Should I have said anything?

[bu's mama]

Looking for some input from you wise mamas!

I feel like I'm stuck in the middle with letting stbx making his own mistakes & such and sticking up for my daughter/sticking to our agreement about her care.

He's flaky & pretty incompetent, very irresponsible & let's others pick up his slack. One of the reasons he wanted out was to be more responsible & learn to act for himself so he moved 25 miles away & in with his parents (ftr I have nothing against moving in with parents, but given his reasons & then to move in with his super-controlling mother is just totally wrong).

There were a few ground rules in the beginning...I would be with dd if he couldn't, not his parents; he should be taking care of her needs while she is there, not his parents (for example he should be doing her laundry especially since his mother uses detergent & fabric softener that exacerbate her eczema & didn't "believe" there was a connection). I'm not crazy & see that as a family living together everyone will contribute to the needs of everyone else, but it's more that his mother is taking care of dd while she is there.

Yesterday I had to pick her up there (stbx wasn't home) & brought over some of dd's clothes including a t-shirt that she needs for camp pictures later in the week. stbx works at the camp & she will be sleeping over the night before picture day so I told dd to bring the clothes up to her room & that her tshirt was in there. stbx's sister hears this and says something like "oh that's not for E to know, mom should know that" & tells the mother as soon as she walks in the room. (His mother is also slightly annoyed that I know when picture day is (I looked it up on the website) and she didn't since she likes to know everything first).

I did say something to him later that night about how dd is his responsibility, not his mother's. He should be the one to do x, y and z. There have been numerous instances...it's not like I'm jumping on his back about every little thing. I said it's pattern I'm noticing & I'm bringing it up as a point of concern.

Especially those of you that have been separated/divorced for awhile, do I even bother saying anything? I feel like I have to say something so he realizes that it is not unnoticed...he generally lies and/or enhances what he tells me so it's like I need to point out to him that I know he's not being truthful. I know I have no real control of what goes on when dd is not with me, but we also made agreements of how things should be with dd & he is not living up to his part of the deal. I hope that makes sense.

Didn't mean for this to get so long, but any input would be appreciated.

[singin'intherain]

It doesn't sound like you're being controlling here. I bet your ex made it sound like you way overstepped your bounds.

I'm not divorced yet, so I can't say what's appropriate in light of that situation. But I think that it's your job to stand up for your kid. If you said what you had to say respectfully and not in front of your dd, what can they really complain about? How can it be realistic to start acting like your ex is magically perfect and beyond feedback?

You sound like you have a pretty realistic idea of how far it's actually going to sink in. I wouldn't let them intimidate you out of speaking up when you see something wrong.

[mymaybaby05]

I agree with the last post. You don't sound controlling at all, if anyone sounds that way it's the x's mother. Your x needs to be reminded that HE is the other parent of DD, not his mother. It is good that his mother wants to help out with DD, but she shouldn't be the one to raise her while her dad should when she's at their house.
My stbx is very similar to yours. He is not responsible and can't think for himself. Everyone else has to, or it just doesn't get done. His parents are the ones that come and pick up my kids to do stuff or have them over night. My stbx only sees them there. And from what the kids tell me he barely even talks to them, UGH!!
And like you had mentioned in your post.... it's hard to control what goes on when the child(ren) are at the "other" house. But, it's ok to let it be known that things are happening and it is not going to be unnoticed. I still think it's ok to confront him about it. IMO!

[LankyLizards]

What an aggravating situation! I completely agree that you aren't the controlling one. What is up with your X's mother? It sort of sounds like your X might be under her spell and, therefore, whatever you say may just go right over his head. But I wouldn't hold back if something makes you uncomfortable. I have no idea if there is anything that you can do legally. Good luck, I'm sure this is really hard to deal with.

[Viewfinder]

My two cents

I understand your feelings, that he's the dad, he should be "the other parent," not HIS parents, but, but, but, but,

as long as chooses to abdicate responsibility to his mother, he's going to and there's not much point in getting too worked up about it. Hopefully, he will come to a point where HE gets edgy about how much his mother has taken over, and your dd will stomp her little feet about it, too. He does have to work some of this out for himself.

I mean, yes, it's your child and his, but, she is their (your stbx in-laws') blood relative, too. Maybe your dd doesn't actually get that much one-on-one time from her dad, but while at his mother's knee, she is in that mileau that he comes from, and that is the home he comes home to, at least, and that is something of her dad. So for you to get to keep dd all of the time would rob your dd of even that time with her father, and feeling like she does live with him at least a little bit.


VF

[TAC]

If he chooses to ingore you and continue to have his mom help, what are you going to be able to do about it? You can get upset, but unfortunately when with him, you have no say>

[katydid317]

I would have said something, but it does get to a point that when he just won't listen, you might as well stop. If he knows it already, then you've done all you can. Even if he is not taking the responsibility or caring for your daughter the way you would like her to be taken care of, she is still with him and his family and IS being cared for.

