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Low production or is he weaning? - Page 3

post #41 of 66
The thing is that babies and toddlers have a need to suck. A sippy cup meets that need. When it should be met at the breast to keep your supply up. That's the problem.

In a nursing strike situation a sippy cup IS a problem. For a kid who's nursing tons without issue- no a sippy cup isn't a problem.

You're posting because you're concerned that either you have supply problems OR he's weaning prematurely.

Either could be caused by meeting his sucking need away from the breast.

-Angela
post #42 of 66
: That's one of the main reasons I use an open cup with DD.
post #43 of 66
Thread Starter 
ok ok...i´ll get the sippy cup out of the picture!!!!! AND the "holy" bottle!!!! and see how it goes from there...thanks!
post #44 of 66
Good luck!

Let us know how it goes.

-Angela
post #45 of 66
Thread Starter 
hey, my dh just got home with a cool plastic cup for ds!!! seems he heard you angela! i think he´s gonna love it!
post #46 of 66
What would you all say to a situation like this:

Baby never CRAZY about nursing, just did what he had to do to be fed. Often, since soon after birth, needed to be coaxed to eat. At 12 months, had NEVER been given pacifiers, bottles (except a couple times a newborn with EBM), and no sippy cups either! that's right! Not even open cup...

Then one day he decides he is done. No, not a nursing strike, been thru that many times before (up to 4 days of not nursing)...this was different...this baby just over a year was truly done...and suddenly takes a sippy cup tho never before. This is after offering many times a day, constant denial. So much so that he'd rather get dehydrated. NOT A STRIKE. I beleive this was CLW and i allowed him to make the call. ALthough still expressing milk, but don't know how long i will choose to do that.

Been very leary of posting this as i'm sure some of you will never be convinced, but i do want to write it, and maybe should post it in a thread itself...to encourage moms that are getting guilt trips for 12 month olds that ARE self weaning and being told its impossible on MDC.
post #47 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkmama View Post
What would you all say to a situation like this:

Baby never CRAZY about nursing, just did what he had to do to be fed. Often, since soon after birth, needed to be coaxed to eat. At 12 months, had NEVER been given pacifiers, bottles (except a couple times a newborn with EBM), and no sippy cups either! that's right! Not even open cup...

Then one day he decides he is done. No, not a nursing strike, been thru that many times before (up to 4 days of not nursing)...this was different...this baby just over a year was truly done...and suddenly takes a sippy cup tho never before. This is after offering many times a day, constant denial. So much so that he'd rather get dehydrated. NOT A STRIKE. I beleive this was CLW and i allowed him to make the call. ALthough still expressing milk, but don't know how long i will choose to do that.

Been very leary of posting this as i'm sure some of you will never be convinced, but i do want to write it, and maybe should post it in a thread itself...to encourage moms that are getting guilt trips for 12 month olds that ARE self weaning and being told its impossible on MDC.

All of a sudden? Strike. By definition.

A 12 mo old is not self weaning. 18 mo I can buy. Not 12.

-Angela
post #48 of 66
Thread Starter 
i trully think a kid can wean at any age. why is 1yo "too young"? if you never gave him a sippy nor bottle...then i guess this is what angela is talking about, right? this is clw. no problem then.

one more thing...let´s say, like in our case, the kid only asks to nurse when he wants to sleep. if he only asks to nurse once int he afternoon for his nap and once to sleep at night, is this weaning? or is he nursing just to sleep and is that ok? i mean, is that enough nutrition for him?
post #49 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by paakbaak View Post
i trully think a kid can wean at any age. why is 1yo "too young"? if you never gave him a sippy nor bottle...then i guess this is what angela is talking about, right? this is clw. no problem then.

one more thing...let´s say, like in our case, the kid only asks to nurse when he wants to sleep. if he only asks to nurse once int he afternoon for his nap and once to sleep at night, is this weaning? or is he nursing just to sleep and is that ok? i mean, is that enough nutrition for him?

Can a 6 mo self wean? No. Of course not.

-Angela
post #50 of 66
Children are interested in living I assume..."weaning" at ANY OLD AGE would be suicide. Think pre-formula days. 12 month olds do NOT self wean.
post #51 of 66
Thread Starter 
:
ok a 6mo doesn´t self wean, that i know. 12mo, too young? ok... i´m learning alot here!
post #52 of 66
Thread Starter 
so if he only nurses to sleep...does that mean it´s enough for him or is it important to offer more?
post #53 of 66
Thread Starter 
ok...it´s 11:25pm here...i have to go to bed...i can hardly keep my eyes open. i hope to read more replies in the morning. thenk you so much for this. it´s great to get so much help...and learn so much! i´ll give him his new cup in the morning!
post #54 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by paakbaak View Post
:
ok a 6mo doesn´t self wean, that i know. 12mo, too young? ok... i´m learning alot here!
IMO, as a rule, humans need to nurse until at least 2 years old. So, given averages, I can believe that *some* children can self wean around 18 months or so. And some much later. But it is difficult for a child to get adequate nutrition without breastmilk or its substitute (formula, other animal milk etc) much below 18 months.

-Angela
post #55 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by paakbaak View Post
so if he only nurses to sleep...does that mean it´s enough for him or is it important to offer more?
I think it is important to offer often for a full two years. Don't offer/don't refuse is a weaning technique. And (in general) I don't think weaning is appropriate before 2 years.

