EC Etiquette - Page 2

[mamamook]

ITA with everyone who mentioned being respectful of other people's feelings and DC's privacy.

I EC'd my 3 y.o DD (graduate at 23 mos.) and we took her pretty much anywhere that was convenient. Then, when she became more independent, we had to train her that the potty is where pee-pees and poo-poos go. So, now with DS (4 weeks old), he exclusively gets held over the potty. I will be buying a bblp for travel and nighttime, but we're hoping he will know that the potty is the place once he can get there on his own.

[astrophe27]

We EC'd ours and never carried tubs around.

Also never bothered with sinks -- the toilet is right next to it. So we aimed her there. Same in public restrooms -- into the toilet.

When stuck, we'd put a CPF inside a plastic bag in the car, aim her in that, tie up the bag and wash when we got home.

A.

[Arwyn]

Part of me gets the etiquette thing, and part of me thinks this is like the NIP discussion - "yea, I NIP, but it's only polite to not do it in front of anyone who would mind, and I always be sure to cover up."

Now, NIPing is different, because that's eating, and is appropriate anywhere and anywhen, and this is elimination, which is, y'know, not. But I do think babies get different rules. They can't wait as long to eat or to pee. When they need it now, they need it now, not when the other houseguest is done with the bathroom.

Re: sinks, yes, the toilet is right there (except when I'm peeing baby in the kitchen, 'cause it's across the house from the bathroom), but it's a heck of a lot lower. I'm tall. That hurts. I do it at other people's houses, and in public unless it's a single restroom, but it's not comfy. Either I'm partially squatting or leaning over, which hurts, or I'm fully squatting and Naked Baby is within grabbing distance of the toilet lip (or I'm standing, and pee goes everywhere). Talk about unsanitary. No thank you.

Honestly, I think we as a society need to chill just a little about baby pee. Yes, we can and should be reasonable and sanitary when possible, but we should also be reasonable about expected levels of sanitation. And we should also acknowledge that we each have different expectations, and that's OK.

[EdnaMarie]

Okay, I have a strong opinion about this.

Baby pee is generally, in and of itself, pretty clean. In fact you can drink most people's pee and not get sick. Not only have there been lab tests but people have also done it in emergency situations. The computer I'm on sucks (this is the third time I've written this post) but if you look it up, you will find scientific proof of this.

However, poop is not clean. The reason poop smells so bad (and the less related and more different a person is to you, the more it will smell, guaranteed) is because it is dangerous. It's a kind of instinct. Your own poop does not smell as bad to you because it's not too dangerous, but even a baby's poop, if it's not your baby, should smell bad. There are all kinds of bacteria and so on that could cause disease (and often do).

Now, here's the catch(es). Have you ever heard of strange traditions of far-away cultures in which someone uses the pee of a baby boy to do whatever?

THere's a reason it's usually from a boy.

The girl pee might go over her anus and thus will be less sterile. I'm not trying to be sexist- it's just a biological fact.

Plus, of course, there's the rogue poops (when we thought we were getting a pee but a poop came out) and the splash.

Having your baby eliminate in a separate room, in a special container that will not be mixed with the dishes, not a matter of etiquette. It's a matter of hygiene, by which I mean sanitation, by which I mean, health.

I appreciate the NIP analogy- I'm not going to have my kid poop on herself just because pooping in a toilet freaks someone out. But there is absolutely no argument that NIPing can endanger people's health. I think there's a strong argument that a child defecating in the eating quarters of another family, or washing elimination containers in the same water as food containers, increases (however slightly) the risk of disease.

[eastmillcreekmama]

Interesting thread...well, I posted about accidentally leaving our container behind at a party. We felt pretty bad about that. At the time, our pottying practice was to tote the potty around because a) our DD was too little to hold pee for long b) many of our hosts/friends don't have indoor bathrooms and c) it was winter and too cold outside to potty our little girl. Now that she is older, however, we are more comfy with outdoors, even in the cold, and she can hold it longer.

