Pelvic Organ Prolapse, Support Thread - Page 24

[tayndrewsmama]

Oh geeze, my bad. I didn't even take notice of what forum this was in. My youngest will be five in August. My time is way up for getting better I guess.

[IrishMa]

Thanks for the link, CKM! I did look at it, I had also previously read the post you put up regarding your question. Did he ever get back to you? It makes me feel slightly better to think that perhaps this is just 'saggy' vaginal walls and it might get better in a year or so. At least, I am permitting myself to hope that!

At this point, I'm just weaning myself off the obsessive checking, trying to remember to do regular Kegels and just not thinking about it. I'm still absolutely shocked to learn about this whole possibility and equally shocked to find all these other women out there who are experiencing the same thing. Maybe because I am *slightly* younger, I was lucky enough to grow up where lots of issues were already out in the open (if you will) unlike what my mother had to deal with. I think I just took for granted that all that 'female myth' was over and done with. That the women of the 21st century were armed and informed with open info about their bodies, nobody was sent away anymore for a 9 month *holiday* to their distant aunt's. So I guess to find something that is still truly surrounded by silence really floored me! You can bet I'm going to be much more vocal about it in the future in order to dispel any potential stigma. Every time someone gave me a compliment pp, I thought to myself yes but you don't know the dirty little secret I have...and that was in my own brain! So shame on me...I'm trying not to think that way.

I know others have commented on it as well, which made me laugh because I thought the same thing, but I'm also flabbergasted at how many women I know who never look down there and couldn't tell you if something was amiss. In my line of work, I run into women all day long who come in really terrified that something is wrong and they can't tell you because they never looked, you check for them and it turns out to be an ingrown hair!

So is it just me or do a lot of women feel nervous jitters when starting exercising/sex/work again? I've read how yoga, pilates, etc has been fine for some and made others worse..I'm feeling quite apprehensive. I saw a post about how recumbent cycling is out...naturally, that was something I had been doing. Doh! :

I also received that advice from my doc that as soon as I d/c BF, then things might tighten up a bit. I felt that was an unfair sort of carrot to dangle in front of my nose, at least I thought she should have followed it up with some reassurance that if I follow such and such parameters while BF, it won't get worse. I'm committed to BF my little fella and thus I will do that no matter what gets lower or squishier but still...

I know my experience thus far is small compared to some and for those others, you have my most profound respect and support.

[CKM5513]

Originally Posted by IrishMa

Thanks for the link, CKM! I did look at it, I had also previously read the post you put up regarding your question. Did he ever get back to you? It makes me feel slightly better to think that perhaps this is just 'saggy' vaginal walls and it might get better in a year or so. At least, I am permitting myself to hope that!

At this point, I'm just weaning myself off the obsessive checking, trying to remember to do regular Kegels and just not thinking about it. I'm still absolutely shocked to learn about this whole possibility and equally shocked to find all these other women out there who are experiencing the same thing. Maybe because I am *slightly* younger, I was lucky enough to grow up where lots of issues were already out in the open (if you will) unlike what my mother had to deal with.

Hi there!

Yes, the doctor did answer me, his response is below my questions. Just keep scrolling down to see his answer. I totally understand about the obessive checking...sometimes I want to smuggle my hand mirror into my purse so I can check while out to eat and using the restroom! HA! I use to check all the time, I mean everytime I went to the bathroom! And then at other times, like getting in the shower and etc. I was a total freak about it. Now I am much better. After I went to my urogynecolgist I swore off checking for a month, it felt good, and I was surprised at the results when I did look again. I'm thinking of doing that again...it eases the mind. And for me mine always, feels better touching and otherwise, then it looks!

