Please help us with diaper changes!

[sarahmck]

I have been struggling on and off with my DD over diaper changes for months. We are currently in a bad month, so I will describe the situation and hope beyond hope that someone will have a suggestion for me that might ease the situation.

DD just turned 2. She wears cloth diapers. Almost every morning, she asks for her diaper to be changed as soon as she wakes up. She nurses all night long and really needs a diaper change right away in the morning. She also poops within a couple minutes of waking up.

I take her in the bathroom to change her diaper and now the fun begins. She won't lie down for me. I have to emphasize that her morning diaper is seriously gross, and is almost always filled with poop, so it's really not a good one to try to change on the run. We always change her diaper lying down, so it's not like I'm trying to get her to do something different in the morning. She climbs up onto her changing table and proceeds to play with things. There are always some toys in the bathroom since she has recently begun insisting on bringing a toy or two upstairs with her whenever we go up for a diaper or bed. She is always in a good mood and messing around with toys or diaper cream or kleenex or her toothbrush, etc. I ask her to lie down for me. She appears to not even be able to hear me and just keeps prattling on about whatever she's doing. I explain that we need to change her diaper and get her dressed so that we can <see her friends on playgroup days>/<go to the toddler gym on those days>/<have something to eat>/<go downstairs and play with toys>. She continues to not lie down and if I try to lie her down, she wriggles away. If I push her down, she rolls over immediately. It is totally impossible to change her diaper if she doesn't want to let me. She is both physically strong and extremely strong-willed.

I often spend 30-40 minutes getting her diaper changed in the morning. Especially given that she often asks to get up and change her diaper, this is driving me mad. Most days, around three of her diaper changes are like this to some extent, but slightly shorter, say 15 minutes.

I don't know what to do. I really really don't. I can't stand wasting an hour or more of my day each day on wasted time during diaper changes. I have tried every demeanor that I can think of -- gentle and extremely calm; waiting quietly for her to tell me she's ready (she has occasionally told me she was ready, but I have to wait a looooong time); stern and firm; offering choices ("do you want Mama or Papa to change your diaper?"); not offering choices ("your diaper is full of poop and I am going to change it now"); warning of consequences and sticking to them (this is generally "lie down now or Papa will come change your diaper and I will go downstairs" and when I do leave the room, all hell breaks loose); warning of consequences and not sticking to them (eventually coming back and changing her diaper because she's inconsolable after I leave the room); and on and on.

I have now shouted at her on several occasions and attempted to gain her compliance with mild force (holding her down when she tries to twist away, but this is both totally not what I want *and* fruitless) and I'm at my wit's end. I don't want to yell at my baby. I don't want to dread every diaper change.

I don't feel like this is about her wanting to potty train. I often offer her the opportunity to use the potty when we're doing a diaper change and she is rarely interested. I just casually offer it with no pushing. If she does use it successfully, I congratulate her heartily. But it's definitely not a big deal in our home.

I don't feel like leaving her with no diaper is a viable option because she pees very frequently (avid nurser and small bladder just like her mama), we don't live in a terribly fantastic climate, and we have a lot of new furniture and rugs. This wouldn't help a lot anyway, since she doesn't allow me to take the dirty diaper off. Once it's off, putting the clean one on is usually not a problem.

The one thing that I've noticed that seems to help is that if she does her messing around in bed in the morning and then we get up after 15 minutes or so, she is more often cooperative. Like she needs to play a bit because it's so exciting to wake up. Trust me, I never hurry us out of bed -- the problem is that she recently has been insisting on having her diaper changed immediately upon waking up. I try to distract her with the few toys that she has in bed, but that usually doesn't work.

Please please help me, someone, anyone. Any and all suggestions will be appreciated.

[mumkimum]

Not sure if you use a diaper she'd be able to - but what about the option of letting her take the diaper off herself? Trying out a different kind of diaper she would be able to take off?

[sarahmck]

Originally Posted by mumkimum

Not sure if you use a diaper she'd be able to - but what about the option of letting her take the diaper off herself? Trying out a different kind of diaper she would be able to take off?

I've never tried this. Some thoughts:

• The morning diaper is really yucky: many layers, all soaked through, with a big lump of poop in the middle. Not great for having a toddler handle.
• I'm hesitant to make her aware that she could take her diapers off.
• She might like this, though, and it might work.