My big sticking point here is public restrooms. The baby changing stations are usually out in the open, which means if you undress your child and then venture into a stall, your belongings are unattended, leaving risk of theft. Public toilets in our area are VERY unclean, and my DD has a knack for grabbing at them and touching them! And I agree with PP that bending over to aim appropriately is painful and difficult! The sink is at the right height, and the same few bacteria from their anus will be the same ones on your hands after we use the toilet as adults going into the sink. I'm just not so worried about it. I don't touch the sink when I wash my hands anyway, and I don't think other people do either. A public restroom is, well, public, and dirty, and I practice very careful washing, and touching of door handles, etc. after using it.

[rumi]

funny stories!
we took our BBLP everywhere so that dd would have her familiar potty (and so that I could go at the same time). We never used sinks except at home but I think she (mentally) outgrew the sink pretty fast.

Now that just sits on a toilet seat I kind of miss her having her own because now I first put TP on the toilet seat if we go to public restroom. But of course it is less work than carrying around the potty.

None of this really pertains to the etiquette question. But I was pleasantly surprised when we missed while in the library and the librarian just said, "oh" like it was no biggie, as I was cleaning and apologizing. I wouldnt want the tables turned though ... kwim?

[Da WIC Lady]

I'm kinda new to the world of EC, but aren't there fold out potty seats that fit over regular seats? Would those be easier than a seperate potty?

Anna

[arizonawillow]

I think EC definitely has a bad reputation due to the media coverage this past week. I think it's disrespectful and rude to pee your baby in a public sink.

I'm a little more relaxed about taking a baby/toddler pee outside when it would be inappropriate for an older child or adult but I think indoors, pee and poo should go in the toilet.

I don't think it works to compare it with nursing in public... I guess if you want to be public about it you could leave the stall door open; I've done that when pottying a baby because sometimes there's hardly room to shut it and I'm not worried about modesty. But I think the vast majority of non-ECing folk are going to be at least offended if not totally disgusted by seeing a baby pee in a public sink.

[Ruthla]

ITA. It's not about whether or not it's actually sanitary to pee a baby in a public sink- it's about making other people comfortable if they walk into the restroom while your baby is doing his/her thing. Some people won't care, and some people will be completely freaked out by it.

If the baby can't wait, I think it would make sense to have the baby use the potty on the bathroom floor or on the baby changing station- then empty the potty into a toilet when one becomes available. Is that unrealistic? I've never ECed a baby so my potty-learning experience is limited to 3yos sitting on the regular toilet, with or without a potty seat.

You can't compare ECing a baby to NIP. I'm disgusted when NIP is compared to urinating in public. EC IS about urinating in public!

[Da WIC Lady]

Originally Posted by Ruthla

ITA. It's not about whether or not it's actually sanitary to pee a baby in a public sink- it's about making other people comfortable if they walk into the restroom while your baby is doing his/her thing. Some people won't care, and some people will be completely freaked out by it.

If the baby can't wait, I think it would make sense to have the baby use the potty on the bathroom floor or on the baby changing station- then empty the potty into a toilet when one becomes available. Is that unrealistic? I've never ECed a baby so my potty-learning experience is limited to 3yos sitting on the regular toilet, with or without a potty seat.

You can't compare ECing a baby to NIP. I'm disgusted when NIP is compared to urinating in public. EC IS about urinating in public!

: Being tuned into your baby's needs is awesome no matter how you go about it. I'd be kinda grossed out about babies peeing in the sink, or otherwise obviously in public. Nursing in public is another matter. I hate it when people compare eating to toileting. I generally am pretty tolerant when it comes to other people's parenting decisions, but if I saw a parenting toileting their child at any age just wherever I'd be moved to speak up about teaching their child where it's appropriate to go. I do limited EC with DD because I can't be home all the time and I had never heard of it until she was well over a year old. I'm thinking about trying it from the start with the new DC, but since I'll be going back to work, I don't know how well it will work in the long run.

