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full dilation = time to push? - Page 2

post #21 of 66
A woman in a coma can give birth vaginally. The body will push the baby out with or without active pushing. It may take "too long" considering the amount of pain many women are in during that stage of labor, or the amount of time spent in that stage, but it would happen eventually.

That being said, I don't knock anyone's experiences. If pushing before the urge hits you has worked for you, then I think thats great.

For me, I tried very hard not to push at all, but had a short point where the baby was so far down that my hips were being forced apart, and it felt very very uncomfortable (scary to be honest, since I Had not felt it before) and i pushed because I couldn't handle that wierdness for a moment longer than necessary. I was lucky, in that by the time I finally gave in, I really only had a few contractions and baby was out....it was definitely < 15 min. It was so fast that my DH was telling me "ok, take a deep breath, lets get ready for the next contraction" and I said "hold on, I have to catch the baby" (she was born underwater, and I was on my knees leaning back...DH was just outside the tub face to face with me) I had no tearing, and very minimal skid marks even, and I attribute it to breathing through every contraction as long as was humanly possible.
post #22 of 66
I'll have to go back and read the thread later when I get more computer time... but with both my kiddos, I felt the urge to push, it was so overwhelming... BEFORE I got to 10 cm! I think if I'd been allowed to give tiny pushes like my body wanted to, I might have dilated faster, at least with my first... I often wonder why some of us get the urge (like a HUGE urge) before we are 10 cm? There has to be a biological reason for it...

But yeah, I agree, if a mom doesn't feel ready to push the baby out, why not wait as long as everyone is stable?

Oops, OK, just read about how one mama here waited hours for the urge!! I have to agree that our bodies all work differently... I really believe that - not just in birthing, but in all other aspects!
post #23 of 66
I remember having a bit of a break after transition. DD's head was just kinda hanging there, at the cervix, ready to get moving down and out. (DH felt it while I was on a birthing chair and looked to surprised that there was a fuzzy head there-duh!)

It took a little while for the urge to push to kick in so I just relaxed. At some point my midwife asked if I wanted to try doing a hula like gyration to see if it would trigger the urge. I did about 2 circles and next thing I know I was in the biggest squat ever with my body pushing away (no conscious effort at all!).

After that the urge to push came and went, sometimes a little push, sometimes this massive, intense sensation (that felt incredible good).

I can't imagine having someone stand over me, telling when to push, how to push and when to stop. Yuck!
post #24 of 66
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by twilight girl View Post
I feel like I've heard a million times that women shouldn't push before full dialation and doing so can result in cervical swelling and swollen cervical lips that can prevent the baby's passge. I guess I've always felt a level of confusion about why my body wanted/needed to push so badly before all of my body was technically "ready".
Another myth. Obviously if you're trying to push the baby out before the body is ready, it can cause problems (exactly the point of the OP.) It's actually very common for women to start doing little grunting pushing before full dilation, and bearing down as your body directs you to (only as much as relieves the urge, no more and no less,) will only help position the baby and dilate the cervix.

I felt bearing down urges for three weeks before the birth. It felt wonderful to give in to that, absolutely wonderful. And it didn't create problems at all -- in fact once it was actually time for the baby to be born it only took four contractions for her to traverse the birth canal.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Romana9+2
You've probably read my story or heard me talk about this before, so I'll make it really short, but bottom line, even after over 7 hours of pushing contractions that I breathed and bellowed through uninhibited and alone (except for dh, who spent part of the time asleep), even after that "lip" of cervix was pushed aside, even after all that, I still had no pushing urge. I was too tired to wait through another 8 hours of that excruciating pain for the moment that my body finally decided it was ready to give me an urge to push.
If you had no urge to push, what do you mean by "pushing contractions"?

Quote:
I agree that full dilation does not necessarily mean it's time to push. And I think it makes a lot of sense to wait a while for an urge to push - definitely take a nap if possible. But I just don't think it's necessarily true that your body will definitely have an unmistakable urge to push, or the fetal ejection reflex, or push the baby out on its own if you don't do it yourself. Sometimes, it just doesn't happen that way.
How do you know? By your own admission, you didn't wait to see. What if you had started pushing much earlier? Maybe you would have just pushed that whole time with no progress, wearing yourself out and hurting yourself. Maybe that 25 minutes of pushing that you did do just happened to coincide with a relatively high degree of readiness on the part of your body, even though it was not yet fully ready to spontaneously move the baby down. I was able to push my baby out (in two hours of pushing) without a pushing urge, too; that is certainly a choice, but it doesn't mean that I had to. But please understand, I'm not saying that the choice you made is not valid. I don't know enough about what your body was doing to be able to make a judgment about it, and I didn't say that there is never any reason to try to get the baby out as soon as the cervix is fully dilated. I am only saying that the assumption that the mother must push at full dilation even without an urge is wrong, is contrary to the natural unfolding of labor, and usually makes for a longer, harder pushing stage than she would have otherwise.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jenlaana
The body will push the baby out with or without active pushing. It may take "too long" considering the amount of pain many women are in during that stage of labor, or the amount of time spent in that stage, but it would happen eventually.
That being said, I don't knock anyone's experiences. If pushing before the urge hits you has worked for you, then I think thats great.
Aw heck, if I'd just read through the thread first, I could've just said, "yeah, that!" You said basically the same thing I was trying to get across, only much more succinctly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Georgia
I think it's important to remember that many women around the world believe that normal birth does not require a doctor or 'medical' assistance and/or intervention.
Okay, now I get my chance. Yeah, that!

