LLL, its reputation, and lactivism

[mom2mich]

Been thinking again (that can be a problem) and from what I've seen, several people who start out nursing do not go to La Leche meetings or call La Leche because they do not feel comfortable with the group given its reputation of being so-called extreme. I never realized it had this reputation until I started hearing comments from people after I got pregnant.

I am wondering how this reputation came to be and how to help people feel more comfortable with the group. I mean, it's kind of sad that people will turn down its support when it could in fact help save a nursing relationship. Why do people say such mean things about LLL? Is it because of lactivism? How does LLL affect the lactivist movement?

[annettemarie]

LLL can't win. Many Lactivists get upset with the group because they fell it doesn't go far enough in promoting breastfeeding. They don't get too involved in politics, and they don't allow leaders to mix causes. But to anti-breastfeeding people, the very existance of a group dedicated to supporting breastfeeding mothers is offensive.

Personally, I think people who claim LLL is somesort of exreme group of zealots either are using LLL as a blanket term for any lactivist, or are running into people who are claiming to be LLL when, in fact, they don't actually represent the group at all.

nak, sorry

[Ammaarah]

Most of the people I know who bash LLL have never been there. They are going off info from a friend of a friend (of a friend?) and that info may or may not be based in reality.

I always make a point of telling new moms that there are often a few meetings in most cities, and to keep looking until they find a group that works for them.

[AlexisT]

Also, unfortunately there is the occasional case of LLL members/leaders not being supportive (the stories you read of people going and being told they weren't trying hard enough), and it really hurts the cause. It tarnishes the image of LLL and makes people afraid of the group.

(NB: Am an LLL member myself, am not saying this is anything but a small minority, but that whenever one of these incidents does happen it gets taken of representative of the group as a whole.)

Also, because we're so, so far behind on breastfeeding, LLL's positions can look extreme simply by comparison.

[redhotmama]

My $.02
Sometimes moms who aren't really committed to breastfeeding ask for breastfeeding help when they really just want to quit. If they can blame LLL for failing them, they don't have to examine their own failure.
"Those LLL people are zealots, they wanted me to tape a tube to my nipple!" "LLL says I shouldn't use a pacifier, can you imagine?" etc.

[eepster]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

LLL can't win. Many Lactivists get upset with the group because they fell it doesn't go far enough in promoting breastfeeding. They don't get too involved in politics, and they don't allow leaders to mix causes. But to anti-breastfeeding people, the very existance of a group dedicated to supporting breastfeeding mothers is offensive.

Personally, I think people who claim LLL is somesort of exreme group of zealots either are using LLL as a blanket term for any lactivist, or are running into people who are claiming to be LLL when, in fact, they don't actually represent the group at all.

nak, sorry

I hear that they aren't strong enough much more often than that they are radicals.

I think it deppends on who you hang out with.

[sonrisaa29]

My experience with LLL has been varied and I think it depends on the group leader. I have met one who absolutely refused to help me figure out anything unless I was going to BF 100% which I kept trying to explain to her that my medication I am on prevented me from doing so but I wanted to at least give him some BM (which I felt was better than none, but who knows I could be wrong?). But I couldn't afford to stay off my meds for very long either.

Now I have met other ones who have told me they wished I had called them instead because they would of totally worked with me and understood my reasons and that it would only be a short time for BF.

I will say that I always thought LLL was all about doing nurse-in's when they felt a woman's right had been violated till I did some research on their site and found this":

"Nurse-ins, where mothers and babies gather at a specific location to breastfeed and call attention to an issue, should not be suggested by a La Leche League Leader, although some mothers may choose to respond in this manner. A Leader is not prohibited from participating in a nurse-in, but should do so as a private citizen. Nurse-ins are not always an effective tool and may lead to more public backlash"

[wannabe]

Originally Posted by redhotmama

My $.02
Sometimes moms who aren't really committed to breastfeeding ask for breastfeeding help when they really just want to quit. If they can blame LLL for failing them, they don't have to examine their own failure.
"Those LLL people are zealots, they wanted me to tape a tube to my nipple!" "LLL says I shouldn't use a pacifier, can you imagine?" etc.

