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Incident at the county fair - Page 5  

post #81 of 102
Personally, I think the 5 year old (what's that? Kindergarten? 1st grade maybe?) should have been publicly flogged in front of everyone there. By that ripe age, he should have known that "midget" is a slur and not insulted that employee.
:

As far as where he heard it-I hear it often, on the radios "Sad news, SoAndSo, a midget who starred in Wizard of Oz, died last night of xyz", Midget Wrestling gags, my instructor at college talking about the special health considerations of midgets, etc. Or possibly from a well meaning, but clueless adult in the child's life. (This is part of what makes such a large difference between "midget" and "n*gg*r")


An example-My son is biracial-half black, half white. The term "mulato" is a slur. A highly insulting slur. I try my best to remember that not everyone realizes that (as I'm sure many reading this right now didn't), and use the opportunity--as an adult and someone with class--to educate. My son's pediatrician, who I love, said something like "Well, it's hard to see if there's much discoloration because he's mulato" without a hint of maliciousness. I almost had to laugh at how clueless he was. So I explained "C, that's a slur. Big no no! The right word is biracial". He was so embarassed! He apologized, and thanked me for preventing him from making the same mistake with other families in the practice.

Now, which was better-that, or if I blew up and said "That's it! You're not treating my child. This visit is over-I'm getting a new doctor!" and stormed out, making a big scene in front of other patients? He'd have had NO idea what went wrong, and I would have come off as a bit reactionary, no?

That term bothers me, and I'd be pissed at anyone who told me to get over it or lighten up, etc. I am entitled to my feelings, as was this woman. But there's a way to go about things, a way to use sense to interpret situations, and she was way off base.

And no, it's not always our job to educate the public. It shouldn't be our burden. But if I'm going to take offense to a term, I make the choice to be proactive in irradicating the usage of said term. IMO, it's more beneficial than leaving in a huff.

Now, if someone is using a term to knowingly hurt someone, or just because they refuse to accept that the term hurts others, then that's a different story.

Kae


PS-I'm thinking the manager offered the tickets in part because this carnival worker way overstepped her job description as someone who gets paid to do something pretty simple--Collect a ticket, Assist the child on the Ride. There's no judgement involved, no deciding who goes on and who doesn't (unless the person were drunk, under or over the height limit, being abusive, etc). She was way out of bounds, threatening a child/mother with that, trying to pull rank and use her "power" to punish a child who didn't know any better. Because of that, the OP was right to accept the 20 tickets gratis.
post #82 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by oneotamama View Post
I think this whole thread got a little carried away. The op did talk to her ds. She did her best.
Yes, this thread did get carried away the moment the below post appeared.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Demeter9 View Post
I can't get over the fact that she works at a CARNIVAL. And she wants to challenge the assumptions of small children.

A CARNIVAL. Oy.
I am still shocked that this attitude is not called what it is - bigotry. And that other posters agreed with it just leaves me shaking my head.

She told the child what he said was insulting. And, I will agree that it was bad judgement on her part to say that she didn't have to let him on the ride. But, she did let him on the ride. And, I don't think her stating "that's very insulting" is any cause to state that she basically deserved what she got. What a sad world we live in if it is.

Nobody was saying the child didn't deserve compassion. But, those sticking up for the woman were simply saying that she deserves it as well.

The best way to teach empathy and compassion is to have it, folks.

But, I do agree that the op really handled it in the best way she could at the moment. I'm sure being shocked about what was unfolding before her gave her little time to think.

And, just because you live in a small town doesn't make phrases like "jew them down" acceptable. I grew up in upstate NY, too, in a much smaller town than Oneota, and I really don't think location makes it acceptable to continue to spout offensive statements. The 'just because everyone else here says it" excuse is pretty lame.
post #83 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by joensally View Post
North American Hockey League has a midget level (youth level). There's also midget baseball and basketball (and just to really rock this thread, there's a Swift Current Midget Indians baseball team http://www.swbooster.com/index.cfm?sid=44609&sc=32). There is also midget-car racing. "Midget" is not universally a slur, and a five year old boy who likes cars or sports may very well have come across it in an entirely positive context.

What was the boys intent - the innocence of a child whose mouth followed his mind. IMO, it's important to discuss with children, and model, that we don't make personal remarks ("personal remarks are always in bad taste" was the phrase I was raised with). Compliments, sure; but not idle remarks about appearance.

