Really Confused

[mama_kass]

I have been reading both sides to the vax debate. Both sides seem to be telling the truth. Of course they both can't since the contradict each other. I am really confused by the information that is out there. It makes me mad that something as important as our children's health can be so confusing. I get one side that sounds very convincing only to get the other side and it is equally convincing. Am I the only one? What helped you to figure out the truth?

[Tracy]

what helped me out were..... the hard numbers.

Just how many cases of all these vax-diseases do we get here in the united states?

This is one of the hardest to find pages at the cdc… the way that I actually found this page was by accident. I had called the CDC to find out about hib cases and I got a doctor and he sent me to this page…

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/mmwr_wk.html

if you download the current issue it gives you the most uptodate stat that the cdc has on the reportable diseases by the way, the stats are at the end of the document.


also, this may or may not be helpful but I wanted to offer it to you:

http://mothering.com/discussions/sho...threadid=57794


finally, if you know anything about politics...what Eli Lily did last november during the election and the 18 million they donated and then the rider that they got attached to the homeland security bill...this rider gave them a free-ride...it meant that no one could sue eli lilly for any vaccine damages. That was it for me! Talk about covering your ass.

[hahamommy]

This topic scares and overwhelms me too! What has made my decision NOT to vax easier, was educating myself on the *worst case scenarios* for the diseases "at risk" for by not vaccinating. It's very easy to prepare for the illnesses themselves, the information is out there. What is impossible to prepare for is the complication from the vaccine itself. That information is not available and most health care practitioners are themselves in denial about the possibility. THAT scares me. My comforting mantra is "I can always vaccinate later, I can NEVER un-vaccinate!"
Hope this helps you feel better
~diana

It does reinforce my position that after DH was diagnosed with a brain tumor and I discovered the SV-40 from polio vaccines = rare cancers including brain tumors...hmmmm

[suschi]

Follow the money and you will find the answers to your questions.

Who has more to gain, the pro side or the anti side?

Christine

[PuppyFluffer]

What originally got me questioning the vax issue was my own gut feelling that is was not right to inject foreign bodies into a newborn or a small infant. I just couldn't make peace with the idea and started looking into it before I ever got pregnant. I think it has helped me to have started this questioning before I had a child.

I was the "victim" of "medical care" as a small child and I remember a good bit of it. What finally got me better was a small family doctor who diagnosed me correctly and came to my home to treat me! Those doctors are hard to find anymore.

I think of what is called health care as sickness managment. I don't really think that the medical practice, as a whole, is interested in healing people. I feel the same about higher education. Universities are businesses. It is their job to make money first, provide an education secondly. I think medicine is the same way.

Because money is the motivating factor, I have always taken a pro-active stance on my interactions with medical people. I do not necessarily believe that the best treatment will be chosen for a person firstly. I guess I'm just a rampant skeptic about medical care and my early experiences as a child have shaped my thoughts and caused me to look deeper. What I have found causes me to believe deeply that between my daughter's own body and the support I can give her thru breastfeeding and good diet...that she will come thru any illness just fine.

[BAU3]

One of the ways I reached my conclusions was by sort of playing devils advocate on each side... For every pro-vax article or item i read, I would try to refute it and I would try to find an anti-vax one......After a while the pro-vax just seems to kep repeating the same thing.... mainly"its good... its important...if you don't you're putting others at risk...(I think that mantra is the reason I became anti-vax...it made me go"wait a minute....")
Just keep reading... keep researching... and question it all... it becomes much clearer after you sort through alot of it.

[Xenogenesis]

I began studying vaccines when I discovered the sites advocating them were saying that the adverse reactions might simply be pinkness at the injection site.

I saw some that were really irate (and rude) concerning the sites advocating making informed decisions.

I went to the second set of sites to find facts, references, and researched scientific fact laid out in an easy to understand and common sense format.

They didn't rant.

They didn't rave on.

They presented themselves in a mature, respectful manner. Fully backed with references.

I began to compare the two.

I question why I found the "vaccine advocates" are in just about a complete state of denial.

And why the "other" sites are so calm and gentle and respectful of parents learning both sides and making a knowledgeable decision based on their own intelligence.

