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If you experience an urge to spank, what do you do?  

post #1 of 19
Thread Starter 
I'm asking humbly for help here, so please be gentle in your suggestions.

I spanked my 4.2 year old today. It isn't the first time, but it's the first time in a very long time (over a year, and before then it was three other times). I really thought I had gotten a handle on it. But I guess I was wrong.

We are going through a very rough patch with sibling rivalry lately. I posted about it a few days ago and the suggestion was that DS1 is frustrated and that just as I must advocate for my pre-verbal 2 year old (who is getting the brunt of it from the 4 yo), so too do I have to advocate for my 4 yo. I really heard that and took it to heart and have been doing this. What I've noticed is that even when I can help DS1 deal with his frustration over little brother's direct actions, he (DS1) often gets pissy and aggressive (verbally and physically) toward DS2 just b/c he is in a bad mood -- i.e. having nothing to do with DS2.

This is what happened today. He was mad/having a tantrum b/c I told him it was time to come inside. He'd been abusing our flowers repeatedly and I told him that if he couldn't play gently (yes, we modeled, redirected, etc. etc.) then we'd have to come inside. I don't see this as punishment, but prevention. Unfortunately, DS1 takes it as a punishment and that sends him into a tizzy. When he kicked his ball intentionally into the flowers again, I told him, in a very upbeat (i.e. not brow-beating) manner, "Ok, time to go inside." He flipped, started running and screaming hysterically. I scooped him up and carried him gently inside; he was beside himself. I suggested that he hit a pillow if he needed to "get it out". That was a no go. I suggested that we sit and read, or that he go up to his quiet corner (stuffies, books that he loves, etc) to calm down. None of these things abated his hysterics; he was past the point of talking -- one of those totally out-of-control tantrums. He started growling at DS2, I told him to stop. I said I know he is angry, but he can't take it out on DS2. I said, Tell me how mad you are. Growl at me, I said. He started lunging toward DS2, I tried to scoop him (DS2) up/out of the way, but I was too late. DS1 scratched his back and then kicked him very hard (he fell down and cut his lip). I totally snapped. I just turned him around and spanked his bum, hard. : Then I told him to go upstairs (shouted really). He screamed NOOOOOO! and I told him to do it or I'd spank him again. : He was shocked, and sore (rubbing his tush) but went upstairs. I went up about 2 minutes later, after I cleaned up DS2's mouth and woke up my DH, who was napping, to look after him.

I apologized immediately. I told him that I lost my temper and I acted in a terrible way. I told him that no one should hit him, most especially not his mommy. I promised him that I would try my best never to do this again. Then I started discussing his behavior; I reminded him that he can't take his anger out on his brother, that he isn't his punching bag. I told him I want to help him learn to 'hold himself' when he is that angry. And he said "You didn't hold yourself when you spanked me." : Oy. What could I say? I told him he was right. That I set a terrible example for him, but that I still wanted to try to help him get better control over his anger so that he doesn't hurt people when he's mad. I felt like the biggest hypocrite.

So that's it. We brainstormed a bit about things he could do when he was feeling angry. I asked him to think about it more and we'd talk again about it tomorrow.

Now I am left dealing with my part of this, which is how do I control these urges that I have to spank my child. I try to acknowledge it and let it pass through me, without acting on it (of course), but today, there was literally no time. I saw my younger son falling to the ground and I was reacting totally on instinct. For me, DS1's aggression, and particularly when it is directed toward DS2, is my trigger.

So, I'm asking: What do you do? When you have that urge, how do you reign yourself in? And, how do you work toward curbing that urge altogether? FTR, it isn't helpful to tell me, just commit to never hitting your child again. I do that. I *am* committed to never hitting my child. This isn't a disciplinary tactic; this is a total fight-or-flight gut instinct (awful, awful) reaction.

(And I know that DH and I need to strategize on how to better handle the sibling rivalry issues, but right now my concern is getting control over myself.)

Please help.
post #2 of 19
I just don't. I bite my lips until they bleed if need be. I'd ask myself, "Would I hit partner? My grandmother? My mother who has aggravated the hell out of me far more than any child? The dinkwad who runs a red light and side -swipes my car?" What would I think of an adult who hits people? I remind myself that just because I have power over a child doesn't mean it's permissable to use/abuse that power. It's good you apologized (now you just move on); we can't expect more from a little one than we can manage ourselves.

