or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Pregnancy and Birth › Birth and Beyond › how offensive is this tee-shirt?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

how offensive is this tee-shirt? - Page 3

post #41 of 113
I had an obviously drug free home birth with my second after a hospital transfer and epidural with my first.

Of course I am proud, and I have every right to be, but I don't think being proud equates calling other women names or belittling their experiences.
post #42 of 113
Quote:
I had an obviously drug free home birth with my second after a hospital transfer and epidural with my first.

Of course I am proud, and I have every right to be, but I don't think being proud equates calling other women names or belittling their experiences.
agreed --

to me

"I make milk what is your super power" is phrased as a POSITIVE, not a negivits of not doing something else.

so to me shirts that say "birthed at home without drugs" are not offisive .. they are phrased in a pos light.

however a shirt that is derogotory to fourmal or in this case to a medical intervention -- i have an issue with -- as there are too many variables ....

Aimee
post #43 of 113
I would never wear a shirt like that. It reeks of judgement and a crummy, belittling attitude towards others. I did NOT have an epidural, but the last eight hours of my labor were absolutely excruciating. I can see how a woman would want to avoid that and very legitimately choose the risks/benefits of an epi over the experience I had. I ended up with mild PTSD, solely due to the impact of the extreme pain I experienced for hours on end.

I think when a woman is ready for an epidural or whether she wants one or not is her own decision. I think a woman choosing an epidural because "everyone else does" or "why make myself suffer" would look at the shirt and thinks, "Wow, that's stupid." But a woman who tried to hold out, and was pressured into an epidural or decided to have one during a really difficult part of her labor would probably feel hurt and belittled. In other words, I'm not sure who the audience is for the shirt, but I feel it would have minimal positive impact and possibly a big negative impact.

I'm still planning a NCB for #2, but I completely understand why women would choose an epidural and I would not belittle anyone for making that choice (I might be sad/disappointed if the choice was not an informed one, but that's a different issue).
post #44 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by stellimamo View Post
I think epidurals are scary personaly. A huge long needle into my spine... not for the faint of heart.
:
I've had three c-sections. My last two were under spinal, and if it weren't for wanting dh to be there, I think I would have begged for a general instead. Needles in my spine completely freak me out.
post #45 of 113
Maybe I am being a little sensitive to the issue but I had a spinal (same diff in my eyes) because I need one for my second c\s. I know my situation is different because it was an emergency c\s but I feel belittled by the comment considering three of my 5 births were natural and 2 were emerg c\s.

For those who did not choose to have an epidural or spinal it may be offensive.
post #46 of 113
I've seen that shirt before.
I didn't have any medication and don't ever want to, but that is pretty stupid and mean.
post #47 of 113
You know, I had a client not long ago choose an epidural after 28 hours of hard labor. I also know her family personally and she said something to me like "I feel so bad wimping out like this, I know you never had an epidural for any of your kids." (I don't advertise this to my clients, I just know her personally also so she knows my history.) I pointed out to her that she had already labored longer than I had for all 4 kids put together!! She'd made it through the equivalent of all 4 of my own labors put together, plus another 8 hours! I told her if she'd had my labors, she would have already been holding her baby for nearly a whole day, and not considering some much needed pain relief out of sheer exhaustion and inability to go on. She got that epidural, slept for a few hours while continuing to progress slowly, and then pushed out her 1st baby - 10 lbs and 14 oz.
This client was not in any way, anything remotely less than an amazing, powerful, strong woman.
That T-shirt is beyond offensive, and definitely plays up division and pettiness. I never had an epidural, or wanted one, but I would never wear such a thing.
post #48 of 113
What good comes out of wearing a shirt like that?

Does it educate? No.

Does it entertain? Not really. If it does it's really only at the expense of women like those who've been mentioned (the comment on the mamas who choose not to feel the labor for a late loss particularly makes me wish this shirt had never been printed). I'm sure the people who've printed that shirt didn't intend to insult, degrade, or belittle those of us who've gone through a medically necessary c/s or had medicated births for any reason, but it I think it does.

I think it's insensitive to the complexity of the choices women make and the situations that many women find themselves in either by their own doing or others'. I recognize all the aspects of my situation that allowed me to have a natural birth in a hospital that many women don't have the luxury of (education, supportive DH and caregiver, positive hospital policy, etc). It wasn't b/c I'm not a sissy as the shirt would claim.
post #49 of 113
i had an energency medically necessary c-section at 35 weeks due to pre-eclampsia. i am still heartbroken that i never got to go into labour let alone have the option of having a natural childbirth. i find this t-shirt to be hurtful and belittling.
post #50 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by gwerydd View Post
i had an energency medically necessary c-section at 35 weeks due to pre-eclampsia. i am still heartbroken that i never got to go into labour let alone have the option of having a natural childbirth. i find this t-shirt to be hurtful and belittling.


This is kind of how I am too...not that it isn't an accomplishment to have an unmedicated birth, because it it. So mamas who did it, be proud! OTOH, I'd love to be lucky enough to get the chance to try for it. My body seems not to know how to carry a baby to term and grow him or her nice and chubby. It happened in my first pregnancy and is happening again now.

I'm sitting here right now trying to come to terms with the reality that I will possibly never get to experience labor and that I am very likely going to end up having another unwanted CS with a barely-term (if I am lucky), small-for-dates, fragile little baby who will then have trouble breastfeeding, who will be at risk for RSV, who will not fit into all the little cute little CDs I bought for him...