And by far, the reason I began to question vaccines was definitely the people I have seen (even here) who advocate vaccination and "guarantee" they are 100% safe, effective and that the occurance of adverse reactions is basically nil.

"Official data shows that large scale vaccination has failed to obtain any significant improvement of the diseases against which they were supposed to provide protection" - Dr. Sabin, developer of Polio vaccine.
http://www.vaclib.org/basic/quotes.htm

"My data proves that the studies used to support immunisation are so flawed that it is impossible to say if immunisation provides a net benefit to anyone or to society in general. This question can only be determined by proper studies which have never been performed. The flaw of previous studies is that there was no long term follow up and chronic toxicity was not looked at. The American Society of Microbiology has promoted my research...and thus acknowledges the need for proper studies." --John B. Classen, M.D., M.B.A.
http://www.vaclib.org/basic/quotes.htm

[naturalmama3]

What did it for me was the fact that our government protects the vaccine manufacturers and doctors from any liability from vaccine injury. They went so far as to create the national vaccine injury compensation program to compensate families with vaccine injured children with a 3 year statute of limitations. This is nuts!!! You notice there are no federal laws on vaccines...only state laws. How will the drug companies ever be motivated to research vaccine reactions if they are not held accountable for dammages, especially when the laws force you to have them? They know they are dangerous, they know they damage the immune system but they won't do thorough studies to look into it. The Hep B vaccine was studied for 5 days prior to being placed on the market! We are allowing our kids to be guinnea pigs in a huge heinous experiment! I thought we lived in a free country, not Nazi Germany! I have to ask myself, how can this be constitutional???? Dr. Sherri Tenpenny is an excellent resource--osteomed 2. Dr. Stephanie Cave's, "What your doctor may not tell you about childrens vaccinations" is a good book. I am angry as hell that I never was appropriately informed about my children's vaccine's and potential dangers by my pediatrician, that in itself is illegeal! Last month my children's ped told me she could no lomger see my children if I did not vaccinate! Goodbye! How about that one! They like to use the strong arm tactics! They won't tell you about exemptions, they just try to bully you into getting the vaccines. I wouldn't give my children msg so why would I have them injected with mercury, aluminim, formaldehyde, ethylene glycol (antifreeze)just to name a few!!!~That is a quote from a mother in Dr. Caves book...oh and suchi is so right, vaccines are a billion dollar business, do you think drug companies are going to chance hurting that revenue? I could go on for hours, it is heart breaking and we just put our blind faith in our doctor's who are trained by those drug companies....God help us.
Susan

[Stacie]

I began to question vaccines after watching my once happy baby decend into an autism abyss!!! His apgar were9 and 10.

within 7 days post vax at 21 months - he had seizures!!! major seizures. within days, he lost speach, he appeared to loose hearing, he quit being with me. Do you know how hard it is to attempt to nurse a babe and they are holding on pushing away? He screamed for days.

original dx was severe profound autism. "he will never know who you are you, never read, never ride a bike...think about finding a place to put him..." over my dead body!!!!

It is hell to watch your baby loose contact with you.

well, thanks to many therapies and chelation to pull (MERCURY) out of his body... he is coming back! We have put that little man thru hell! But he is returning. He is strong and he isa fighter! He is my hero!

[Aidensmom]

Umm, I just found stuff on lots of people quoted here.
This goes to show how you can find arguments for both sides.


http://www.minimum.com/reviews/bhcoudi4.htm

Coulter is a homeopath, not a medical doctor, which may make him more favorable.

http://healingwelldiabetes.subportal..._I/505035.html


The sabin quote, I can't find where it was said by him, and there is no record of him presenting in Italy in 1985 about vaccines that I have been able to find and verify. If anyone has a copy, please post or provide the report on the presentation in Italy.

The problem is you just have to believe what you feel is correct information. My main rule is to never believe anyone selling anything and writing articles that look scientific to push vitamins.

Otherwise, there is a wealth of information on both sides. Look at the background of the people providing the information. I like putting their name in a search and then 'biography'

Like this:

Sabin, Biography

Or

Dr. Mendelsohn, biography

if you can't find much, then add "vaccines" to the words.