Anna

[Arwyn]

This is the only aspect of this conversation that I think compares with NIP:

Originally Posted by Ruthla

It's not about whether or not it's actually sanitary to pee a baby in a public sink- it's about making other people comfortable if they walk into the restroom while your baby is doing his/her thing. Some people won't care, and some people will be completely freaked out by it.

If it's just about other people being freaked out, I really don't care. I'm taking care of my baby and myself in the best way I know how, and really that should be what matters, just like with NIP. Unlike with NIP, there is a sanitation issue, and while I disagree with some others on where lines should be drawn, I completely respect those opinions and am willing to listen to that argument. Lines should be drawn somewhere, unlike with NIP.

Gotta get to bed, maybe more later.

[rainbow_mandala]

I may take some heat for this: we've EC'd him in parking lots, right on the pavement as well as on the beach and on the side of the road. When he's gotta go, he's gotta go!

As far as holding him over a sink in a public restroom, I've done this a few times myself. I don't see any harm in it. I can't imagine anyone would run their hands inside the sink, so what does it matter? It's interesting how a lot of mainstream parents were feeling grossed out about babies ECing over sinks...I've known quite a few mainstream parents who have no qualms with picking up pacifiers that have hit the floor in a public establishment or the ground, "cleaning them off" in their mouths and then sticking them back into their baby's mouth.

[karina5]

Originally Posted by QuantumMama

I may take some heat for this: we've EC'd him in parking lots, right on the pavement as well as on the beach and on the side of the road. When he's gotta go, he's gotta go!

As far as holding him over a sink in a public restroom, I've done this a few times myself. I don't see any harm in it. I can't imagine anyone would run their hands inside the sink, so what does it matter? It's interesting how a lot of mainstream parents were feeling grossed out about babies ECing over sinks...I've known quite a few mainstream parents who have no qualms with picking up pacifiers that have hit the floor in a public establishment or the ground, "cleaning them off" in their mouths and then sticking them back into their baby's mouth.

I'm not mainstream, and I think it's gross. Nothing - not even close - to NIP. I think the putting pacifiers in mouth thing is gross, too.

Just b/c one thing is gross it doesn't negate another. I am a supporter of EC, but think it should be done respectfully. Crapping in a sink is just not respectful.

[rainbow_mandala]

Originally Posted by karina5

I am a supporter of EC, but think it should be done respectfully. Crapping in a sink is just not respectful.

If you're going to take issue with that then what about people who pee on the toilet seat or leave their pee or poop in the toilet without flushing or how about those who don't wash their hands and then their germs are on the door handle for everyone to touch as they are leaving the bathroom? Those feel, to me, to be greater displays of disrespect than simply allowing a baby to go where he's the most comfortable.

[mtn.mama]

Our six week old gets a pottytunity wherever we do a diaper change. She used the midwife's sink last week. Otherwise its in a toilet, in one of her BBLPs or on the ground. And every once in awhile, held over a diaper for discretion. I think pees and poops are different... peeing in the yard, etc. but #2 needs to be taken care of properly. With a babe, this doesn't always happen, but the amounts are tiny enough I'm not going to stress out about it.

[Arwyn]

Yea, I didn't potty him outside in the beginning 'cause I was never sure we weren't going to get poo. (I'm still not entirely sure, but the odds are much better.)

[Twwly]

Originally Posted by QuantumMama

I may take some heat for this: we've EC'd him in parking lots, right on the pavement as well as on the beach and on the side of the road. When he's gotta go, he's gotta go!

As far as holding him over a sink in a public restroom, I've done this a few times myself. I don't see any harm in it. I can't imagine anyone would run their hands inside the sink, so what does it matter?

Same here. DS loves peeing outdoors.

