"Settling in"

[Always_Evolving]

My 3 YO DD just joined a Montessori school near our home (around here academic years start in June and run through April.)

School has been on barely a couple of weeks, of which DD has missed several days. I just had a few concerns about her "settling in" period. She is really very mama-attached, still nurses and takes her time getting comfortable with people to the point that she will agree to be left with them. As far as the school experience, a few points that are confusing for me

• DD has been crying at the time of drop-off; her protest ranges from a downcast look to dramatically running towards me saying "I want to go home. I don't want to go to school". However the director and teachers say she stops crying practically right after I leave, and that she's very focussed on her work etc.
  While getting ready in the A.M. also, she can be fairly downcast about school, and often says she doesn't want to go. Some of her issue is that she doesn't want me to leave after dropping her off so I promise her that I'll "wait" outside (though this is quite pointless and I don't actually do it). That seems to help her feel better.
• At pick-up she tends to be quite okay and often says she had a good day, didn't cry etc. and describes what she did. But some days she seems kinda stressed out. One day in particular she'd had a potty accident, and also said on the ride home that school was very "loud" and that all the children were making too much noise! She often says school is crowded.
• Another thing that has filtered through from talking to her is that she finds school takes a "long time". Basically its for 3 hours. The first 15-20 mins are prayer and singing, then Montessori work for 60-75 mins, then snack and play outside, and the last 30 mins are either singing, stories, group craft activity or such like. I wonder if there's just a lot of down-time the last hour or so, and that DD starts to get antsy then? I would like to ask the director if we can pick her up after 1.5 or 2 hours every day and slowly increase to 3 hours. I have a hunch this will really help. But I am not sure the director will agree -- they seem to really want us to just leave the kids for 3 hours and get them to settle into the routine, even if it means some amount of crying. What do you all feel? Is this kind of normal in Montessori?

We had her in the same school from Jan - April earlier this year but she didn't settle into it AT ALL that entire time. She gets ready much more willingingly and doesn't seem so stressed out this time around.

Personally I like the Montessori concept and would like her to continue. Though ideally I would like to have my child home with me until she is ready for kindergarten, I find that she gets bored easily and the onus is on me to come up with interesting stuff for her to do. If she's at school, and is interested in what goes on there, it frees up time for me to do other things and I really need time for myself too. However I don't want to keep ignoring her protests and "forcing" her to go. So I am kind of torn.

Any thoughts?

[nkm1968]

Separation troubles....

The usual Montessori "phase-in" is for the first week, a 3 year old spends 45 minutes in class while mothers wait in a parent room, assuring their availability if needed, the next week 75 minutes in class, the next week 90 minutes, etc. But sometimes that is "too fast" for perfectly typical little children. As a child and adolescent psychiatrist, I had the wonderful opportunity to observe at the Hanna Perkins School, in Cleveland, which has a nursery program (NOT Montessori) for 3 to 5 year olds, and most of their little ones have difficulty with separation for a lot of different reasons, so they have a much more gradual process, sort of like:

for the first 2-4 weeks, mothers are in the classroom in a little chair while the children are settling in

for the next 2-4 weeks, mother waits on a chair right outside the classroom for the entire class time

for the next 2-4 weeks, mother waits on a chair in a mothers waiting area, and the children have access to her whenever needed

for the next 2-4 weeks, mother is in the area for only a portion of the time, and the child knows for part of the time she will be outside of the building but available if needed

etcetera: most children with various difficulties are able to manage this separation with support from the teacher as well as a GRADUAL separation.

Now, both of my kids separated with relative ease (but very BIG feelings! all of them have feelings about this big step) BUT there have been other kids in their preschool classes who did not, and both had teachers who were able to develop a flexible separation plan with the help of consultants from Hanna Perkins. So, maybe the directress would be open to a different plan from the "usual" to help your dd make an easy transition....I don't think starting preschool needs to be any more stressful than it already is. PS There are lots of therapeutic nurseries like Hanna Perkins, and Hanna Perkins also has a few publications for preschool teachers and parents available, although they are just a wee bit too "freudian" for me, the advice is pretty solid.

[Always_Evolving]

Thanks for the reply nkm1968.

Wow thats really news to me that the typical phase-in is so gradual. I guess around here the schools do what's most convenient for them, not necessarily what's best for the child.

I would appreciate other responses from parents of M children -- do your schools follow the typical phase-in as nkm outlined? Were you able to be in a parent room, chair inside, outside etc. for a few weeks while your DC settled in?

I also wonder, in your schools how strictly is the 3-6 age group followed? In our school there even are children as young as 2 yrs 3 mo. IMO that makes for a more tearful environment as the younger children have a lot of separation anxiety.