I found Richard MOSKOWITZ, MD that way

http://www.minimum.com/p7/engine/auth.asp?n=285#

Contemporary author
Country: USA.
Richard Moskowitz received his B.A. from Harvard, his M.D. from New York University, and a Graduate Fellowship in Philosophy at the University of Colorado. Dr. Moskowitz has been in family practice since 1967, specializing in homeopathic medicine since 1974, and has taught and lectured widely. He has written numerous articles and monographs on homeopathy and related subjects.

http://www.vaclib.org/basic/quotes.htm quotes Moskowitz, Dr Kalokerinos, Dr. Eva Snead and Dr. Obomsawin's, like everyone else here

Like Coulter and Moskowitz, and Snead, there sure are a lot of homeopaths that don't like vaccines.

This person has a nerve to speak out against Kalokerinos after his numeous awards and published books

These facts are unknown to most medical people in the world, but then these doctors could all be part of the great conspiracy that Dr Kalokerinos claims is being run by the World Health Organisation and Save the Children Fund to use vaccination as a tool of genocide.

You can find a tribute to him and Dr Glen Dettman who is Quoted on the same site agains vaccines as Kalokerinos is.
http://www.nutri.com/wn/kt.html

I first heard about the great Dr Archie Kalokerinos from another "great", the great Dr Irwin Stone. In 1975 he introduced me to Archie's work with SIDS and convinced me to offer his book, "Every Second Child" to the public through my mail-order company (Wholesale Nutrition). Don't I wish I kept a few of those $8 Australian hard-cover copies since they now fetch, with a fine dust jacket, about $100!

Archie, and his co-worker, Dr Glen Dettman, were coming on one of their frequent lecture tours of the U.S. in 1979 and, since I was planning to put on a Vitamin C seminar about that time, Irwin Stone suggested the date should coincide with their visit, and that the goal of the seminar should be to publicize Archie's pioneer work and successes

Here is more on Dettman

Dr. Dettman commenced manufacture of injectable vitamins in his pathology premises. Subsequently, Dr Ian Dettman introduced a range of injectable Vitamin products, along with several patents concerning their production.

http://www.biologicaltherapies.com/profile.htm
_________________________________________________

http://www.ratbags.com/rsoles/comment/altmedicine.htm

Dr. Eva Snead Has her own site here:
http://drsnead.tripod.com/healing-miracles/
Another homeopath offering "HEALING MIRACLES CLINIC
WE OFFER UNIQUE, ADVANCED TREATMENTS
FOR CHRONIC DEGENERATIVE CONDITIONS, BASED ON
ALL "STATE OF THE ART" TRADITIONAL AND ALTERNATIVE SCIENCE AVAILABLE"

Has written extensively on AIDS and the conspiracy to cleanse the planet...and questions the microbe connection to diseases, and talks of how


[

I used to be in the practice of holistic medicine and chelation therapy and to those activities and dealing with vitamins and alternative methods I learned to know the wrath of the establishment.......the legend says that we were given cowpox because it has cross defence with smallpox. However, when the specimens of vaccine are investigated today that were made with the original virus, the peculiar thing is that the studies yield neither smallpox nor cowpox but a separate virus which has now been called vaccinia.....Of which, of course, the smallpox family is one of the herpes viruses

http://www.*********/vaccines/snead2.html
___________________________________________

Several people have written me asking about a Raymond Obomsawin, variously described as an MD or PhD, who writes anti-immunization materials which you can buy.
According to some websites, which I'll let you find on your own, Dr. Obomsawin was commissioned in 1992 by the Canadian International Development Agency to prepare a report to guide its immunization policy.
But when Dr. Obomsawin's report was submitted, it was suppressed by sinister conspirators. A search of the NIH database shows that Raymond Obomsawin has only one peer publication, a popular article from 1978 for Canadian nurses about Indian health issues.
If you want to believe that the Canadian government really hired this guy as an elite scientific consultant, you're free to do so. Of course, I don't know one way or the other.

