Formula Frenzy outside of the US?

[sheilajolene]

We all know that America is largely formula fed. What is it like abroad? What other countries are so formula-centric? Educate me, or tell me where I can find my facts!

[Claire and Boys]

Very formula centric here in the UK although we adhere to the code so there is no formula marketing and no bags in hospitals, they try to push breastfeeding but sadly many women either do not bf at all or only for a very short time. One good thing is we now have 9 months paid maternity leave (from April this year).

[superlori]

Actually the UK only adheres to a weak version of the Code, but yes, even though some hospitals try to be baby friendly and promote breastfeeding, formula is still the majority.

It's not as bad as the US though; as Claire and Boys already mentioned, they don't give out formula samples with the hospital bags and whatnot.

ETA: You might find some info on this website.

[clavicula]

here in Hungary, you can not choose FF just by choice. F has to be prescribed, you can not buy it in local stores. Lots of women breastfeed, but only until 6 months average.

[Turkish Kate]

Turkiye is a mixed bag. Here in Istanbul, a city of 20 million people, it largely depends on where you give birth, how breastfeeding-friendly the docs/hospital are, etc. I had DS in a certified baby-friendly hospital affiliated with Harvard, had a very BF-friendly ped, etc. No probs for me, but then I disregarded quite a bit of their advice, such as to leave the baby dressed in 15 layers of clothes for warmth, no co-sleeping, etc. (He was naked and on me from the minute I got him until we left for home.) A friend had her baby at the same hospital, not-so-BF-friendly ped who advised formula supplementation for reasons I don't remember now. Other friends who had their babies in state hospitals were steered towards formula at the slightest hint of breastfeeding problems, although the hospitals don't provide the formula and the families have to pay out of pocket for it.

In many cases, it's the lower middle class moms who use formula. It's viewed as a sign of affluence, that they can afford to buy formula (which is about twice the price that it is in the US) and bottles and all the other stuff that comes with FF. The more educated families tend to breastfeed because they know that it's better, the less educated do it because they can't afford not to.

Even though Turkiye was among the first signators of the WHO Code, it's not enfored here. Nestle has a helluva foot in the door, everywhere you go you see Nestle products--some of the worst crap food produced anywhere. On the weekends you can even see "milkmaids" in the stores handing out samples. I've had them approach me once or twice, but DH won't let me go off on them. He's learned to steer me clear of the baby aisles when there are product demonstrators lurking around. We have those nasty follow-up milks, too. I just don't understand what benefit people think they're giving their kids with this stuff.

[JustJamie]

I don't think I've seen a baby other than mine fed at all here in Germany.

My landlord (German) has seen me nurse my daughter, and does know my daughter's age (2) and has never seemed surprised by it, just saying matter-of-factly "oh, eating time!"

I have a few errands to run tomorrow, I'll have to poke into a few baby stores/baby sections and see how much formula is on the shelves.

[AlexisT]

Teh thing about the UK is that it talks the talk but doesn't walk the walk--breastfeeding support is really poor and a lot of the midwives don't really know what they're doing. I had a midwife tell me I wasn't going to produce any milk (basically, she just grabbed me, rather roughly!), then when she saw I was using a cup feeder (because I had latch problems from her being in the NICU) tell me I had to use bottles because DD would forget how to suck!

Formula manufacturers try to subvert marketing; Aptamil got told to take "closest to breastmilk" off their cartons and now SMA is in trouble--Jordan (don't ask)n was shown feeding her baby SMA formula in a picture, and mysteriously, an ad for SMA follow-on (which is legal to advertise) was next to it!

[Clarinet]

I read somewhere that Canadian breastfeeding rates are similar to that of the U.S. At the hospital after giving birth, I was never asked if I wanted to supplement and neither formula samples nor "The Bag" were offered to me. They did give me a bit of bad advice about making sure she got 15 minutes on each side and I was given a chart to fill out. I ended up lying because I was afraid they'd request supplements or try to make her stay longer. It was in that hospital, though, where I learned how small a newborn's stomach really is and the fact that they only need a few tablespoons those first few days. I was kind of surrounded by confusing information but I knew what I needed to do.