We potty DS over our bathroom sink. Occasionally he poops (most of his poops go in the toilet, but sometimes he sneaks one in) in the sink and I really, really don't care. I wipe it out with some TP, splash some soapy water around and that's that. Soap itself IS antibacterial, so I don't make a big fuss over what I clean the sink out with. (And studies have shown that e.coli bacteria can easily survive most "antibac" soaps anyway, there is really no difference). Whenever I clean the bathroom, I clean the sink too. It's just poop. I'm not eating it or rinsing off tonights veggies in the bathroom sink either. There's more chicken crap tracked into our house and sheep manure under my nails than DS poop in my sink. Again, it's just poop.

We travel with a potty bowl and will generally take him to the bathroom to use it. At other people's houses we use their toilet. In public restrooms we generally use the toilet, but sometimes use the sink (if all stalls are full and he's desperate), and splash it out with soapy water when finished.

I would certainly never eat out of my OWN bathroom sink, let alone a public bathroom sink. You're washing the same germs off your hands into the sink anyway, touching the faucets with those same germy hands. I have not seen current media musings about EC (I love not having TV) but from the sounds of things, EC is getting a pretty bum wrap.

(Wacka, wacka).

[karina5]

Originally Posted by QuantumMama

If you're going to take issue with that then what about people who pee on the toilet seat or leave their pee or poop in the toilet without flushing or how about those who don't wash their hands and then their germs are on the door handle for everyone to touch as they are leaving the bathroom? Those feel, to me, to be greater displays of disrespect than simply allowing a baby to go where he's the most comfortable.

LOL. I *do* have issues with that, too. Does it have to be one or the other? Or since some people are rude, then it's okay for others to be rude, too?

How about everyone just start peeing and pooping in sinks. Yeah, now THERE is a good idea! =)

[prettypixels]

Originally Posted by QuantumMama

If you're going to take issue with that then what about people who pee on the toilet seat or leave their pee or poop in the toilet without flushing or how about those who don't wash their hands and then their germs are on the door handle for everyone to touch as they are leaving the bathroom? Those feel, to me, to be greater displays of disrespect than simply allowing a baby to go where he's the most comfortable.

I completely agree that leaving urine on a toilet seat is disrespectful and I curse everyone who does it! Really! CURSES! I hate that!

BUT multiple wrongs do not make a right. Just because someone else engages in a rude and disgusting behavior, doesn't make it ok for you to engage in a rude and disgusting behavior. If a behavior is inappropriate in public (and I think having your child use a public sink as a bathroom, IS), then it is just inappropriate.

Besides, is your plan to lead by example? "GO ahead and pee on the seats! After all, my baby pees in the sink!" Ugh!

For those of you for whom leaning over the toilet is uncomfortable... um... that is your deal to manage. I am *positive* there are some creative solutions that would be right for you and don't involve your little one spraying urine all over the bathroom. Seriously.

[rainbow_mandala]

Originally Posted by prettypixels

I completely agree that leaving urine on a toilet seat is disrespectful and I curse everyone who does it! Really! CURSES! I hate that!

BUT multiple wrongs do not make a right. Just because someone else engages in a rude and disgusting behavior, doesn't make it ok for you to engage in a rude and disgusting behavior. If a behavior is inappropriate in public (and I think having your child use a public sink as a bathroom, IS), then it is just inappropriate.

Besides, is your plan to lead by example? "GO ahead and pee on the seats! After all, my baby pees in the sink!" Ugh!

For those of you for whom leaning over the toilet is uncomfortable... um... that is your deal to manage. I am *positive* there are some creative solutions that would be right for you and don't involve your little one spraying urine all over the bathroom. Seriously.

Nah, multiple wrongs don't make a right. That wasn't my point...only to illustrate that there are lots of different ways to be disrespectful, so to make a big deal out of something that I don't feel (and neither do many other people) is disrespectful seems pointless. What's the use in getting uptight about it? If you don't feel comfortable with it then don't touch the sink...if you don't like people peeing on the toilet seat then either don't use it or squat over it.

Also, my baby doesn't "spray urine all over the bathroom"...I seriously doubt any baby has done that