I would have been mortified if my child said it, but also recognize it as a learning moment. I would not have imposed a huge resolution process with a lot of discussion and explanation, that would be time consuming and potentially embarassing both to the offended/hurt person and my child. I would have simply said to the woman that I was very sorry and that I was sure my son did not understand the word and meant no ill intent. Then I would have privately spoken with my son. Finis.
Yes sports have midget teams, but it has nothing to do with little people. I don't see how he could make that connection.
post #84 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamazee View Post
If my 5-year-old says something, as kids that age do, and accidentally offends someone, I apologize for her, and explain to her why it hurt the person's feelings. I don't make her apologize herself because that is a shaming-style punishment, and it's punishing for something a child doesn't yet understand - kids that age just say what they've heard.

It's an opportunity for education. It is not intentional misbehavior.
Yes, this.
post #85 of 102
I'm reading words like "rage," "screaming," and "cruel" to describe the woman's behavior toward the boy. Am I missing something? As I understand it, the woman's exchange with the boy went like this:

Boy: You're a midget.
Woman: That's insulting.

I think I read all the responses -- did I miss a significant one?
post #86 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post
I'm reading words like "rage," "screaming," and "cruel" to describe the woman's behavior toward the boy. Am I missing something? As I understand it, the woman's exchange with the boy went like this:

Boy: You're a midget.
Woman: That's insulting.

I think I read all the responses -- did I miss a significant one?
Thank you, Limabean. I was thinking the same thing. I went back and reread the OP just to make sure I hadn't missed something. She was hardly "screaming", "raging" and "cruel".
post #87 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by Twocoolboys View Post
And, just because you live in a small town doesn't make phrases like "jew them down" acceptable. I grew up in upstate NY, too, in a much smaller town than Oneota, and I really don't think location makes it acceptable to continue to spout offensive statements. The 'just because everyone else here says it" excuse is pretty lame.
You are wrong to assume that I am from upstate NY. I am not from Oneota, NY. You are also wrong to assume that I'm saying it's acceptable to say "jew them down."
post #88 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by oneotamama View Post
Honestly, I still probably use that phrase b/c I don't associate it w/Jewish people.

Wow, doesn't this mean you think it's acceptable to use this phrase? Just because you don't associate it with Jewish people does not mean that is not what the phrase means. It's an offensive phrase no matter how you slice it.

My mistake on Oneota - I just assumed on that one. It's such a unique name, I thought there was only one.
post #89 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_lissa View Post
Yes sports have midget teams, but it has nothing to do with little people. I don't see how he could make that connection.
It refers to "small" - small players or small cars. He's five - he may have played with a friend's midget cars (small cars), and he's generalizing the term midget to simply mean small. In the dictionary, midget includes small as definitional. My point is that he could have heard this term in an entirely different, and innocent, context (unlike the compared term n*****, which arguably would never be innocent). I think we're getting sidetracked by the term used and assuming that it was a slur, rather than that he was simply making a five year old observation about something new to him.
post #90 of 102
Just a friendly mod reminder to keep the thread on topic and within the UA Please don't give me extra work to do tonight, I have tons of school work to do
post #91 of 102
At first I was miffed about the 'she works at a CARNIVAL' comment, thinking it was a slam on carnies (is that term offensive ??) Then I thought she was just expressing shock about someone working at a position which caters to children - a carnival - not knowing how to deal with kids.

Not sure what she really meant, though...
post #92 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by limabean View Post
I'm reading words like "rage," "screaming," and "cruel" to describe the woman's behavior toward the boy. Am I missing something? As I understand it, the woman's exchange with the boy went like this:

Boy: You're a midget.
Woman: That's insulting.

I think I read all the responses -- did I miss a significant one?
Yes, you did, where she threatened to not let a 5year old on the ride that his parents paid for, overstepping her boundaries (and just being plain nasty).

I'm not sure anyone here is against her telling him "That's insulting". I must have missed all those.

PS, for all of you chastizing the OP for not using this as an educational moment, please refer to Post #1 where she asks
Quote:
What do you think? And I don't mean to be stupid, but what is the politically correct way to tell the kids why she is so short?
. She wants to teach her son but isn't sure of the way in which to do so. To the OP-if it were my son, I'd explain that everything in nature is a little different. In the case of a Little Person, they stopped growing after getting to a certain hight, and they won't grow anymore (maybe you could touch on genes and say 'there's something in their body that tells it to stop growing before most people'). It's not something you can catch, it's something that you're born with. I'd explain that their brains are the same, they can have all types of jobs and do pretty much anything that someone of an average height can do, and that some have been teased for their height/appearence. the right thing to call them is a Little Person, because Midget is not a nice word to use. I'd also explain that they know that they're a Small Person, so there's no need to point it out (same with someone who has no legs....a facial deformity, etc).
post #93 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by LilyGrace View Post
Yes, but what if the 5 year old called you a n****** or a sp***?

