Support outside of the "surviving abuse" forum - Page 2

[todavia]

i don't know if my childhood homelife counts as abusive but my mom suffers from severe depression and was very intolerant of me as a child. my memory of her from that time mostly involves her locking herself in the bathroom and yelling at me to go away we still have a very difficult relationship.

Originally Posted by lindsaye3

For some reason the elementary years are so hard for me. Babies and toddlers are easy and adorable to me, but elementary school age is hard. My ds is smart and funny and wonderful, but he gets on my nerves and it isn't his fault. It is a fault in me that I am working on.

this is me to a T and i hate it. at the end of the day yesterday (after a long weekend basically alone with 2 kids) i cried and cried about these feelings and the dynamic between me and my son. i find myself getting so frustrated and angry - yelling, sending him to his room and basically dragging him when he refuses i know this is not okay. i love him and we have some really great time together but overall i wish i could just relax and enjoy him more. i find so much of his behavior annoying and grating even though the rational part of myself knows he's just a kid with a lot of energy who wants to play and be silly.

after my minibreakdown, i started reading "liberated parents, liberated children" and this morning tried to implement some of those tools. it was actually good and i'm hoping to continue even though i know there will still be bumps in the road.

[Mama_2_Boy]

Originally Posted by violetisadora

i don't know if my childhood homelife counts as abusive but my mom suffers from severe depression and was very intolerant of me as a child. my memory of her from that time mostly involves her locking herself in the bathroom and yelling at me to go away

...neglect...even though it may have been totally unintentional on her part..is classified as abuse. Can you share some of the tools that you learned in your reading?

[momsadvice]

Sure, sounds like a great idea. It is always easier to talk with someone who has been there themselves than someone who is trying empathize with no history of their own.

[hippymomma69]

Originally Posted by Mama_2_Boy

Alot of the tension I feel towards DS is because his actions are reverting me back to my younger self and how helpless I felt back then as a small child.

I see so much of myself in all of your posts....:

I struggle too every day and every day it seems like I yell at DD or sometimes do the mommy arm grab....sometimes I get so angry I just WANT to see her cry - that's the child in me coming out!

I love the LIberated Parents/Liberated Child book - one thing I learned is to let my anger out sooner so I don't reach the explosion point (not to try to repress it) - well I learned that intellectually but still need to implement it....it's hard for me to talk about my anger in a non-shaming way....I need to just learn to say "I"m angry!" without any blame or shame.



thanks for posting....
peace,
robyn

[Mama_2_Boy]

Originally Posted by hippymomma69

I love the LIberated Parents/Liberated Child book - one thing I learned is to let my anger out sooner so I don't reach the explosion point (not to try to repress it) - well I learned that intellectually but still need to implement it....

This book was mentioned by another poster in this thread...is this the book of choice for mama's like ourselves? Perhaps I will pick this one up. I would like to hear more about it and what it address'.

[todavia]

Originally Posted by Mama_2_Boy

Can you share some of the tools that you learned in your reading?

the parts that i read last night were basically the authors interpretations/examples from a parenting group led by dr haim ginott (between parent and child). there's a lot of validating feelings, using descriptive language instead of praise and letting go of parental control to allow for children's autonomy.

i tend to be a bit of a control freak and get really frustrated with ds when i'm wanting him to do something in a certain way/at a certain pace. once i start giving orders - things only go downhill and usually end up with me yelling and him crying. mornings can be really ugly (me: Come on, come ON! hurry up. get dressed! what are you doing? let's go. stop WHINING! what are you DOING? you forgot how to put your socks on?! grrr). not a good way for either of us to start the day.

