Life After Waldorf ~ A Support Group - Page 46

[muse]

Originally Posted by jalilah

Oh Muse, I am so sorry.
I would just leave if I were you. Don't be afraid. Believe me and all of us. It got better after we left!

I think we're there...today i started to drive ds to school and broke down in tears because i just couldn't do it. we decided to have our own "time out". we went and got bagels and he had a playdate and library trip with a homeschool friend while i went to work. he's the happiest i've seen him in some time.

So....exploring our options and funnily enough i ruled out montessori a long time ago but just learned about a lovely sounding one here.

I don't think I can say too much until our decision is clearer...isn't it SO bizarre to be in a system where you have to watch what you say and who you say it to all the time?!

[karne]

Originally Posted by muse

I think we're there...today i started to drive ds to school and broke down in tears because i just couldn't do it.

It's going to be OK.

[orangewallflower]

he's the happiest i've seen him in some time.

You said it all right there! You are doing a great job of working through this. You went in to the problem constructively, you communicated about the issues clearly and you gave a new teacher a chance. And now you are looking for other options. You will be in a better place very soon! I'm glad your son had such a nice day. You are a great mom!

[muse]

thanks everyone for the support. it's so tough though. on friday he *asked* for the day off, which is so unlike him. we went to the science museum and learned so much cool stuff and when we got home he spontaneously started making a book on all the creatures he'd seen. i saw him with that spark of excitement about learning again, instead of him coming home telling me how he is learning to wrestle and punch and kick and how he got sent to sit in the K class.

Today we toured a montessori school. I am quite surprised how much we liked it. Lovely staff, and it is not at all what we *thought* we wanted from a school (ie so NOT waldorf) but then so many exciting things about it. In particular a big emphasis on music, which has been a real problem for me in waldorf. And science..imagine that! The teachers were all so open and transparent and talked at such length with such *intelligence* about the curriculum, discipline, classroom management. Such a RELIEF! We don't know yet if they have a spot and i think the process will be slow so we came home thinking we have some time.

Instead we came home to a letter from the support teacher at the waldorf school basically telling us that they "request our agreement" to them doing an assessment of ds. We've already said no to that. I don't know if we have any rights to stick with that and keep him there even for a short length of time. We're in a tough spot.

Any thoughts about montessori after waldorf?

The more days ds is home from school the more we hear about how things go in the classroom and they sound more and more bizarre. Besides the larger issues going on he lists these as things he finds hard or strange:

- havign to stand still with arms crossed over his chest reciting a very long verse about God. if they goof around or make silly soudns they have to do it over and over till they do it right. he told us he ahs nightmares about this.

- they are only allowed to arrange things in their desks in a certain way, and they can only change it once a month.

- he feels very certain that the girls never get in trouble and can get away with anything.

- he burst into tears telling me he feels his teacher expects him to be perfect and that nothing he ever does is good enough for her. just now he was drawing a picture and said, " aargh, i messed up the border. thank goodness i'm not in school right now!". a minute later he dropped his crayon and said, "i would have got in trouble for that!"

- not being able to talk to friends during class time at all.

- only being allowed to draw using outlines on "special occasions" (he said, "and the 'special occasion' was just to draw a star! it makes no sense!")

- zero conflict resolution; "i don't know why the teachers just don't think of letting kids talk about it when they've hurt someone"....

so much more i'm not remembering right now.

we're also upset realising he was teaching himself to read and write when we hs-ed, and it's all disappeared since he started school.

[karne]

Hi Muse,
I've no experience w/Montessori after waldorf, but I will say that we looked at a number of schools before settling on the pub. school for one, homeschool for the other combo. We weren't especially going for pub. school, but the absolute clarity of the teachers, the happiness of the children, the lack of kids sitting outside the classroom, just to name a few drew us in. And, as I've said before, post-waldorf kids and families were a known quantity and there was a clear system to remediate the academic weaknesses. It felt like we'd been viewing everything through gauze-never any clear answers, psedo religious answers, class teachers overstepping their bound or assuming knowledge that they never actually had, and then suddenly the gauze was lifted. We were clearly looking for a place that had a no tolerance policy for bullying because we'd frankly had it up to here with one of our children being hurt and the "karma" explaination just didn't fly any more. The kids at the PS were so well supervised, play was pretty harmonious and non-conflictual. In short, it was what we had thought we were getting, but hadn't.

But, it was still tough to admit that waldorf wasn't going to work. The promise was there, but never fulfilled, as you hear over and over again. It's very, very, sad. As an FYI, I have seen the posture your son describes used with kids, although they were older, and I have heard a waldorf teacher describe the reasons why they would make a child stand in this posture-it's supposedly some sort of therapeutic posture, if I remember correctly. If Bean sees this she may have some light to shed.