I will give this some thought. Thanks for the suggestion.

[addictedtocloth!]

can you find something special for her to hold, like say a marker and a peice of paper. promise her something afterwards that she would normally not ever get, like a real tiny chocolate drop?

[cutekid]

When I started going through this with my DS I started potty training. I felt like, our struggles with diapers weren't healthy anymore. It has taken a while, but he is doing good with the potty now.

He started pooping in the potty consistently within a few weeks of learning how to the potty.

Denise

[mumkimum]

FWIW I am all for the reasons you might be hesitant about letting her take her dipe off - but as a 'last resort' for helping mum from going crazy, YK?

What about showering/bath in the morning? If she likes that might she be more apt to let you take the diaper off?
I think the key is finding something novel and interesting enough that she GETS to do that she can be active about instead of, say, what she is doing now that is making the diaper change difficult. I'm trying to think of interesting things she might like to do lying down but I can't right now.

(I sort of fear this happening with my dd when she gets that age. . . knowing her temperment so I'm preparing myself here )

[CalBearMama]

We've been EC'ing since DS was about 10 months old, so from that perspective, my first thought was that you have a great opportunity to start ditching the diapers and helping her use the potty, especially since it sounds like she's very regular with her morning poops. I haven't been in your shoes, but here's what I think I would do if I were:

1. Institute a policy of taking off her diaper immediately when she wakes up, even though she is still in bed and hasn't pooped yet. Tell her beforehand that you are going to start doing this, so that she isn't wigged out by this change in routine. Then just relax in bed with her for as long as she wants, while explaining to her that as soon as she needs to poop, you will help her do it on the potty. Keep a potty nearby, and as soon as you notice or she tells you that she needs to poop, put her on it and give her whatever support she needs to poop in the potty. If she needs a diaper in order to be comfortable pooping, you can try putting a diaper on the potty before helping her sit on top of it, and then eventually removing the diaper from the equation.

2. If she won't cooperate with you taking her diaper off first thing in the morning, I guess you could get a little bit sneaky and remove it while she's sleeping, just before she usually wakes up. You could put a waterproof pad with a cloth diaper on top of it under her to protect bedding from any additional pee. You might be surprised to find that her diaper is not terribly wet when you remove it, but that she pees a ton as soon as she wakes up. If that's the case, then you can work on getting both her first morning pee and the poop in the potty.

3. If none of this helps, maybe try standing her in the bathtub or shower in order to remove her diaper, rather than trying to make her lie down. Once the diaper is off, you can then bathe or shower her quickly, and it sounds like putting a clean diaper on won't really be a huge issue. If this is the only time she poops during the day, she won't need another bath or shower later, so any additional time you spend doing this in the morning will save you time later.

[sarahmck]

Originally Posted by CalBearMama

We've been EC'ing since DS was about 10 months old, so from that perspective, my first thought was that you have a great opportunity to start ditching the diapers and helping her use the potty, especially since it sounds like she's very regular with her morning poops. I haven't been in your shoes, but here's what I think I would do if I were:

1. Institute a policy of taking off her diaper immediately when she wakes up, even though she is still in bed and hasn't pooped yet. Tell her beforehand that you are going to start doing this, so that she isn't wigged out by this change in routine. Then just relax in bed with her for as long as she wants, while explaining to her that as soon as she needs to poop, you will help her do it on the potty. Keep a potty nearby, and as soon as you notice or she tells you that she needs to poop, put her on it and give her whatever support she needs to poop in the potty. If she needs a diaper in order to be comfortable pooping, you can try putting a diaper on the potty before helping her sit on top of it, and then eventually removing the diaper from the equation.

I need to get my head around this EC thing. I feel confident that what your suggestion would result in her becoming potty trained earlier. I have only logistical concerns. I know her diaper is at least wet in the morning before she has woken up because she nurses so much overnight that she couldn't possibly be holding that all in. So how would you handle taking it off while you yourself are also in bed? Just have a box of disposable wipes there to clean her off? This is all keeping in mind that she's in our bed, which is new and expensive and therefore not sacrificable to the potty training cause.