so this morning i put his clothes on the couch but didn't tell him to get dressed. i left his lunch in the refrigerator and his bookbag on the hook. he knows that we usually leave at 8 and at 7:45 kind of looked at me like "well? aren't you going to tell me to get dressed?" i didn't say anything. "i'll get dressed now" he said and started taking off his pajamas. well, without my pushing, it took him a good ten minutes to get dressed because he kept stopping to ask me questions or kiss the baby or whatever. normally, this would drive me crazy ("Just do one thing at a time! Now is not the time for ____!) but i just sat on the couch and waited. i told myself, "if he's late, he's late. the school/teacher will deal with consequences of that. i am not in a hurry and don't need create conflict for no reason "

he also does this thing where he asks for permission to use the bathroom and won't go until i say "Go" which usually comes out as "JUST GO!!! - it drives me crazy! so today, he raised his finger (like they do at school) and i said "i know that at school you have to ask permission to go to the bathroom but home is different from school so just listen to your body and you decide when you have to go" and i walked away. then instead of getting frustrated about him refusing to wipe himself i said "i know it's a challenge to wipe yourself. you'll do it when you're ready". and i didn't even try to do anything to his bed-head hair - which he hates and always resists.

on the way to school, i resisted the urge to say "great job this morning" and just said "it feels really good to have a morning with no yelling and sadness". he didn't say anything but kind of skipped a little and started talking about who he was going to play with at school.

mostly i just tried to let go of trying to control the morning routine and let him do things on his own. revolutionary, huh? i have to say i felt a like a robot saying a lot of those things - it's really just not my style. i've always worried that gentle discipline = a kid that walk all over you but i'm trying to move away from that. either way, what i've been doing isn't working so it's time to really try a new approach. i'm hoping it becomes more natural with practice.

[Mama_2_Boy]

Originally Posted by violetisadora

...mostly i just tried to let go of trying to control the morning routine and let him do things on his own. revolutionary, huh? i have to say i felt a like a robot saying a lot of those things - it's really just not my style. i've always worried that gentle discipline = a kid that walk all over you but i'm trying to move away from that. either way, what i've been doing isn't working so it's time to really try a new approach. i'm hoping it becomes more natural with practice....

Sounds like you are feeling some "room to breath" from this approach, good for you! I know what you mean about the 'control' issue, for me that's all it's about and that is what causes me to lose it, is when I think I no longer have control, which is a means to a very sad end.

[Devaskyla]

Count me in too. I've been trying to do gd since ds1 started needing discipline/boundaries. I read here for awhile and/or read books on gd...I think I've read most of them at this point. And I'll be, mostly, the parent I want to be, for a few hours, a few days. Most of a week or 2. But then I don't see anything changing or I get stressed or depressed, and I'm back to being...my mother. I don't think I'm as bad as her, though. I hope.

Honestly, I never realized how badly I was treated by my parents, it was so 'normal' until I was an adult. I thought somehow I deserved the lack of respect, consideration and empathy. My first inclination that I was way too used to being walked all over was when I was 17, living with a friend, and an aquaintance pointed out to me how badly my friend treated me. I had never noticed, because she was nowhere near as bad as my parents. Even now, my h gets mad about how my mom treats me and the kids and I just...don't notice because I'm so used to it.

I don't want my kids to grow up like that. I want them to notice when people are treating them like crap and be able to stand up for themselves. It's *so* hard to not yell, though. And h has a horrible problem of taking everything the kids, especially ds1, does personally, even when he was a tiny newborn. He's a yeller and a namecaller (his mother is/was...well, a UA violation is the nicest thing I can say, his father wasn't around much and both of them stole from him).

Both my boys are extremely energetic and ds1 is high needs. And I'm an introvert who has frequesnt bouts of depression where I want nothing to do with anyone. Yet another thing to feel guilty about.

[hippymomma69]

Originally Posted by Mama_2_Boy

This book was mentioned by another poster in this thread...is this the book of choice for mama's like ourselves? Perhaps I will pick this one up. I would like to hear more about it and what it address'.

It's basically a long extended example of how to apply some of Ginott's work....they have a specific chapter on anger that I found helpful...but I do have some trouble applying what they suggest since my DD is basically non-verbal.

