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Midwives, what would you do? Update Post #15  

post #1 of 20
Thread Starter 
I had someone call me three weeks ago saying that she's due at the end of May. I went ahead and scheduled a consult, against my better judgement. I sheduled the consult and the client was 60 minutes late, only coming after she called to see if I was still at the office. I was and agreed to still meet her, thinking something might have come up. At the consult, I gave her all of the paperwork, including how to verify insurance coverage. I asked if she's had any prenatal care and she said no "because we make too much money." But she has insurance? Okay...moving on. We scheduled an appointment for the next week, which *I* ended up needing to reschedule to this week. When I called to reschedule, she told me that she had looked at her calendar and was actually due amost 10 days sooner than she thought.

Today she had a 4pm appointment. She called at 4:45 to see if I was still at the office and I was. I told her to come on in (because she's due and I need to see her and decide if I'm going to take her, even!). She came in and had none of her paperwork filled out, including the insurance verification. I called the insurance because I wanted to settle the financial side of things so we could know how much she needs to pay me.

Then I move on to her prenatal. I had a hard time palpating her baby. Her belly was B-I-G and high, like none I've ever seen before. Her navel was on the bottom side of her belly and everything from her ribs to her pubic bone was HARD, as if she was contracting, but she wasn't. She's a 4th time mom, but it felt like a first time mom with rock hard abs. I couldn't tell anything. So I moved on to listening. All I could find was cord and placenta, until in desperation I listened at the top of her belly near her ribs and found a heart rate of 128. This is the only heart rate I heard, but I heard cord and placenta everywhere. So I move on to measuring, with growing unease. I'm thinking at this point that I probably want her to have a sonogram before I agree to care for her, because I just can't figure out what's going on in there! Then I measure, and she's measuring a whopping 52 centimeters. I think back to when she walked in and sat down: she sighed and asked if I thought this could be twins because she's so big. I laughed it off and said "nah, you have ten pound babies and you're due in a few days, so of course you feel big." But then when I measured and palpated, I realized what she meant.

I talked to her and told her that I'm not comfortable being her midwife unless she sees a doctor for a sonogram and there's only one baby in there. I told her that I've felt twins before (at 36 weeks, not 40) and that her belly didn't feel like that, but it didn't feel like what I'm used to feeling with one baby either. I gave her the phone numbers of doctors I know *can* be mother friendly, because she's had all unmedicated quick births and doesn't want a c-section.

My concern is that they won't take her because she's 40 weeks and has had no prenatal care, though. I'm also concerned that she won't call because she's worried about the money (though she has EXCELLENT maternity benefits). I'm concerned if she does go in and have a sonogram, that they might want to section/induce her ASAP, which she doesn't want. And I'm concerned about sending a client who doesn't understand the concept of insurance or prenatal care to doctors that I *like*. I thought about calling the #1 doctor on the list that I gave her to give him a heads up that I referred someone to him (he's the OB I saw for my own miscarriage a couple of months ago), but I'm not sure if I should do that or not. I did ask her to call me as soon as she talked to them, and I told her to call first thing in the morning and explain that she's due soon and hasn't had prenatal care becuase of a lack of insurance (until January) and that she's concerned she might be having twins.

THIS is why I want a backup relationship. I don't know what to do but I do know two things: I can't do her birth if she's having twins (it's illegal and I don't have enough experience, anyhow!!), and I can't know that she's not having twins until I see a sonogram report. I feel railroaded and "on the clock," though, because she's due MONDAY and just had her first prenatal (with me) TODAY. What if her water breaks tonight or she goes into labor in the middle of the night? Do I tell her to go to L&D, then roll over and go back to sleep and just hope she takes my advise? Do I meet her at the hospital as her doula? Do I go to her house and risk her having twins at home? ACK! None of these is a good option, though I'm leaning toward meeting her at the hospital as a doula.
post #2 of 20
It just strikes me that she's not really connected to the big picture somehow. I get the feeling that you'd be doing the best for her and for protecting yourself by being her doula in the hospital.
Just my opinion.
Best of luck!
post #3 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmom View Post
It just strikes me that she's not really connected to the big picture somehow.
:

That's a great way of putting the feeling I get into words. It's just so...odd, the whole situation. I keep looking back and thinking "what can I do differently next time so I'm not in this place again?"
post #4 of 20
In my past experiences (because I'm on sabbatical right now) I found that things rarely went smoothly if I had a gut instinct that something wasn't lining up energetically. I also found that those mamas that showed up late in their pregnancy with little or no prenatal care didn't have very groovy births, to say the least. There would be something missing in the relationship maybe, or even between the mom and baby if she hadn't been taking responsibility all along. Know what I mean?
post #5 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxmom View Post
In my past experiences (because I'm on sabbatical right now) I found that things rarely went smoothly if I had a gut instinct that something wasn't lining up energetically. I also found that those mamas that showed up late in their pregnancy with little or no prenatal care didn't have very groovy births, to say the least. There would be something missing in the relationship maybe, or even between the mom and baby if she hadn't been taking responsibility all along. Know what I mean?
:

The doula thing is the best idea. There are too many question marks here.

Please let us know how things turn out!

Jennifer
post #6 of 20
Charmie, I'm not a midwife of course, but I have to agree with the go with your gut. The few folks I've had show up like this, very late for care, with odd reasons and then coming late, not showing, not finishing paperwork, etc, have turned out to be actively using drugs. I've had this happen to me twice. In my situation, in a hospital practice, it's a little different because I have back up to call in and a lot of resources at hand, but I'd be really leary showing up to someone's house without knowing the full story.
post #7 of 20
I am not a midwife--just a newbie doula. I read Baby Catcher years ago and have been fearful of legal issues associated with attending childbirth. I know this might sound silly. But that this MW attended a birth as a doula and ended up losing her practice through a lawsuit was alarming.

Is this realistic? Could this be a threat to you? If so, it sounds tooooo risky!!
post #8 of 20
I've come to the conclusion that I'll probably do what other midwives in the community do here, and not accept women that haven't had any prenatal care by the 32 weeks. I thought it was mean when I first heard of it, but I've come to agree. Late transfers from someone else? Sure. People that missed a couple of appointments due to moving? Sure.

Totally off the wall - do you think she's in denial about something? Like she did get prenatal care, found out something she didn't want, and "forgot" about it? I wonder if you could find out her previous provider through her insurance company - is that a hipaa violation?

If I was doing it over again, I'd give her ONE doctor's name and definitely call that doctor for a consult first (before giving the number). "I just had someone come to start care at term. She's a G4P3 and she's measuring way ahead and fht's are high. I don't feel comfortable taking her on for a few reasons. I'd like to send her your way to see what you think?"

I would call her and tell her you are not taking her until she gets an ultrasound/consult from a doctor, so if she calls in labor, you'll send her to the hospital. I'd also send her a letter saying that, but that's me.
post #9 of 20
I wouldn't take her, based on what you have said, and it sounds like you're not comfortable taking her either. Listen to your instincts.
post #10 of 20
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Apricot View Post
I've come to the conclusion that I'll probably do what other midwives in the community do here, and not accept women that haven't had any prenatal care by the 32 weeks. I thought it was mean when I first heard of it, but I've come to agree. Late transfers from someone else? Sure. People that missed a couple of appointments due to moving? Sure.
I agree with this. I've decided based on my two experiences with no prenatal care that I just don't want to take someone who is late in their pregnancy and who hasn't had any prenatal care!

I don't know enough to know if she's in denial about something, but I guess anything is possible at this point. I did verbally tell her I can't attend her birth, but I'll send a letter that says so also. A friend had a good point when she said "well, you've been here all the time, so if she was worried about money for a hospital birth, she could have called much earlier." Its just too weird!
post #11 of 20
Instincts are the 6th sense-I truly believe that. And it is scary to trust it at times.

If she dosen't get the US then be her doula in the hospital.

