No Cry Sleep Solution Support Thread.... - Page 2

[rzberrymom]

Originally Posted by bellymama

i read it when ds was a tiny newborn. i like the fact that its a book that doesn't advocate cio and that it somewhat encourages co-sleeping (although the ridiculous chapter on making your bed safe seemed like overkill...duuuuuh...) but i'll be honest, i just think any book that tells you how to raise your kid is faulty, because your kid just isn't going to fit the description...yk? and then i think mama's go crazy because they are like, i followed all the directions and my dc is still not doing it...and then you get even more obsessed with whatever aspect of childrearing that particular book focused on, in this case, sleep training...yes, i said it. i think the pantley theory is gentle sleep training, but sleep training nonetheless....
imho...you might do better just taking it day by day, because your baby is going to change every day...and i don't think babies have sleep issues...they are doing what they are hardwired to do...which, unfortunatly for us very very tired mamas (i woke up at 5 am today: after a wiggly night!)isn't always sleeping at the same time we do...
anyway, if the book is working for you, then go for it! but if its not, don't think its because you aren't doing it right, yk? i think that just makes whatever problems you are having worse...
plus i just found that book to be to much about log keeping...you are already sleep deprived,right?why waste more time you could be sleeping on writing down stuff about your babies sleep pattern.
from my limited experience with my little sister, my baby and what my girlfriends babies have done, this is the rule: as soon as you got baby figured out...they change on ya again...sneaky little buggers .
anyway...i really hope you all are getting rest...nothing is worse then mamahood on an empty tank!

bellymama, I had the EXACT same experience as you did with the book.

[earthgirl]

Oh, my! Let me tell you about our night!

It's probably best to just do a time line of sorts.

5:30 Start bedtime routine, which goes quite well
6:15 In rocking chair nursing, which is our last "step"
6:35 DD is OUT!
7:20 DD is awake. (This is typical and up until recently has been our biggest sleep issue. She has to be put back to sleep 2-3 times before she settles well for the night.) I go in and get her back to sleep pretty quickly.
7:35 DD is awake. I go in and get her back to sleep again.
8:15 DD is awake. DH goes in and gets her back to sleep pretty quickly.
8:30 DD is awake. DH goes in, this time for 30 minutes.
9:00 DD is sleeping.
9:10 Our neighbor starts yelling for their dog, DD is awake. I get frustrated and decide I'll just go to bed b/c I'm tired of messing w/ it. I go in and nurse, rock, etc.
9:55 DD is FINALLY asleep.
10:15 I think "Wow. She really is so sweet", and gently stroke her little forehead. BAD IDEA! DD is awake. We nurse, cuddle, etc.
10:30 DD decides to do a little Jr. Rockettes performance. She's in love w/ herself and applauds wildly. It was so good, she decides we need to see a few encore performances.
10:55 DD is STILL awake. I move myself at an angle so she can't roll off the bed and decide I'm going to sleep. DH is already in Z town. :
11:50 I wake up and realize DD has somehow managed to fall asleep.
2:25 I hear a noise outside and wake up DH to see what it is. There is a guy next door on top of a trash can peeking in our neighbors' window. He calls 911. DD wakes up. We cuddle and nurse while I'm a teeny bit terrified.
3:30 DD is asleep.
5:30 DD is up for the day as if she's had the best nights sleep of her life!

Please tell me it's going to get better.

Oh and the house next door was not being robbed.

[timneh_mom]

Reluctantly, I pulled out my copy of this book again and took a look at it last night. This was after DD woke up a 100,000 times before she actually went "down" for the night at around 11:45! :

Anyway I think she is chronically sleep deprived. I did find today that around 45 min into her nap she wants to wake up (coming up into lighter sleep = vulnerable to waking). I made sure I was in bed with her at that point and got her back to sleep, now we are at about 1 1/2 hours of napping. Supposedly she will learn to not wake by herself after about a week of me helping (yeah, we'll see). I am going to put her to bed WAY early tonight and see what happens. Both our kids need to be in bed LONG before they are (*I* need to be in bed *LONG* before they are!!!) so maybe we can get to an earlier bedtime soon. I would happily get up early but NOT if they are not sleeping until 11 pm!!!

