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Commercial toys, tv and ASD  

post #1 of 48
Thread Starter 
Anybody else sort of switch gears when it came to how they are going to handle tv and commercialism?

I discovered, over time, that letting ds watch kid appropriate shows and getting some of the branded toys seemed to help him socialize a lot better. It also helped the therapist a lot because it gave him more social references with language, instead of just staring blankly when somebody said "is Dora happy or sad?" or "What is Goofy doing?" and just gave them a lot better variety to work with to help reinforce different things. It helped when he was with other kids because if they were acting out something that he was familiar with, he was able to participate at least to a degree.

Open ended toys generally do not inspire nearly the social interactions because they don't have 'rules'. He likes some open ended toys, but he doesn't really play with them in an open ended way like typical kids do (where a block becomes food, or a wall, or car) unless he is shown a specific way to play with them. Once he is shown that it can 'represent' something specific, he can sometimes continue to play like that, but he would never see a blue playsilk and think "oh, it can be water" like my dd probably could.

The closest he gets to that open-ended type play is to make patterns out of the toys. Creative in it's own way, but not what people are aiming for when they get the really cool waldorf/montessori/natural toys.

I noticed that his language definatly saw improvement when I stopped limiting tv too. For a while, he watched tons of tv, although that really slowed down a LOT after a while. When he ramped up his tv viewing though, he especially liked videos that he watched over and over again, and would pick up some scripts and they basically became social stories for him. (I was very careful about *what* he saw, just not about how often he saw them). I honestly think tv was a much easier medium for him to learn from than the unpredictibility of the normal world, the way typical kids pick up language and behavior.

I was wondering if anybody else had this experience. It is just really hard on me on many levels because it isn't how I envisioned parenting at ALL, but it seems to meet his needs better than my ideal vision of what I thought was the *right* way to parent. I feel like such a fraud sometimes, but, contrary to all the studies on the negative impact of this stuff, it just seems to be the opposite for us in reality.

I would love to hear others thoughts on this. I know this is probably one of those "I can't believe this is on MDC" type threads, but that is why I put it in SN, because the SN status of my child is directly relevant, and the needs of my child seem to be in direct conflict with NFL ideals and I am struggling with it.
post #2 of 48
since I stopped fighting the tv battle with ds, I've noticed more stable behaviour, better communication with his small vocabulary and more signing. His recognition of things seems to have gotten better to. I figure if it helps in anyway its fine by me.

ETA: hes not ASD but has SID
post #3 of 48
Totally!

My dd likely has a language processing disorder, but lots of social anxiety and some asd-like quirks. I credit tv with helping her learn to communicate and use language. It's terrible, but it's true.

She learned to communicate and play by copying and scripting. Once she became proficient in that, she began to create her own thoughts and play scenes. She is a visual learner, so seeing and hearing language together is the way to learn for her right now.

There are also little things like using names, answering questions that really benefit from shows like Dora. Like you said and I've said before, more traditional toys are too open ended, and she just doesn't know where to start, so she just does things like put toys in and out of a container or something, rather than play with them.

There are different rules for atypical kids. I'm learning to follow my dd's cues for everything, including how she learns.
post #4 of 48
Ds watching "Signing Time" all the time helped tremendously with not only his signing but with his LANGUAGE. I totally get you on the therapists using common/popular toys thing. His therapists got so frustrated when I told them, "he doesn't know who <insert tv character here> is..." They'd try to engage him with a Dora toy or a Disney toy or something, and he gave them no reaction.

He's still not into many character things, with the exception of Nemo and Thomas and Little Einsteins. TEACCH uses Little Einsteins characters on his task boxes a lot, which does help.
post #5 of 48
We, too, find that tv and "characters" help alot! DD has APD (rec. and exp lan delay) and she learns sooooo much better off the videos. She can repeat them and repeat them until she "gets" it - then she uses the phrases appropriately in real life.

Also, once she "knows" a character, we can expand into the books and toys associated with the tv show - so she is eager to learn to read, for example, so she can find out what Dora and friends are doing in the book LOL

Pretend play is still not very good though - but I haven't tried helping her act out exactly one of the scenarios on a video - maybe I should try it?

But, yeah, I'm disappointed that I don't have one of those "super creative" kids who I can give a bucket to and she will make up lots of scenarios LOL - but maybe she'll just end up being a very observant scientist type instead. I'm thinking of helping her start an observation "notebook" (a la Blues Clues LOL) to encourage that type of imagination....

anyway, I totally get you and I agree - you do what you need to just to get ANY communication going!
peace,
robyn
post #6 of 48
my son first starting making eye contact with us when we would imitate the songs from his show.

some AS kids love tv and crave the repetition. There are so many wonderful shows out there, and they really can teach kids alot. The childrens TV and movie companys are not ALL bad. they spend millions on research, educators and professionals to create shows that kids like and teach them about the big world around them. :
post #7 of 48
Yes! This has been our experience too. I'm so glad you said it first. Now I just have to figure out how to get my NT kid to stop watching as much as my ASC one does.
post #8 of 48
Thread Starter 
I am so glad I am not the only one. Here, the assumed ideal is "no tv", so it feels a little weird to try and argue that tv is good in some situations. No doubt there are people who read this thread and were rather dismayed.

