4 year old that will not go to sleep

[gratefulbambina]

My dd has never been able to self sooth right. We cannot even put her down and leave 1/2 the time. She spent years going to sleep on my dhs leg in the livingroom while we watched tv. We have moved her to start going to sleep in her bed at night with the knowledge and understanding that she is always welcome in our bed if she wakes up in the night and wants to come in. The trouble is that we cannot get her to go to sleep. Its 10:25 now and shes still up. I've tried and early bedtime of 8:00 and bumped it up till 9:00. I would like to be able to spend some time alone with my husband eventually and it doesn't look like that is ever going to happen. This is getting EXTREMELY frustrating and I don't know what to do. I've given her options to read or play quietly with her animals she may do it for a couple minutes and then shes out the door running around the living room which is only keeping her more awake. We have a routine also and nothing seems to work

[hottmama]

My son is 4.5 and just fell asleep alone in his bed for the first time three nights ago (with no repeats, yet). I don't think it's unusual for a 4 yr. old to still need help getting to sleep. We have set a new, early bedtime of 9pm and I can generally get him to sleep within 3 minutes, but I'd like him to do it on his own, so we're working on it.

[zeldamomma]

Originally Posted by gratefulbambina

I've given her options to read or play quietly with her animals she may do it for a couple minutes and then shes out the door running around the living room which is only keeping her more awake. We have a routine also and nothing seems to work

What do you do when she leaves her room? We did this with a younger child, but here's an idea that might work (even though it's not a super quick fix): go through your bedtime routine, and then tell her you (or dh) will stay with her in her room, as long as she is laying down in bed playing quietly or reading books. Bring a book for you to read, and if she gets up out of bed, or stops playing quietly, get up without any kind of fuss and leave the room. If she gets upset about your leaving, remind her of what she needs to do for you to stay.

I would probably keep the rest of the house kind of dull and quiet for at least the first few nights, so that if she leaves her room she doesn't get anything out of it (just quietly escorted back to her room).

Once she has better habits, you should be able to taper off the amount of time you spend with her.

HTH!

ZM

[AKmoose]

nak
just a quick thought - is 9:00 still too late? Our girls (5 and 3) go to bed at 7:00...if they stay up later, they get over-tired and actually much harder to get to sleep.

[eco_mama]

OMG this is exactly what i was looking for!! my dd is turning 4 SOON and all of a sudden (for the past 4 nights or so) so has been taking forever to fall asleep. she's usually very good about going to bed. we brush teeth, jammies, read books, and then i rub her back for a few minutes and she's out. but man, not for the past few days. i was wondering if it has to do with the impending age change or something. :

[AKmoose]

OK - baby is being "loved" by his sisters, so I can respond a little more...
We have definitely noticed over the years that the earlier we put the girls to bed, the easier it is. However, we've gone through these horrid stages with both now where they fight to stay awake for a loooong time (singing, talking loudly, out of bed, playing...). It was right around 3.5 with dd1, and now for the last week or two, dd2 (3.5) is doing it.
We do bedtime routines (teeth, potty, book) together, then they go to their own beds. If dd2 is reeeally tired, dh stays and just snuggles her all the way to sleep. However, if she's not...she's been up until almost 10, just "playing games." It gets particularly frustrating, because she still gets up about 5:30, and is cranky!
It sounds like this is some developmental thing, as all of our kids are sometime around 4 years old...so in this ramble, I guess I'm saying I don't know, but I can't wait for good advice!

I may just have to try the old bribe with dd2...something along the lines of a prize for going right to sleep? :

[peachpie]

My dd is 4 and still prefers someone (ummm that would be me) to stay with her while she falls asleep. I have been able to start leaving her at the end of the bedtime routine, if she pretty sleepy. I usually tell her I am going to take a shower (the bathroom is right next to the bedroom) and that I'll come check on her afterwards. I have the most success when she knows that 1) I'm still nearby and 2) she's not missing anything exciting!

[edamommy]

hey, we have the same 4 year old... but mine's a boy! OY VAY!