It's an old book but it really has lots of practical examples that I find helpful - it's hard for me to put theory into practice and I need to see practical examples....

violetisadora - what a GREAT story! thanks for sharing....
peace,
robyn

[WuWei]

Thich Nhat Hanh's book "Peace Is Every Step" helped me to have perspective about the influence of my upbringing without a sense of hopelessness to changing the patterns that I grew up with. It really helped me to put my (similar) past into perspective and helped me to feel empowered to live in the moment rather than dwelling in the past. http://www.amazon.com/Peace-Every-St.../dp/0553351397 It changed my life.

The book helped bring peace to my soul and give me tools to.... PAUSE.....BREATHE......consider my reaction in the heat of the moment, BEFORE reacting automatically and viscerally. He has many books; but "Peace is Every Step" really empowered me to see my explosive reactions as a *learned* coping mechanism that could be *unlearned*. And it offered methods of identifying my underlying feelings and needs to help me take care of my anger (smoldering since childhood).

He has a new book called "ANGER". I only just started it. And it too is powerful and comforting to increasing my awareness, understanding and caretaking (compassion toward mySelf) of my emotional angst at myself for not being as calm (internally) as I wish I were and strive to be. http://www.amazon.com/Anger-Thich-Nh...336562-8587237 He talks about embracing your anger as messages about your values and priorities, and "taking care of your needs like a crying baby". That anger is a message of unmet needs. And recognizing and honoring those values as important in my life. Taking care of those needs, like we care for the needs of the young, is important. I highly recommend both.

Also, this thread about challenging children has helped many of us: "My Challenge, My Love": http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=328627


Connection Parenting by Pam Leo is fascinating about identifying underlying needs and seeking mutually agreeable solutions. It has a lot of tools for conflict resolution. Naomi Aldort's book Raising Our Children, Raising Ourselves discusses validation of our needs and our children's needs. Oh, the Center for Non-violent Communication has an article about the steps to turning anger into compassion. Here it is: http://www.naturalchild.org/marshall...ten_steps.html The Secret Life of Bees is a fictional story about learning to mother yourself and giving yourself the unconditional acceptance that you yearn for.

I found it helps to supplement with Magnesium, which is often associated with aggressive moodiness and high stress when depleted, especially around PMS. Most Americans have insufficient magnesium in their diet, especially pregnant and nursing mamas. Same with essential fatty acids. I just read a study about aggression associated with lack of essential fatty acids. Apparently stress depletes both Magnesium and EFAs, and causes less ability to create serotonin, or something like that.

I hope these help you all find a path to peace. Personal counseling helped me too.


Pat

[Danaoc]

Mamas, I am so touched by all your posts - it is inspiring to see such amazing women seek out awareness and support. I get very inspired by that and think of you (as a collective group) when I go about my day as a parent.

I feel like I grew up with a Devil Mom - she would get a flashing rage in her eyes before she came after me, which luckily was only 5-10 times, but boy watch out when she did! And my friends & everyone else thought she was so nice! My Dad played complete victim & still does.

So I had the tendencies to lash out and did respond physically to my ds when he was around 2 (swats on the butt, not crazy rage). I had a lot of internal nasty crap to deal with and took a lot out on my dh too. We both got in a vicious cycle of blaming each other for our misery and would have headed towards divorce.

The only thing that saved me was the Landmark Forum (landmarkeducation.com). It totally transformed my life 100%. It was the ONLY thing that showed me I am in complete control of my life. Immediately after the Forum, I put in months of research and education into my own issues of communication, self-awareness, self-empathy, and self-empowerment. And then the beautiful effect from it all was transforming myself as a parent too.

It was so hard to admit to my responsibilities and to come to terms with a painful childhood. Most of the times, my own painful childhood was enough to motivate me to give a better childhood to my ds, but I just didn't know how to do it. I'm grateful that now I do. And I'm especially grateful that there are other mama's out there to support each other through all of it. Thank you all for your courage in this thread.

[harmonymama]

I have spanked a couple of times recently after months of not, and years of off-again, on-again deciding not to spank, and then changing my mind, feeling like all the folks who say look at all the spoiled kids, its because nobody spanks anymore. I'm not advocating this opinion by any means, I'm just being honest about a tape that plays in my head...