She also thinks she is up for the day around 5:30 or 6 am, even though she JUST went to sleep around 12 am... :

Earthgirl, I sure hope, for both our sakes, that it gets better. She is, seriously, making me NOT want more kids. I can't handle this a third time!!!

Oh, and I'm thinking she might have a bit of reflux, along with the teething. I'm going to try a few things that I haven't tried before and see what happens.

[nylecoj]

It might be sleep training, bellymama, but after having dd, I do believe that some kids need to be trained on how to sleep. She's wired in all the time and is chronically overtired. She needs to be trained on how to relax and unwind so that she can fall asleep comfortably, and while I don't think any book has all the answers I do think some guidelines really help. Having a sleep journal was a way for dh and I to see that dd was really sleep deprived.

Question for the rest of you. If your child is mobile and nap in their crib, what do you do to anticipate their needs and help them go right back to sleep during naptime.

We're still doing what we can while out of town and I've noticed that her body is more attuned to napping at specific times instead of 20-30 min cat naps all day. (Or, a chronically cranky baby - that's what really started this whole thing)

[prettypixels]

Originally Posted by earthgirl

It's probably best to just do a time line of sorts.

5:30 Start bedtime routine, which goes quite well
6:15 In rocking chair nursing, which is our last "step"
6:35 DD is OUT!
7:20 DD is awake. (This is typical and up until recently has been our biggest sleep issue. She has to be put back to sleep 2-3 times before she settles well for the night.) I go in and get her back to sleep pretty quickly.
7:35 DD is awake. I go in and get her back to sleep again.
8:15 DD is awake. DH goes in and gets her back to sleep pretty quickly.
8:30 DD is awake. DH goes in, this time for 30 minutes.
9:00 DD is sleeping.
9:10 Our neighbor starts yelling for their dog, DD is awake. I get frustrated and decide I'll just go to bed b/c I'm tired of messing w/ it. I go in and nurse, rock, etc.
9:55 DD is FINALLY asleep.
10:15 I think "Wow. She really is so sweet", and gently stroke her little forehead. BAD IDEA! DD is awake. We nurse, cuddle, etc.
10:30 DD decides to do a little Jr. Rockettes performance. She's in love w/ herself and applauds wildly. It was so good, she decides we need to see a few encore performances.
10:55 DD is STILL awake. I move myself at an angle so she can't roll off the bed and decide I'm going to sleep. DH is already in Z town. :
11:50 I wake up and realize DD has somehow managed to fall asleep.
2:25 I hear a noise outside and wake up DH to see what it is. There is a guy next door on top of a trash can peeking in our neighbors' window. He calls 911. DD wakes up. We cuddle and nurse while I'm a teeny bit terrified.
3:30 DD is asleep.
5:30 DD is up for the day as if she's had the best nights sleep of her life!

Please tell me it's going to get better.

Oh and the house next door was not being robbed.

: that's a rough night!

Last night was the first in three that I didn't have a wide awake baby in the middle of the night for a solid hour... so I guess that's good... but she was up just about every hour again. I feel like I take one step forward and ten back. Which is why I started this thread, because I surely do need some support and hope that it is going to get better!

[rachellanigh]

Originally Posted by nylecoj

SUMMARY:
Wake up 6:30-ish
1st nap: 8:30-9:15
Rock/hold: 9:15-9:45
Sleep: 9:45-10:20

Repeat those steps between 1:00 and 3:00 pm.

Bedtime routine starts around 6:30 generally.
Read, rock, nurse, rock until 7 or 8 depending on the night.

You were saying that she's not staying down for her first nap...could you try to postpone the first nap by 15 mins and see what happens? I think I remember Pantley talking about that. Good luck! I hope my baby is a good sleeper. (As good as my first!)