Quote:
Originally Posted by AbbieB
I remember having a bit of a break after transition.
Yes, also very common and normal. I had a break of about an hour after the baby dropped. The "rest and be thankful" stage Sheila Kitzinger talks about.
post #25 of 66
The "urge to push" and uncontrollable pushing are 2 different things. I've had pushing contractions and uncontrollable pushing or fetal ejection. While both are competly natural and normal they are different. And its a completly different thing altogether from forced pushing. Uncontrollable pushing or fetal ejection your body just wraps itself around the uterus and pushes the baby out. Kinda like vomiting lol. Pushing contractions or the urge to push is like needing to go potty. You feel the need to push. They are different. If you wait through those pushing contractions and never push you might get the fetal ejection reflex. You might not.
post #26 of 66
With my VBA2C, I never really had an urge to push. I was fully dilated for well over an hour, closer to two hours, and didn't have the urge. I don't know if it was because my epidural was blocking the urge (even though I had it turned down) or what. I ended up deciding to just try pushing, so I called my doctor and the nurses in and started pushing. DD2 was born within half an hour, maybe less. She did have a nuchal hand--maybe that effected the urge? I don't know. They kept telling me I'd "just know" when I needed to push and it didn't happen for me. I was a little afraid of rupturing during pushing so maybe I had a mental block on the whole thing.
post #27 of 66
maternal efforts in pushing make up about 30% of the descent of baby. BUT, another poster was right when they said your uterus could do the job itself...it just takes a bit more time.

nobody HAS to push - for most women, the "urge to push" isn't an urge at all - their body just does it. it's like saying you have an "urge to vomit". you know? (and I just noticed that FullHeart said nearly the same thing - but not quite!)

in quite a few cultures women bear down with EVERY contraction all through labor. they do NOT swell their cervixes closed.

a swollen cervix and a very early strong bearing down urge has more to do with a head that is malpresented (asynclitic or posterior, or both) than pushing too early.

what I'm amazed with is the number of women with epidurals that are told to start pushing as soon as cervix is gone. wouldn't it make more sense to labor the baby down to where it's starting to emerge under the pubic bone?
post #28 of 66
Amen Linda.
post #29 of 66
I feel very fortunate to have had 2 births at an awesome freestanding birth center. The midwives there pretty much just let me do what nature was telling me to do.

First baby I started pushing right about 10 cm, totally involuntarily. 2nd baby, I was fully dilated for probably 30 minutes before I started pushing. Midwives both times were just going with the flow and it was great.
My wonderful dh said "Push!" once during my 2nd birth and I practically screamed back at him "DOn't tell me to push!"

I hear so many bizarre stories of hospital birth experiences.
post #30 of 66
Thank you for posting this. With my second child born this October, I felt very well educated about birth and already had one homebirth under my belt. I also knew that sometimes a woman's body goes into a resting period between being complete and needeing to push.

I just didn't know it could be for eight hours. During her sister's birth I'd been 2 cm for over 28 hours and dilated completely and pushed the baby out (2 pushes) within an additional hour, so I was very unprepared for what happened almost four years later. I was complete when my midwife arrived at my house at midnight. It was about 29 hours into labor. Everything had been long but much easier. However, and I am kind of resentful of both myself and my midwife the way things turned out- though there were other circumstances happening in the background that made us both want to hurry up including two other clients in labor who lived pretty far away.

She held back a lip andI tried pushing in every position, birth stool, tub, squatting, semireclined, knees to chest (my mother's wondedrful suggestion "How about just pushing normally"), side-lying, squatting holding onto the couch...

I never felt the urge. I remember saying, "With Dylan it was so strong, I couldn't have stopped had I tried." Shye actually told me that it was more difficult with some babies and to keep trying. Of course I exhausted myself trying when I shouldn't have been. She was eventually born 30 minutes after arrriving at the local hospital ( almost eight hours after having been proclaimed "complete") in two pushes again.