-Angela
post #56 of 66
Ok ok. i'll elaborate a little.
Angela, great point. Sudden weaning is by definition a strike (been thru it as stated) and i had a poor choice of words there.
It was not sudden. He only nursed 5x a day since 3 months. Slept 8 hours a night at 5 weeks. Slept 12 hours a night at 4 months. I'm not bragging, although i know i'm extremely blessed.

So he's never been into nursing. never stared into my eyes. Constantly trying to keep him latched on for a feed. great latch tho. He never ripped my shirt down. we could be naked together in the tub or shower and he couldnt' care less.

So at about 11 months he dropped a morning feed. could not get him to nurse until nap time no matter how hard i tried/offered. So we gave up on that. Didn't drink anything either until naptime. Then he'd nurse once in the afternoon, and once before bed. that was it for him. i tried getting him in the middle of the night while groggy to nurse. NO SIRREEE! He didn't want that and was not happy to be woken.

So, then he went to 2x (only before napping/nightime) and then stopped all together. Bit me several times very very hard to the point i took tylenol. I didn't even yell at him for that. I just told him no biting. But the very next day he was done. i gave him milk in a sippy and he sips on that ALL DAY LONG but gets 10+ ounces in a day.

So i am pumpin' away, 2x a day, but don't know how long i want to do that.

So that's my story and i'm stickin' too it. My child CLW at 12 months.

I was intimidated to post all this at first, but then i realized "Hey, i'm very confident in my child and what he wanted and needed, and i will allow him to do this". I am very confident and firm, and repeat: i post this to encourage mamas to DO ALL YOU CAN to keep your baby nursing as long as possible, but for those few with personalites that don't dig the nursing thing, its OK! Let yourself let go, as your child can CLW.
post #57 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by paakbaak View Post
so if he only nurses to sleep...does that mean it´s enough for him or is it important to offer more?
I think your situation sounds very similar to mine. I understand Rzbm and Angela...i read their posts all the time all over the place about nursing until 2 at least, etc. I understand all that, i beleive in that, i applaud you both for being awesome cheerleaders for others and advocates. What did they do in biblical times/etc. Yes, nursed children to older ages! I beleive in it.

BUT you obviously do not have children that don't even like to nurse. I look forward to my next baby hoping its a sweeter experience. I love my son but its been a very "this is what we do" breastfeeding relationship.

To answer paakbaak's quote, Offer offer offer. Yes offer more BREAST. But as in my case, he did not take it EVER when i offered. (not even naked in the tub). SOOOOO he ate a lot of fruit (water in that). watch for dehydration. If it were ME i would start offering water at least (since you wrote earlier you can't pump) in a sippy. I LOVE LOVE LOVE our NUK sippy, pvc free, soft teat spout.

I would guess your DS is in fact weaning. TOTALLY depends on him if you can get him into the breast again or not. I would say it is still CLW even if you have offered a sippy for SIPS ONLY in the past couple weeks. I do not like bottles tho. get rid of those things! To me it sounds like you are doing what you can. Congrats for making it this long! Well done!

Oh my goodness...i'm in the UK so i'm exhausted too. i'm going to bed. thanks for the lively discussion ladies!
post #58 of 66
You're right, I DON'T understand what it's like to have a baby uninterested in nursing. I don't know what I'd do. I hope, along with you, that next time you have a ravenous babe who is a cheerful nurser! I appreciate that you understand my position, I really do.
Can I just say ONE little thing more to irritate you though? : When offering a cup, I really recommend an open cup...keep offering the boob, yes...but that sippy is NOT helping matters!
Good night!
post #59 of 66
Quote:
Originally Posted by mkmama View Post
Ok ok. i'll elaborate a little.
Angela, great point. Sudden weaning is by definition a strike (been thru it as stated) and i had a poor choice of words there.
It was not sudden. He only nursed 5x a day since 3 months. Slept 8 hours a night at 5 weeks. Slept 12 hours a night at 4 months. I'm not bragging, although i know i'm extremely blessed.

So he's never been into nursing. never stared into my eyes. Constantly trying to keep him latched on for a feed. great latch tho. He never ripped my shirt down. we could be naked together in the tub or shower and he couldnt' care less.

So at about 11 months he dropped a morning feed. could not get him to nurse until nap time no matter how hard i tried/offered. So we gave up on that. Didn't drink anything either until naptime. Then he'd nurse once in the afternoon, and once before bed. that was it for him. i tried getting him in the middle of the night while groggy to nurse. NO SIRREEE! He didn't want that and was not happy to be woken.

So, then he went to 2x (only before napping/nightime) and then stopped all together. Bit me several times very very hard to the point i took tylenol. I didn't even yell at him for that. I just told him no biting. But the very next day he was done. i gave him milk in a sippy and he sips on that ALL DAY LONG but gets 10+ ounces in a day.

So i am pumpin' away, 2x a day, but don't know how long i want to do that.

So that's my story and i'm stickin' too it. My child CLW at 12 months.

I was intimidated to post all this at first, but then i realized "Hey, i'm very confident in my child and what he wanted and needed, and i will allow him to do this". I am very confident and firm, and repeat: i post this to encourage mamas to DO ALL YOU CAN to keep your baby nursing as long as possible, but for those few with personalites that don't dig the nursing thing, its OK! Let yourself let go, as your child can CLW.
Okay- I might consider it child led IF there were:

no sippys
no pacifiers
no bottles
no other milk
no spoon feeding.

Any of those can contribute to early weaning (as can change or addition to mom's medications or new foods in her diet or pregnancy)

-Angela
post #60 of 66
Thread Starter 
he´s been drinking water in an open cup all day! yes, i´m doing what i can and so is he. he´s nursed twice today, so that´s good. thanks!
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