http://www.pathguy.com/antiimmu.htm
If that's not confusing, then I don't know what is

As Dr. Michael Odent, Europe's leading childcare expert courts controversy by claiming fathers should never attend the birth of their children, Britain's National Childbirth Trust hits back by claiming having the father present is irrelevant if the mother is confident and happy.

http://www.ukparents.co.uk/archives/...w_father.shtml

Dr. Michael Odent has written a letter in the JAMA (1994) where his figures show a five times higher rate of asthma in pertussis immunised children compared to non-immunised children. He is also quoted in the International Vaccination Newsletter (Sept. 1994): "Immunised children have more ear infections and spend more days in hospital."

http://www.vaclib.org/basic/quotes.htm

The publication of the Medical Mafia (--Dr Lanctot MD) caused quite a stir. On its way to becoming a best seller it landed its author before the Medical Board.

After a drawn out hearing, which saw most of her witnesses set aside, not surprisingly, the verdict was unequivocal - "Guilty" for having dared to speak out. The medical establishment takes a very dim view of any member who dares to speak out, all this under the guise of protecting the public. Free speech is replaced by the party line....

Guylaine Lanctot was banned for life from practicing medicine. And if that wasn't enough, she was to pay for the expenses the establishment had incurred in bringing her to trial. Her reaction to that, as reported in one newspaper, was also unequivocal: "Over my dead body!"

http://www.davidicke.com/icke/reading/MedicalMafia.html

Punished for speaking out, but still quoted by those who don't fear the 'mainstreamers'

"Vaccination is expensive and represents a cost of one billion dollars annually. It therefore benefits the industry; most notably, the multinational manufacturers. One sells the vaccines. The other then provides the arsenal of medications to respond to the numerous complications that follow. Their profits increase while our expenses go through the roof. To the point where we have simply had it up to here and are ready to accept the unacceptable, such as socialised medicine in the United States, for example." --Dr Lanctot MD

http://www.vaclib.org/basic/quotes.htm

You can fire my butt, but the truth is out there!

Why this lethal relentlessness?
by Guylaine Lanctot, M.D.


2. Vaccination stimulates the immune system, the body's defense mechanism. Repeated, vaccination exhausts the immune system. It gives a false sense of security and, in doing so, it opens the door wide to all kinds of illnesses. Notably, to those related to AIDS, which can only develop on ripe ground, where the immune system has been disturbed. It causes AIDS to explode. It ensures that the illness flourishes perpetually.

http://www.*********/vaccines/lanctot.html

[

I used to be in the practice of holistic medicine and chelation therapy and to those activities and dealing with vitamins and alternative methods I learned to know the wrath of the establishment.

__________________________________________________ _
The Health Newsletter where Susan DeSimone is Quoted from has a little disclaimer

The Nature's Healing Newsletter is intended for information and educational purposes only. It is not intended to diagnose any ailment or prescribe any remedy. It is not meant to be a substitute for professional help. It is intended to set forth historical uses of natural remedies. A person should consult a duly approved health professional for any condition which requires their services

But she does say

Even the WHO (World Health Organisation) has admitted, disease and mortality rates in Third World countries have no direct correlation with immunisation procedures or medical treatment, but they are closely related to the standard of hygiene and diet. A 1973 issue of Scientific American revealed the same finding : that "over 90% of all contagious disease was eliminated by vastly improved water systems, sanitation, living conditions and transportation of food." Mass vaccinations did not appear on the scene until a century after the decline in infectious diseases started (1850-1940), but inoculations were, and still are given full credit. --Susan DeSimone

The products offered at the sight may be promising

http://www.inatureshealing.com/products.html
I can't get on the members page, but she is not touted as a Doc or anything. I'm sure she's good with the vitamins though.
________________________________________________

Vincent and Bioelectronics is very complex.
An objective scientific system of measuring life energy based on the Second Law of Thermodynamics was developed in France by Vincent. It is called BioElectronics of Vincent, or BEV
http://www.wizardofeyez.com/babev.html
http://www.wizardofeyez.com/index.html

Vincent, who developed this understanding, was charged with studying the safety of the drinking waters of France. His epidemiological studies showed clusters of different diseases in communities with different sources of drinking water.........
Once balance is achieved, especially in our modern world full of stress, air and water-borne chemicals, depleted soils, and processed foods, maintaining balance is an ongoing dynamic process. The educated consumer of Energetically Correct products will be alert to the need to temporarily utilize each of the product formulations under specific conditions, as well as faithfully use the general maintainence products of phase 5 which contain adaptogens and essential nutrients.

design a personal health program to support your health optimization needs at this time through this site.