I hear one of the PPs though, I am struggling to keep my NT dd to not watch tv because I don't think it is particularly good for her to watch tv, especially not to the degree ds does. Her brain is just different though and she can play with open ended toys and naturally does pretend play. At 19 months she is far ahead of my 5yo on ability to do pretend play in the traditional sense. I want to encourage that as much as possible.

I wonder if our kids respond better to specific characters because they are more well defined. They can understand the concrete example of "Cinderella" vs. the more vague, abstract concept of "Princess" or "Diego" vs. "Animal Activist/Zoologist", or "Bob" vs. "Carpenter". Once they get what that characer does, how they interact, they have something to build on and related things to, which helps them expand their world.

I totally agree with another PP also. We started with the tv, and the characters he liked (Dora was the first big one) we started getting books, which interested him and jumpstarted reading, and the doll, which works on fine motor (or, most of the time, asking for help to put on the clothes...but asking for help was a big deal too) and he would sit the doll in front of him and "talk" to her, so it did spawn a pretend play of sorts. One of the books grandma got for him was Dora themed book on how to tell time, and had buttons that said phrases like "time to go to bed" and "time to eat lunch", and he actually would pick up the book and have the book say things for him sometimes...it was one of the first times he ever used words, in any way, to communicate with us instead of label something.

I am about to get him some Dora panties for Potty Learning because that might be the only thing that might inspire him not to poop on her. PL is having zero success at this point. So frustrating.
post #9 of 48
Thank you for posting this.

We chose to get a digital cable bundle recently for the Sprout and Noggin channels. Most of the shows are developmentally appropriate for my kids and do serve as a audio-visual social story. Print social stories do nothing for my daughter, but she can understand it in a tv show like Berenstein Bears or Backyardigans.

Another issue is the social factor with her peers. This is not very NFL at all, but I want to give her as much as a level playing ground with other kids as I can. She really wants to be social and play with other kids, and letting her play with Barbies and knowing what Disney Princesses are gives her more of a common ground with other kids her age to be able to relate to them.
post #10 of 48
Bede learned to talk from television. He hasn't taken any interest in any particular characters in a way that could be expanded on, but unlimited TV and computer time has opened up his world to me in a way that would be very, very hard to match, if not impossible.

I must say, I think it is much more common to castigate TV viewing when it is used as a babysitter. While I have been known to say "No, not now... go watch TV!" on occasion, the vast majority of TV and computer use in this house is in our livingroom and we experience it together. Bede prefers to sit on my lap when he uses the computer (even though he totally 'drives' on his own - I'm just an interactive talking cushion ) and when he's not sitting on my lap, he's talking to me about what he's doing, sharing it with me. TV too.
post #11 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Empress View Post
Thank you for posting this.

We chose to get a digital cable bundle recently for the Sprout and Noggin channels. Most of the shows are developmentally appropriate for my kids and do serve as a audio-visual social story. Print social stories do nothing for my daughter, but she can understand it in a tv show like Berenstein Bears or Backyardigans.
We are about to go up to digital cable partly for this reason also (mostly because its only $2 more and has 60 more channels. 3 of which are noggin, sprout and discovery kids. They are slowly taking channel by channel away from us on our normal cable and charging us more and more, so why not just switch to digital when the difference is so minor.

I love blues clues, because steve has taught ds finnaly how to sign thank you! (despite me doing it all the time) And ds no longer frustrated when communicating what he wants, he uses the hand signals that steve does when he says blues clues, to tell me he wants that, or he now uses the word memo for elmos world.

Blues clues has also encouraged ds to write/color more. We got him a blues clues notebook toy with wipe off pages, and he loves sitting down and "drawing" his clues.
post #12 of 48
I am going to be the voice of decent and say that we saw a drastic improvement in ds (ASD) when I got rid of the tv. I had one of those days where we couldn't leave the house because it was 1:00 and he was worried that we wouldn't return in time to watch his favorite show (which started at 5:00) and I was sick of being tied down to that damn box . His whole life revolved around the shows he was obsessed with and he was scared of every other show on tv. I had enough of all the stress it caused our family so I got rid of it and we have been tv free for 2.5 years.

I never really noticed the impact it had on him until the influence was gone. I thought it was helpful because it seemed to be a good way to introduce ideas to him, to demonstrate social situations, to help him understand emotional language, to help him unwind/de-stress on hard days, and the list goes on. After we eliminated it we realized how it affected him so much more than a NT child. He only knew how to play in ways that emulated what he saw, generally just repeating (word for word with perfect intonation) scenarios he saw on his favorite shows. He would just repeat phrases he saw on tv in social situations, he refused to even try to do it differently. It was as though the way he saw in on screen was the "right" way and therefore the only way. Everything had to be measured against the visual images so there was no room for expansion on those ideas.