I would really like to talk to the directress about a gentler phase-in. But it would help if others could confirm that that is considered typical for M schools.

Thanks again

[3girlmom]

I don't know what Maria Montessori said about this, but we've been to two Montessori schools. At the first, the phase in involved parents sitting in the room for a week. At the second, you dropped your child off for about 45 minutes for the first week, then went right to the full three hour drop off the following week I think some of the kids at both places had issues for maybe the first month: mostly what you describe, with crying at drop-off but then being fine the whole morning until just before it was time to be picked up. Both schools have been pretty strict about the age requirements, though., which I think is related to state licensing. I agree that younger children can cause the issues you describe - why are they not in a toddler room?

I remember being torn when my oldest had some difficulties when beginning, and I sympathize with what you're going through. If you trust your school, though, and if you think it's best for your daughter to be there, I urge you to tough it out a bit longer, and make sure you are presenting a straight-forward message that school is where it's at to your daughter. I've gone through periods with my own kids where I've bought into the "I-don't-want-to-go-to-school" exercise and those days never turn out well (planned days off from school are a different story).

[Maggieinnh]

Not a Montessori parent here, but just thinking if your daughter has been in the same school since January and still has issues with settling in I personally would consider if it is the right environment for her?

I would also probably try to come to a compromise with the director about phasing her into the classroom as nkm1968 suggested, take it step by step and see how she handles school this way, when you can see what she is doing at the school every day you can maybe see what could cause her to be so upset. If after a few weeks she still is not liking the school than I would consider finding another option to the school, after all this is just the beginning of school, if she starts to hate school this early on it could cause real problems later on when she needs to attend school.

[Always_Evolving]

Thanks for the responses folks. It's really helped me think through this.

Maggiennh: It's not that DD completely doesn't like the school... She certainly seems to enjoy many aspects of it. And I want her to go; I like Montessori and she gets more peer interaction than she ever could at home. But the school's philosophy on phase-in and separation is not in sync with mine.

3girlmom:

I urge you to tough it out a bit longer, and make sure you are presenting a straight-forward message that school is where it's at to your daughter. I've gone through periods with my own kids where I've bought into the "I-don't-want-to-go-to-school" exercise and those days never turn out well

That's very true. We are probably showing a lot of ambivalence ourselves and that is not helping her :-( I do want to convey to her what you said so nicely -- school's where it's at. Problem is I don't want to carry her in kicking and screaming, which has been happening the last couple of days. I am concerned about the stress she is going through : makes her overall more clingy, nurse interminably before falling asleep, etc. etc. Last term it also resulted in her pushing her dad away a lot -- I think it was spin-off from wanting to cling to me.

I've decided to talk to the director (Oh BTW does anyone else here share my dislike of the term directress?!) tomorrow about a much gentler phase-in over the period of a month. 90 mins for 7-10 working days, increase by 15 mins, then another 30 mins and finally up to 3 hrs. I know they won't agree to my being inside the school bldg. so that's out. But I have a real hunch this will work well for DD and increase her sense of security. If they don't agree to this, I am going to wait for just one more week to see how she's doing.

Wish me luck!

[RomanGoddess]

I just have a few points.

First off, there should be an insertion period of at least 2 to 3 weeks, during which you are there for gradually more limited period of time.

Secondly, the Montessori work period should be three hours. A one-hour work period doesn't doesn't allow for much to get done and interrupts concentration. I can imagine that your daughter feels disoriented being interrupted at that point.

Thirdly, I found that my daughter only really fully adapted in her Montessori nursery when she bonded with a couple of children. As long as she had not bonded, I think she felt kind of alone in a group. Has your daughter made friends with anyone?

What you describe does not sound like an AMI-certified Montessori school? Is it?

[Always_Evolving]

edited to delete double-post.

[Always_Evolving]

First off, there should be an insertion period of at least 2 to 3 weeks, during which you are there for gradually more limited period of time.

I spoke to the director today about the normal phase-in. They do have a more gradual period but its not the same for all kids. Depending on how the child is doing, (as I read it, this translates to crying) they modify the insertion pattern. My DD's was very quick and I just came to know from today's discussion that that was because she joined after the term had started in Jan. Bummer, if only they'd told me to wait, start with the academic year and have a proper phase-in. Anyhow they have now agreed to an early pick-up (2 hrs) after much persuasion on my part.

Secondly, the Montessori work period should be three hours. A one-hour work period doesn't doesn't allow for much to get done and interrupts concentration. I can imagine that your daughter feels disoriented being interrupted at that point.

Hmmm... I don't know whether that's the issue. Wouldn't they have some time alloted to snack, play, singing etc? I expect 3 hrs of M-work plus those other things would amount to a much longer school-day then?