I have NO ADVICE because we do this nightly. ds still sleeps WITH us. DH puts him down and HAS to actually lay w/him until he's asleep.

Our nightly "routine" is railroaded each and every night by this uber bright and exhaustingly manipulative 4 year old. Last night he was up until 11pm... and as usual (5 out of 7 nights) ended in a totally over-tired tantrum. He runs the gamit of running away from dh and downstairs to me telling me that his daddy called him stupid or someother lie. it doesn't end... the antics are killing me/us. he has NEVER gone to sleep w/o a fight and without us acutally laying with him until he's out. NEVER.

so, I'd love to hewar the acvieve

[UUMom]

My youngest is a night owl. A total and complete Night Owl! She rarely falls asleep before 11, and that's been since the beginning. When she was an infant, I clearly remember her being the life of the party on her first New Yea'rs Eve. In fact, that child has never once in young life ever missed an auld lang syne.

That said, she is/was never cranky at night, and when she was younger used to let me know when she wanted to nurse to sleep or when she wanted to have her story. She would amuse herself and then let us know when she wanted to sleep. She rarely napped as a toddler, and was still cheery at night.

Now at 8, she asks someone to 'tuck her in' when she's tired (last night she and I were watching Finding Nemo at midnight in my bed. I fell asleep before the sharks arrived, not sure when she did).

Did I always find this charming? Heck no. But her father is exactly the same way, and thankfully they can keep each other company when am done with the day before they are. If she had been my first I might have been concerned, but I honestly never had kids who didn't like a good party. lol

[mamabohl]

I still lay down with my 5 yo when he falls asleep. Is she taking naps? My ds takes 2 gours to fall asleep if he takes a nap, but 15 minutes with no nap. He also has to be sure to get plenty of excersize or falling asleep is hard.

[gratefulbambina]

I think more exercise would make things more easy...I'm going to make that more of a priority than it has been, but she has been going swimming on the two really bad nights that I've had this week where its taken me two hours or more to get her down. Laying with her only keeps her awake longer I've found because she just plays and makes noises the whole time to keep her body from going to sleep, she doesn't seem to be able to focus on it.

Sometimes she'll take a nap, but most of the time she doesn't unless she falls asleep in the car. Her naps are pretty short when she does take them, maybe 45 mins tops.

[UUMom]

Mine was notortious for taking few naps, or naps that didn't last long. Some people are like this. How is your dc is the day? Happy? Cranky? What's her general dispositon? My night owl is very easy going (but always with a project) and always was. She just didn't require the sleep others do-- as I said, her dad is the same way. She was born like this, and has never outgrown it. She is also a very intelligent person, and I think needing less sleep is part of that. Her brain is too busy, or something.

[gratefulbambina]

She gets really cranky and just plain mean when she needs sleep. She has always needed sleep and you can tell at the end of the day when she hasn't had enough sleep. Her main problem is self soothing. We have always had this problem with her since the beginning. Of course we were ok with this when she was a baby, but it is reaching a time where I would like to spend some alone time with my husband too. Our relationship also needs some attention and now we have a 3rd baby coming and its really starting to stress me. Our 2nd child goes right down to sleep, pretty much by himself as long as you are laying next to him. Our daughter used to have to be physically intwined with you before going to sleep.

[UUMom]

Do you think she could have food allergies/sensitivities? Maybe a sleepy snack (cheese, turkey) an hour or so before bed?

Some kids do need to be draped around and over you. My 8 yr old often sleeps with her head on my neck, even though she starts most nights in her bed, or her dad carries her back when he gets into bed (night owl his whole life). It can be annoying, but kwim, it might be worth it to get to the point of sleep.

[gratefulbambina]

I have not thought of the food allergy avenue, because (IMO) I think it would be unlikely. This doesn't happen only when I serve certain things. Its a nightly event. Tonight was actually a great night and she went down in a 1/2 hr. We went back to some activities that I had been slacking on since I've in my 1st trimester and have been too tired and sick to do things that we normally do. I'm going to make it a priority to go back to those things and make sure she is getting exercise because at this point I feel thats where the lacking really has been.

Thanks for letting me get out my frustrations and helping me!!!