B.E.V. is an exceptionally synergetic evaluation and monitoring system for homeopathy, acupuncture, Electro-Acupuncture, naturopathy and similar approaches.

http://www.oirf.com/recinstr/betasem.html

There is recent work on electrodes and water that can show why the machine really hasn't been used by anyone but homeopaths since the 1960's. Science sticks its nose up again at proof of how balance is required in the body.

Since the phenomena of electrode poisoning was not readily understood until recently, the probability that Professor Vincent encountered this factor or was even aware of its existence, is quite obtuse.....In addition to the electrode poisoning, additional factors need to be closely scrutinized before acceptance of Professor Vincent's values are generalized. The second factor that deserves investigation is temperature compensation of biological samples.

http://www.prostate90.com/sci_papers/redox.html

[Tracy]

this is a little tidbit from mothering mag.-board

http://216.92.20.151/6-0-0/html/6-3-0/6-3-0.shtml#5

Why do parents have questions about vaccines?
In 1996 there were 279 cases of hepatitis B in children under 14. In that same period 827 serious adverse reactions to the hepatitis B vaccine were reported to the government-operated Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS). On May 19, 1999 a House subcommittee met on the then mandatory hepatitis B vaccine. Following the hearing, the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) and the CDC suspended the hepatitis B vaccine for low-risk newborns.

On June 17, 1999 the CDC recommended that the injected polio vaccine replace the oral polio vaccine effective January 2000. Oral polio has been associated with 5 to 7 vaccine-related cases of polio each year. On July 7, 1999 the FDA requested that vaccine manufacturers phase in a replacement for the mercury-based preservative, thimerosal. Hepatitis b and most other vaccines contain thimerosal. On August 31, 1998 the FDA licensed the rotavirus (a type of diarrhea) vaccine, and in November the American Academy of Pediatrics (AAP) recommended three doses for infants. On July 16, 1999 the CDC withdrew its recommendation of the rotavirus vaccine due to 15 cases of bowel obstruction reported to the Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System (VAERS) between September 1, 1998 and July 7, 1999.


here are some threads from moms on these boards which may or may not be of interest.


http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...ghlight=autism


http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...ghlight=autism

http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...threadid=72846


http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...101#post655101

http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...threadid=58460

http://216.92.20.151/discussions/sho...threadid=31826

[Tracy]

.

Who has more to gain, the pro side or the anti side?

expanding on suschi's thought.


I just wanted to say, that a bit more really does need to be said about politics. I hate it. I don't want it to be about politics I wish it could just be about our children but I realized awhile ago that what is going on in D.C. does impact what happens in homes.


a bit more about the eli lily rider...

Thimerosal (pronounced thigh-MARE-uh-sol )... is made by Eli Lily.

Eli Lily CEO is on the Homeland Security Council. Former VP of Eli Lily is On Bush's cabinet.

Eli Lily gave 18 million in campaign dollars on the last election..primarily to GOP candidates...and Bill Frist got his share.

Then, in the dead of the night in October the Eli Lily bill was attached to the homeland security bill which gave them a complete 'free pass" on any vaccine reactions to any of their drugs. Virtually, the bill made it impossible for anyone to sue them for vaccine reactions.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/ac2/wp...&notFound=true

Then, in the third week of November GWB sent Attorney General John Ashcroft to seal the files in federal courts of parents who were suing Eli Lily because their children developed autism after their vaccine.
It was done during the dark week of Thanksgiving when most of washington is home for the holiday.