[nylecoj]

Originally Posted by rachellanigh

You were saying that she's not staying down for her first nap...could you try to postpone the first nap by 15 mins and see what happens? I think I remember Pantley talking about that. Good luck! I hope my baby is a good sleeper. (As good as my first!)

Hmm. I have tried that, but never consistently because usually it just devolves into her becoming more tired and more cranky.

Trip to San Diego was HARD, but somehow manageable.

[spedel]

:

Subbing. Might be needing this soon...

[timneh_mom]

CRAP!! Had a whole thing typed out and Firefox crashed! BAD!!!

Anyway I think getting her to bed EARLY and making sure each nap is at LEAST an hour long is helping... she was up for a while at 10:30 last night thinking it was time to get up but after some dancing and rocking and nursing, we got her back down again. If she wakes up from a nap and it hasn't been an hour, I get her back down and she usually sleeps another good chunk of time. Last night she went to bed at 7:30!! (Usually it's been 11:30!!) But, don't start celebrating yet... I still didn't get to bed til midnight because she woke up right before I started getting ready for bed and it took a long time to get her back down. She woke to nurse every 2-3 hours all night but at least went back to sleep afterwards. She was up for the day around 7-8 am.

I've been trying really hard to get DS to bed earlier too.

I love DH but he gets home from work late (sometimes not til almost 7 pm!) but the kids NEED earlier bedtimes... so, I'm sorry DH... if baby is in the tub when you get home, that's life... I just don't have the steam to plow through the days here alone (sometimes for 11 hours!) when they aren't sleeping til 11 or 11:30...

[earthgirl]

short naps

I find it interesting how many of us have LOs that take short naps. Anyone had any luck getting your babe to nap longer using any of Pantley's methods? The nursing them back to sleep thing hardly ever works for me. I'd say on average it might work about 2x a week and I've been trying it for a LONG time!

[nylecoj]

Originally Posted by earthgirl

I find it interesting how many of us have LOs that take short naps. Anyone had any luck getting your babe to nap longer using any of Pantley's methods? The nursing them back to sleep thing hardly ever works for me. I'd say on average it might work about 2x a week and I've been trying it for a LONG time!

Can someone post some of her ideas? I keep getting the book from the library but don't have it handy. (Yes, I know, I need to get out and buy it)

I have been trying to be very deliberate with noise and a schedule so that when she wakes up after 30-40 mins, I take her out into the rocker and sit and rock and stroke her hair. I do very little talking. Sometimes I nurse, depends on how upset she gets. That usually works but it takes about 30-45 mins.

I've also been making sure the house is quiet for about a half an hour before her nap. This means no dishwasher, laundry, tv or stereo.

[timneh_mom]

My DD seems to wake from naps about 45 minutes after she falls asleep. Pantley says that's when an infant normally comes up into lighter sleep and is vulnerable to waking. If I can catch her right before or right as she starts to stir, I can get her back to sleep just by laying a hand on her or patting. If I catch her right away, it takes a few minutes, if not, it can take 20 minutes. If she wakes up and is crabby, I will work with her til she's asleep again. Rested people don't wake up crabby. (Hmmm. That's probably why I wake up crabby!)

I thought I read in my fog that Pantley said after about a week of helping them through the light sleep part, they will learn to sleep through it. We'll see. (I'm doubtful of the "after a week of this" part but it seems harmless so I'll give it a try.) I really do think some of our babies need to be taught how to sleep, or at least require a great deal of help.

As you can see I'm pretty skeptical of this whole thing but I do agree with Pantley on one thing... both my kids are chronically overtired.

[nylecoj]

My kid is chronically overtired too. I did read that about being there for the light sleep part. I suppose I should try it again - can't hurt. She starts thrashing about immediately when she wakes up so I sort of have to restrain her (she can kick out of a ninja swaddle, I swear) so she won't completely wake herself.

[earthgirl]

Yeah, the nap help in that book is pretty lacking. That's why you don't remember it! Basically, the nursing or patting back before they come out of light sleep is it. Oh, and she says to have a nap routine that's completely different from the bedtime routine. My DD naps for only 30 minutes, precisely. I have tried multiple times to keep her from waking from light sleep and it DOES NOT WORK. I do keep trying, though. Still, it's pretty frustrating.