I was contacted a few weeks later by, well I forget but it was something like a Health Department employee, who asked how I was doing, how I was feeling, how was nursing, etc. Also, when the baby was about six months old, I got to participate in a phone survey where I was able to say she had never had a bottle of formula, had not started solids yet and I had no intentions on ever giving her formula. The lady on the phone seemed surprised but told me she thought it was great.

Formula is sold on the shelves of grocery stores in my town. I've never really paid attention to commercials on the television. I konw when I watch TLC, I'll see formula commercials but that's a U.S. channel we get.

[AlexisT]

Oh, you can buy formula here (I think putting it all on prescription is a bit drastic) but only the regular and soya. Special formula requires either asking the chemist (like for Cow & Gate Comfort) or having a prescription (Nutramigen, Neocate etc). It's not cheap though--£7 for 900g and we don't have store brand. Nice thing about having it on prescription though (if your DC really needs it) is that it's free because children don't pay prescription charges.

[wannabe]

Ireland is pretty bad. EVERYONE says they didn't have enough milk.

Both the UK and Ireland have these persistent beliefs/old wives tales about baby behaviour and scheduling, which obviously don't work well AT ALL with breastfeeding. People like Gina Ford do their best to sabotage as many women as they can : :

Australia is a breastfeeding culture - you would never ever admit you didn't at least try, and switching to formula is looked down on. Support, unfortunately, is patchy. Some mother-child health nurses have APALLING info, but the majority are OK. Weaning is normally around a year, although there's a reasonable sub-culture of extended nursing. The WHO code is enforced.

[julie128]

Originally Posted by clavicula

here in Hungary, you can not choose FF just by choice. F has to be prescribed, you can not buy it in local stores. Lots of women breastfeed, but only until 6 months average.

What do mothers do after 6 months? Go directly to table food and cows' milk or do they get formula prescriptions?

[Chavelamomela]

Formula culture in Israel

Well, I don't actually live in Israel, but I have many relatives and friends who do, and have spent a significant amount of time there.

In Israel, it is acceptable and customary to BF for the first 3 months (there's 3 months mat. leave there). The formula companies are very clever with their marketing, and they say "Sure, yes, nurse your baby for the first 3 months...but when you go back to work, we're there to help you!"

Their marketing works extremely well. Although I know many women who do EBF, like in the US it is not the norm, and more likely amoung the "natural" folks. The mainstream is used to seeing BFing infants, but not toddlers.

[Da WIC Lady]

Originally Posted by Chavelamomela

Well, I don't actually live in Israel, but I have many relatives and friends who do, and have spent a significant amount of time there.

In Israel, it is acceptable and customary to BF for the first 3 months (there's 3 months mat. leave there). The formula companies are very clever with their marketing, and they say "Sure, yes, nurse your baby for the first 3 months...but when you go back to work, we're there to help you!"

Their marketing works extremely well. Although I know many women who do EBF, like in the US it is not the norm, and more likely amoung the "natural" folks. The mainstream is used to seeing BFing infants, but not toddlers.

That really surprises me since I would think it would be popular to nurse to age 2 for religious reasons. Most of the moms I know locally that bf toddlers are mostly religious Jews and Muslims. The others tend to be religious, but they are a minority within the minority.

Anna

[Bonbonne]

just subbing

[Ammaarah]

I spent some time in Bangladesh last year with DH's family. My SIL said everyone starts out breastfeeding, but "then we use feeders" (bottles.) From what I gather, it's fairly common to wean to formula or straight cow's milk or at least supplement starting around 5 months. All the toddlers I encountered from middle and upper-class families had a bottle and were not breastfed anymore. They were all shocked my daughter didn't take a bottle of cow milk.

Nestle has a huge presence there. The packaging of the formula seems compliant with WHO code (no babies on the infant formula, just on the follow-up, I'm not sure if that's right on re the Code but it's better than on the infant formula) but there are huge billboards proclaiming NIDO milk (which is not formula, just powdered whole milk) as the "Perfect Formula." I saw a lot of cans of Nido in babies' rooms.

