My 5yo is being beat up!

[mattemma04]

I just found out yesterday when I picked the kids up that my 5yo ds has be hit,pushed,knocked down daily at recess time. I only know because my other child saw him being bothered,so I probed till I got some names and details.

I called the school and had the K teacher call me back.She is not outside during recess time.She wrote down the names(had only first names and the table they sit at).She says one boy is always in time outs,and she is not suprised.Said she will keep an eye on him(in class),and mention the issue to the recess aides.She did say there was just not enough aides to keep an eye on the kids,so ds is not really safe at recess. Ds says there has not been issues in the class,but at recess he gets sought out/chased by the boys in question.He asked them to stop,and they resufed saying they like doing these things to him. I am steaming mad!

So what do I do? What can I do? Should I stay after I drop the kids off this am and talk to the principal?S hould they have an incident form or something that I should have filled out/copied,so we have proof of progress(or the lack of it)?
Is it out of line to ask the principal to talk to the boys,and put a little fear into them? What is the typical punishment for children hurting others?Grandma says in the least the boys should lose recess.Shoot,my dd lost recess time if she did not complete a worksheet in time,so why not lose it for hurting others no?

My first inclination is to pull my child out of school,but no one wants me too. So I have to work with staff to resolve this and make sure my son is safe and happy.I swear though that if nothing gets done I will remove him.

I am not *sue happy* but what legal steps can I take against the school,abusers,and abuser parents if my child keeps getting hurt?

[RachelGS]

Are you kidding??????? The teacher told you there isn't enough supervision to keep your five year old safe???? I'd be in the principal's office yesterday if not sooner, and no way in hell would I let that go.

[Melda]

OMG ... i am so sorry your having to go through this ... you have every right to be STEAMING!! I hope that you can nip this in the bud very quickly ....

Melda

[kathymuggle]

I am so sorry this is happenning to your DS

Does you Ds have friends at school? Loners tend to be an easier target. Also...if he is hanging out with a friend, when he is being picked on, he has a witness. My experience with schools is that:

a) they expect the victum to tell
b) If the teacher did not see the incident, and the perp denies it, a witness can make the difference betweeen the bullies getting in trouble and the issue being dropped.

Go to the principal. You can insist they keep your son safe. I think there may be something called the "safe Schools" act. Be firm, but friendly.

Document all infractions.

This MAY be a fixable problem...or it may not. IMNSHO, if you seem to be going down the path of "my child is always being picked on, and there is little the school can or will do about it", then it is time to consider homeschooling. I have met children who have been picked on and bullied for years, they are very sad people and have to endure what no-one should have to endure.

Kathy

[mattemma04]

Thanks for the input. Today makes the 7th day of school.No serious friendships have formed for my 5yo. I will look up safe schools.

I wrote a follow up letter to my ds's teacher restating everything I mentioned yesterday on the phone,and letting her know I would talk to the principal.My daughter witnessed the boys bothering him,and she told me otherwise I would never have known.Ds always just said his day was *ok*. My dd now knows to tell her recess aide when she sees anything happenning to her brother.The grades are seperated,so she can not always see her brother.Whether or not the aide does anything I will still be following up with the principal each and every time.

I also pointed out to the teacher that my son is now afraid to go to school knowing he will get *beat up* and this may affect his behavior in the classroom setting(shut down in learning/shyness). I hesitated but stated that I would not tolerate one more incident of a child hurting mine,because the other children have a harder time grasping proper social behavior. Sorry,but my little one is not the whipping boy for others.My son says one boy is 6,so he has had an extra year already to know how to act.

Sadly many are already saying my boy needs to toughen up,stand up for himself,beat them up.He is not the type to do any of these things.I will be lucky if he even tells an adult when he gets abused. I also feel like the adults are already trying to find excuses such as the abuser * likes to chase* or *maybe he was insigated* aka: your son brought it upon himself.

I did go to the office after dropping the kids off,but the principal was out.Left a message with the secretary.He called a bit ago.Said he spoke with my son,and had him point out the 2 boys.They were spoken to,and the recess aide was notified of the issue.I am to let him know if anything happens again.
Beyond having them stay in from recess I am not sure what other punishments I can expect if anytrhing else happens. I will certainly find out.I am not sure if they are documenting,but I sure am.

