Can you be reported to CPS or equivalent for Intrusive Thoughts? - Page 2

[kizmit]

I just wanted to say that Im going through the exact same thing as you are. Im also in BC and have been all too familiar with the Ministry as I spent some time in foster care as a youth and I *hate* them. My dd is a two weeks old and already I've had symptoms of PPD, which, with a history of depression in my past terrifies me. I did tell my midwife about the sadness- I trust my midwife and really get along with her well or else I would not say anything at all. Anyways, she told me about Pacific Postpartum Society and Im working on maybe calling them. They do everything from groups to telephone counselling. If there would be anyone that I would call it would be them as they deal with post partum depression and only post partum depression. There is also a reproductive psychology unit at Women's hospital that you can be referred to, but my midwife said their first line of treatment is pills- and they tend not to be AP friendly at all. Hope I could help you, and if not, Im sending you hugs and know that you are not alone in this, as Im struggling with getting help too.

[MilkTrance]

Wow, some of your stories are so scary and my heart TRULY goes out to you.


I'm not sure what the next step is now. DH is very unhappy with the situation. He thinks vitamins should change everything. I'm not so convinced. However he doesn't want me to tell anyone about the intrusive thoughts either. Can't blame him, it's HIS life that would be affected too.

PPS sounds interesting, kizmit.

[doudat]

Sometimes it's all about semantics.
Instead of intrusive thoughts of you harming your child, say you have intrusive images of things happening to your child. Same treatment, but the emphasis isn't the same, you know?
Most gp have no idea about ppd/ocd so I wouldn't chance it. I know my gp had no idea and when I went to see her for meds I made sure to tone it down. I went to see a psychologist who reassured me this was perfectly normal, that I would not "go crazy and harm my child". He also told me everyone gets those images/thoughts, but "normal" people just forget about them and do not dwell. Whereas anxiety prone people will focus on it and overanalyse the thought. This made me feel so much better.

The meds have made the intrusive images almost disappear, and when I do get one, I can easily brush it aside.

[MilkTrance]

This sounds terrible but please keep in mind my brain is kind of messed right now, so I don't mean to offend anyone by what I write but... do meds make you gain weight? I have such an issue with weight it scares me.

[janellesmommy]

Originally Posted by MilkTrance

do meds make you gain weight?

It is a possibility. It depends on the medication and on the person. But also, some medications, with some people, cause weight loss.

[Breastfeeding Insomniac]

I am not sure. I do know a lot of moms suffer in silence bc of this fear. I would contact postpartum international (http://www.postpartum.net/) and talk to them, they are the experts and can lead you in the right direction. Also if its PP OCD you are dealing with, an educated PPD person should know that this is the PP diagnosis that is LEAST likely to do harm.

[milliegirl]

to you and all of the mamas who are struggling with this. Aggressive intrusive thoughts are so terrifying. There is also so much mis-information (and lack of information) about postpartum issues - especially PPOCD. When it happened to me I was absolutely convinced that if I told anyone CPS would take my DD and they would lock me up

In my case, telling my doctor was the first step to finding relief. Like others' here, I would emphasize that my doctor has known me for a long while, is a woman, and a mom, and has had other patients w/ PP issues. So, I would agree with the advice that (if possible) you go to someone you trust and have a history with, or at least try to find a female doc who has had children and understands where you are physically and emotionally.

Finally, the best thing I did (and the scariest for me) was to get a consult w/ a psychiatrist. He was VERY reassuring that I was NOT a danger to my baby and wasn't really concerned w/ my intrusive thoughts (since he had seen it many times before). He made me realize how incredibly common it is, but just not talked about.

I hope you find some relief soon. I know how incredibly scared you must be right now, but there IS help out there.

Lynn

[KJoslyn78]

Originally Posted by MilkTrance

Can you be reported to CPS (or Canadian equivalent, I guess that would be Ministry of Children and Families here in BC) for intrusive thoughts (those featuring yourself as the "doer" of harm to the baby).

