Broth, and extracting the gelatin

[NoTiGG]

Just curious... i seem to have random success in making broths. The only thing that varies i suppose is : the amount of ACV i put in with it, the temperature and time of cooking... and the different bones.

Does adding an acid such as ACV actually help draw out gelatin? or does it just draw out minerals?

Is there an ideal temperature for extracting gelatin? is it actually possible to cook the broth too much? Or to hot of a temperature? To low of a temperature?

Does it help roasting the bones in an oven beforehand or is that just for making the soup more brown instead of light? Any ideas?

[zeldabee]

The type of bones you use makes a difference. Leg bones will give a more gelatinous broth than neck bones. I've never heard of adding vinegar.

I think the roasting makes stock browner, and I think it improves the flavor. When I've made aspic, I've used leg/shin bones without roasting them. I'd have to look it up again, I don't remember the details. You might look up aspic in an old cook book to see if there are any tricks to getting a lot of gelatin.

I'm only speaking as a former chef, I don't know much about TF per se.

[pnutS4us]

You could try putting trotters (pigs feet) in your stock (beef) or chicken feet in with your chicken bones. Feet tend to have a lot of connective tissue, which adds to the gelatin in the stock. ACV does help in leaching the minerals from the bones--i use about 2 T, give or take, and I have seen it in other cookbooks besides NT (Soup and Bread by Cresent Dragonwagon is one--and yes! That is her name )

I prefer roasting my bones before making stock--for me, it is a richer flavor, but you may want to take into consideration what you are going to be using it for. If you are going to be using your stock in lighter dishes, you may not want the richer flavor. I also roast veg along with the bones and I toss that into the stock pot. Also, don't treat your stock pot as a garbage can--leave out broccoli or cabbage peelings--they can leave an unpleasant taste to the stock. My rule of thumb is, if it is good enough to eat, it is good enough for the stock pot--i personally wouldn't use product that is going bad.

As for boiling, you can bring it to a boil, skim the guck that comes up (add any herbs after skimming, otherwise, you will skim them out with the guck--ask me how I know! LOL!!) Then I would turn down your stock to a nice, low simmer, cover lightly and let it go, keeping an eye on the water level, to make sure the bones are covered. Heavy boiling only stirs up more guck and makes for a cloudy stock, and too low won't extract anything.

hth!

[Tcarwyn]

I have heard that more acv means less gel....I am not sure if it extracts less gelatine, or if it just prevents it from setting....

Tanya

[Plastic]

Start with cold water and don't bring it to a boil - just the first sign of a bubble or two and don't go any higher than that. If you simmer at too high of a temperature, the collagen will be trapped.

[NoTiGG]

hmmm all interesting theories. i will have to try them over time i guess

[covertlycrunchy]

The acv thing is interresting, never heard of that either. But I do know that one of the problems with making gelatin....well gelatinous is pH. The subject often comes up in baking when people want to add a lot of alcohol to some kind of gelatinous mixture only to find out that it won't set up because the alcohol interferes with the gel (Ever have a gooey jello shot?). I would assume something similar would be going on with the acv. I think a little would be fine, like what the pp said, just a couple of tt but not to go overboard with it (like 1/4c would probably be too much for most recipies).

Also, as a former-chef-in-training we made the most yummy broth in my old resaurant by roasting meaty bones (all different kinds) and onion, carrots and celery (veggies on a separate tray in the oven) until just toasty with little brown bits sticking to the bottom of the baking sheet and then de-glazing with red wine. Then we added water (this made a lot, so like 10gal of water) and brought it to a boil quickly and lowed the temp to barely a simmer for HOURS, skimming the entire time as foam rose to the top. Until the mixture was the right thickness. Sometimes they used it for broth and other times they used it as a base for sauces so it was quite a bit thicker for that. Very yummy. Honestly I would look to Julia Child's cookbook for broth instructions.