classroom demographics - Page 2

[hellyaellen]

[i don't have much to say but ... will she be able to mix with other kids who are not necessarily in her class at recess or lunch? if so then the specific ratio in her class might be tempered by that.

[sadie_sabot]

Originally Posted by boysrus

What is your neighborhood school like?

they don't really do neighborhood schools here; you submit a list of your top 7 choices in the entire city, and then there's a lottery. We actually got our first choice, and would have been happy there, but liked this school a bit better because, well, one hour each of dance, music, AND art, every single week? project based learning in a (semi) public school? small, diverse (I thought)?

sigh.

Anyway, though, today they had the school wide community meeting, and I noticed that the other kindegarten class is still majority white but a lot more kids of color, maybe almost half? And the school as a whole has a lot more racial diversity; although I did notice that while there are a lot of african american kids in the upper grades (the school is k - 8) there are not so many in the lower grades; the african american population in this city is dwindling due to gentrification, AND the african american kids are de facto mostly segregated into the less desired schools. so, to me, having a decent african american population in the school is different than having a diverse student body *except* african americans.

[sadie_sabot]

Originally Posted by hellyaellen

[i don't have much to say but ... will she be able to mix with other kids who are not necessarily in her class at recess or lunch? if so then the specific ratio in her class might be tempered by that.

I'm still not sure; I do know that she'll be wioth a bunch of kids from other classes in the after school program, so, that should be good.

[EFmom]

Originally Posted by sadie_sabot

they don't really do neighborhood schools here; you submit a list of your top 7 choices in the entire city, and then there's a lottery. We actually got our first choice, and would have been happy there, but liked this school a bit better because, well, one hour each of dance, music, AND art, every single week? project based learning in a (semi) public school? small, diverse (I thought)?

sigh.

Anyway, though, today they had the school wide community meeting, and I noticed that the other kindegarten class is still majority white but a lot more kids of color, maybe almost half? And the school as a whole has a lot more racial diversity; although I did notice that while there are a lot of african american kids in the upper grades (the school is k - 8) there are not so many in the lower grades; the african american population in this city is dwindling due to gentrification, AND the african american kids are de facto mostly segregated into the less desired schools. so, to me, having a decent african american population in the school is different than having a diverse student body *except* african americans.

Now I'm really confused, but for me that's not unusual! If everybody makes a request for their top 7 schools, I'm not sure how the segregation is taking place. Do you think that the school officials are deliberately giving African Americans the poorer schools? Or are you talking about your district getting "whiter" compared to other districts in your area?

[sadie_sabot]

the district is not getting whiter but it is getting less black...but the majority of white children with economic privilege in this city don't go to public schools.

but with the lottery, the way the segregation plays out is, fiorst of all, white and clas sprivileged asian folks don't want to send their kids to school in the southeast part of the city; and those schools are less requested but the folks who live there maybe want their kid to go to a "better" school but also wanttheir kid to be able to walk there, so that's one factor; the other factor is that socioeconomic status plays out in how people request schools. If you don't submit a list to the lottery, you get assigned a school, and of course you get assigned to a school with openings...which means a school nothighly requested.

It's crazy, I think the lottery is supposed to desegregate the schools, but it doesn't work. I'm sure folks more familiar with the district could offer more ideas on why, but the truth is, african american kids are mostly segregated to a handful of schools; latino kids as well, although they are in high demand for language immersion...that is, the white folks want their kids in spanish immersion programs, which only work if half the kids' first language is spanish, so a lot of latino kids benefit second hand from the white desire for spanish language...I'd be real interested to see what effect being in psanish immersion has on the spanish speaking kid's ability to learn english and learn more generally. but that's a whole nother issue.

Anyway, though, white flight from the public schools has lead to asituation where there is very little funding, so schools only get programs like art, phys ed, music, etc, if the parents are organized to fundraise, which means schools with a high population from poorer communities have less resources and become less desireable, which keeps them that way. I think the system here is just screwy.

[Missy]

I'm bumping this up because 1. I think it's a serious concern because a lot of school systems are now considering lotteries, etc... so these are things that should be considered, and 2. I want to know how Sadie's feeling now about her daughter's classroom situation.

This is not the same as forcing friendships, as someone had suggested. It's not the same as seeking out a black family to befriend just because they are black. When I first started elementary school, there were two black kids in the entire school and neither were in my grade level. I had a friend who lived in the nearby city whose best friend was black and so sometimes--a couple times a year--I'd play with her. My dad was close with one of his co-workers who was black and he and his family were over sometimes, but their son was much older. So, I had no peers who were black; none of the teachers in the school were black; and, I've since learned that the principal I'd adored in first and second grade is a nasty racist. Actually, the entire county was pretty bad, and my friends came to school repeating what they heard at home and so, even though I didn't hear that crap from my parents, I absorbed it at school. And I didn't question it because it was everywhere. It wasn't until I made a few comments at home that my parents realized there was a serious problem. Because of that, we moved into the city before I finished my second grade year. They wasted no time. I was pissed as hell at the time because I didn't understand their urgency, but I get it now. My parents didn't seek out unnatural situations; they simply changed the environment and let me make my own friends. That was so much better than someone just telling me that racism is wrong. You don't internalize words the same way you do experiences. In addition to the school being close to 50% black, there were black teachers and black administrators. Even though it was even more important for my black classmates to have these role models, it was also important for me and for other white students so we wouldn't assume that the stereotypes we'd see in the media were reality. Our daily reality disproved what we saw on television.