As for recess aides there really is just one parent aide per grade.K has around 70-75 kids.

Honestly I don't get how my family can just expect me to send him off each day knowing someone might hurt him.As if a shove,hit,or knock down means little so long as ds remains in public school. I don't know about others but I would really get depressed if I knew I might face those things each day.

Time to go research this issue and see what laws after in place to protect my child.

[supervee]

Hugs, mama.

I was beat up several times in elementary, older age though. This is what I wish my parents had done:

- Taken me out of school immediately, that day, until the problem was solved.
- Conferenced with my teacher immediately, to determine the extent of my safety at school.
- Switched classrooms, because the teacher egged this on.
- Filed a school incidence report to be filed with the school district, and followed through with it to the highest level necessary.
- Filed a police report.
- Gone to the doctor for a medical exam (I had related dental issues years later).
- Sued both the school and the parents.
- Enrolled me in therapy, yes, to include some bully-proofing.

Sorry for the hard line, but you can probably sense the ongoing anger I have at my parents for having done basically nothing. Please, show your son that you are on his side (I know you are, or you wouldn't be asking, but make sure he perceives that, too) and make him know that it won't happen again.

I am not sue happy either, but there's a line which shouldn't be crossed.

(My son was punched in the stomach in preschool, and we came down very swiftly, and it didn't happen again.)

I do not believe in the "toughen up" approach. In my case, the kids doing it were so abused at home, so unsupervised, that they were much tougher than I could have ever become. Not to mention, I don't want "tough" kids.

[oceanbaby]

Is there any way you can volunteer to be an aide at recess?

I don't know what to say. These kinds of things make me crazy. I asked a lot about this stuff when we were doing school tours, and I was not very thrilled at the answers I got. I am not at all in favor of the idea of making it his responsibility to defend himself. He's 5!!!!

As far as homeschooling, what do you mean "no one else wants you to?" Do you mean school officials? Or do you mean your partner? Cuz really, only the other parent's opinion is important. Everyone else can stuff it.

[Maggieinnh]

Originally Posted by oceanbaby

As far as homeschooling, what do you mean "no one else wants you to?" Do you mean school officials? Or do you mean your partner? Cuz really, only the other parent's opinion is important. Everyone else can stuff it.

Not even that!!!
If it comes down to my child's safety, the only importance is HIS SAFETY! At age 5 what kind of a parent or family member expects him to defend himself??? :

I would go pretty much with what supervee suggested! Especially the police report, ...as this way the school can not hush their inability under the carpet!
Please do not just note down each incident from now on, I'd say ONE more incident and I take the poor kid out, with all the follow up problem making possible for that school. After all how many children will have to go through this scenario before somebody does something about this! Your son will not be the last child those kids will pick on unless they are stopped!

[tammyswanson]

If the 'aides' can't watch that many kids, doesn't that make it a safety issue? Sounds like they are being lazy and do not care! I remember being picked on in grade school by a huge kid, however I did fight back and after I hit him a few times he left me alone. I remember clearly looking for 'help' from an adult, and seeing the (lazy a**) teacher 'aide' sitting her butt on a swing, staring off into space. I didn't run to her, I instead fought off this big jerk of a boy. After I hit him with both hands clenched into a fist in the stomach, he left me alone. BUT, the ganging up thing is too much, especially every day! Plus he can't fight all of them at once, right? Sounds like your principal needs to get an earful, at the very least. This is also a liability issue, don't you think? Make sure to tell him that, and say what will happen since this is bad for your son. Plus what if they really hurt him bad??? WTH?!?!? What is wrong with them.

I'd also enroll him in karate or self defense, but then again I always wanted to learn that myself.

[rabrog]

Originally Posted by RachelGS

Are you kidding??????? The teacher told you there isn't enough supervision to keep your five year old safe???? I'd be in the principal's office yesterday if not sooner, and no way in hell would I let that go.

