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Leaving sleeping children in the car for under 3 minutes - Page 9

post #161 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meg Murry. View Post
If she puts my child or children at risk by leaving them in a car unattended for anything except an unforeseeable emergency? Absolutely, I would fire her. And no, I am not particularly moved by the factor of being in a foreign country. Moving here, I presume, was her choice. If I am hiring a servant to be a paid substitute parent to my child, I expect that that person do so responsibly and exercise good judgment. That is why I am paying them. If she wishes to risk her own children's safety, that is her decision. If she risks my children's, I can no longer trust that her judgment is reliable and her decisions are responsible.



It's odd to me that you keep using the term "servant." It seems like a very demeaning word.
post #162 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by lisa49 View Post
...and what happens when those armed robbers leave the store and need a getaway car? hmmm?
I'm not really worried about armed robbers at my tiny country store. The only time anyone has attempted to rob it, they were stopped quickly by all of the old men that hang around and carry their own guns. I have left dd in the car to pay for gas (no pay at the pump here), but the car is always locked and off. Plus most of the time one of the old men come and talk to her, so I guess she is not really alone. I do realize that an armed robber could take out all of the armed men standing around, rob the store, then break into my car and use it to escape, but honestly, I think my dd is in more danger in our front yard from copperheads. We have found three so far, and these snakes are hard to spot. I guess I could refuse to let her play outside, but I don't live my life in fear. I am cautious, but not fearful of every unthinkable thing that might happen.
post #163 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by karina5 View Post
It's odd to me that you keep using the term "servant." It seems like a very demeaning word.
Sorry, would you prefer "wage-encouraged nonfamilial child caregiver"?
I'm not fond of euphemisms. They disguise inequities.
post #164 of 407
What about employee?
post #165 of 407
too OT to fit in here, actually...sorry to delete.
Lisa
post #166 of 407
This discussion reminds me of a funny situation several years ago.....

We used to live WAY out in the country. The only store/gas station within 20 miles was this tiny little one pump store. It gets very "winter" here and although I know it is quite dangerous, most people would fill their gas tanks with the car still running. One night (pre-dd) dh and I were driving home from work. It was dark and very snowy. We were getting low on gas so dh pulled into this little store. We had not lived there long and did not know it was an unspoken rule that as soon as you filled your tank, you should pull up to free the pump for the next person, then go pay. So I am sitting in the car with it running at the pump while dh goes in to pay. I am not really paying attention to anything and all of a sudden some strange guy hops in the driver's seat and starts to drive. I FREAKED! I startled the poor guy half to death. He had not noticed that I was in the car (I was huddled down due to the cold) and was just pulling it forward to make room for his car at the pump. After having lived there a while, we found this was the custom. If someone left their car at the pump and was inside, it was OK to pull their car forward. What a shocker. I call it my little brush with "carjacking".

That store also had it's collection of little old men....but without guns I think. I too used to ask one of them to keep an eye on a sleeping dd when I went in to pay. Not everyone in the world is out to get you. Really.
post #167 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by the_lissa View Post
What about employee?
Servant is more precise in this context:

Servant 1. A personal or domestic attendant; one whose duty is to wait upon his master or mistress, or do certain work in his or her household. (The usual sense when no other is indicated by the context; sometimes with defining word, as domestic servant.)

Employee a. [B]A person employed for wages; = EMPLOYÉ, which it has now virtually superseded. b. (nonce-use.) Something that is employed.

Au pair Applied to an arrangement between two parties by which mutual domestic services are rendered formerly without consideration of money payment; esp. of a young girl learning the language of a foreign country while rendering certain services in return for hospitality. Also attrib. Hence as n., a person who is ‘au pair’.

All of the following are from the Oxford English Dictionary, BTW. By definition, an au pair does not work for wages; ergo, she is not an employee, but a domestic servant.
post #168 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by lisa49 View Post
If you've ever worked trying to help illegal immigrants, especially live-in nanny's than you'd know that the term "servant" is probably more accurate:
Lisa
This also factored into my choice generally, though I know nothing of how the OP treats her au pair specifically and I am assuming she treats her appropriately and well.
post #169 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meg Murry. View Post
Sorry, would you prefer "wage-encouraged nonfamilial child caregiver"?
I'm not fond of euphemisms. They disguise inequities.



How about Nanny or Au Pair?

I don't think it's a euphemism…it just doesn't sound very respectful. There are lots of words we use that are more respectful than others. Most of us would say "person of color" instead of "colored person" and someone could argue that's a euphemism as well.
post #170 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meg Murry. View Post
Sorry, would you prefer "wage-encouraged nonfamilial child caregiver"?
I'm not fond of euphemisms. They disguise inequities.