Thirdly, I found that my daughter only really fully adapted in her Montessori nursery when she bonded with a couple of children. As long as she had not bonded, I think she felt kind of alone in a group. Has your daughter made friends with anyone?

She has indeed made friends. But that doesn't seem to fix the separation anxiety.

What you describe does not sound like an AMI-certified Montessori school? Is it?

I doubt it. I should have mentioned we are in India! The school it is certified by the Indian montessori center. We lived in the US forever and moved (back) to India just a few months ago. I honestly don't know the differences btw American and Indian montessories; I imagine a lot of stuff are local adaptations. However India has a long tradition of Montessories and they are fairly popular. M.M. spent several years here and wrote The Absorbent Mind while she lived here.

[smaug20000]

different ways

I'm glad that I found this thread because my dd is 16 months old, and I found a Montessori school that I really like for her primary school years. However, I was uncomfortable with the phase in. They said, the school year starts with the 4 and 5 year olds coming first to get a routine established, then the 3 year olds start. The 3 years olds start by just getting dropped off with the directress each day. They said they do not want parents dropping off the children in the classroom, that a definite separation place needs to happen, like maybe the front door of the building. There is also no place for unobserved observation so that I could watch my dd and see how she is doing. I am seriously reconsidering the school because the transition phase seems like it will be difficult. I am glad that you could talk over the situation with your director and come up with a compromise. I need to do the same thing. My school is very strict about not starting children before 36 months due to licensing. It's an AMI school, is that why they are so strict about the rules?

[Maggieinnh]

Originally Posted by smaug20000

"They said, the school year starts with the 4 and 5 year olds coming first to get a routine established, then the 3 year olds start. The 3 years olds start by just getting dropped off with the directress each day. They said they do not want parents dropping off the children in the classroom, that a definite separation place needs to happen, like maybe the front door of the building. There is also no place for unobserved observation so that I could watch my dd and see how she is doing. I am seriously reconsidering the school because the transition phase seems like it will be difficult.

I am with you on that one smaug20000, I would also SERIOUSLY RECONSIDER that school, that is a bit too harsh in my opinion to deal with small children like that.
I think what Always_Evolving said regarding phase in time for a young child makes very good sense.

[malcontent]

My son is registered at a Montessori school and is scheduled to start in August if he is able to meet the potty-training requirement. However, I was a bit dismayed to learn that parents are strongly discouraged from accompanying the child into the classroom.

My son will be three the day before he is scheduled to start in the primary (3-6) class. I am to drop him off and allow one of the volunteers to walk him into the classroom. Unfortunately, I don't think I can prepare him for this experience ahead of time. My son is verbally-delayed and does not understand enough abstract language for me to explain the concept of school. He needs to be shown first. He has never even been dropped off without me before, unless he was in the care of other relatives. He's also very shy. I was unable to transition him by starting him in the toddler group because the waiting list has been impregnable.

My son's therapists have recommended Montessori school for him, and the director of the school thinks he will do well there. He does not have any official condition or diagnosis and mainstreaming has been recommended. This is the only Montessori school in my area. I registered him and paid the fees back in March. I want him to have this experience, especially as he is an only child and needs the social stimulation. However, I didn't realize that I would be discouraged from observing him in the classroom for the six-week transitional period. This is hard because he is still not speaking in sentences or discussing many concepts. I won't be able to ask him if he liked school, if he had fun, or what he did. Well, I can ask him, but he likely won't respond.

I guess I will just see how it goes. I intend to follow up with the teacher and director so that I can stay informed on how well he is transitioning. The therapists who have worked with my son assure me that he is very intelligent and so I am hoping that the preschool experience will push him to open up and begin speaking. I still think it is unfortunate that the only school in my area is so strict about transitions. I understand that they don't want the parent's anxiety to influence the child, but I doubt my son will willingly walk off with a stranger into such a new and perplexing thing as a classroom.

[Maggieinnh]

malcontent, have you tried to go with your child to visit the school a few times before the actual classes start, so he will get used to a teacher and the new surroundings? Not taking part in any classes, just "looking around" so to speak?

[malcontent]

Yes, we have been a few times. We spent some time in the classroom back in February before I decided to register him. I have requested to speak with his teacher, but the primary teacher will not be assigned until the end of the month. There will be a meet and greet a few days before school starts and I will spend time showing him the classroom and trying to explain. Right now the school is on a summer classes schedule so things are a little different.

I had a long chat with the director last week when I was dropping off health forms at the school. She told me about one late-talking boy who blossomed upon entering the primary class, so there is hope. Of course, he will not be starting until I can get him to use the potty consistently.

I think frequent visits to the school is a good idea. My son has a good memory for places, so he already recognizes the building. He just doesn't understand what school is and what a schoolday (8:30-12:30) will be like.