'm not speaking to you directly when I say "you", I'm speaking in general terms).

Oh, and btw, a play set for the backyard is on my wish list too....but we aren't getting one anytime soon.