My adivce when you are in the moment is to stop trying to 'reason'. Stop trying to verbally direct. No amount of talking can bring a child 'down' in most cases. Leave the room with the harming child as clamly as you can. Be proactive and get in there. Change the scene. Don't try to make a point and teach anything at that moment. Scoop up the tantruming child...don't expect they can follow your verbal commands. The more you talk, the more they feel the need to escalate the verbal sparring. A crying child needs your physical presence-- at least to move her to a safer place.
post #3 of 19
Quote:
FTR, it isn't helpful to tell me, just commit to never hitting your child again. I do that. I *am* committed to never hitting my child. This isn't a disciplinary tactic; this is a total fight-or-flight gut instinct (awful, awful) reaction.
Hugs. I especially understand this, but for me it's yelling. I know in the moment that I shouldn't be doing it, and I'm committed to not doing it, but I still do it.

What is most helpful to me is to really try, in the moment, to get behind ds's eyes and feel what he's feeling. To really and truly empathize with him. This can be very difficult in the moment, so I try to get there before it gets too heated.. I also take long, slow, very deep breaths. Sometimes I have to walk away for a few moments. I practice in my head when I'm calm, so I can be in the habit of reacting the way I want to.

I would really encourage you to avoid these situations. Can you see, from reading your own post, how this situation escalated? It started off a small thing and grew to the point where neither of you had a hold on your emotions. Focus on dissipating these situations, rather than escalating them. I would much rather see a child kicking a ball into a flower bed, even if it ruined all the flowers, than I would see a child get hit, (and I'm sure you would, too.)

You're doing good. We all have tough moments. For me, not yelling was something I had to get in the habit of. Practice, practice. And the next time your ds is raging, remember how you felt just before you spanked him, and remember that your ds is feeling just as frustrated as you were then.

Good luck.
post #4 of 19
Well as a former spanker who was spanked I can totally understand where you are coming from as far as that urge to spank. My kids are almost 14 years apart so while I don't have sibling rivalry to deal with, I have a very high spirited 2 yo dd who can push my buttons. This compounded with the fact that I never get a full night's sleep and haven't had one in about 28 mos sometimes has me real close to the edge.

That said, I think what keeps me from not spanking is a belief that it just doesn't work and it breaks the bond between parent and child. I don't want my dd to ever feel the way I did when I was getting spanked, I have talked to my eldest who is almost 16 and while I only spanked him less than 5 times when he was little he remembers and hearing him talk about it only reinforced to me why I can never let it happen again.

So in those moments when dd is raging and pushing my buttons I will either walk away if dh is around and can take over or I have us take a time in as I call it when I sit next to her and just hug her and talk. Hard to explain but it works or I will ask her to sit down and think for a moment while I am next to her.

Sounds like your eldest is having a rough time, you also.

Shay
post #5 of 19
Could you maybe make it a thing you're doing together? In other words, how about talking together about what each of you can do to manage their temper when it gets tough. Maybe if he sees it's a team effort, something you're working on together, it will be easier.

But I have no experience with this sort of thing, so feel free to discard anything I say. :P
post #6 of 19
Maryjane Wow, what a tough situation. I totally understand the 'mama bear' instinct when it comes to protecting your little ones, especially if you know it's been a problem before, and you are on your guard about it. I don't have the urge to hit but I do have the urge to yell, say things I don't mean, ect. When I feel this welling up inside, I have to get alone. I know in this situation, it wasn't entirely possible, since you have the little one to comfort. I think in that situation, I would put all my energy in calming down the baby. Really really focus on that. Don't deal with the older kid until you are calmer. When possible (when kids are safe, ect) walk away. Take a deep, very SLOOOOOWWW breath. I need to do this a few times. And they need to be slow. Like almost uncomfortable yoga breathing slow. I need to calm my racing heart a little. I think in this situation, it was almost (almost) unavoidable, since it was a reaction, not something you planned to do. It's still not ok, of course, but you know that, you are working on it, and most importantly, you talked to your ds about it. I think as you work with him on his own anger, you will also be able to see things you can do for your anger. I think this is actually a good thing for both of you to go through together. Sometimes, we forget just how hard it is to control ourselves, and we ask it of our kids all the time. Sometimes when I'm yelling at dd to "CHILL OUT AND LAY DOWN AND GO TO SLEEP!!!" I look at myself and feel terrible. It's only happened a couple of times, but still, it's a stinging reminder of how hard it is for little ones. HTH
post #7 of 19
Have a plan. And then, in that snap second when you could choose to spank, think: "I have a plan of what to do when this feeling happens!" and then implement that plan. The plan could be to gently lift the child you wish to spank to a safe place -- perhaps placing the child on the other side of a baby gate or inside of a playpen until you can cool down.

Good luck, you can do this!
post #8 of 19
I only get this yelling verge on spanking urge when ds1 is violent towards ds2. I'm working on preventing by separating them before they get too out of control. That seems obvious but sometimes I get in the middle of doing the dishes or something stupid and I figure I can just finish it really quickly.

