I saw a botched circ

[ErinsJuneBug]

:Puke

I work as a medical assistant in a pediatrics office - and I kind of knew that this day would come

The 5 day baby came in to urgent care for "constantly crying, and not eating." When I took his diaper off to get a rectal temp I saw the problem - it was a massacre. His penis was all red and bloody and scabbed and looked REALLY bad....the parents asked "is that normal"

"The doctor will be in to take a look in a minute" was all I could say...

The doctor went in and told me that it was very badly infected and may need reconstructive surgery, and out of my mouth came something like "hardly seems worth it to ruin a man’s sex life because his mommy thinks his penis will look better if a part is chopped off." :

OOPS...the doctor went off on me about how they are responsible parents and sometimes bad things just happen. And they are Jewish so it is extremely inappropriate for me to be judging them based on a religious practice and that a bris is something that is vital to their culture...bla bla bla.

But then I got home and thought - the baby was only 5 days old. Isn’t the bris at 8 days? I totally think the doctor was trying to play off that the botched circ was done by a rabbi rather than a doctor...

Poor baby.

[Frootloop]

Ugh, poor little one
You know, I'm sure it's a big no no to judge patients' parents or whoever, but really, I commend you for saying what you did It's probably a really good thing that I don't work in the medical field.. I have an issue saying things without thinking them through. I would probably get myself into trouble somehow.

And yes, I'm pretty sure that a bris is done on the 8th day. It sounds like the doc was attempting to protect his fellow man

[MCatLvrMom2A&X]

[mammal_mama]

My midwife is opposed to circ -- but did attend a circumcision of one of her Jewish clients. And she was amazed that the rabbi did it so well, the baby didn't even cry.

I have a feeling more circumcisions are botched by docs than by rabbis. The rabbi is totally focused on this one thing, and it's a whole ceremony with lots of witnesses ... for a doctor in a busy maternity ward, a circumcision is just one task in the midst of a very busy shift, done in a little room with maybe one assistant (?) ... I don't know any stats but a circ in a hospital seems way more risky than a Jewish circumcision.

I wouldn't be so sure that baby was circumcised because "his mommy thought his penis would look better" that way. Most mothers are just following the advice of their doctors. I'm not saying that absolves them of their parental responsibility -- just that a blind faith is kind of encouraged by the medical establishment, many of us were schooled that way from an early age, and sometimes it takes things like this to wake us up and make us say, "Never again."

[CherryBomb]

Honestly? The number one reason I hear from women for circing is "I think uncirced penises are gross."

Sigh.

And yeah, I'm pretty sure the bris is done after 8 healthy days of life, so, correct if I'm wrong, wouldn't it be invalid? I know a lot of people who are culturally Jewish who think having the doctor do it in the hospital counts.

[Frootloop]

Originally Posted by CherryBomb

Honestly? The number one reason I hear from women for circing is "I think uncirced penises are gross."

Sigh.

And yeah, I'm pretty sure the bris is done after 8 healthy days of life, so, correct if I'm wrong, wouldn't it be invalid? I know a lot of people who are culturally Jewish who think having the doctor do it in the hospital counts.

I've read many circ debates online and have seen where many women have said that. And as horrible as it feels to admit it, I used to be one of the women who thought the same thing, BUT, I'd never even seen one! With many of the women that have said this, I've read later on where they've also admitted to never seeing one. Most of the "ew" factor is all heresay, that's it. They heard another woman say it and there ya go

[phdmama06]

Originally Posted by Frootloop

With many of the women that have said this, I've read later on where they've also admitted to never seeing one. Most of the "ew" factor is all heresay, that's it. They heard another woman say it and there ya go

: I think a lot of women may just be a little (lot?) afraid of what they don't know, so they give the whole bit about intact men being "disgusting."

I'm so sorry to hear about this little boy's botched circ, and I would have been biting my tongue not to say anything. If I worked in pediatrics and had to deal with cases like this, over time, I'm not sure how well I'd be able to keep my views to myself.

As far as I know, a bris isn't done until at least 8 days after birth, and sometimes it is later if the baby has a low birth weight or has health issues that need to be resolved first. One of my friend's DS didn't have it until nearly a month old because he was only 4 1/2 pounds at birth.

[Bm31]

A lot of women AND men both are culturally brainwashed to wrinkle their nose to the thought of an intact penis. To me it's even worse among the cut men because they HAVE to believe they got something "better" out of it, even if it defies all logic.

But yeah, doctors are completely conditioned to cover each others' backs as a "professional courtesy," much like what often happens among law enforcement types. After being circ'd as an infant, then re-circ'd and having a new pee hole cut for meatal stenosis, my penis was seen by at least three other doctors. Not ONCE did any of them ever admit it was botched by the circ's, though it obviously was; it wasn't like I took a knife to it myself. Even this year, all these years later, my urologist wouldn't directly come out and admit it, but he took a look at it and said, "That's too bad that happened, but at least it looks like you can pee ok." Yeah, like that's all I'm concerned about. :

I think another part of it is that so many penises have been mutilated that they really don't KNOW what a normal penis is. All the scarring, side effects and complications of circ. have come to be seen as "normal" variations of the penis....or at least the cut penis. The sad part is, once the immedate scarring on this poor kid heals up the doctors will probably be all "hush, hush" and reassure the parents everything is "normal." :

I feel really bad for this child; he's the one that will have to live with his parents' ignorance.