Far as being "slightly" younger - I am 29 and had my son at 28 - so right there with you. My parents where and are very open also. Problem is no one not even my mother knew this could happen. When I told my mom I had a cystocele, she was like what??? Your bladder is where??? She was shocked, she delivered my brother breach and had (as you can imagine) a horrible labor with him, and was just amazed things could do that down there. Far as me not kegeling, mother never told me to do so, I guess she just assumed the doctor would...he didn't! Yes, I read the books about pregnancy and etc. but dismissed how silly it was to exercise your vagina! Not so silly to me anymore! As for my story, there are a lot of people to "blame". For one me, for not kegeling and taking care of myself down there. The next my OB (who now I think is a complete idiot, who really has no idea what he is doing, or is just to old to care anymore). He should of known my son was going to be large (my kids head are massive! Daughters was 14 1/2 and son's was 15 inches on top of being 10 plus lbs. I am not a large woman...pretty average with a bit of a smaller pelvis), that is his job, and I should of been given option and etc. At least having all choices in front of me would of been nice. And then for the man too take a matter of maybe and I say maybe 3 seconds to reach in and say "yup that is your bladder"...is just insane. Has he heard of a complete exam? But I could go on and on about my OB...I'll save you the pain of that!

My OB also went on and on about the return of estrogen after weaning. I almost stopped, came as close as you can to stopping. Then I thought hey, if I have this and there is a big chance it will never go away then what the heck...might as well keep nursing. And yes, I felt the same way with a carrot dangling in front of me...like they were saying if you stop now there might be a chance! My OB actually said to me when I told him I normally nurse for about a year - that he hoped "I can get use to it!" Refering to the bulge in my crotch!!! Can you even imagine saying that to someone! Keep nursing, if you have some sort of prolapse, stopping nursing isn't going to make it all go away. If you have some trauma from having your son, then stopping nursing is not going to make it all go away either! Either way it takes time estrogen or no estrogen! Keep having those special times with that little guy...and keep kegeling on!

Anyways, like I said before go to a urogynecologist to get a accurate account of what is going on down there. I highly recommend you do that so you know for sure! According to my urogynecologist I don't have anything near a prolapse, in fact my bladder is well inside my vaginal walls. Read my post again on MedHelp...it was interesting to see what the doctor said. This same doctor is actually the one who told me to go to the U of M hospital in Michigan and see a urogynecologist. My next OB is getting a down-right interview before I just let anyone take care of my body again. I am smarter now, and no longer this trusting little girl...I have learned my lesson!

[CKM5513]

Originally Posted by tayndrewsmama

Oh geeze, my bad. I didn't even take notice of what forum this was in. My youngest will be five in August. My time is way up for getting better I guess.

All are welcome here...not matter the PP time! We are all here to support eachother! Please stay and chat with us!

[That Is Nice]

Pain

I apologize in advance for not reading the entire thread (it's a long one!). Can any of you who've had prolapse describe the pain you have, or other symptoms? I am pretty sure I have this.

Thank you.

[wombatclay]

Pain of prolapse...hmmmm. I don't know that I have active "pain". But it's un comfortable and annoying.

For me (mild to moderate bladder and uterine prolapse) the sensation all the time is of having a tampon not "all the way in". Uncomfortable and annoying but not exactly "painful". When voiding my bladder there is an ache along the top of my pelvic area that feels better if I apply pressure against the bone while voiding. When sitting or walking quickly the sensation is closer to wearing bunched up underwear... sort of like something is bunched up/rubbing/scraping only it's my own body and not the clothing I'm wearing.

[tayndrewsmama]

The pain I have is actually mostly during sex. The doc explained that with my uterus coming down, so have my ovaries and they don't like to be bumped.

I just found out that acupuncture can be quite effective in treating this. My sister is writing up a treatment plan for me to take to my acupuncturist here. I also found out that the PT office that I am already going to does vaginal therapy as well. On top of that, I ordered a kegelmaster. I WILL not let this get worse or get me down.

[CKM5513]

Originally Posted by Spring Flower

I apologize in advance for not reading the entire thread (it's a long one!). Can any of you who've had prolapse describe the pain you have, or other symptoms? I am pretty sure I have this.

Thank you.

Normally you don't have "much" pain with prolapse...more like annoying as posted above. Great way to put it wombatclay!!! It imagine it can be like scrunched up undies. HA! I have a lot of pressure and some pain. I have some muscle trigger points that I am having some trouble with, 4 months PP now. I'm going to give it some time until perhaps my son is a year then if things are still bothersome go for physical therapy. I would have to say a true prolapsed organ, doesn't cause much pain, but can be a pain in the you know what...far as being bothersome! I have some rubbing of my vaginal walls, that can be annoying, I use personal lube to help with that. And I do have some pain once in awhile, and the doc says that it is my muscles and their trigger points. I guess therapy can help break those trigger points up. I don't have any prolapse...just a very saggy/droopy vagina...that needs some major TLC!!! HA! Do you think they have spa days for vagina's...wouldn't that be nice!!!