My DS is very bright and strong-willed and his having trouble in school and in life, because he is very oppositional. Sometimes I feel that I just have to do something to "knock sense into him"- horrible phrase I know!

This time I spanked, and then DS pushed his friend at school the next day! I know in my heart there is a connection...

I've committed to not spanking before, and it hasn't worked, so I am trying to admit I have a problem, seek help, and make a plan, so that I will NEVER act on that impulse again!

Right now my plan, is to march straight to my bedroom and lock the door, just long enough to breath and remind myself of this commitment, and go back to respond, not react. I think I will also use some other strategies, like nutrition and stress-management for myself, and staying organized so I don't get too stressed out. I will also probably do some loss of privileges (I know not big on this board, but at this point I need a consistent, nonviolent logical consequence for DS. Words don't do it for him, and he has to learn to follow instructions).

*I'm looking for support and affirmation only. Supportive ideas are great, but mostly I just need a place to admit to others that I've screwed up, and that I need help to make sure in truly never happens again. thanks.

[mamabear&babybear]

A few minutes ago I was watching my youngest get really frustrated because she wanted to let go of the stool she was using to help her stand and chase after her sister into the living room. It got me thinking. In the past 3 weeks my sweet baby has gone from sitting, to army crawling, to hands and knees crawling, to climbing the stairs, to pulling up on furniture and is now working on cruising around holding on to furniture. : I do have a point I promise. I realized that I have been trying to go from sitting to running without learning all the things in between. So I am going to try and break down my goals into mini-baby steps. I have decided to take one of J's behaviors that is a trigger for me and teach myself to react differently. The trigger is her peeing on the floor instead of in the potty (this after she was using the potty by herself every time for over a month). Anyway, I'm going to take an idea from Easy to Love, Difficult to discipline. The idea is to tell yourself, "I'm angry and that's okay" and "This moment is as it is and it's okay". If I can do that not everytime I feel angry just everytime she pees on the floor, I think I can slowly teach myself to react that way to all of my triggers. We'll see how it goes.

On another note, I just talked to my dad on the phone and told him that she peed on the floor again. His reaction was to say "I think I would have to smack her on the butt but this is your chance to be the parent." : On one hand I'm glad he realizes that I parent my children my way on the other hand I don't like being told to smack my child on the butt. Of course, 5 minutes after the call ended I thought of what I wanted to say so I thought I would tell you all. I don't want to teach her that when she makes a mistake or has an accident then someone bigger and stronger than her hurts her for it. I don't want her to learn that my love is conditional and that she needs to pee in the potty if she wants to be loved. My goal is to teach her to put her pee in the potty, but that whether she does or not I love her to pieces. Okay gotta get these girls down for a nap.

Thanks for starting this thread.

[Mama_2_Boy]

What I can relate to the most in your post is:

I've committed to not spanking before, and it hasn't worked, so I am trying to admit I have a problem, seek help, and make a plan, so that I will NEVER act on that impulse again!

and here...

*I'm looking for support and affirmation only. Supportive ideas are great, but mostly I just need a place to admit to others that I've screwed up, and that I need help to make sure in truly never happens again. thanks.

because right now I am finding that what is helping me the most is to continue to talk about it. I find that speaking about it really keeps it at the front line and keeps me committed to trying to make a difference. I do support you whole heartedly. I know all to well the place you are in and I think we all have the power to make it over to the "other side" so to speak.

[sasntappy]

I've had a terrible day today--the culmination of a progressively deteriorating month. I tend to be a screamer and can be "too rough" also. I was committed to no spanking and then resorted to them only to find (duh!) that it just makes matters worse. I remember being screamed at and spanked at least daily by both my mom and my grandmother because i just don't back down. I never felt wounded or traumatized by it as a child. My sister, who never fought back and never got spanked or screamed at, but witnessed it regularly reports being much more traumatized by it than me. I love her dearly, but even as a child remember being mad at her for not being tougher. She battles with depression and I battle with rage. I think we just focus anger in different directions. What I want is to NOT HAVE THE ANGER! Even when I feel my blood starting to boil I am thinking "this is ridiculous! completely out of proportion to the situation" but other than just locking myself away and neglecting my kids I don't know what to do about it. I hate to see them looking scared or hurt. And we have such a good time most of the time... For me I know a lot of it is hormonal. PMS is my enemy and I'm 3 months post partem right now. I've written down every book title mentioned so far and am looking forward to reading them and have favorited this thread.