The lower-class women I saw breastfed. I'm not sure how much supplementation goes on in the lower classes. I would love to open a lactation clinic in Bangladesh someday.

ETA: There is pretty much no water that's safe from the tap in Bangladesh. There are deep tube wells that are generally free of microbial dangers, but in some areas the tube wells are heavily contaminated with arsenic. To safely bottlefeed, the water would need to be boiled, filtered (can you filter out arsenic) and all the stuff would need to be sterilized as well. This is just not happening in most places.

[AlexisT]

Originally Posted by wannabe

Ireland is pretty bad. EVERYONE says they didn't have enough milk.

Both the UK and Ireland have these persistent beliefs/old wives tales about baby behaviour and scheduling, which obviously don't work well AT ALL with breastfeeding. People like Gina Ford do their best to sabotage as many women as they can : :

Ooh, speaking of this, they're having something about formula advertising on BBC Breakfast, and the woman from the formula manufacturers used "not enough milk" as a reason women stopped breastfeeding. Way to perpetuate the myth! Wish the NCT woman had challenged that one.

[elmo&zoe]

Originally Posted by Chavelamomela

Well, I don't actually live in Israel, but I have many relatives and friends who do, and have spent a significant amount of time there.

In Israel, it is acceptable and customary to BF for the first 3 months (there's 3 months mat. leave there). The formula companies are very clever with their marketing, and they say "Sure, yes, nurse your baby for the first 3 months...but when you go back to work, we're there to help you!"

Their marketing works extremely well. Although I know many women who do EBF, like in the US it is not the norm, and more likely amoung the "natural" folks. The mainstream is used to seeing BFing infants, but not toddlers.

That sounds about right. Most of the women start out trying, at least with one of their children. There are very high nursing rates for the first few months, and they drop at 6 months, and again at a year.
Nursing rates in the first 6 months (and maybe a little after) have risen in the past few years, after the horrible story with one of the formula companies. (Faulty formula, missing vitamin B1, a few babies died, others were left with irreversible neurological damage : ).

Since most women have to go back to work, the nursing rates go down. Financially, it's often hard to stay home, and not all women find pumping that easy or have enough knowledge to do it well.

They adhere to the code to a certain degree, not marketing aggressively to mothers of babies under 6 months, but at the 6 month mark, you get those samples in the mail. :

[MilkTrance]

Well, my Canadian perspective is a bit different from the PP. I found that I was really supported in BF and that everyone assumed I was going to BF. Most of my friends who have babies BF at least 6 months, some 1 year, some longer.

However, similar to Clarinet, I did receive conflicting advice at the hospital. One nurse even suggested I supplement at the hospital due to DS losing weight. Most of the nurses were okay, though.

It's my friends who have really supported me. They pretty much all BF, or at least started BF.

The hospital policy is clearly posted all over the hospital in the mat ward. Rooming-in, on-demand feeding, etc. Maybe it varies by province, I dunno.

[angelcat]

Originally Posted by MilkTrance

Well, my Canadian perspective is a bit different from the PP. I found that I was really supported in BF and that everyone assumed I was going to BF. Most of my friends who have babies BF at least 6 months, some 1 year, some longer.

However, similar to Clarinet, I did receive conflicting advice at the hospital. One nurse even suggested I supplement at the hospital due to DS losing weight. Most of the nurses were okay, though.

It's my friends who have really supported me. They pretty much all BF, or at least started BF.

The hospital policy is clearly posted all over the hospital in the mat ward. Rooming-in, on-demand feeding, etc. Maybe it varies by province, I dunno.

Pretty much this. I wasn't pushed to suppplement at the hospital though. They were annoyed at me for having problems nursing, though. I was constantly hounded about my milk coming in. They seemed to think I was doing something wrong since it took about 5 days to come in. (I had a c-section).

I only know one person irl who simply chose not to even try to nurse. It's very odd. (that she doesn't).

[RoundAbout]

Does anyone know about New Zealand? Just curious because I will be heading there for Christmas when my DS is a 12 month old.