My opinion.....and this is just my opinion.....If Eli Lily is acting, moving and manipulating like they have a smoking gun....well, then ...I will do the mathwork. If anyone is waiting for Eli Lily to give a published report that they were wrong and they have the stats to prove it, well that is not coming. I don't even think the tobacco industry has coughed up those stats either.... someone leaked it and they lawyered up to sue him for leaking them...frankly I think Eli Lily make The tobacco industry look like a roadside fruit stand. There is no bigger, scarier business in my opinion.

just for a side note: The top grossing industries in the fortune 500 make their bushels of dough on something like a 8 percent profits. Less than ten percent. The Pharms... 18 percent! for more on them...

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/



there are plenty of people, authors, doctors, and websites discussing thimersole and autism. And of course, there is the whole measles in the guts of autistic children which brings in MMR......

I also want to say that so many politicians were disgusted by the Eli Lily Rider, including Sen. McCain who was so incensed that he even had the ba***s to vote AGAINST the homeland security bill of which this onerous rider was attached. Frankly, he knew no one could even suggest this war hero was unamerican by voting against it. So, he could vote with his conscious... this rider was hideous.

Anyway, in January, Main Sen. Olympia Snow, a moderate republican who has had her own run in with pharms...took up the cause along with several democratic senators and lobbied to get the rider disconnected from the law. It took work but they did it. However, Sen. Frist...major recipient of Eli Lily dollars for his campaign immediately responded that this rider will come back..it is his intention to do it. Sure, he has been paid enough.


And if you had the time or energy and watched the president's state of the union speech. He said very little about how he was going to fix the economy and he said little about other stuff...but he went on and on about FRIVILOUS lawsuits against doctors and Pharmaceuticals. get a copy of the speech, it is fascinating. And then he went on about aids in africa. Again, what many would say is a noble cause... if it wasn't for the fact that he is so plugged into pharms. We will be paying for those pharms to send drugs to Africa. I certainly want to help Africa, but I also see how this is benefit to his favoirte special interest group. Pharms

[Chelly2003]

I made my decision based on the fact that I didn't know enough, and at first I told myself I'd avoid the vaccines for two years..... (because you can't take them OUT once they're in - it seems safer to avoid till I know more or enough)
Its been FOUR and we're still no closer to knowing enough for me to be comfortable injecting "stuff" into my child.
He's a happy healthy little boy and god made him perfect - why mess with perfection?

Good Luck

[dswmom]

Me too!

Mama Kass, I have struggled with this issue too. My recent readings on the "pro" side has lead me to question some of the statistics I've read on the "anti" side and I just get frustrated. For example, hardly anyone is getting chicken pox anymore. This is not to say that it doesn't exist, but it is not nearly as prevalent as before vaccination. Now, this in and of itself is leading me to believe that the vaccine must really be working. I doubt it can be attributed to cleaner conditions and hygiene since I believe our communities haven't gone through some drastic environmental change.

Also, the statistics that address the percentage of those who have contracted an illness they were vacc for is bothersome, simply because percentages can get misread if you don't look at the raw data. Here's an example from the CDC website:

"In a high school of 1,000 students, none has ever had measles. All but 5 of the students have had two doses of measles vaccine, and so are fully immunized. The entire student body is exposed to measles, and every susceptible student becomes infected. The 5 unvaccinated students will be infected, of course. But of the 995 who have been vaccinated, we would expect several not to respond to the vaccine. The efficacy rate for two doses of measles vaccine can be as high as >99%. In this class, 7 students do not respond, and they, too, become infected. Therefore 7 of 12, or about 58%, of the cases occur in students who have been fully vaccinated."

See what I mean?

I have chosen to not vaccinate my son after his first round (which I only chose a couple then). The thought of all those foreign bodies being injected into his new body made me sick. And it would devastate me if he became injured by one of the vaccines so I've decided to hold off on any more. However, it doesn't mean that I don't struggle with this decision. I still wonder...what he does actually get infected with a disease and gets really, really sick. It's always possible.

I'll just keep reading, bf and praying that he stays as healthy as he has been:

[goodpapa]

THE TRUTH, dswmom...

...is very hard to find. But let me give you some personal experience to chew on.