Once we went tv free we noticed a shift in his perception of things. Without those visual images put in his head he was able to tolerate (and even accept) new ideas. He was better able to generalize ideas from one situation to another because he was not fixated on it being or looking like one exact image (the image on tv of course). Over time he began to play more creatively. Without a catalog of images to emulate he was forced to create his own. It was awkward at first, but amazing nonetheless. I vividly remember the very first time he used his imagination to create characters (complete with funny voices). He had two plastic people and one said something to the other in a peculiar voice. Something that most parents of a 4 year old wouldn't even notice, but it was such an amazing accomplishment for him on so many levels. He CREATED something on his own instead of just repeating something he had heard. I actually cried tears of joy!

He has such a brilliant imagination now. He gets the idea that things can represent other things (blocks can pretend to be food). He doesn't play the way NT kids do, he plays in his own amazing way. But I don't think he would have the ability to create the way he does with his imagination if he watched tv. He is too visual, seeing a representation of something fixes that image in his mind and that makes it the only "right" way, leaving no room for change. That doesn't work for us as we need less rigid ideas to grow from. That is why it is NO tv for him. Even a limited amount interferes with our progress.

Anyway, that is just *MY* experience with *MY* child. As with most things there is no right and wrong way, just different methods that work for different families. I just thought I would share what has been successful for us
post #13 of 48
If anyone is interested, I would gladly share (when I'm actually fully awake and coherent) the ways I believe television, and commercials in particular, helped me learn some of the things autistics typically have trouble with (social expectations, nonverbal communication, concise narrative, etc.).
post #14 of 48
We spent years fostering our eldest (NT) child's imagination, bought open ended toys and strived to avoid commercial toys, tv books at all costs. We no longer subscribe to that philosophy now that we have DS2 (autism)

He was always drawn to the bright lights and the music in videos and tv, would notice them in stores and at friends houses. But it wasn’t until he got very sick and landed up in the hospital and watched A LOT of tv that we realized what a great tool tv could be in our household. My ds tends to shut down if feeling overwhelmed, yet in the hospital he watch a few minutes of tv and re-group himself and then would be willing/able to deal with whatever what happening at the time.

When he comes home from a particularly challenging day, we put a show on in our room, hand him a chewy tube and he will come out 30 minutes later ready to rock and roll Its our ace in the hole (since he weaned) for soothing him when facing an unpleasant task. Put on something with music like the wiggles ***shudder*** and he's golden through anything from blood work to allergy testing.

Never would have thought I'd see the day that I owned a portable dvd player in my house But I have long since embraced the "what ever works" theory long ago!
post #15 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brigianna View Post
If anyone is interested, I would gladly share (when I'm actually fully awake and coherent) the ways I believe television, and commercials in particular, helped me learn some of the things autistics typically have trouble with (social expectations, nonverbal communication, concise narrative, etc.).
Im interested:
post #16 of 48
Thread Starter 
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brigianna View Post
If anyone is interested, I would gladly share (when I'm actually fully awake and coherent) the ways I believe television, and commercials in particular, helped me learn some of the things autistics typically have trouble with (social expectations, nonverbal communication, concise narrative, etc.).
I am very interested too. I love hearing your perspective!
post #17 of 48
Quote:
Originally Posted by Brigianna View Post
If anyone is interested, I would gladly share (when I'm actually fully awake and coherent) the ways I believe television, and commercials in particular, helped me learn some of the things autistics typically have trouble with (social expectations, nonverbal communication, concise narrative, etc.).
I'm very intersted. I have watched my ds pick up things from the tv in the past couple of years that he doesn't pick up as well from us. It's funny actually, he learns academics better from people but the little social and language things he seems to pick up more from tv.
post #18 of 48
My OT actually recommended I INCREASE my son't viewing time on the TV and I love her madly for it.

DS needs to unwind visually after OT/ST or other hard work. He is going to be one of those kids who loves the Where's Waldo books. It calms him to watch small things moving and/or tiny details.

We've given up reading at night and exchanged it for a video. He loves "Cars," he likes to play with his "Thomas" stuff but the movies seem to bore both of my kids. Shrek and Signing Time are big here too.

I made it all three years of DD's life without cable or TV of any kind in our home. (We just used the DVD player) but we are adding cable in the fall. It's time and I feel like we laid a foundation of not relying upon the TV for babysitting, it definitely forced me to be more creative on those gosh-awful, freezing winter days.
post #19 of 48
This is an immensely interesting thread.
I too find that DD responds to T.V in that it helps with her vocalization and is a general stimulant.

I am wondering, if t.v. would "detract" her from human interaction. It is hard to get her to answer to her name when she is watching t.v b/c she is so absorbed.

Like many of you, I never calculated t.v watching as part of my child's upbring. Now, I see it as a tool, much like a tupperware filled with finger foods and toys.

Mary
post #20 of 48
I think that the moms of SN kids sometimes have to make allowances that we didn't otherwise plan on before actually becoming aprents. I never wanted my DD to be apart from me 3-4 hours a week while I took DS to therapies.

I didn't want a TV becuase I was afraid it would "cause" autism or obesity in my kids.

Oh well. Parenting has changed me and challenged me in so many ways that it doesn't really surprise me anymore.
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