ITA

Also, if you don't get satisfactory action from the school, is there any way you can find out last names and parents of these kids? I'd be on their doorstep, making sure THEY knew what their kids were doing at school. I guarentee those children did not go home and tell Mommy and Daddy that the principal talked to them.

I know not all parents care these days, but if I found out my kid were hurting someone at school, I'd be mortified, apologizing all over myself and there would be some appropriate discipline at home. That is not acceptable.

Jenn

[Maggieinnh]

Originally Posted by rabrog

I know not all parents care these days, but if I found out my kid were hurting someone at school, I'd be mortified, apologizing all over myself and there would be some appropriate discipline at home. That is not acceptable.

Jenn

I am not so sure if talking to the parents would help, as kids that do things like that, "just out of fun", which they said they do, I think they must have learned that from somewhere!
I'd be careful showing up at those parents house, ...not that you get beaten up in the end!

[CarrieMF]

The school should have an Behaviour Plan/Policy, do you know what it is? You may be able to look it up online. Does the school division have a Bully Policy/Program?

Here there are 250 kids in the school, there are 2 teachers who walk the school grounds on supervision. There are also 2 Aides who are with specific students(1 each). Kids can come to them, but those Aides can't leave the child they are with.

In addition to the steps you've taken involving the staff, talk to your son about going to an adult IF something happens again.

Which grades are divided? Is it possible for him to go to a kid in his section who is older?

If your son is not really playing with other kids at recess, see if the teacher can set up Recess Buddies.

[KJoslyn78]

Originally Posted by supervee

Hugs, mama.

I was beat up several times in elementary, older age though. This is what I wish my parents had done:

- Taken me out of school immediately, that day, until the problem was solved.
- Conferenced with my teacher immediately, to determine the extent of my safety at school.
- Switched classrooms, because the teacher egged this on.
- Filed a school incidence report to be filed with the school district, and followed through with it to the highest level necessary.
- Filed a police report.
- Gone to the doctor for a medical exam (I had related dental issues years later).
- Sued both the school and the parents.
- Enrolled me in therapy, yes, to include some bully-proofing.

Sorry for the hard line, but you can probably sense the ongoing anger I have at my parents for having done basically nothing. Please, show your son that you are on his side (I know you are, or you wouldn't be asking, but make sure he perceives that, too) and make him know that it won't happen again.

I am not sue happy either, but there's a line which shouldn't be crossed.

(My son was punched in the stomach in preschool, and we came down very swiftly, and it didn't happen again.)

I do not believe in the "toughen up" approach. In my case, the kids doing it were so abused at home, so unsupervised, that they were much tougher than I could have ever become. Not to mention, I don't want "tough" kids.

as a former "verbal punching bag" i totally agree with all of the above. the bullying i received contributed to a LOT of problems i had as a teen, and still do today (ex. i was called Shamoo, even after i was anorexic).

[joensally]

I don't know what jurisdiction you're in, but here's what I'd do in my district.
1. Talk to the teacher;
2. Talk to the principal, and mention the word "liability." This doesn't mean you're litigious, it just reminds him/her that he has accountabilities;
3. Ask if they have a school-based team to work with the kids who are struggling with their own behaviour management (in this case, the bullies);
4. Ask if they have an anti-bullying policy, what it is, and how they enforce it;
5. If not satisfied with the answers to the above, and if I didn't have a reasonable belief that they had an action strategy that would largely reduce or eliminate the likelihood of it happening again with these particular children and my child, and a plan to help my FIVE year old feel safe at school, I would:
6. Inform the principal that I was going to the district and parent advisory committee, and follow with a dated letter and email to this effect which itemizes the incidents and the efforts I'd made to date to rectify the situation locally;
7. Go to the district - phone call plus letter to the district, attaching the letter sent to the principal, and go to the PAC president or parent liaison.




That should about do it . If it doesn't - well, frankly, the district is hopeless and I'd have my child attend school elsewhere, whether home or another school (a different principal can lead an entirely different school culture, regardless of the district administrators).

I cannot abide bullying, and no lower elementary school student should be left to deal with this, or suck it up, or toughen up. Puhleez.