Wombatclay, seems to know a lot about prolapse and is very positive about her situation. She is the one I would talk with about this!

Take care, and we are all hear to listen!

[CKM5513]

Originally Posted by tayndrewsmama

The pain I have is actually mostly during sex. The doc explained that with my uterus coming down, so have my ovaries and they don't like to be bumped.

I just found out that acupuncture can be quite effective in treating this. My sister is writing up a treatment plan for me to take to my acupuncturist here. I also found out that the PT office that I am already going to does vaginal therapy as well. On top of that, I ordered a kegelmaster. I WILL not let this get worse or get me down.

Kegel on sister! I love my kegelmaster...love it! I was so weak after the birth of my son, that I couldn't hardly move the thing on the first spring. Now at 4 months PP I am up to the highest level with 3 springs...next onto 4 springs! YEAH! And as a added bonus it has made sex better!

I'm sure you'll love yours too! Keep up with the good attitude - the mind is a very powerful thing!

[threadbey]

i haven't checked in here in a while, so i'll try to be brief even while responding to the many interesting posts i've missed!

Originally Posted by DoulaMary

Didn't even think of urine with the term "discharge". I am experiencing no incontinence but tons of other vaginal discharge, similar to cervical secretions during ovulation, only this happens every day. Any idea why this would increase with prolapse?

this happened to me, too. no idea. possibly my body's reaction to bf hormones, i guess. also possibly result of more internal friction due to things not quite in the right place? or just more of the mucus comes out because the vaginal canal is shorter than usual? i'm totally brainstorming with no knowledge to back it up.

Originally Posted by CKM5513

I just wanted everyone to know that it is possible to have vaginal wall showing and NOT have it be your bladder.

yes, i think this was the case for me, but i was too focused on my visible out-of-body cervix to worry needlessly about my bladder, thank heavens!

Originally Posted by wombatclay

If you have gotten pregnant with a uterine prolapse, how exactly did that happen? (other than the obvious)

I mean, my cervix isn't going to be anywhere near where DH's swimmers are going to be arriving and short of a small detour sign saying "dudes... turn around and head back to the beginning, you missed the turn!" I'm not exactly certain how the necessary bits will be meeting up.

haven't gotten into ttc #2, but i don't believe actual "meeting up" has to happen. the swimmers are strong (hopefully!) and some of them get where they're supposed to somehow! i mean, even if they squirt right onto the cervix, they still have to swim *through* the cervix, through the uterus, and up into one of the fallopian tubes. it takes a while, but they get there! i know they told us in sex ed in high school that penetration isn't even necessary - semen in the general area can get inside on their own in some cases. (maybe more likely with highschoolers, but still.) and i would bet anything that with penetration some semen ends up on the cervix somehow, anyway (splashing, sloshing, what have you).

Originally Posted by IrishMa

When I finally saw my doc (had to bully my way in to be seen earlier rather than later) she laughed it off and said it was normal, that lots of women have it. I asked her why didn't anyone tell me or at least warn me pp that it might be a possibility? Her lovely answer was 'well you wouldn't have gotten pregnant now would you??". I wanted to slap her face but instead, I started researching. She never even gave me a name, told me if there was anything I could or shouldn't do, nothing at all. just like, oops now you have to live with it. She laughed at me when I asked about sex, UTIs, etc.

ooooooh, if i were you i would be and get a new doctor immediately!

Originally Posted by IrishMa

I think I just took for granted that all that 'female myth' was over and done with. That the women of the 21st century were armed and informed with open info about their bodies, nobody was sent away anymore for a 9 month *holiday* to their distant aunt's. So I guess to find something that is still truly surrounded by silence really floored me! You can bet I'm going to be much more vocal about it in the future in order to dispel any potential stigma. Every time someone gave me a compliment pp, I thought to myself yes but you don't know the dirty little secret I have...and that was in my own brain! So shame on me...I'm trying not to think that way.