So the first few times we do this, she'll probably pee (and poop, since she usually poops before getting out of bed) in the bed. If you're right about her peeing a lot when she first wakes, then it will be a real flood (we've had to buy super-absorbent diapers for nighttime because she pees so so much). How do you handle this? I'm imagining all that pee rolling off the waterproof flanelette sheet and onto our sheets and mattress and down comforter, etc. Then it just stops sounding worth it.

I know I must sound so selfish. I'm putting my desire not to have to wash all my bedding daily and not to risk damaging my expensive bed over helping my daughter to potty train when she's showing signs of readiness. Is there any way to make this work without creating so much mess?

On a separate note, we did quite well this morning. Her first words upon waking up were "change diaper," but I had her new tea set at the ready and gave her that to play with. She played with that for 20 minutes and then we got up. Then she only delayed about 5 minutes, which I can live with. I am not totally confident that this will be repeatable, though, because she often plays in bed before getting up and then still gives me lots of trouble.

[cutekid]

I use a shower curtain on our bed, in case my DS has an accident over night. However, until last month I wouldn't let him get in bed without his night time pants (training pants I made)

Also, if she figures out that going to stinky on the potty is easier and less intrusive from you, then she'll likely go for it. My DS was all about not going stinky in his pants after he realized that there was little clean up.

Denise

[CalBearMama]

I need to get my head around this EC thing. I feel confident that what your suggestion would result in her becoming potty trained earlier. I have only logistical concerns. I know her diaper is at least wet in the morning before she has woken up because she nurses so much overnight that she couldn't possibly be holding that all in.

Her diaper may be wet, but it might not be - she might just be peeing a ton immediately upon waking up. Some kids are able to hold it all night despite being all-night nursers. When my son was that age, he peed once during the night (about four hours after nursing to sleep), and that pee always got in the potty because the need to pee made him so restless in his sleep that none of us could sleep well unless I pottied him. I couldn't stand being kicked constantly and awakened hourly (or more) "to nurse" between 2 a.m. and morning, so I held him over a big bowl to pee as soon as he started getting restless, and he fell right back to sleep afterwards and slept well. Within a few short months after he turned 2, even though he was still nursing to sleep, he no longer needed to pee during the night at all (unless he consumed huge quantities of water, soup, melon, etc. right before bed). And I know some children achieve night-time dryness even earlier (some when they are tiny babies), so it is possible that your daughter is holding it all night and peeing a ton first thing in the morning (or perhaps peeing once during the night, like my son did, and then peeing a huge amount again as soon as she wakes up).

So how would you handle taking it off while you yourself are also in bed? Just have a box of disposable wipes there to clean her off? This is all keeping in mind that she's in our bed, which is new and expensive and therefore not sacrificable to the potty training cause.

I have been giving some more thought to this, and I think what I would do is start by telling her the night before that as soon as she wakes up in the morning, you are going to take off her night-time diaper, because you know she likes to have it taken off first thing in the morning. Explain that you will have her potty right by the bed, and that she should try not to pee or poop in her diaper when she wakes up, because you want to help her do it in the potty. Then as soon as she wakes up, remind her of the plan, "OK, now we're going to take off your diaper so that you can go pee and poop in the potty." Then just quickly remove the diaper and help her sit on the potty. Then do what you can to help her relax and go in this new place - read books, sing songs, drink water, nurse (I could never manage to nurse my son on the potty, but some moms can), hold her hand - just whatever seems likely to help her feel comfortable.

I know I must sound so selfish. I'm putting my desire not to have to wash all my bedding daily and not to risk damaging my expensive bed over helping my daughter to potty train when she's showing signs of readiness. Is there any way to make this work without creating so much mess?

I do not think you're selfish for not wanting to ruin your nice things or do tons of extra laundry. I think that's one of the main misconceptions about EC, though - that it results in messes everywhere. People EC very successfully using diapers or training pants as back-up - you just have to really focus on the communication aspect. Maybe the alternative I described above will be a more realistic way of approaching the situation, so that she is not actually sitting around in bed diaperless. You could also check out the EC forum (under Diapering) for ideas about protecting your bed from any accidents, if you ever decide to have her be diaperless in your bed.

[ThreeBeans]

One answer. Tub. Change her in the tub. She doesn't have to lie down and there is a handy shower head to clean up the damage

[EdnaMarie]

We also EC. My DD does not pee at night, but she pees a TON when she first wakes up. She will go three or four times in fifteen to twenty minutes, all very big pees. But if she wakes up all the way before that, they're all in the pot.

