Specific infant probiotic question

[treelover]

My 5 month old has eczema and several food sensitivities (dairy, wheat and soy for sure), she also suffers from severe gas and bowel difficulties. She is ebf (and non-vaxed) and I have been on the elimination diet for 2.5 months now. She has not responded to Solaray probiotics (or Natren's which I am taking) and now I am trying to place an order through Customprobiotics. They suggest a blend of: L. Acidophilus, B. Bifidum and B. Infantis for her but I thought that was strange.....most of what I've read says acidophilus is not found in breastfed infants. I've read a lot about the strain of L. rhamnosus being helpful for eczema and allergies in infants. My question to those of you wiser than I....Should I go with the "expert's suggested blend, or a blend of B. infantis, B. Bifidum and L. rhamnosus or stick with just plain B. infantis? This is the third probiotic that we are trying and they are plenty expensive so I want to be sure and get the correct strain.
Thanks so much. Please feel free to PM me if you need more information on dd's condition.

Want to also mention that through a combination of the elimination diet and high doses of vitamin C the eczema is nearly gone, but I can't stay on this diet "forever" and don't think I should take this much vitamin C long term either; so the probiotics are largely for the digestive issues and to prevent the eczema and/or allergies from returning.

[JaneS]

High doses of vitamin C will case the gas, what kind are you taking and how much? Ascorbic acid or sodium ascorbate for long term use will cause deficiencies in bioflavoniods.

How long did you try the Solaray and how much did you give? Did she tolerate it well or couldn't you tell?

I have only been able to find one warning (on Natren site) that acidophilus shouldn't be given regularly to bf babe except in times of health crisis but don't know their reasoning or research behind that beyond what has already been studied.

If she has serious gut imbalance a LOT of probiotics might be necessary. She could also have other food sensitivities, we have a bunch of weird allergies going on with DS. Have you considered digestive enzymes for you too? Digestive Wellness for Children recs them for babes but I don't have any more info on that, more in recent Cheat Sheet post on that book.

Also nutrient deficiencies need to be considered. For ex. an elimination diet for a long time can especially lead to vitamin A deficiencies, and A directly influences production of your immunoglobulins. Allergies are not only influenced by gut flora.

Are you taking dairy free Natren?

[treelover]

Thank you for replying. DD has had the gas/bowel issues from age 3 wks so it's not the vit. c. I'm taking a combination of SA and various emergen-C packets....up to 15grams/day. I know I'm falling short in the nutrient department on this diet, so I need to start adding back more foods. The ED was br. rice, sweet potatoes, pears and yellow squash. I've added olive oil, white potatoes, avocados, spinach and lettuce greens so far. I think she has issues with the high amounts of organic coconut oil I was consuming pre-diet. The Natren Healthy Trinity I take is dairy free and she was on the Solaray about a month....it seemed to really bother her, making her more gassy and stinky. She's actually pooping better now that she's not taking it, even with the vit. C.

I only briefly tried enzymes....wasn't sure if I should take them or not because it has warning on the label for lactating women. (Enriching Gifts plant enzymes) Also, every time I took them it seemed to again cause more gas and pain for mr babe....maybe I didn't try them long enough...is there an initial adjustment period?

I don't plan to introduce solids to her until she's at least 9 mos.....maybe even older since she's so sensitive. I don't know where this all comes from....I am healthy other than a slow thyroid. No yeast probs or antibiotic use. No history of allergies in our families. Her older brother (3.5 yrs) also had dairy intolerance and I think still has some issues with wheat. He also takes Natren and it works great for him.

nak
jenifer

[JaneS]

Well first of all, as I'm learning now, your thyroid has a GREAT deal to do with enzyme production and digestion. The Master Gland. I think it may be a root cause for us. Which is not to say nutritional deficiencies didn't cause the thyroid to go out of whack (selenium, iodine for ex.) or mercury fillings as I just found a connection. There can be many layers to the "why" question. Allergies are not inherited, they are created. Something has to turn the gene on, the environment plays a larger role than what we inherit in this instance.

Vitamin A deficiency is so very common and can wreak havoc on proper functioning of immune system. Did she or DS get vaccines? I'm pretty convinced that the Hep B at birth has a lot to do with messing up intial laying down of infant gut flora. Coincidentally peanut allergies have risen the same time as Hep B shot has been more widespread.