This is my main concern for getting help. The thoughts are getting worse and are turning into nightmares. But I don't want to be "flagged" and have a ministry worker invade my home, especially since we are non-vax, don't attend well baby visits, co-sleep, co-bathe, are often nude, cloth diaper, all the "weird" stuff.

I understand that Canada is more liberal than the US for child care, but I think all of these things ADDED UP plus the intrusive thoughts and PPD would flag us. I don't want to endanger my family but these stupid thoughts and stuff are getting more than I can handle, dunno what to do?

: First - i wanted to give ya a hug - jsut for posting - i know... KNOW.. how hard even that can be :

secondly - not sure where you are - but i had some pretty sever PPD after dd#2 was born. I had thoughts, clear, even to the point of "seeing myself" do it and when i finally went and got help - I disclosed it - and no one (CPS, cops, etc) ever showed up over it. Mind - i didn't tell my Dr about much about WHAT i was feeling/thinking (other then how i feel i got to being so depressed, there was a lot going on besides having a new baby), and she had no problem making the referral for mental health appts. I felt terrible, guilty, afraid of all the thoughts/images i had of bad things happening to my baby.. i loved her - so why have these things happen? I didnt understand why then i had them then (as opposed to with DD#1, who was preemie and i was sick, etc etc). But seeking help, and talking things out was such a HUGE help and relief.. as well as a stepping stone for the rest of the "stuff" going on at that time.

With the added stuff - i'm not sure... but to me the co-bathe/nakkie thing (esp nakkie adults) compared to the age of DCs might be a bigger issue... as we had CPS and an investigator show up when DD#1 drew a pic of daddy/DH nakkie at school. Umm... hello - we only have 1 bathroom - and people DO walk in on each other - it happens. Don't get me wrong - i think all those things you do are fine (as we did most at one time or another)... just letting you know what I/we went though.

Ok - i'm sure i forgot something... but sorry this is soooo long. again s to you mama

[MilkTrance]

Thanks so much you guys, this is the best support group ever. <3

What would you say to a doctor's administration? It is customary in my doctor's office for the receptionist to ask about the reason for the visit. Do I just say "it's private?"

Then what do I say to the doctor? I think I have PPD? It feels so stupid to say that. I don't know why -- possibly cultural outlook/disdain on mental illness. Like it's attention-seeking...

[gwerydd]

do you feel comfortable talkign with your doctor? i just told my OB and GP that i was suffering from PPD and they set up the appointments with the psychiatrists for me. don't feel stupid about telling someone or saying it out loud. PPD is a real condition and is being increasing recognized. a good doctor will know that and applaud you for seeking help. if you are belittled or feel stupid, find another doctor and get s second opinion.

[GalateaDunkel]

Just tell the receptionist you think you are experiencing some symptoms of PPD. It is nothing to be ashamed of. Being mysterious about it would just raise more eyebrows.

You don't have to be brutally honest in order to benefit from mental health treatment. Sadly a lot of people run into trouble that way. I have a very close, long-term trusting relationship with my therapist but I would never tell him everything, for example we could spend hours going over how I FEEL about things at home, but he has no clue about nitty gritty details like co-sleeping. Like any other medical provider, keep it in mind that you are the customer and you make use of their services as you see fit. It's not the priest in the confessional kwim. Just report symptoms you feel safe discussing to get the meds.

[BelgianSheepDog]

You can report a vague symptom to the receptionist if you want. I am resentful of having to tell receptionists personal information in order to see the doctor, regardless of why I am going in. You could say something like fatigue, or trouble sleeping, or lack of appetite (fill in whatever depression symptom you might be having.)

[psychmama]

Just wanted to add reassurance as someone who has worked with numerous OCD patients that intrusive thoughts mean nothing about who you are as a person. Think of them as "brain hiccups" that everyone has to some extent. Except that for someone with OCD or PP-OCD, intrusive thoughts persist because of the anxiety associated with them (the more that you try to avoid the thoughts or worry about having more of them, the more likely they are to reoccur). And thoughts of harming your baby are so distressing (because, of course, it's the last thing you would ever want to do and you love your baby tremendously) that they are the ones most likely to evoke the most anxiety. A provider who knows about PPD and PPOCD would not report you for those thoughts; however, an uninformed person might. So I second the recommendations to go through an organization like postpartum.net or to be somewhat vague with your primary care physician and ask him/her for a referral to a psychiatrist and/or psychologist with expertise in this area. Effective treatments are medication (usually an antidepressant such as Paxil) and/or cognitive/behavioral therapy.