Don't risk your livelyhood, passion and life over this woman. I feel bad for her too but we can't save everyone. People need to help themseves too. Part of our job is to empower women so that they can do just that. If she's not taking responsibility for her pregnancy then she's not doing her part.

of course, this is just the opinion of a student midwife....so take it for whatever its worth...

Heather
post #12 of 20
That is a weird situation. I like the pp that suggested being a doula for her at the hospital...at least until you feel comfortable taking her as a client. Perhaps you could call her up and go to the sonogram with her. That way you know whats going on and you get a better feel for her.
post #13 of 20
What a totally sad situation but I must say in a loud voice GO WITH YOUR INSTINCTS!!! It's true..we can not save everybody. You could be dealing with so many things..Lowlying placenta, high transverse baby, twins, breech or a baby with multiple anomolies (these like to get into strange configerations and there is usually a lot of fluid.) I personally would even hesitate to be there as a doula..most hospitals have at least one caring nurse and if any thing at all goes wrong at the hospital, even if she "doesn't like" her experience, then she is just as likely to blame you..after all you put her there...
I will share one experience..Pregnant lady asked my good friend (midwife) to be her care giver. She showed for a few appointments, although she lived a good distance away and had experience with birth herself.. She didn't "look good", had tons of water, was huge for dates with a small, hard to palpate babe, etc. Called Midwife in labor, who got there as fast as possible, to find baby born and breathing with great difficulty. Transport of mom for retained placenta, refused to take babe who stayed with dad and a friend. Baby died! Trisomy 13, incompatable with life. Tragic all around. And who got "blamed"? Midwife!!These ladies were friends!!
Anyway, if I have a gut feeling that something isn't right, I go with my gut.
Just my two cents>
post #14 of 20
Quote:
Originally Posted by doctorjen View Post
Charmie, I'm not a midwife of course, but I have to agree with the go with your gut. The few folks I've had show up like this, very late for care, with odd reasons and then coming late, not showing, not finishing paperwork, etc, have turned out to be actively using drugs. I've had this happen to me twice. In my situation, in a hospital practice, it's a little different because I have back up to call in and a lot of resources at hand, but I'd be really leary showing up to someone's house without knowing the full story.
my thoughts too, I am always more than a little nervous with folks who show up at the last minute and are as scattered as this one is- and then if everything is perfect come on down- but this is unfolding like the things I want to stay away from-she would probably be better off in hospital. Do her kids live with her? belly sounds like polyhydraminos , I would think front placenta is why you can't feel except for size, which seems more like poly-- and the baby could be breech--- even with an ultrasound she is already out of my realm.
I think people will try from time to time to come in late, some are ok actually a very few- mostly people who move or sometimes it is that they had a bout of testing in the hospital and could see it unfolding in a nightmare way-or if they are people you know already- then that is one thing but I generally don't take last minute folks- I am not set up to do it, and thinking back I have dealt with some of the biggest messes from last minute clients.
post #15 of 20
Thread Starter 
Update: The mother had her baby on May 17 and the baby was anencephalic. She was breech and died shortly after her vaginal birth. She didn't call me and I was unable to reach her until today, so there were no issues with me being there as far as legality and such, and though I hate to think of her going through that without a support system, I do appreciate that I wasn't called on to be the support system. She named her baby Mercedes LaJoy because her short life was a joy to her family .
post #16 of 20
That's so tragic, but then again I'm thankful you weren't subject to any legality concerns surrounding the birth.
I'm so sorry for that mama and the loss of her babe.
post #17 of 20
so devastating for the family. i'm glad it turned out for you.
post #18 of 20
Thank you for the update, Charmie.

I'm so sad for this mama.
post #19 of 20
hmmmmm. It IS sad...perhaps she didn't want to accept another practitioner's word that the baby was not going to make it? Or just didn't want it to be a "medicalized" birth/death? In any event strange and sad...and a good thing you listened to your gut, Charmie.
post #20 of 20
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Mothering › Forums › Archives › Birth Professional › Midwives, what would you do? Update Post #15