I think this is it exactly.

Someone goes to a LLL leader or group for the OK or as a last step before weaning. And when they're told "yes, you can do this, we will help you, it will be hard, but we'll be there for you" they feel guilty, and would prefer to blame them than take resposibility fro their own decisons and choices.

The first time I ever offered advice on a message board the woman was dealing with low supply. I posted a huge list of what she needed to do, and lots of "you can do this". Of course, what I didn't know is that she'd actually posted her SNS for sale the same day she posted (after she posted), so of course she comes onto every thread now and uses the N word about people who give BFing advice. And claims that she was unable to BF, etc, etc.

[studentmama]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

Personally, I think people who claim LLL is somesort of exreme group of zealots either are using LLL as a blanket term for any lactivist, or are running into people who are claiming to be LLL when, in fact, they don't actually represent the group at all.

This is how I feel. I think it's just easier to blame one another why breastfeeding doesn't work than to think about the bigger picture and how women are really sabatouged from the very beginning. You wanna talk about a women's rights issue that's not talked about, this is one of the big ones!

[sonrisaa29]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

LLL can't win. Many Lactivists get upset with the group because they fell it doesn't go far enough in promoting breastfeeding. They don't get too involved in politics, and they don't allow leaders to mix causes. But to anti-breastfeeding people, the very existance of a group dedicated to supporting breastfeeding mothers is offensive.

Personally, I think people who claim LLL is somesort of exreme group of zealots either are using LLL as a blanket term for any lactivist, or are running into people who are claiming to be LLL when, in fact, they don't actually represent the group at all.
nak, sorry

Here's my question in regards to that. How does one check if one is truly certified by LLL? To bad they don't hand out id cards...ok so maybe that a little much. But I guess my reasoning is that if people have a bad experience with LLL but its not someone from LLL there is no way to tell the difference. It would be great if there was.

Again for I think it depends on the group leader/group on how the experience is.

[lacysmommy]

Originally Posted by sonrisaa29

Here's my question in regards to that. How does one check if one is truly certified by LLL? To bad they don't hand out id cards...ok so maybe that a little much. But I guess my reasoning is that if people have a bad experience with LLL but its not someone from LLL there is no way to tell the difference. It would be great if there was.

For some reason I'm picturing LLL Leaders in black conservative suits, sunglasses, identifying herself with a badge, a la FBI agents. But in their holsters are flanges.

[sebarnes]

Originally Posted by sonrisaa29

Here's my question in regards to that. How does one check if one is truly certified by LLL? To bad they don't hand out id cards...ok so maybe that a little much. But I guess my reasoning is that if people have a bad experience with LLL but its not someone from LLL there is no way to tell the difference. It would be great if there was.

Again for I think it depends on the group leader/group on how the experience is.

You can go to LLLI.org site and look for your area. It lists the accredited leaders. If you are questioning someone's credentials, ask them what area they are in and look them up. The site is usually fairly up to date.

[jesrox]

In my experience, LLL is far less extreme than many internet message boards I frequent. While they are very encouraging of CLW and exclusive BF- they are accepting of women with different challenges and will not write someone off for supplementing w/ formula. They also seem to stay away from politics(nurse-ins etc).

I look forward to the LLL meetings every month- it is a great group of women!!

[she]

My opinion of LLL has actually become more negative over the 4 years that I've attended meetings in my area.: I started out thinking it was the bee's knees, - a group of women that share the same priorities! now... not so much, when those women belittle others for anything deemed too mainstream. Still it is a fabulous cause and a great resource.