Don't know if any of that made sense. My whole point was that Sadie has reason to question and to be concerned. She's not trying to create a false environment.

My thing is . . .the school will be giving her art, music, PE, math, and science. (HOPEFULLY they will give her LA at her level, but that remains to be seen.) It's going to be my job to fill in the gaps. School only lasts 6 hours a day, I get her for 18.

But at least 8 to 10 of those hours, maybe longer, she'll be sleeping. So you get her for 8 hours. For me, as a child, those eight hours apparently didn't cut it. Just as a general observation, not about the member who posted what I quoted, way too often I think parents underestimate how deeply school influences our children. Six waking hours, five times a week, is a long time.

[sadie_sabot]

thanks for the bump and the feedback, Missy.

I'm feeling...I don't know. My daughter is liking school a lot; I am seeing challenges. I doubt she's going to learn overt racism at this school, because it's within a progressive community and all, but...well, the 4 kids of color in ehr class are all boys and so far as I can see (i've spent a bit of time in the classroom) one of the msot disruptive boys is one of them, and two of the otehr boys of color are dealing with what seems to be some otehr challenges, not that I can say that *for sure*, but it looks that way based on behavior. SO now I'm really concerned about what she is going to learn if these boys are her primary interactions with kids of color.

I hope to haunt her afterschool program at some point because it may be that that is a more diverse situation, since the kindergartenres ar ein with 1st and 2nd graders there. But even there, there is the regular afterschool, and there are the clubs, which cpost more money. DD is in the clubs because after what we were paying for preschool, the clubs feel affordable, but I am owondering how taht braks out...who goes to the clubs (yoga, spanish, clay...) and who stays in the aftercare space.

So, I'm still feeling pretty ambivalent. I am hoping to find someone in the school I can discuss this with; there is a diversity commmittee and maybe I can go to the meetings and see who's involved and find someone who's been around longer than I ahve who shares some of my perspective who can help me place all of this into context.

I think it could be very, very easy for me...for any white parent at this school...to just "forget" about this stuff, about demographics and race, because in so many many ways the school is so awesome. But, I'm determined not to because I owe it to my kid, and to all the people she will be interacting with thoughout her life.

so...that's where I'm at with alla this.

[kama'aina mama]

I wonder of there are scholarship for the clubs. Or of there should be. That might be something you could tackle if you want to do something concrete. Another is getting you and some of your like minded confederates to form a grass roots effort to educate and assist people in understanding and exploiting the lottery system.

[sadie_sabot]

I'm defnietly thinking about if there is no scholarship, looking into creating one. As for the lottery system, oi, that's a tall order!!! Not that I'm ruling it out, mind; it''s just a massive system. parents for Public Schools actually offer tips on how to best submit your choices and whatnot so, some work is being done on that front.

[Momily]

Sadie,

Does the Parents for Public Schools program structure their workshops to accomodate the needs of familes that are low income, English Language Learners and/or families of color? What I find here is that those kinds of workshops don't take into account the needs of families -- no child care, scheduled right after work with no food available, in locations that aren't easily accessible by public transportation, advertised by email/listserve/website etc. . . Then people are suprised when the meetings are overwhelmingly middle class, and majority white.

At my school kids qualify at the beginning of the year for Free/Reduced price lunch and everything else follows from that -- how much summer school costs, the fees for afterschool clubs, how much it costs to attend the school camping trip etc . . . I think it makes a big difference that families don't have to ask over and over again for help, but just once and then it's automatically offered.

The downfall of this system is that things like the clubs have mostly the kids at both ends of the economic spectrum. The lowest income kids get scholaraships, and the middle class and upper class kids pay the tuition, but for the families in the middle it can be a stretch.

[kama'aina mama]

So... is the afterschool situation any better than her classroom?

[sadie_sabot]

I don't know for sure, I only pick here up one day a week. It does seem to be a touch more racially diverse, but it's also kind of a wild scene, with kindergartenrs in therewith first and second graders, yowsa! I missed the first diversity committee meeting due to fever, but am hoping to join in with them and see what they do, how theys ee their weork, etc.

I'm not going to pull her form this school, but I do want to figure out ways to sort of make up for the low level of racial diversity somehow. maybe some other extra cirricular activities soemwhewre else??

[kama'aina mama]

That's a good idea. And yeah.. there's no match for an afterschool program teeming with kids. Half the time i can barely pick my own kid out of the crowd. I try to warn friends who pick her up for me but there's just no preparing!