Uh...sorry. Got off on a rant there! My point is, it's not always the easier way out to go not-natural. I guess it just gets to me sometimes that I know how hard this all is (CS, nearly-preemie), because I've done it before. I am pretty much at a place finally where I don't feel like a failure personally because of this.

So yeah. I guess some of us (like me) are bringing some baggage to this conversation. But it helps a lot to see how many of the mamas here who did give birth naturally also feel that the shirt isn't funny and is potentially hurtful. I'm not in a place where it hurts me anymore, but I can see how it would have hurt me a year ago. And the pretty strong feelings against the shirt here affirm that most mamas are not walking around feeling superior to people like me. That makes me feel good!
post #51 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by annettemarie View Post
I don't find it offensive so much as petty. With all the work to be done empowering women, why stoop to third-grade insults? Not to mention that whole "sissies" thing.
Yeah, I don't like the whole "I'm better than you" attitude of the shirt. Especially when it comes to such a sacred subject as birth. Why not go for something more positive?
post #52 of 113
I'd laugh if someone who bought it ended up having one. I'm all for natural child birth and I'd never want an epidural. I think on rare occasions a "tough" women might need one for the health and safety of her baby.
post #53 of 113
I'm a huge homebirth (and natural childbirth) advocate and I I find the shirt very self-righteous and mean. You're not going to win any converts by putting people down and making yourself look like an a$$. ITA w/the posters who said it is not wimpy to lay still while someone sticks a huge needle in your back! I would be a big wimp about that for sure.

Quote:
Originally Posted by washforestlion View Post
I'd laugh if someone who bought it ended up having one.
Now THAT would be funny!
post #54 of 113
I'm offended and I've never had an epidural. Its one thing to be proud of your decisions and experiences, but another thing to judge someone else. :
post #55 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by fourlittlebirds View Post

Second, women get epidurals because they're necessary to allow them to relax, or because they're not educated and don't understand the risks, or because they don't have support for a natural birth and are psychologically undermined every step of the way (something that is very hard to deal with in the midst of labor,) or because the pain truly is torturous. Even if the goal is to prove something, none of the above is about being a "wimp". And until you've been through excruciating pain that made you feel like you were being drawn-and-quartered, you are not in a position to judge. If you have, you'll get it: people who think the only women who get epidurals are princesses who can't bear to break a nail in labor, just weren't pushed far enough to their breaking point. Trust me, there is one.


I had an epi for my first after 44 hours of labor - yes - there is a breaking point!

And yes - it is offending!
post #56 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by meisterfrau View Post


This is kind of how I am too...not that it isn't an accomplishment to have an unmedicated birth, because it it. So mamas who did it, be proud! OTOH, I'd love to be lucky enough to get the chance to try for it. My body seems not to know how to carry a baby to term and grow him or her nice and chubby. It happened in my first pregnancy and is happening again now.

I'm sitting here right now trying to come to terms with the reality that I will possibly never get to experience labor and that I am very likely going to end up having another unwanted CS with a barely-term (if I am lucky), small-for-dates, fragile little baby who will then have trouble breastfeeding, who will be at risk for RSV, who will not fit into all the little cute little CDs I bought for him...

Uh...sorry. Got off on a rant there! My point is, it's not always the easier way out to go not-natural. I guess it just gets to me sometimes that I know how hard this all is (CS, nearly-preemie), because I've done it before. I am pretty much at a place finally where I don't feel like a failure personally because of this.

So yeah. I guess some of us (like me) are bringing some baggage to this conversation. But it helps a lot to see how many of the mamas here who did give birth naturally also feel that the shirt isn't funny and is potentially hurtful. I'm not in a place where it hurts me anymore, but I can see how it would have hurt me a year ago. And the pretty strong feelings against the shirt here affirm that most mamas are not walking around feeling superior to people like me. That makes me feel good!
You left me in tears because you worded my thoughts and feelings completely the way I could not. You hit it right directly on the head of the nail with this post. Thank you so much for posting.
post #57 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheal View Post
You left me in tears because you worded my thoughts and feelings completely the way I could not. You hit it right directly on the head of the nail with this post. Thank you so much for posting.
Sheal
post #58 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by Da WIC Lady View Post
I don't understand. Why should it be that a natural physiological process should be painful outside of complications? I'm now firmly convinced that everyone should read the works of Dr. Grantly Dick-Read.

Anna
Well, the Bible answers that one...After the fall of man...Genesis 3:16 To the woman he [God] said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children."
post #59 of 113
So does that mean people who have little pain or pain free births are just really good people?
post #60 of 113
Quote:
Originally Posted by ssolberg99 View Post
Well, the Bible answers that one...After the fall of man...Genesis 3:16 To the woman he [God] said, "I will greatly increase your pains in childbearing; with pain you will give birth to children."
But the bible doesn't answer anything for me. I'm sure plenty of people here don't follow the bible at all either. Honestly, I don't like much of anything men write about chlidbirth. I really hate that quote. Sounds like a punishment. Yes, it's hard work. Yes, it can hurt (badly sometimes!) but it is a beautiful experience and a gift men could never understand. Even the ones who wrote in your bible.
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Birth and Beyond
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Pregnancy and Birth › Birth and Beyond › how offensive is this tee-shirt?