What about child care provider?
post #171 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meg Murry. View Post
This also factored into my choice generally, though I know nothing of how the OP treats her au pair specifically and I am assuming she treats her appropriately and well.
ah, you got me before I deleted.....oops.
post #172 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeBeans View Post
I should point out to the whiner mcwhinersons who are snarking, "oh, you'd have a bill for breaking a window and i'd press charges for kidnapping!"

What would actually happen if you took your eyes off your child long enough for a strange person to approach your car, look inside and see unattended children, see if they were awake/old enough to open the door, then hem and haw about what to do, then look around one last time to see if any adult was in the immediate area, then find something to smash in a window, then smash in said window, then remove children from unfamiliar carseats, is that the police would arrest you for child abandonment and would laugh at your attempted vandalism charges. As would any judge.
If you are going to address someone, just do it. Passive aggressive snark is not attractive. Also, I though name calling was against the UA?

If you would've read my other post you would've noticed that I mentioned no one would get so far breaking a window, much less actually taking my kids out of their seats.

Also, because it is NOT illegal to leave my kids in a locked car in my view for a few minutes, and breaking a window and attempting to remove unknown kids from an unknown car where they are in no danger IS illegal, your assessment as to what a police officer and/or judge would do is laughable, at best.
post #173 of 407
While I wouldn't have yelled at the au pair, I would certainly called the cops if she hadn't been out in short order. And let her know that.
post #174 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissingMinnesota View Post

Also, because it is NOT illegal to leave my kids in a locked car in my view for a few minutes, and breaking a window and attempting to remove unknown kids from an unknown car where they are in no danger IS illegal, your assessment as to what a police officer and/or judge would do is laughable, at best.
Methinks you don't know very much about child neglect laws. Let me explain it simply. Just because there is no law SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSING leaving children alone in the car does not mean it is not illegal to neglect children by leaving them unattended.

It is also not illegal to stick your child up a tree and leave it there for days on end whilst occasionally flinging nuts and berries at it and encouraging it to sip water off of the leaves, but it would still be considered child neglect. Which is illegal. Do you understand?
post #175 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeBeans View Post
Methinks you don't know very much about child neglect laws. Let me explain it simply. Just because there is no law SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSING leaving children alone in the car does not mean it is not illegal to neglect children by leaving them unattended.

It is also not illegal to stick your child up a tree and leave it there for days on end whilst occasionally flinging nuts and berries at it and encouraging it to sip water off of the leaves, but it would still be considered child neglect. Which is illegal. Do you understand?
There IS a law specifically addressing leaving children unattended in a car. Have you read ANY of my posts?

If running into a gas station with my locked car in full view for 3-5 minutes is classified as "neglect" I would hate to know what they consider taking a shower, or doing dishes while my kids play in the next room is.
post #176 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeBeans View Post
Methinks you don't know very much about child neglect laws. Let me explain it simply. Just because there is no law SPECIFICALLY ADDRESSING leaving children alone in the car does not mean it is not illegal to neglect children by leaving them unattended.

It is also not illegal to stick your child up a tree and leave it there for days on end whilst occasionally flinging nuts and berries at it and encouraging it to sip water off of the leaves, but it would still be considered child neglect. Which is illegal. Do you understand?
Okay...but I don;t think that leaving your child in a car that is in plain sight for 2 minutes is viewed as neglect...at least not where I live.

And abandoning your child in a tree is illegal where I live. Maybe I just live in very rational city??
post #177 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by dubfam View Post

And abandoning your child in a tree is illegal where I live. Maybe I just live in very rational city??
They actually made a law about that?



I just realized there are two threads about the same subject. Suddenly I'm a lot less confused.
post #178 of 407
This thread has kept me entertained this morning--and I should be pulling weeds right now--but there's no way this will ever be settled on these boards. Parents who would never leave their child(ren) in the car won't change their minds because of comments made here about fear, and those of us who feel comfortable with it in certain situations probably won't stop because someone else "would never under any circumstances." Not that it's not a fascinating discussion, but I highly doubt anyone is going to be convinced to "switch sides" here.

But I will probably keep reading... But later, weeds await...
post #179 of 407
Quote:
Originally Posted by ThreeBeans View Post
They actually made a law about that?



I just realized there are two threads about the same subject. Suddenly I'm a lot less confused.
oooohh! there's a tree-abandonment thread, too! Where is it?
post #180 of 407
at woobysma
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