What My Teacher Ed. Program Taught Me About the Ineffectiveness of Punishment

[beansavi]

Punishment Does Not Work
I am so proud of my school!

Basically, I just finished creating a 17 page chart (whew!) outlining a dozen different human behavioralists who expanded into the area of classroom management (behavior).

The common thread that ran through each of their models was that:

A) Punishment does nothing to extinguish negative behavior and only weakens the teacher-student relationship.

B) Classrooms should be democratic climates in which the students create the rules, consequences, and rewards, along with the teacher.

C) Rewards should be organic, such as "Feeling good about a job well-done" rather than candy, for example.

D) Teachers should view their students as citizens of the larger community, and the classrroom should teach them by experience how to get along in their community.

E) Students should follow rules because they care about human beings and want to get along with them, NOT because they are simply afraid to get in trouble. We as teachers should strive for a higher level of morality in our students that benefits the world, at large.

F) Students have a right to feel joy when learning.


Here are the behavioralists if you ever want to reference/Google them:


Redl and Wattenberg
Kounin and Dreikurs
Ginott and Skinner
Canter and Canter
Jones
Albert
Dreiker
Gordon
Nelsen, Lott, and Glenn
Glasser
Curwin and Mendler
Coloroso
Kyle, Scott, and Kagan
Kohn
Charles

[zavierchick]

all things that should be obvious and exalted....I am so glad your teacher/student colleagues got to see that in action YAY!!!!!!!! and thanks so much for sharing with us...it is always nice to see things we believe in being lived by others people

[majikfaerie]

yay! right on! but you didnt need to go to school; I coulda told ya that

[MamaRabbit]

And the students do just fine don't they?!?

If only parents would do the same things, no need for punishment.

I taught for 2 years and never had a problem with a single student... and that was middle school. No need for punishing.

[nascarbebe]

I've always wondered what they were teaching you guys. Thanks for sharing.

[beansavi]

Originally Posted by zavierchick

all things that should be obvious and exalted....I am so glad your teacher/student colleagues got to see that in action YAY!!!!!!!! and thanks so much for sharing with us...it is always nice to see things we believe in being lived by others people

I am really happy this is a part of the teachre certification process now. It was not when I began ten years ago... at least not for me. Yay for change!

Originally Posted by majikfaerie

yay! right on! but you didnt need to go to school; I coulda told ya that

Amen sista!

Originally Posted by MamaRabbit

And the students do just fine don't they?!?

If only parents would do the same things, no need for punishment.

I taught for 2 years and never had a problem with a single student... and that was middle school. No need for punishing.

Exactly. Hopefully, since these theorists advocate for parental partnership, the parents will eventually learn this through a kind of "trickle down" dealio.

Originally Posted by nascarbebe

I've always wondered what they were teaching you guys. Thanks for sharing.

[malibusunny]

Our program was big on democratic classrooms, too.
Even Skinner admitted that punishment wasn't an effective way of changing behaviour.

[beansavi]

Originally Posted by malibusunny

Our program was big on democratic classrooms, too.
Even Skinner admitted that punishment wasn't an effective way of changing behaviour.

Good to hear! Thanks!

Are you finished school now?

... and yeah, I think Skinner said you could actually extinguish good behaviors by using punishment for the inappropriate ones, and you wreck your relationship with the child and so anything you do runs the risk of being ineffective.

[mommy2julia]

Yep, many of the teachers at my school (as do I) Punished by Rewards by Alfie Kohn, it was funny b/c the first time I saw a colleague reading it I made a comment about unconditional parenting! They were very impressed. (i am a first year teacher!!!)

[beansavi]

Originally Posted by mommy2julia

Yep, many of the teachers at my school (as do I) Punished by Rewards by Alfie Kohn, it was funny b/c the first time I saw a colleague reading it I made a comment about unconditional parenting! They were very impressed. (i am a first year teacher!!!)

Well nice to meet you! Thanks for sharing that bit of info!

I used to teach Spanish and French in middle school, and elementary in a Waldorf school, but now I am getting my for-real license to teach public school elem. ed. I have three more courses to go...whew! Glad you are having what sounds like a great first year.

[malibusunny]

Originally Posted by beansavi

Good to hear! Thanks!

Are you finished school now?

... and yeah, I think Skinner said you could actually extinguish good behaviors by using punishment for the inappropriate ones, and you wreck your relationship with the child and so anything you do runs the risk of being ineffective.