: i now have a little more understanding of what that awakening generation went through - it really is hard to make yourself speak up about a problem "down there" even if i know it's a public service to do so!

Originally Posted by tayndrewsmama

Oh geeze, my bad. I didn't even take notice of what forum this was in. My youngest will be five in August. My time is way up for getting better I guess.

check out the whole woman site if you haven't already - she is much more focused on the woman who is past the postpartum year(s).

Originally Posted by CKM5513

Do you think they have spa days for vagina's...wouldn't that be nice!!!

it's the wave of the future! i look forward to that section of the spa menu!

[IrishMa]

I love that there are so many positive women in here but the best part seems to be their sense of humour! The Monty Python quotes get high marks from me as well..any Shirley Valentine fans as well?

Again, I come back to my ongoing (but slowly waning) disbelief about how pervasive this situation seems to be. I don't think I've felt quite so naive in such a long time. It's one thing to chat around the dinner table about how modern medicine fails to consider each person as an individual but entirely another when it happens to you! The d/c thing is a perfect example..so now I've met two other women here who also experienced this mucous like d/c that was not urine or infection, a friend of mine and me as well and you have all the 'literature' stating how it really ought to be the opposite experience. I give up!! Or rather, I think I'll start swimming in another direction. I have to remind myself just because it's printed in a medical text, doesn't make it true. But boy, "they" can really make a girl feel condemned...I've felt like I'm in a stone prison with only a spork to dig myself out! This site has made me feel much better.

The vaginal spa is a great idea...take it and turn a profit, my dear! After all, if a vaginal 'face lift' is gaining in popularity as a cosmetic procedure....
I look forward to receiving my WW book so I can hand my boy over to my husband with the directions that I not be disturbed because I'm off to exercise my vagina! O, the words/phrases I never thought would pass my lips!

I'm going to have to see if there is a UG in my area who takes my insurance. After all, at this point, it can't hurt to have someone else look under the hood as well, eh?

I'm curious to anyone's experience with POP/saggy walls and the baby that came after? I would like to have another child but I'm fearful of really landing myself up a creek and making it worse. I saw that the general advice is to wait 2-3 years before being pregnant again to give the dust a chance to clear and see what you are truly working with. However, being 30 (which isn't old but for me, an age that requires some cognizance), I would rather do it closer to two years than three.

My little fella was born in a hospital au naturale (where I learned that giving birth on your back is NOT a natural position, at least for me and certainly without an epidural!) so I was thinking about a birthing center next time around. However, because I did tear, bleed and required stitches, I'm not sure I would be a candidate for that, especially given my hx of a precipitous labour. Has anyone any experience with this?

I've also been cleared to have sex again but I admit, I'm a little scared! Mentally as well as well as physically..plus I don't feel like my nerve endings are even there yet. Lovely.

[IrishMa]

Threadbey, you're right about the public service part..although I'm trying to figure out a way to be vocal without being obnoxious to more men. I would like to have my son have this sort of awareness just seamlessly integrated into his general knowledge (in a totally non-painful, unembarrassing way) because I think more women could do with supportive partners and if guys already knew it was a possibility then they might be more comfy and 'normal' about it. Thank goodness my husband is one!

[threadbey]

Originally Posted by IrishMa

My little fella was born in a hospital au naturale (where I learned that giving birth on your back is NOT a natural position, at least for me and certainly without an epidural!) so I was thinking about a birthing center next time around. However, because I did tear, bleed and required stitches, I'm not sure I would be a candidate for that, especially given my hx of a precipitous labour. Has anyone any experience with this?

i don't have experience with #2 yet, but i don't think the tear, bleeding or stitches would in any way prevent you from a birth center or home birth, from what i know. some midwives will even handle vbacs!