[Papai]

: :

The medical community would love to make you believe that things like this don't happen. What a shame. How is this NOT genital mutilation? How is this any different from FGM? Because it's a boy?

[kldliam]

guts to speak out!

Erinsjunebug: The doctor went in and told me that it was very badly infected and may need reconstructive surgery, and out of my mouth came something like "hardly seems worth it to ruin a man’s sex life because his mommy thinks his penis will look better if a part is chopped off.

GOOD FOR YOU!!!

[nikihodges]

[QUOTE=CherryBomb;9263793]Honestly? The number one reason I hear from women for circing is "I think uncirced penises are gross."

Sigh.

:

[rabbitmum]

I have never seen a circed penis and I hope I never see one. Poor little boy.

[kblackstone444]

Only 5 days old and in need of reconstructive surgery. :

[hakunangovi]

ErinsJuneBug, I applaud you for speaking out. As other pps have pointed out, that doctor was covering his associate's a$$. However I would hope that your comment might make him think about the situation afterwards.

[ErinsJuneBug]

Thanks everyone for the kind words - I am looked less nicely upon by the girls at work. I just can’t understand how people DONT GET IT. One girl argued the "it was sad, but you could die driving in a car and sometimes bad things just happen."

I've been having a lot of issues at work recently - and I’m really starting to regret the career path I have chosen. I'm almost done with nursing school and I feel like my life right now is a big hypocrisy. I don’t vax my child, yet give immunizations every day...I would never circ a son, but cannot talk to parents about the risks of circ (only the doctor can do that because it is such a "sensitive issue").... and during my maternity rotation I helped administer pit all the time, AROM and watch wayyyy too many unnecessary c-sections.

This is not what I thought being a nurse was going to be like.

Sorry for the vent, it’s just really all wearing on me, yk? I really appreciate the support ladies; at least I know I’m not the only crazy one who thinks cutting of a newborns penis is not preferable and "OK."

-Erin

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by ErinsJuneBug

This is not what I thought being a nurse was going to be like.

Really? Surely you realized the medical system promotes circumcision, vaccination, and a whole host of other unnecessary and often harmful interventions?

I'm not saying this means you've chosen the wrong career. On behalf of those of us who sometimes need to use the medical system, I wish there were more nurses like you.

I'm just surprised you're so surprised that your comment didn't go over well. After all, those parents were "following medical advice" without question, as "good little parents" are supposed to do. No one (steeped in a medicalized world-view) would ever criticize them for THAT.

I hope you'll come back to update us regarding how things go with your job, or if you decide to make a change. I've heard that sometimes ER is the best place to get good experience, because all day long you're handling people who really are sick or injured, which means you get to focus on helping them get better, rather than doing stuff to interfere with perfectly healthy bodies.

Of course, I imagine the hours would be less agreeable than Dr.'s office hours.

[blsilva]

I knew a mom once who was a nurse in the maternity ward. She had homebirths, and did not immunize. In fact, she did not ever take her kids to the dr unless they were very ill. I don't know if she circed or not as I never thought to ask at the time.
She still enjoyed the job, but thought differently about it for herself. We always thought it was a bit ironic.

[mammal_mama]

Originally Posted by blsilva

I knew a mom once who was a nurse in the maternity ward. She had homebirths, and did not immunize. In fact, she did not ever take her kids to the dr unless they were very ill. I don't know if she circed or not as I never thought to ask at the time.
She still enjoyed the job, but thought differently about it for herself. We always thought it was a bit ironic.

But what a blessing to the mothers who had babies in her care! I wonder how free she was to share her personal decisions with those who were interested?

[phatchristy]

You know, you will find your place.

I have a friend who is an RN who works L/D. She'd rather be at home with her three young kiddos, but her DH is unemployed right now so she needs to work. She's had two of her three at home (those two unassisted) the first was a hospital transfer while in transition and babe was fine. She doesn't vaccinate, breastfeeds (even tandemed three I believe) and of course she lets her son keep their whole penis.

She is a valuable resource for the moms there. Whenver a mom comes in expressing a strong desire for a natural birth/breastfeeding they generally assign her to them. She's kept QUITE a few moms out of unnecessary cesareans, helped educate moms about circ and breastfeeding.

It's a different situation now that you're a student....it will change and you will find your place.

[blsilva]

Originally Posted by mammal_mama

But what a blessing to the mothers who had babies in her care! I wonder how free she was to share her personal decisions with those who were interested?

She seemed pretty free with the info when I knew her, but she had been there a while, didn't really need the job, and didn't seem to care what her superiors thought. Nice position to be in, but not everyone is in that position.