My sons measles will go undiagnosed, although his immunity WILL be confirmed with an IgM antibody test.

Why?? Because for a pediatrician to confirm a case of measles would mean reporting that measles to local health authorities.

Attention would then be drawn to this pediatrician's allowing a child to go unvaccinated. Not very good business practice.

My son's measles was 1 week ago, caught on a plane from a very sick mother and child. I'll bet the child was vaccinated and the shots simply didn't work. Luckily for me my son now has lifelong, natural immunity to measles.


It's sooooo simple. Doctors are not only NOT looking for illnesses that are vaccinated for, but they will consciously AVOID diagnoses for these illlnesses.

I commend you for stopping vacc. after the first ones.

DO NOT FEAR ILLNESS!

Research on building the immune system. Read other posts on probiotics on recent threads here.

Fever is an important part of the human immune system.

Do your homework for the sake of your child's immune system,
and for starters get your family OFF of regular meats--move to anti-biotic and hormone free meats and GO ORGANIC as much as possible.


the revolution will not be televised,


Ray

[mama_kass]

Thank you Thank you for your responces! I appreciate the time and passion that has been put into these posts. Thank you for your direction. There is a lot to read I'll keep you all updated on how my research is going.

I have been reading and will continue to do so. I just wish that the FACTS were available to everyone. We as parents should not have to go on a scavenger hunt to find the facts.

Now I have a couple more questions. What happens when you tell the ped "No, we are not getting shots" Are there any legal issues? I mean, could CPS call me one day and tell me that I'm being investigated for neglect because I refussed vax?

Also, what do you do about putting your kids in school? I have looked into the law in MD and children must be fully vaxed to attend. I remember when my ds was going to go into school he did not have the chicken pox vax. Even knowing nothing about the problems with the vax I just thought that it was unnecessary to keep a child from getting chicken pox. They made me get him vaxxed.

So I guess I'm asking for direction as to how to handle professionals and the law.

[MoonLissa]

Mama-kass...almost every state has exemption laws. There is no federal law that says you must vaccinate. For schooling, check to see that there is a religious or philosophical exemption in place. Hold your ground, though. It's often a challenge to get that information.

Keep reading for sure. An excellent book that helped me make my decision is "The Vaccine Guide" by Randall Newstaedter who is a OMD and a homepath. It is written for the lay person, well researched and contains information on how each vaccine works, what it's purpose is, adverse reactions and information in general on laws and exemptions.

I happened to stumble upon a print article a few years ago that discussed how the chicken pox was developed under corporate pressure on pharm companies. (Sorry! Cannot recall the source, though I would love to have the article handy to quote directly!) Corporations were losing too many worker hours to parents needing to stay home for a lengthy illness such a chicken pox. That is the FIRST and largest reason for it's development. I halted all thoughts about vaccination while I researched. So far, ds (3.5yo) has had NONE and #2 will have none until we travel to foreign places, and that will require some more reseach, I'm sure.

Many have said it...you can ALWAYS vaccinate, but you cannot UN-vaccinate.

Stay strong and firm in your research. Yes, there is a lot of information out there and it is definitely overwhelming at first. That is why I suggest Neustaedter's book. It's a great start.

Keep us informed. There is lots of support here.

Best,

^^Liss

[Chelly2003]

As for school, I'm lucky being in CA, they have the philosophical exemtion, all I have to do is sign the back of the vaccination card and I write "EXEMPT" on it - I've never had a problem at all.

As for visits to the doctor, my son has only been twice, once for his two week check up and once at 2 years old when he had a high fever (105) - we did some well baby visits with the midwives who gave me my prenatal care, and we only did that up to about a year.
At my son's visit when he was 2, the question on vax never even came up - they just assumed he was fully vaxed, told me it was "probably" an ear infection and prescribed a antibiotic, which I didn't get. THe doctor got annoyed with me when I asked if the high fever could be making his ear red and not the other way round, he said well we could use the anti biotics or NOT, and then hussled himself out the door - all in all a waste of our $10 co-pay.

As far as traveling - I took my son to Africa when he was 2 years old and was never asked about his status on vax. There were no outbreaks or anything before or after we were there.