Originally Posted by IrishMa

Threadbey, you're right about the public service part..although I'm trying to figure out a way to be vocal without being obnoxious to more men. I would like to have my son have this sort of awareness just seamlessly integrated into his general knowledge (in a totally non-painful, unembarrassing way) because I think more women could do with supportive partners and if guys already knew it was a possibility then they might be more comfy and 'normal' about it. Thank goodness my husband is one!

that's an interesting idea. my husband has been really great about it. i know his mom wasn't that open with him about things. i think it probably has more to do with the general level of kindness and empathy he was raised to have and i think that's probably the tack i will take with ds rather than being too concerned about making sure to discuss prolapse specifically. i will definitely make sure to talk about how new mommies need lots of rest and need to be taken care of, though!

[IrishMa]

I wanted to know if anyone has any experience with a dull ache in the lower tummy region after exercising or standing for too long? I'm a little worried because I have to return to work next week and that requires standing and running around for 12 hour shifts. I don't know how I am going to make it because I go for a walk on the treadmill or ride the bike for 30 minutes and I get very achy. I have to sit or lie down for a few hours before it starts to subside. Does it get better with time or what? I'm currently 11 weeks pp now...I'm not quite sure how to work back up to the fitness level I once was. Or at least, enough for work!

[threadbey]

Originally Posted by IrishMa

I wanted to know if anyone has any experience with a dull ache in the lower tummy region after exercising or standing for too long? I'm a little worried because I have to return to work next week and that requires standing and running around for 12 hour shifts. I don't know how I am going to make it because I go for a walk on the treadmill or ride the bike for 30 minutes and I get very achy. I have to sit or lie down for a few hours before it starts to subside. Does it get better with time or what? I'm currently 11 weeks pp now...I'm not quite sure how to work back up to the fitness level I once was. Or at least, enough for work!

i experienced this while i was pregnant (maybe the first sign of problem? or is it normal??) but not that i remember after. i would take it as easy as you can for the next week and see how it goes. is there any way you can extend your maternity leave or get some sort of short term disability coverage while you recuperate? i know it feels like there must be some way to speed up the recovery by *doing* something like exercising, but i personally feel that prolapse immediately postpartum is something to just let be and coddle. i'm not a doctor, midwife, pt, or anything, though, so that's just my gut feeling. anyway, maybe try just resting as much as possible this next week.

good luck to you.

[CKM5513]

Originally Posted by IrishMa

I wanted to know if anyone has any experience with a dull ache in the lower tummy region after exercising or standing for too long? I'm a little worried because I have to return to work next week and that requires standing and running around for 12 hour shifts. I don't know how I am going to make it because I go for a walk on the treadmill or ride the bike for 30 minutes and I get very achy. I have to sit or lie down for a few hours before it starts to subside. Does it get better with time or what? I'm currently 11 weeks pp now...I'm not quite sure how to work back up to the fitness level I once was. Or at least, enough for work!

I had this, but I wouldn't say it was in my tummy more like my pubic area. The whole area was sore, and would hurt/ache bad sometimes. I honestly think it was my body "healing" itself. Plus perhaps I was doing to many kegels at first. I think it is muscle aches for me. I still get it sometimes after using my kegelmaster.

See if you can take more time. If not like I said before go to a urogyn and perhaps get fit with a pessary, many woman have a lot of success with them. Maybe that will help with the feeling of pressure down there.

Good luck to you dear. Enjoy the last weeks with your little one!

[wombatclay]

Wombatclay, seems to know a lot about prolapse and is very positive about her situation. She is the one I would talk with about this!

Awwww... thanks! I was a reference librarian at a major research university for years before staying home after dd2 arrived so I have a lot of experience finding info/studies/resources. And when it's a topic that impacts me directly... well.

I may not be as "positive" as I sound, but I find that writing, speaking, thinking in a positive manner helps my general outlook. Sort of forcing the positivity but hey, fake it till ya make it works, right?

[Nicole R.]

Hello, everyone! I have a few responses to (fairly) recent posts.

As a refresher, I'm 38, my son is 2 1/2, and I have uterine, bladder, and rectal prolapse, each between the first and second degree to varying extents.

Originally Posted by wombatclay

So, if you did TTC and/or become pregnant with a prolapse, did you do anything different, or does nature just find a way?

I'm wrapping up the fourth cycle of TTC with no luck -- no period yet to officially end this cycle, but based on the large amount of prolapse ache I'm feeling right now, it should be starting tonight or tomorrow.