[prettypixels]

My baby *usually* takes a two hour nap in the morning and a 1 hr to 90 minute nap in the afternoon. Or, if her morning nap is messed up (I'm guilty! I sometimes go to mama events that almost always take place during her naptime...), she'll usually take a longer nap.

*usually*....

Today, her morning nap was messed up, then her afternoon nap, and now we're on her second afternoon nap. :

So far helping her back to sleep when she wakes (approx. every 45 minutes, coinciding with Pantley's description of the duration of a sleep cycle!) quickly does help her go back to sleep, but I'm not seeing TOO much luck with getting her to sleep LONGER. Then again we have had a few 3/4 hour stretches this week which is a first!

BUT... we've also had her waking up... one night at 2 am, one night at 3 am, last night at 11 am (which was better, as I was not yet asleep so I could incorporate this into my own going to bed), and she is WIDE AWAKE. I think we're seeing our first temper tantrums as she gets *mad* that we won't get up and play with her and she just screams! This is in arms, right next to us in bed. She stops immediately if I lift her up where she can see herself in the mirror and smiles, so I know she just wants to play. Crazy girl. After about an hour of rolling around, screaming, and smiling at herself in the mirror she is giving us 3/4 hours.

So now I just need to eliminate that crazy hour!!! LOL!

[timneh_mom]

We have the "midnight crazies" here too, although the time varies... and she does cry a lot when we are trying to help her to sleep... it must sound like we are a CIO house although we never do that! But I've already noticed that she is crying a whole lot less now that we making sure she gets more sleep... maybe she was crabby from not enough sleep.

[prettypixels]

Originally Posted by nylecoj

Can someone post some of her ideas? I keep getting the book from the library but don't have it handy. (Yes, I know, I need to get out and buy it)

I have been trying to be very deliberate with noise and a schedule so that when she wakes up after 30-40 mins, I take her out into the rocker and sit and rock and stroke her hair. I do very little talking. Sometimes I nurse, depends on how upset she gets. That usually works but it takes about 30-45 mins.

I've also been making sure the house is quiet for about a half an hour before her nap. This means no dishwasher, laundry, tv or stereo.

*stable routine
*quiet routine in the few hours before bedtime (I'm working on this one)
*Pantley Pull Off... allow baby to nurse until eyelids fluttering, then remove nipple... press chin to close mouth. If baby roots and fusses nurse, and repeat until baby falls asleep.

Those are a few of the main ideas I'm seeing tossed around here... there are lots more, especially some really cute ideas for older babies... like making a bedtime book with pictures of your babe showing them from birth to present and ending with something like "Baby is a big boy now, and sleeps all night long!" Really intended for I guess 2 year olds and older... but so cute. I wanna do it but I know my baby wouldn't *get* it...

[prettypixels]

Re: naps, she really says just do whatever you have to, to get the baby to nap... and focus on nighttime sleep first. Working on the idea that bad naps = bad night sleep, and parents need that night sleep most of all....

[nylecoj]

Originally Posted by prettypixels

Re: naps, she really says just do whatever you have to, to get the baby to nap... and focus on nighttime sleep first. Working on the idea that bad naps = bad night sleep, and parents need that night sleep most of all....

Hmmm. But don't bad naps also equal bad night sleep? I just figured it was easier to help in the nap department in the short term, while the night time stuff takes a bit longer?

[strawberryfields08]

I am just getting ready to buy this book. I am in desperate need of a change. DD is 17 mo and wakes every 1-2 hours at night, and it takes forever for her to fall asleep. It seems like everything we try makes her mad and I need more sleep as I am 5 mo pg. Anyway I am frustrated with her and with everything and I am looking for some help. Does anyone know if I should get the no cry sleep solution or the no cry sleep solution for toddlers. She is still nursing to sleep and pretty much all night so I am not sure which book would help me the most. or if I should just get both. Thanks