I do better if I get enough sleep and get a break through a babysitter once a week.

I've never spanked them but if he had hurt ds2 that severely, oof, i just don't wanna think about it.

Usually I say i'm really really mad right now please go in your room. (not sure if this is the best idea..but it is just what i say!) i just keep saying i'm so mad, i need a time out. He can sit in a chair or play in his room...just anywhere safe while i calm down. Then afterward we have to totally switch gears for the day or it will just happen again. we go do something fun, have a book party on the bed, etc. mostly i just get mad at myself for not preventing what happened somehow. the guilt from not preventing it and getting angry usually causes me to do better sometimes.

if i yell, i always apologize. something i learned here and was hard to start. everyone gets angry sometimes. if you believe in the bible, even jesus had a temper tantrum and through a table in the temple once.

i hope there is a way you can prevent things without letting him ruin the flower beds. lol!
post #9 of 19
The 4 yo/2 yo thing is so hard. It helps me to tell him how angry I am. I'll tell him Im so mad I feel like screaming. That helps me calm down for some reason
post #10 of 19
I was raised in a VERY pro spanking abusive home. I was spanked for the tinest infraction, sometimes to the point of leaving bruises...and I was physically abused. As such, I don't feel like I was taught coping mechanisims I only saw my parents fly off the handle and beat me...so honestly that is my first reaction when James is testing my limits.

What helped me was

1) Putting a rubber band around my wrist. Sometimes just pulling on that and snapping myself cools me off just enough.

2) Leave the situation. I cannot reason with him when he's hysterical and I'm hysterical. It's pointless. I have to leave him and calm down. I make sure he is somewhere safe turn on Nick Jr or PBS, grab my iPod and shut myself in the bathroom for just a minute. That way I come back refreshed and not so frazzeled.

3) BREATHE take a DEEP breath and hold it for 15 seconds or so, the counting the 'getting inside your head' for a minute helps detach you from the situation for a minute.

4) Lower your expectations. Kids will be kids. They will ignore you, not listen, be defiant, hit, scream, cry, throw themselves to the ground and pitch a fit. All this is NORMAL. It is NOT your fault. You did NOT raise horriable disobediant children because you are a worthless parent. Kids are kids. There isn't anything you can do about it but roll with it. Remind yourself of this when they are having melt downs "This is normal childhood behavior. I did not cause this. I cannot prevent this. I cannot change this." something to that effect. Not sure why but it helps me.

I see my cousins who are perfect little robots but then I remember that they are raised like I was. They are spanked, they are hit, they obey their parents out of FEAR not out of love. I want my children to follow the rules because I have taught them, and because they were raised with LOVE not because they FEAR my wrath or fear punishment. Thats not obediance, thats fear. I do not want my children to be raised in fear.

Believe me, I understand the gut reaction OhMyGod I just hit you and didn't even THINK. I know that guilt, been there done that more times than I care to think about or admit...but I hope to do better. Each time I hope to do better.

There isn't much more I can do than strive to be better.

: I'm right there with you mama
post #11 of 19
It sounds like we have very similar styles of discipline -- I do redirection and "natural" consequences for my 2 -year-old DD too ("if we can't be gentle with the flowers, we'd better stay away from them right now because we could break them!") and I'm not quite willing to let that go, but it does mean that we often come inside and start doing an activity (less desirable) that sets off the toddler and there we are in a full-blown tantrum.
It's very frustrating, and the baby gets worked up, and everyone's just miserable.
I love the other suggestions that you can say "I have a plan!" and follow through instead of getting roped into an escalating emotional situation. What worked for me the other day when it was at its worst was putting the baby safely in her crib, putting the toddler in front of Nemo, and taking my own "time out." I went in the tent we have in our living room, texted a venting message to DP, and took literally 1 minute for myself. DD had calmed down and I only had to comfort the baby which seemed do-able by then. Venting really helped, and I didn't feel guilty for venting at the kids.
Mostly, offering my support, mama. Know that lots of people know how hard it actually is to be in those moments.
post #12 of 19
There are books too, that can help you understand why you revert to spanking although in your heart you are against it. I also have spanked my ds a few times even though I am against it and I feel awful after. Try, When Anger Hurts Your Kids by Matthew McKay and Patrick Fanning. It has helped me understand the situation and my feelings and urges a little more.

I read someone say to have a plan of action for when you reach your limit and practice it so it is as quick as slamming on the breaks when you something runs out in front of your car. This is key!
post #13 of 19
It's a tough situation to be in

I agree with previous posters that trying to 'teach' at that moment wouldn't have helped. He was hysterical and wasn't open to that, or redirection. I would have taken the youngest away to prevent any further aggression, but without leaving your son feeling that he was being abandoned or punished by you walking away (tough to do I know). I remember my hysterical tantrums, no amount of communication from an adult helped, I basically had to let it all out, calm down and then I would become receptive.