I agree that if you can't change her diaper, you should definitely consider giving her some more control over the situation. Start trying to get her to communicate her needs. Does she know when she's pooping? Does she go to a special place, or does she do it in bed? If she goes somewhere, you can always put the pot there.

EC can be messy- but at 2 it would be more gentle potty training since there is still that un-training aspect with getting rid of the diapers. So I am not going to say there won't be messes because you have a willful two-year-old on your hands, not a placid little infant. But it could work. Try it- why not? Couldn't hurt.

Good luck!

[gabysmom617]

I don't know much about ECing, but from a curious diapermaker's perspective, on the EC thing, I wanted to chime in and say that there are tons of options out there to keep your bedding from getting soiled.

First up, they have waterproof mattress covers at many department stores. That's so that if *all else* fails, you could wash your sheets and blankets and at least your mattress will be un-peed-upon. (if that's a word)

Then, if you check out some of EC stores on the net, they have different types of absorbably pads that you can put under her during the night, or upon waking in the morning. Being that she is not going to wear the pads, they can be as thick and as absorbable as they need to be. If they are done right, (The right combination of fabric and fabric treatment) they will absorb pee quickly and keep your bedding dry at the same time. Might I suggest some type of densely felted and lanolized wool pad underneath some kind of absorbable pad above? Wool is extremely waterproof. I have a real for wool, and it doesn't have to be washed often. And it doesn't have to be itchy to sleep upon if it's covered up by something else absorbable above it...

Just brainstorming for you on the EC/messy bed covering thing.... Just check out some EC stores and see what you can find to protect your bedding.

[sarahmck]

Thanks for the responses.

I have been offering the potty with every diaper change for the last few days and it has really been helping. I spend just as long in the bathroom because she pees 20 times at each session and takes great pleasure in dumping each one individually (and spilling a few drops, and treading in those, creating fun pee footprints, but I digress), but at least I'm not getting as frustrated with her and the time is being spent making progress towards the eventual goal of getting rid of the diapers.

CalBearMama, your comments about fidgety time in bed really struck a chord with me. Most mornings, Eloïse wiggles and squirms for a good 1.5-2 hours before finally waking up, thereby robbing me of most of my sleep during that period. If I need to pee by then, and I usually do, I can pretty much forget getting back to sleep myself.

I am hesitant to offer her the potty at 6am for fear of her waking up fully and doing her standard pee 20 times and gleefully run back and forth from the potty to the toilet thing, but I figure I don't have much to lose in trying it -- after all, I'm not sleeping anyway. Maybe she'll be sleepy enough to just pee and then let me put her diaper back on (that's the part I'm most worried about) and go back to bed with me. So I think I'll try that tomorrow, or whenever she next is very fidgety.

I know I have trouble sleeping when I have to pee, so why hasn't it occurred to me that she may feel the same way? I guess I just always assumed that if she has to pee, she'll just use her diaper, but maybe that's not the case.

Thanks, everyone.

[sarahmck]

A quick update: Eloïse woke up about 2.75 hours after going to sleep tonight. I offered her the potty and she accepted. She was very sleepy and whiney/crying, so I crouched down in front of her and nursed her (thanks for the suggestion to do that, as I wouldn't have thought to nurse her on the potty without it) and she peed a lot, all in one go. She made no attempt to dump it or any of that, so clearly my fears about her waking up and getting all excited about it (at least in the middle of the night) were unfounded.

She hasn't woken up again in the 2 hours since I managed to sneak out again. We'll see if getting that big pee out helps her to be less fidgety in the morning.

Note that her diaper was already somewhat wet when I took it off.

Bringing her to the bathroom brought back memories for me of my mom waking me up when she went to bed to get me to pee. I was a bedwetter until I was 8. I remember absolutely hating being woken to pee, and clearly Eloïse felt similarly!

[EdnaMarie]

So glad to hear it's going well. It's perfectly normal for some children to wet until childhood- here everyone ECs and some babies still wet the bed until 7 - 8. Obviously not fun but c'est la vie.

Good luck with your gentle potty training! Feel free to stop by the EC forum if you ever have questions. Most of us have experienced two-steps-forward-one-step-back progress so sometimes you need encouragement.