I respectfully think that the vit. C could be an issue now if not the cause in the beginning... high vitamin C is very hard for a sensitive gut, I know this personally! And the C in your breastmilk definitely increases based on supplements. And the deficiency in bioflavonoids could be a factor, they are certainly well studied for aiding allergic response (quercitin for example). Natural sources of vitamin C at a smaller dosage (b/c its anywhere from 10-15x better absorbed than chemical form) might be better for everyday use.

Yes, there can be an intial adjustment period with digestive enzymes. See www.enzymestuff.com. Generally one needs to start slowly, with maybe a half a capsule 1x day. I had significant issues with just myself starting enzymes.

Coconut oil is a huge problem for DS, the idea in the "pro coconut community" that it is rarely an allergen is not correct. I've since met many people with coconut issues.

Also it's possible what you are eating still contains an allergen for your babe, as frustrating as that sounds. My DS reacted to 25 different foods in allergy testing, lots of weird ones. He is doing well on a Rotation Diet that limits exposure but there are some things he simply cannot have at all.

I think you might just have to test the probiotics on your DD to see what works best with the general need for bifidobacterium in mind. Perhaps there was something else in the Solaray that was a problem, maltodextrin from corn? Did you try the dairy free Bifido Factor from Natren on her?

[SAmama]

The maltodextrine in Solaray was a problem for us - mucousy diapers and sandpaper rash all over her body. We have her on custom probiotics now and after only two days she looked much better, sleeps better and and is just happier. We got a mix with mostly bidfido bacteria, but thought that since she was already into solids it might not be a bad idea to get some of the bacteria in there that shows good results for eczema.

[caedmyn]

Personally I don't think the guy at customprobiotics knows much about infant probiotics (that's the impression I got when I talked to him, anyway). I'd either go with the 2 bifidus strains and the l. rhamnosus, or just the b. infantis. If you tell them it's for an infant, you can probably get 25 grams instead of 50 (he charged me $60 for 25 grams of a custom blend). Also, if your DD's eczema doesn't completely clear up, you may want to consider the Failsafe diet which eliminates/lowers amounts of natural food chemicals in your diet. For instance, coconut is high or very high in salicylates so it's certainly possible that your DD was actually reacting to those and not the coconut itself. Failsafe finally helped my DD's eczema to clear-up...I wish I had known about it earlier and maybe she wouldn't be allergic/intolerant to so many foods. (Salicylate intolerance has been shown in animal studies to increase chances of developing food allergies.) www.plantpoisonsandrottenstuff.com www.fedupwithfoodadditives.info

[treelover]

Ok....I stopped the vit. C and have added kiwi to my diet, so far, so good. Also, aren't sweet potatos loaded with Vit. A? I eat 1- 2 of them a day. I went ahead and bought the Digest Gold enzyme and have been taking it for 3 days...I haven't noticed any changes, good or bad in either dd or myself yet. Her face is still almost clear! Gas/digestion issues are still there, but not nearly as severe as they were a month ago. I really think it was the coconut oil causing all the problems. I started eating it when dd was 2wks old and the problems started at 3wks. Duh! I don't know why it took me 4 months to figure that one out. I even went off my thyroid medicine thinking it could be a pig allergy (Armour thyroid). DD's poops still aren't normal though....,hence the probiotic. I finally ordered the blend of f B. infantis, B. Bifidum and L. rhamnosus for her...I really hope it helps or at least does no harm.

JaneS....my dd is not vaxed, so no link there. Thanks all for your help. I will update after we try the custom probiotic.

[JaneS]

There is no vitamin A (retinol) in sweet potatoes or any other vegetables, it is only in animal products (best sources: cod liver oil, liver, grass fed dairy, pastured eggs, wild fish).

Beta Carotene is in veggies and needs to be converted to vitamin A. If you have impaired digestion (and also thyroid problems) it cannot be converted very well to usable retinol. Studies show normal conversion is anywhere from 12:1 to 20:1 in healthy people. Which means an entire carrot will not even get you close to the the RDA of vitamin A.

And the RDA is woefully inadequate for healthy people nevermind those facing illness. The RDA for many nutrients are just to prevent overt clinical signs of deficiency b/c western medicine knows little about healing with nutrition.