Yep, this is my fifth year teaching. Wow. Is it really? I guess I'd better renew my license.

[beansavi]

Originally Posted by malibusunny

Yep, this is my fifth year teaching. Wow. Is it really? I guess I'd better renew my license.

[cutekid]

A) Punishment does nothing to extinguish negative behavior and only weakens the Parent-Child relationship.

B) Homeshould be democratic climates in which theChilderncreate the rules, consequences, and rewards, along with the Parent.

C) Rewards should be organic, such as "Feeling good about a job well-done" rather than candy, for example.

D) Parents should view theirChildern as citizens of the larger community, andHome should teach them by experience how to get along in their community.

E) ChildrenA) Punishment does nothing to extinguish negative behavior and only weakens the teacher-student relationship.

B) Classrooms should be democratic climates in which the students create the rules, consequences, and rewards, along with the teacher.

C) Rewards should be organic, such as "Feeling good about a job well-done" rather than candy, for example.

D) Teachers should view their students as citizens of the larger community, and the classrroom should teach them by experience how to get along in their community.

E) Students should follow rules because they care about human beings and want to get along with them, NOT because they are simply afraid to get in trouble. We as teachers should strive for a higher level of morality in our students that benefits the world, at large.

F) Students have a right to feel joy when learning.
should follow rules because they care about human beings and want to get along with them, NOT because they are simply afraid to get in trouble. We as Parentsshould strive for a higher level of morality in our students that benefits the world, at large.

F) Children have a right to feel joy when learning.

Substituting Parents and Children and you get a great idea of how children should be treated.

Denise

[mammastar2]

That's great. You'd think, given that she's only been teaching 3 years, that some of this might have sunk in with dd's first grade teacher....:

[LianneM]

wow that is awesome!

I went through an elem.ed. program (graduated in 2003) and only had one class that was even remotely like this. MOST of my classes were about using behaviorism, in fact my ed.psych. prof told us all about how to get exactly what we want out of kids using jolly ranchers :

I'm glad to know there are SOME schools out there teaching better!!

[beansavi]

Originally Posted by LianneM

MOST of my classes were about using behaviorism, in fact my ed.psych. prof told us all about how to get exactly what we want out of kids using jolly ranchers :

Yes! Isn't that ridiculous! Evidently there is a new trend in education about all of this. Alternatives to using any punishment or bribery the "cutting edge", "hip" new thing....not that everyone is really using it when they teach. My daughter's teacher gives them one skittle every time they answer a question correctly. Good grief! What is she, a puppy?

[beansavi]

Originally Posted by cutekid

A) Punishment does nothing to extinguish negative behavior and only weakens the Parent-Child relationship.

B) Homeshould be democratic climates in which theChilderncreate the rules, consequences, and rewards, along with the Parent.

C) Rewards should be organic, such as "Feeling good about a job well-done" rather than candy, for example.

D) Parents should view theirChildern as citizens of the larger community, andHome should teach them by experience how to get along in their community.

E) ChildrenA) Punishment does nothing to extinguish negative behavior and only weakens the teacher-student relationship.

B) Classrooms should be democratic climates in which the students create the rules, consequences, and rewards, along with the teacher.

C) Rewards should be organic, such as "Feeling good about a job well-done" rather than candy, for example.

D) Teachers should view their students as citizens of the larger community, and the classrroom should teach them by experience how to get along in their community.

E) Students should follow rules because they care about human beings and want to get along with them, NOT because they are simply afraid to get in trouble. We as teachers should strive for a higher level of morality in our students that benefits the world, at large.

F) Students have a right to feel joy when learning.
should follow rules because they care about human beings and want to get along with them, NOT because they are simply afraid to get in trouble. We as Parentsshould strive for a higher level of morality in our students that benefits the world, at large.

F) Children have a right to feel joy when learning.

Substituting Parents and Children and you get a great idea of how children should be treated.

Denise

[beansavi]

Originally Posted by mammastar2

That's great. You'd think, given that she's only been teaching 3 years, that some of this might have sunk in with dd's first grade teacher....:

Same with my dd's teacher. Heck, even those that have been teaching for 35 years are required to take several courses to renew their license every 5 years... so they know the new attitudes and strategies...but it is up tothem to actually use these... and to their their principals to make sure they are using these new techniques.

[AngelBee]

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