You made a mistake in spanking him... but hey, we all make mistakes when it comes to parenting, in whatever form that mistake may take. You're very brave for coming on here and admitting your actions, frustrations and dilemma and I admire you for your courage.

Peace
post #14 of 19
My thought is maybe to get at the bottom of why this situation makes you angry (not the hitting - that's obvious, but the sibling rivalry)....where were you in the birth order? Who's side is it easier for you to see? Do you have any leftover feelings about "fairness" from your own childhood?

For me, understanding why I'm reacting badly has alot to do with my own childhood and understanding what I have "left over" from that time that I need to deal with. It helps to diffuse some of my anger if I understand my own hangups.

hth
peace,
robyn
post #15 of 19
Hugs. I haven't read all the responses, but this is totally a situation that would get the best of me, too. I really try to recognize that I'm getting to that point, and w/my 4.5 yo, I would have walked off the minute the fit started. It may seem harsh, but it's way better for me to take a breather and let her work things out on her own than to try to "fix" things and head off the tantrum, and then eventually lose it.
post #16 of 19
post #17 of 19
Thread Starter 
Thank you all. Your replies have been immeasurably helpful. First the hugs and empathy -- it really helps to know I am not alone and that I am not some monster. Second, the suggestion to make a plan -- THANK YOU! I am such a planner, of course I need a plan with this. And bless my son, I'm sure I'll have plenty of opportunities to practice it And third, thank you for the suggestions to read and reflect more on what's at the root of this trigger. I will check out the book about anger and I like the idea to think more about my own sibling relationships (I'm also a first, but a girl and 6 years older, so there is a world of difference.)

Today, however, I just focused on connection and it was a *great* day. I actively chose to love, love, love on him rather than harp, harp, harp on him. And miraculously, it seemed to work. He did great -- both freer and more self-controlled than I can remember him being. Which in turn furthered my desire to be in the moment and happy with him. Here's to the upward spiral!

Thank you again everybody!
post #18 of 19
I hit my DD once. It was very similar to what you're describing here:

Quote:
This isn't a disciplinary tactic; this is a total fight-or-flight gut instinct (awful, awful) reaction.
Believe it or not (I wouldn't have) it has been a strangely transformative experience. DD was very shocked and appalled that I hit her and immediately cried, "DON'T hit me, Mama!" I apologized and told her it was not okay that I had hit, etc etc. As with you, I hit because she hit (me, in this case).

Quote:
I told him I want to help him learn to 'hold himself' when he is that angry. And he said "You didn't hold yourself when you spanked me." Oy. What could I say? I told him he was right. That I set a terrible example for him, but that I still wanted to try to help him get better control over his anger so that he doesn't hurt people when he's mad. I felt like the biggest hypocrite.
As awful as I know this felt, it may have been of great value. DD, too, pointed out my hypocrisy when we debriefed afterwards. I acknowledged that I had made a big mistake. She thought about this A LOT over the next few weeks and repeatedly brought up the incident, obviously still processing it. She said, numerous times, "Mama, if you love me, don't hit me" (not sure where this came from as we've never said that). Ouch. Then she started saying, "Mama, let's never hurt each other again." ("Rememeber the time when I hit you and pulled your hair, and you hit me? Let's never hurt each other again.")

Although I would OBVIOUSLY never recommend this "method," the whole incident, while painful to experience and relive, seems to have been psychologically important to DD. Hitting has been much, much reduced. I DON'T think it's because she's afraid I'll hit back, as I've made it clear that I never will do that again and should never have done it at all (also, my hit was not at all hard). I think there was some comprehension that happened, though. All the times I lectured her about why we don't hit didn't seem to get through to her, but when SHE was saying them back to ME--well, it made sense.

As for what I do when I get the impulse (because I still do)--she goes in her room or I go in mine. Period. Just for two or three minutes, till the red clears from my eyes.
post #19 of 19
I don't have a lot of suggestions; I'm still trying to find my own way through a gentler form of discipline. But I just wanted to say that I think you should be really proud of how you handled the situation after it was over. The way you were eagerly taking ownership of your mistake and not justifying or rationalizing your spanking when your son called attention to it really rocked.

You made a mistake. You snapped. Now, you're getting up and learning from it. I just wanted to say I'm proud of how you reacted towards your son after and the lesson/example you taught him in ownership of behavior. I hope I can always be as honest and supportive of a mom as you truly sound like you are.
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