Good luck. I am sorry for your experience and I hope your son ends up in a loving place.

[orangewallflower]

It will be interesting to see what they say about your refusal to do the assessment. If you really don't want it done, it might be best to be up front with them and tell them that you are looking for a new school and would like to make a smooth, not sudden, transition out of the Waldorf school. Otherwise, I would imagine that they would want your son to leave the school if you don't comply. What they want to do is examine your son's life to see if they can solve the problem they see. They may want a detailed story of his birth and life from you so that they, as a college, can figure out anthroposophically how to help him. The learning specialist may ask him some questions, but hopefully in a way that he wouldn't even know what s/he up to. Then they will probably come to you with an anthroposophically therapeutic approach for how to help him. When my friends' kids have been assessed it has really had no impact on the kid since they just observe and ask questions. The kid never knows what sort of conclusions are drawn or anything like that. I say this because if it buys you some time, the assessment in itself probably won't do any harm.

I hope that the M school works out for you! Can your son go try it out for a couple of days to see if it seems like a fit? One positive thing is that the M teachers may have a pretty rich understanding of W and may be able to assess whether or not M will be a better fit.

[beansavi]

Hi, Everyone!

I am about to put my 2 year old to bed and he is feeling a little under the weather... then it's up early and off to school...

I have skimmed the posts and will try to sneak on while my kids are in PE tomorrow.

But in the meantime...

know I love you guys and am holding you in my heart until I can check back.

I am so happy to see all of the support that flows so freely around here...

[ravenna206]

Bean it's wonderful to read about all the things that you are doing! It seems like your dream of being a great teacher has come true.
Muse, I know I have been in your place before. You are lucky that your ds can talk about it with you. Unfortunately my dd internalized a lot that happened and we didn't know until it boiled over! It sounds like you are finding alternatives that may work for you.
I know public school has been great for my dd. She's excelling even more academically this year. Socially I think it's always a challenge but there aren't the tears and heartache of being singled out by the teacher and then the children.
Hi Karne! Glad your dd is doing great! It's wonderful isn't it. Sorry to be so slow on posting. I think of the board a lot but sometimes with working and school it just gets crazy!
Happy Early Thanksgiving to all!
:

[muse]

Originally Posted by orangewallflower

If you really don't want it done, it might be best to be up front with them and tell them that you are looking for a new school and would like to make a smooth, not sudden, transition out of the Waldorf school. Otherwise, I would imagine that they would want your son to leave the school if you don't comply.

thanks for your thoughts on the assessment. the kicker is we have to pay for it! $25 for the assessment and $40 for sessions or therapeutic eurythmy. it seems half the class is being referred for therapeutic eurythmy right now; that really gives me the creeps.

so, we will decline on the assessment. having had ds home the last few days and talking at length with him i know exactly what the issues are and why he's having a hard time there. and i firmly believe we won't have those issues in a different environment, with an experienced teacher.

so, we will send him this week at least to see friends, and let them know we are applying elsewhere (we need their letters of recommendation!), and see where this goes. i have a feeling we may not make it beyond the thanksgiving break, but id' prefer a smooth transition of course.

eta: at any of the schools we're considering ds would need to spend a day in the classroom. i trust he/we will know quickly what is the best fit.

[orangewallflower]

Oh, they charge for it! Well that makes it much easier to say no thanks. You must be so relieved to have come to some clarity. I am still impressed by how quickly you were able to figure it out! (It can take some parents of unhappy students an agonizing few years.)

Isn't the therapeutic Eurythmy interesting? It's one of those things that I was sure was untrue about our school when I first heard about it. (I was proved wrong of course!)

[muse]

Originally Posted by orangewallflower

I am still impressed by how quickly you were able to figure it out! (It can take some parents of unhappy students an agonizing few years.)

well, we're kind of piggybacking on many of those people since we've heard so many similar stories over the yrs and i know how they always end up turning out...we just had no idea this would happen to *us* and so early on

[karne]

Originally Posted by orangewallflower

Oh, they charge for it! Well that makes it much easier to say no thanks. You must be so relieved to have come to some clarity. I am still impressed by how quickly you were able to figure it out! (It can take some parents of unhappy students an agonizing few years.)

Isn't the therapeutic Eurythmy interesting? It's one of those things that I was sure was untrue about our school when I first heard about it. (I was proved wrong of course!)

I don't know if you meant that therapeutic eurythmy is "interesting" in a good or bad way as I couldn't tell from your post.