But I'm assuming nature will find a way, and that the sperm will all swim around willy-nilly until at least a few of them find my poor misplaced cervix. It's not like they can see where they're going, so they shouldn't find it too confusing. I do still put my hips up after having sex, but only for five minutes or so, and then I stay lying down flat for at least another ten minutes.

My grandmother had a uterine prolapse diagnosed after the birth of her third child, and the doctor told her she'd probably never get pregnant again. She went on to deliver eight more children!

Originally Posted by IrishMa

And Doula Mary, I also have this crazy mucous like d/c that is constantly there. My doc (although now I take her with a big grain of salt) said that will be there as long as I am BF..but again, the literature will tell you that BF keeps estrogen low so in fact, I ought to be experiencing dryness, which I can tell you, is NOT what's happening here!

For a variety of reasons, I think you need a new doctor!

My experience has been that breast-feeding has caused vaginal dryness. I don't really have any discharge with my prolapses.

Originally Posted by tayndrewsmama

My youngest will be five in August. My time is way up for getting better I guess.

My time is up, too, and I keep getting worse. Part of the problem is that I'm finding it hard to stay motivated with the Kegels, and I can't keep myself from over-exerting. I keep lifting heavy stuff, and at a wedding last weekend I danced vigorously holding my son on my hip.

Originally Posted by Spring Flower

Can any of you who've had prolapse describe the pain you have, or other symptoms?

Some days I don't feel any pain, and others (like right before my period, or after I've hauled a bunch of bricks around my garden) the pain is like a dull throbbing ache low inside my vagina. It does feel a bit like a poorly-inserted tampon. I didn't feel much pain for nearly two years post-partum, but it's getting worse now.

My other symptoms are seeing (and feeling with my fingers) the walls of the vagina bulging inward and drooping downward, so they can be seen at both ends of the vaginal opening, pressed by the bladder at one side and the rectum at the other. Also with my fingers I can feel my cervix hanging within half an inch of the vaginal opening (although during ovulation it does move back up to be three inches within the opening).

Originally Posted by IrishMa

I would like to have another child but I'm fearful of really landing myself up a creek and making it worse. I saw that the general advice is to wait 2-3 years before being pregnant again to give the dust a chance to clear and see what you are truly working with. However, being 30 (which isn't old but for me, an age that requires some cognizance), I would rather do it closer to two years than three.

I say you should have your next baby whenever you want. Yeah, waiting longer will give your body a chance to recover, but I think that there will be diminishing returns -- probably not much value in waiting three years instead of two. (Two years would be better than one year, though, I'm guessing.) Plus the longer you wait, the older you'll be, and your prolapses may worsen with age, as will your ability to bounce back from childbirth.

[IrishMa]

I'm not good with the multiple quote thing so I just have to type it myself..

Anyway, CKM, perhaps that is what is going on..just still healing. The ache does seem to be getting better in miniscule amounts as the weeks pass but for a while there, it was like I had had a c/s, this band of pain went straight across my lower tummy. I know we can all agree my doc got her degree on sale from Sears but can you believe she tried to tell me it was just gas??? To add insult to injury on top of it all, eh? :

And I will probably take Nicole R.'s advice into account. Two years will be better than three. I have to say as I went through my pregnancy, I saw all these couples who were having trouble TTC and it really made me appreciate how lucky we were. This whole cystocele thing just adds fuel to the fire to be lucky again.

I finally got the book and tried out the fire breathing but maybe I wasn't doing it right because it looked lower after a minute or two?! I don't know. I tried a 12 minute segment of yoga and that didn't seem to affect it but I'm trying to figure out a way to resign myself to a less intense workout than I used to do. That means I have to start watching what I eat instead..which sucks!

[veryerin]

You know I totally have the aching thing going on. I also get pretty sharp pains in my pelvic region. I can't stand on one foot after working out (like to tie my shoe or take off clothes) without having serious pain around my hips and pubic bone. I had spd while pregnant and I feel like my pain might be more related to that, but who knows. I just returned home after almost 4 months of travelling around New Zealand (with a babe no less!) and am soooo ready to figure out some sort of exercise routine that works with this.