I'll be the first to admit that the individual leaders in question are the cause of the negative environment. Women attending meetings (whether members or not) were badgered for their choices to: nightwean toddlers, not co-sleep, spoon feed babies (>6 months), TTC after a baby amongst many many other things. I know full well that leaders should not be so forceful in their convictions on these topics, but that doesn't change anything for those mothers leaving the meeting feeling like a sack of poo.

When I move, I plan on attending a meeting or two in my new town, and I really hope the change of scenery is the key.

[turtlewomyn]

I am a member of LLL and I recently moved, so I have been exposed to two different groups. I really think there is a big difference between leaders and groups. My last group had new women and pregnant women rotating in all the time. We even had one woman who came who didn't really feel that she wanted to breastfeed, but her husbands family did and so she was going to a meeting to check it out. We commended her for taking that step, gave her information, and encouraged her not to write it off without at least giving it a try to see what it was like.
My current group feels a bit cliquish, there are pregnant women coming in, but there are a lot of women who are good friends, obviously known each other for a while, and get off topic to birth story chit chat and what not. I have gone a few times, and still feel like an outsider. I have not seen any other "new" people show up there more than once. I had a leader tell me I should bring my toddler back into my bed after I told her that we stopped cosleeping at seven months because it wasn't working for us.

I had a coworker where I used to live that was really negative about LLL and I am not quite sure what it was that set her off. I think her comments were usually regarding toddler nursing. However, she never said anything negative to me about nursing my daughter, even when we passed the year mark (I think she thought it was cute when DD would sign milk and tug at my shirt). So I don't know what it is that makes mainstream people think that LLL is so extremist.

[amandaleigh37]

I experienced this firsthand when I became pregnant. I planned to breastfeed, but I wasn't especially passionate about it. (During my pregnancy and immediately after is when I really changed my views on many issues.) But anyway, I remember my in-laws talking about the "la leche league wackos" who "breastfeed their kids for 10 years" as they laughed about it. I didn't know any better. My MIL went to "a few" meetings when she had my husband (who she nursed for 4 mos.) I wish I would have started going to meetings when I was pregnant. I finally went when my son was 4 mos. old, as I was eagar to meet other "wackos" like me =) They don't make those comments any more since they know I go to the meetings and will likely nurse my son well past his first birthday.

[the_lissa]

Originally Posted by annettemarie

LLL can't win. Many Lactivists get upset with the group because they fell it doesn't go far enough in promoting breastfeeding. They don't get too involved in politics, and they don't allow leaders to mix causes. But to anti-breastfeeding people, the very existance of a group dedicated to supporting breastfeeding mothers is offensive.

Personally, I think people who claim LLL is somesort of exreme group of zealots either are using LLL as a blanket term for any lactivist, or are running into people who are claiming to be LLL when, in fact, they don't actually represent the group at all.

nak, sorry

ITA. I can't imagine that people find LLL extreme.

[phreedom]

Originally Posted by redhotmama

My $.02
Sometimes moms who aren't really committed to breastfeeding ask for breastfeeding help when they really just want to quit. If they can blame LLL for failing them, they don't have to examine their own failure.
"Those LLL people are zealots, they wanted me to tape a tube to my nipple!" "LLL says I shouldn't use a pacifier, can you imagine?" etc.

I think this is a big part of it...at least in my experience.

[mirlee]

I recommend LLL to people, but for me, I never had a response to any of my questions when I was first breastfeeding. No one ever called me back and I must have called five people. That really soured me on them.

[snowbunny]

Originally Posted by redhotmama

My $.02
Sometimes moms who aren't really committed to breastfeeding ask for breastfeeding help when they really just want to quit. If they can blame LLL for failing them, they don't have to examine their own failure.
"Those LLL people are zealots, they wanted me to tape a tube to my nipple!" "LLL says I shouldn't use a pacifier, can you imagine?" etc.

Yes.

I also think that LLL gets targeted because it is an organized group that supports breastfeeding whereas there is no central organization for lactivists and, to many people who don't know much about breastfeeding, there's no division between supporting breastfeeding mothers with information and lactivism.