In our old school there was a point at which almost half of the class was referred for therapeutic eurythmy-paid for in addition to tuition. One of the parents asked when any results from this intervention would be expected to be seen and the answer was something along the lines of possibly not until another lifetime. It was one of those moments where you think you couldn't have possibly heard correctly, except that you did.

[muse]

Originally Posted by karne

One of the parents asked when any results from this intervention would be expected to be seen and the answer was something along the lines of possibly not until another lifetime.

i'm getting to the point where i have to laugh, or else i'll cry...

[raksmama]

Hi Muse,
As I wrote in my earlier post, we switched from Waldorf to Montessori and it went well.
There are 2 things you need to consider however:

1. Not all Montessori schools are the same. Unlike Waldorf, there is no TM on the name Montessori so any one can open a school and claim it is Montessori.
As I said before, our first Montessori school was great but we moved. In the city where we live now I was not impressed with the Montessori schools. They all seemed like businesses. There is an association called in AMI. See that the schools are AMI certified at least, but most of all check the school out and see how you feel about them.

2.Many Montessori schools will not take "Older" children, meaning children over 6 who have not done the program from the beginning so I am not sure how old your child is but if you decide for Montessori don't wait to long

You can read more about Montessori in the Education forum.
There is also a Comparisons forum where I wrote in greater length about our switch.
Good Luck!


[QUOTE=muse;12618909]
Today we toured a montessori school. I am quite surprised how much we liked it. Lovely staff, and it is not at all what we *thought* we wanted from a school (ie so NOT waldorf) but then so many exciting things about it. In particular a big emphasis on music, which has been a real problem for me in waldorf. And science..imagine that! The teachers were all so open and transparent and talked at such length with such *intelligence* about the curriculum, discipline, classroom management. Such a RELIEF! We don't know yet if they have a spot and i think the process will be slow so we came home thinking we have some time.

Any thoughts about montessori after waldorf?
QUOTE]

[raksmama]

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=252612
This is a link to the thread where I wrote about changing from Waldorf to Montessori (in 05)

[muse]

sad news, no spots in the m school.....huge bummer....now we're not sure what to do. haven't found a good affordable alternative.

ETA
also wanted to say, i was just away for 5 daysat a music therapy conference. i talked with a top music therapist who is also a life long anthroposophist about his opinion about music in waldorf schools and he basically told me to get out of there asap. he had much to say but basically said these schools are full of dogma and can be so damaging. he knows first hand from yrs and yrs (he's in his 70's) of experience in the UK and US. In fact, "pernicious" was the word he used. I had to look that word up:

pernicious:
1. highly injurious or destructive : deadly
2. archaic : wicked

And I came home to ds telling me how much trouble he got into at school all week. : (

[mommabeehilly]

want to be informed/make best decisions

hi, i have a dd who is 19 mos. old. as we have looked into schooling options, we are theoretically attracted to waldorf (nature, natural toys, play, tv free, etc). i came across this thread in all of my research, which i am pleased about as i like to see all sides before figuring out what is best for our family. i guess i am a researcher in that way. i have waded through many of the posts and don't want to spend the time reading them all. i would however like for folks to comment on the following questions i have (of course these are all subjective, but that's what i want).

what is good about waldorf?

what is bad?

what resource have you found that has educated you most on this subject?

i am hoping to tour the local waldorf school....what should i be attuned to and/or look for during my visit?

what would you do if you had it all to do again?

thanks! peace to you all. know that your answers will help me move forward to make the best decisions for our family.

kindly,
mommabeehilly

[karne]

Hi Muse. So sorry about the M. school. Where does that leave you in terms of any options? It seems like you've done the h-schooling piece? Also another private school if I remember correctly? The W. school would have him stay as a student provided you do remedial therapy through them-is that the situation? Does public work for you at all? Sorry-lots of questions. I hope something emerges as an option that feels good to you and your family. I wonder if you have charter or magnet schools where you are that would appeal in any way.

AND, wow about the music piece.

[orangewallflower]

I'm so sorry to hear that, Muse. Were you able to get him on a waiting list? I too hope that a good alternative emerges.

[orangewallflower]

Mommabehilly,
My gut response to your questions is that they are out of the scope of this thread which is dedicated to supporting each other while we transition out of Waldorf. I think that if you re-post in the Education section (there is a whole section dedicated to Waldorf and you can start your own thread) you will get a more immediate and thorough response. I would be happy to answer your questions over there. There have been many threads around prospective parents. If you go to the Waldorf threads and then click to organize them by number of responses, you will get the "juicicest" threads on top.