[mom0810]

Thank you for the post, psychmama. It's what I was trying to convey earlier, but I did not find the right words as you did. I hope the OP found it reassuring, as well. I have just read a book, called beyond the Blues, that really helped me with some of the feelings/thoughts I had been having. Perhaps you would benefit from that book, too, Milktrance?

Just know that you are okay, and that getting help is a great step forward.

[transformed]

I was so scared of intrusive thoughts when I first started having them. I still have fears about CPS as well, but honestly, CPS are such a screwed up agency here, I dont think it would be on their radar. (I mean, they have left children in peoples care in FL who kept kids in cages with a bowl to pee in for crying out loud.)

I just wanted to offer support-it is SOOOOOO hard....but it feels so much better to me, now that I know its not all my fault, or weird.

[sbgrace]

YOu know, if you just talk about PPD and they then prescribe an anti-depressant that also is effective for OCD you may find that in a few weeks time your thoughts are much more manageable. Any SSRI would work (Zoloft, Celexa, Paxil, etc.); wellbutrin or a first generation anti-depressant wouldn't. I don't know that is the right move for you but if you are really uncomfortable with the idea of mentioning the OCD thoughts you can still get (medication) help for just depression that will treat the OCD too.

[Ornery]

I just went in yesterday to see my doc about my severe PPD as the psychiatrist that I chose can't see me until the 19th. My intrusive thoughts take the form of nightmares, constant nightmares about horrific things happening to my children. I told him my symptoms and he prescribed Zoloft immediately. Easy as pie. He didn't even ask very many questions, other than whether or not I was planning on harming myself. Please don't hesitate to get help. You don't have to suffer through this and while medication might not be the perfect solution, it might be a start.

[Adele_Mommy]

I feel for you. Taking that first step to tell someone about your problem is so terrifying. You have already gotten a lot of good advice. I would just say that it actually might be better to say you think you have PP_OCD rather than PPD because, as a previous poster mentioned, these are the people with PP disorders who are least likely to be a danger to their baby. This is true of OCD in general - people with true OCD virtually never do the things they worry about doing. (Though that does not make the thoughts any less scary.)

However, as another previous poster mentioned, people who are not experts in OCD may not know that. So, there is no need to tell a GP what specific thoughts you are having. You can just say you are having scary, disturbing thoughts and can't get them out of your head. I will recommend telling someone about the intrusive thoughts at least in general terms because, while it is true that some of the same drugs are used to treat OCD and depression, some SSRIs are more effective for OCD than others and often different dosages are needed.

Good luck.

[LynnS6]

Originally Posted by mom0810

Wow if that is the case, either people are not seeking the right help, or there are many unethical caregivers around.

I suggest going to one recommended by PSI, Postpartum Support International, by going to their website, www.postpartum.net. You can find referrals to caregivers all over there. And they are all very educated in postpartum issues.

: I second the PSI recommendation. PSI has some great resources.

If you're worried, I would be circumspect about your intrusive thoughts until you know you have a caregiver that knows something about PPD. But they are very, very common. And it's highly unlikely that you will snap. PPD OCD (which is what you're describing) is NOT the same as Postpartum Psychosis. PPP is RARE and frightening - but the thing is, people who are in psychosis aren't thinking that there's anything wrong. So, as long as you're recognizing that these thoughts are intrusive, it's probably not psychosis (though, of course, only someone trained can tell you that.)

Get help. Go through the major PPD symptoms and tell them about that. Telling them that you are having trouble because you're "worried all the time" will be a good cover for intrusive thoughts until you trust your provider.

Look for a counselor too - PPD OCD responds best to a combination of meds and cognitive behavioral therapy. (Know too that PPD OCD sometimes takes more meds than just 'plain' PPD.)