If you google bullying, there's a tonne of information. And the book The Bully, The Bullied and the Bystander does a great job of outlining the negative impact for everyone involved (including the bully) and offers strategies to deal with preventing bullying and supporting the subjects of it.

[GearGirl]

: .

[beatrixmum]

I feel so badly for you and your little one. Really, 5 is so little he needs and deserves protection. Can you keep him at home until the school comes up with a real solution? It sounds terribly understaffed. Is there really a ratio of 1 adult to 70 children?! That doesn't sound right. I worked in a kindergarten last year and we had to keep a 1 to 10 ratio (in Vermont). This situation doesn't sound safe for any child.

This is serious. Have the perps parents been notified? They (parents) may be liable for battery.

[Momily]

I am so sorry this is happening to your little one!

I can completely understand if you do decide to pull him, but that's a complicated decision, and I can decide trying to stick it out as well.

1) Definitely talk to the principal, talk to the school counselor, talk to the teacher again. Make it really clear that this is not acceptable to you, and that you expect them to come up with strategies -- if they can't think of any you can suggest separating the boys in some way, whether it's by keeping the offenders inside, having the kids play in mixed age groups (since it sounds like they have more than one playspace if you're daughter is also ut but can't get to him), having staff supervision (it always boggles my mind that they allow this job to be done by volunteers), recruiting more volunteers, directly teaching social skills to the kids, etc . . .

2) If at all possible, I'd be on that playground for a while watching, and jumping in if need be.

3) Practice strategies with your son. Play close to the aide, tell the aide, if you won't tell the aide, then when something happens say "Stop, I don't like that" in your loudest voice -- hopefully the aide will hear you, find a group of other kids to play with and promise to stick up for each other (sticking up may mean finding an adult).

4) Work on strengthening your child's friendship with other kids -- kids are more likely to pick on someone who is alone.

5) Don't neccessarily assume that the other kids parents are "abusers" or deserve to be charge for "battery". Instead reach out to them as potential allies -- give them a call, invite them over for coffee (having the kids play under close supervision might even be a good thing, give them a chance to build a relationship), and brainstorm together. My son's friend went through a phase when he was like this. His parents are the nicest, most gentle parents in the world, but until they knew what was going on they didn't do anything to change it -- he was the youngest at home so they didn't see the behavior there.

Good luck!

[famousmockngbrd]

I agree that something needs to be done to protect your little boy, and clearly there is not enough supervision going on at school. However, I think the "'perps" are being villified in a way that is not appropriate for 5 year olds. They are being classified as "bullies" and I don't think that's fair for a Kindergartner. These kids *all* need help, and pointing fingers and labeling and blaming is not helping anyone to grow into the people we would like them to be.

JMHO.

[MCatLvrMom2A&X]

The schools here have a zero tolerance policy even for kids in K if they hurt or bully others they are expelled and proper steps are taken to get them the help they need to understand what is unacceptable.

[joensally]

Originally Posted by famousmockngbrd

I agree that something needs to be done to protect your little boy, and clearly there is not enough supervision going on at school. However, I think the "'perps" are being villified in a way that is not appropriate for 5 year olds. They are being classified as "bullies" and I don't think that's fair for a Kindergartner. These kids *all* need help, and pointing fingers and labeling and blaming is not helping anyone to grow into the people we would like them to be.

JMHO.

I'm not villifying the miscreants (LOL), in fact I posted above:

3. Ask if they have a school-based team to work with the kids who are struggling with their own behaviour management (in this case, the bullies);

In fact, my son struggles to control his emotions and actions at times (he's just started kindie). He is NOT a bully, but I can see some event in the future where his conduct is not okay and we need to have some kind of group discussion at school . As his parent, I would be mortified to find out that he was being conditioned within his school environment to believe that sort of thing was ok or normal, and to adopt that role in his peer group. School-based teams are there to smooth the rough edges that normal redirection and coaching can't handle.

Whether the bully knows (say at 7) or doesn't know (say at 5) that their behaviour constitutes bullying, it needs to be called what it is so it can be dealt with head on. I should not have called them "the bullies" above, but their behaviour is by definition bullying. From the OP's description, this isn't boys behaving impulsively - this is deliberate and seeking a negative reaction.