[bu's mama]

Thanks for the replies mamas. We're not divorced yet either, there isn't even an official separation agreement in place. I think that's part of where this comes from...I can't accept it now & then complain about it later when we're working out the details, yk? I'm definitely not intimidated by him & he doesn't make it sound like I overstepped my bounds by saying anything, it's more that he makes a big show of how he'll fix it, who he'll talk to, etc. and then nothing. Pretty much the history of our relationship.

I wanted to bring it up because I don't want him to think I'm not aware of the actual situation. I don't think his mother shouldn't help ever, but he agreed to take care of her while she is there, he doesn't and then lies to me about what he actually does. I don't want him to think he's pulling anything over on me. A very small part is optimistic that he'll change for dd's sake, but I know it is very unlikely.

It's frustrating because we've discussed his mother's overbearing & controlling tendencies throughout our marriage & especially after we had a child and then in discussing our separation. He was all on board until he actually has to stand up for dd & that's the part that gets me...I feel like I need to say something to stand up for dd (I'm teaching her to do this for herself but she's only 5).

I guess that is the bottom line...do you not say anything unless it involves actual physical or emotional harm, or do you try to advocate on the behalf of your child(ren)?

Originally Posted by Viewfinder

.... So for you to get to keep dd all of the time would rob your dd of even that time with her father, and feeling like she does live with him at least a little bit...

I just wanted to clarify that I don't deny him access, ever. Sometimes there are logistical issues, but I encourage whatever time he wants to spend with her. That's one of the reasons I was annoyed that he moved so far away. I also buy two of certain things so she can have one at both places, encourage her to bring the little crafty things she does over there to share with them & hang up, and talk to her about things she does with them so she knows that she can talk freely & not worry about 'well I can't say this because Mom doesn't want me to talk about Daddy's house' type of thing.

and

Originally Posted by Viewfinder

...my brothers would have to order a spine from Home Depot before they could stand up to her. VF

[Metta&Karuna]

Originally Posted by bu's mama

.

I guess that is the bottom line...do you not say anything unless it involves actual physical or emotional harm, or do you try to advocate on the behalf of your child(ren)?

I would say the crux of it is: what can you change?

Have you reached the end of the line on hoping you can "get through to him" and see him take action? If so, drop the subject with him.

Do you have any recourse in the courts? I think this is an excellent forum to learn if you do or not. If not, then drop it.

If you can't control it, drop it. The more you focus on your sphere of actual influence, the more peace and satisfaction you will find in this situation and in life in general.

Just my 2-cents.

[singin'intherain]

I don't hear the op getting upset and banging her head against the wall of trying to change other peoples' behavior. She seems to know from experience that she can't do much to make her x change his ways. She also doesn't sound reluctant to let dd go over there or have a relationship with either xh or the grandparents. What I hear her saying is that she doesn't want to make it seem like she is unaware of his not keeping their agreement. It sounds to me more like, "For the record, we have an agreement and I see you're not keeping it. You aren't fooling me."

I have no idea if the courts care in the least who takes care of the child when she's visiting her dad. There's no way they can enforce such an agreement (if you can't, they can't!). I don't think it hurts to say something, though. For one thing, someone like your x is just waiting for your silence to conclude that everything is ok. Speaking up will let him know it's not. For another, you are teaching your daughter to respectfully speak up when something is wrong.

The only thing I would worry about is having your mil begin a huge fued over this, and it might affect your daughter. I would let it go if she starts bad mouthing you in front of your daughter, or yelling at you. And, of course, there's a good chance your ex is going to live with his mommy for years to come so she can take care of his daughter while he gets to continue his childhood.

[TAC]

You could always ask for right of first refusal. That means that if he leaves her with someone you can demand he check with you about your availablity.

[bu's mama]

SITR - you managed to sum up what I wanted to say (in a much more concise way )!

Originally Posted by singin'intherain

I don't hear the op getting upset and banging her head against the wall of trying to change other peoples' behavior. She seems to know from experience that she can't do much to make her x change his ways. She also doesn't sound reluctant to let dd go over there or have a relationship with either xh or the grandparents. What I hear her saying is that she doesn't want to make it seem like she is unaware of his not keeping their agreement. It sounds to me more like, "For the record, we have an agreement and I see you're not keeping it. You aren't fooling me."

This is what I was trying to get at...

Originally Posted by singin'intherain

... For one thing, someone like your x is just waiting for your silence to conclude that everything is ok. Speaking up will let him know it's not. For another, you are teaching your daughter to respectfully speak up when something is wrong.

I don't want my silence to imply my consenting or condoning his behavior. I feel like part of my job as a mother is to hold him accountable to her until she can do it on her own. Also, since we don't have an official separation agreement in place yet, I don't want patterns established that I don't voice my concern or objection to.


And yes, the mil is a bit much. As soon as stbx said he wanted a divorce she began with the I don't know if I'm comfortable with you here & I immediately had a discussion with her about how my daughter is not going anywhere I'm not welcome, with or without me, and she will not be around people who disparage either of her parents. This was over a year & a half ago but I think it set the tone that I won't stand for much of the petty crap (though she still tries).


Thanks again for the input. This forum helps immensely just to get my thinking in order and help me determine how I really feel or the best course of action.