I don't think she overreacted. I think there are some underreactions here. Personally, if I was called a slur, even by a child, I would be horribly offended because he learned it from somewhere- and how to use it.
I think ultimately the problem is how bad we think the word is, and this is a sticky issue. There is a lot of people complaining about something being offensive and other people telling them they are overreacting and not to get their knickers in a twist and no one meant to be insulting and so on. So I don't want to get into that argument, but the bottom line is that some words just don't strike the majority of the public as badly as other words. I think what the woman was trying to do was reinforce the idea that the word midget really is a slur, even if a lot of people don't see it that way. And maybe one day midget will carry the same emotional impact as n**** or sp**** But right now it just doesn't.

So I think the worker was right to say that was an insulting term so she can work at the goal of eradicating it from polite language, but in no way do I think it is comparable to a child using the n word. I am a morbidly obese person and I would feel offended if a child called me a tub o' lard and I'd say something, but it wouldn't be the same as being called a n*** or a sp**
post #94 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by UUMom View Post
Thoughtful adults don't throw children under the bus when they make mistakes.
I haven't read a SINGLE post where someone said it was okay to yell at the child or it would be warranted to "throw the child under the bus."

I think the posts, such as mine, that speak to the woman's point of view are trying to point out, hey, an ethnic(?)/derogatory slur was used, the woman got seriously offended. She has a RIGHT to be offended even if used by a child, and try to look at it from HER point of view. And also that she was owed a sincere apology for her hurt feelings.

That's it. Anyone reading into that that bashing the child is okay is way off.
post #95 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by MadWorldSonnet View Post
Yes, you did, where she threatened to not let a 5year old on the ride that his parents paid for, overstepping her boundaries (and just being plain nasty).
That was in the OP, too. And, as it is written, the woman said that to the mother, not the child. I agree that that was overstepping, but she did take the worst of her annoyance out on the mom, not the child. To the child she simply said "that's very insulting".
post #96 of 102
Not all 5-year-olds are even going to know what "insulting" means. I'd chalk this up to the woman not knowing any little kids that well and therefore having unrealistic expectations of what they'd know. I understand her being hurt, but I don't understand her having so little patience with a young child unless she just doesn't have much contact with them. Even if she works at a carnival, she wouldn't necessarily really know many children, and you have to know them a bit to understand what's normal for any given age. The things my daughter said to people when she was younger! Luckily everyone understood she was just a little kid who didn't understand what she was saying.
post #97 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by blessed View Post
I didn't know the term 'midget' was insulting, although I did realize that 'little person' is more en vogue right now. Of course, as an adult I wouldn't be calling a person any name. But I could have easily used the term in conversaton without realizing it was offensive.

I think the woman could have handled the situation much more gracefully than she did. She could have smiled at him and said "We prefer to be called 'little people'. It's a nicer term!" He is a child, after all.
Glad I wasnt the only one. And I agree with your solution as well
post #98 of 102
post #99 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by LilyGrace View Post
Yes, but what if the 5 year old called you a n****** or a sp***?

I don't think she overreacted. I think there are some underreactions here. Personally, if I was called a slur, even by a child, I would be horribly offended because he learned it from somewhere- and how to use it. It wouldnt matter to me right at that moment that he was 5 years old - I would be absolutely appalled and take steps to not have that child near me.


Half of the adults posting on this thread have made it clear that they were not aware that the term midget was offensive but we are all aware that the N word and the SP word ARE offensive and EVERYONE knows that.

I think the worker was mean, rude, and shouldnt be working around kids. That was such a learning moment not just for the child but the whole family.

Child : Are you a midget?

Worker : Well I am a little person, and we do not like being called Midgets.

Child: oh

And my guess is he would have just gotten on the ride and it would have been over and done with.

Was it nessary that she be mean and rude about it? Not at all. So now the mother is upset, the child is upset, the workers is upset and now the boss is ticked off at the worker.. How was her reaction helpful?
post #100 of 102
Quote:
Originally Posted by blessed View Post
At first I was miffed about the 'she works at a CARNIVAL' comment, thinking it was a slam on carnies (is that term offensive ??) Then I thought she was just expressing shock about someone working at a position which caters to children - a carnival - not knowing how to deal with kids.

Not sure what she really meant, though...
Yes, some consider being called carnies a slam. Others don't.

It is as you say, AND it is that if one intentionally takes a job that would probably be the most likely job on the entire planet to be associated with a particular word.....it should not be a surprise that people know it.

Also, being a person with dwarfism isn't like being a person who is of a different ethnic, racial, regional morphology. It isn't even close to be as common anywhere at anytime. That everyone hasn't been introduced to the concepts surrounding the little-people-cultural-sensitivity is FAR from surprising.

To expect that a FIVE YEAR OLD knows that people with dwarfism don't like to be called midgets is ridiculous to the point that the person is LOOKING to be a j*****s.
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