I know I get a strong urge to push, and I know that next time I will wait patiently for it.
post #31 of 66
I have always thought this is a silly myth that midwives didn't believe, but a team of two homebirth midwives nearby that I interviewed asked me in all seriousness if I didn't allow VE's how I would know when to push (??!!). As if the baby might never come out if I didn't know I was at 10 cm. It is very strange to me. I wonder how they think babies get born without "expert help".

Sorry about your bad experience. I still feel trauma from my first birth too--and my mw didn't do VEs or any of that silliness, but the process was still intrusive and scary for me.
post #32 of 66
With my son I got to 10 and my wonderful OB said that he was too high so to take a nap and she would come back later and when she came back an hour later, he had come down A LOT thru the birth canal and she was glad because she said the body can do it all on its own. On the flip side with my dd I was 9 1/2 but felt pressure so when the nurse said "lets do a practice push", her head almost came out, so it all depends on what our body is doing.
post #33 of 66
Yeah my body DEFINITELY let me know when it was time, and it was at about 7cm. I didn't push before 9.5 cm though because everyone told me not to (wish I'd known better).

When your body is trying to push, it's HARD not to. I ended up pushing an hour and 13 minutes, but DD was stuck under my pelvic bone and was oxyposterior...they kept telling me I was going to need a c section because a first time mom "couldn't" get a stuck OP baby out, but I did it.
post #34 of 66
I dont have vaginal exams so no one but me knows when I am fully dilated. I start pushing when the overwhelming urge takes over and I cant prevent it anymore.

I try to encourage my clients to do the same.
post #35 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shonahsmom View Post
This is something I've never fully reconciled about my dd's birth.. but kind of on the opposite spectrum. Overall, it was a wonderful birth and I totally did my own thing. But my labor was fast and intense and my dd descended so rapidly and I had the most intense pushing urge from about 6 cm on and was encouraged by my mw to not to push, to blow through the ctx. I feel like I've heard a million times that women shouldn't push before full dialation and doing so can result in cervical swelling and swollen cervical lips that can prevent the baby's passge. I guess I've always felt a level of confusion about why my body wanted/needed to push so badly before all of my body was technically "ready". :
http://www.midwiferytoday.com/articles/pushing.asp
Shaping the head.
post #36 of 66
Can't some presentations distort the pushing urge? Either make it not happen or happen too soon?
post #37 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by gini1313 View Post
I know no one was in this thread, thus why I said off topic.
My apologies
post #38 of 66
Some of the PPs remarked about the different feeling in pushing when totally "ready" versus not. I had the "urge" while still having a cervical lip. It did NOT feel good to push at that point!! It seemed uncontrollable but I actually did manage to breathe through I don't know how many or for how long. I was in such a haze by then that I can only assume my MW finally managed to get the then-swelling cervical lip out of the way. When I did finally push again, it felt TOTALLY different! He was born very quickly - one or two ctxs? This was my first HBAC and I was just in shock that it finally ended, and so quickly! There really is (for me) just a totally different sensation, and I know I'll be paying a bit more attention to how the urges come this next time.
post #39 of 66
Such an interesting thread!

As a new doula, I've recently witnessed both the urge to push and directed pushing.

For one of the births, the OB encouraged the mom to push against a cervical lip, hoping to help it melt away. This mom was unmedicated, used the squat bar, but had no urge at that point other than the excitement of the thought of finally getting to meet her baby. Several hours later she had a c-section. In hindsight, I suspect that the baby was had not rotated into a favorable position, which is why she 1) still had some cervix, and 2) she had no urge to push. The baby hadn't descended enough to contact the bundle of nerves (ferguson's plexus?) that triggers the fetal ejection reflex. I think that by pushing too soon, she actually forced the baby down into a funny position. Can this happen?

For my most recent birth, mom went from 4cm to baby in 45 minutes. I watched her work through 15 minutes of transition, then she fell asleep--ASLEEP!-- for 10 minutes. Talk about a "rest and be thankful" period! Then her eyes popped open and she was pushing. She couldn't resist it.
post #40 of 66
Ok, everyone's post is interesting, so I just have to add my own experience. I spent 5 hours, yeah, 5 hours, at 7 cm with the urge to push. Breathing through most of it, though it would have felt good to push, oh man, it would have been the best feeling in the world... but towards the end it was not like, "oh, it might feel good to push", but with every contrax my body was taking over. It was like the intensity split in the middle, with the top half of me vomiting uncontrollably, and the bottom half bearing down. Try trying not to do one or the other or either for five hours essp twd the end of that time when I couldn't help it . Everyone was yelling, don't push, don't push. And I was like, I CAN"T HELP IT. I"M NOT DOING IT!
(I ended up in a c/s

I will also add that my son was turned the wrong way, face up, I got confused but I think that's posterior, right, and the "right" way is anterior?
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