[lindsaye3]

nak

Thank you for this thread. No time to type but I read so many good responses. I think it is good to talk about this. It helps me to read what others have written.

Will get liberated book, currently reading playful parent and it has helped. did not get mad today at the little stuff, feeling hopeful for first time in a while.

[Momma_Camille]

Posting on this thread & then thinking about all the things I read - made a big difference for me today. Maybe just knowing I have a place to come spill it out when I want to will be helpful!

violetisadora - I was thinking about your control post today. It helped me a lot!

Of course, I also had a conversation with my mother today. Sigh. After I got off I looked at the phone & said "You are supportive as a rock." :

Luckily she's a dang good grandma. We'll see how it goes as DD gets older.

[Fuamami]

Originally Posted by Momma_Camille

Of course, I also had a conversation with my mother today. Sigh. After I got off I looked at the phone & said "You are supportive as a rock." :

Luckily she's a dang good grandma. We'll see how it goes as DD gets older.

You know, this is something I think about a lot (my mother) and maybe it's an appropriate part of this discussion, too.

It's been really important for me to forgive my mother of her parenting mistakes. I've noticed the more I can do that, the more I can forgive myself and approach my anger issues from a calm, reflective perspective.

But part of this also includes wanting more information from her. I have tried to delicately bring up the subject, to get a little more background about how she was feeling when things got violent, but I also don't want to hurt her feelings and cause her any pain.

Anyone successfully done this with their parents?

[harmonymama]

Wow, this thread is like a gift from God right now. Thanks all you wonderful mamas. We are in this nonviolent journey together.

Day 1 of beautiful, positive gentle discipline. I taught the boys to rake the yard, stack mats, and they helped me cook. DH arrived home after the previously filthy boys got out of a perfectly lovely bath! And we were all in a good mood. No yelling, nada, a few calm loss of privileges moments, but thats it! This is on top of me feeling pretty sick today. So I'm kinda proud of myself, but mostly I am thanking God with my whole heart, because I know I cannot do GD without grace.

[swampangel]

Originally Posted by sasntappy

I've had a terrible day today--the culmination of a progressively deteriorating month. I tend to be a screamer and can be "too rough" also. I was committed to no spanking and then resorted to them only to find (duh!) that it just makes matters worse. I remember being screamed at and spanked at least daily by both my mom and my grandmother because i just don't back down. I never felt wounded or traumatized by it as a child. My sister, who never fought back and never got spanked or screamed at, but witnessed it regularly reports being much more traumatized by it than me. I love her dearly, but even as a child remember being mad at her for not being tougher. She battles with depression and I battle with rage. I think we just focus anger in different directions. What I want is to NOT HAVE THE ANGER! Even when I feel my blood starting to boil I am thinking "this is ridiculous! completely out of proportion to the situation" but other than just locking myself away and neglecting my kids I don't know what to do about it. I hate to see them looking scared or hurt. And we have such a good time most of the time... For me I know a lot of it is hormonal. PMS is my enemy and I'm 3 months post partem right now. I've written down every book title mentioned so far and am looking forward to reading them and have favorited this thread.

I'm sorry your day was so trying.

I had a thought when reading your post...yes, it is true that perhaps you and your sister focus anger in different directions. But I also think that if your big emotions as a kid had been validated and worked with by the adults in your life rather than responded to with spankings, you might not have that intense rage coming up now.

When we become parents, that wounded child within us becomes much more alive and the memories more visceral. I have absolutely found that to be true for me. I think feeling angry and inpatient is really normal for parents, but when it hits that rage point (and it's clear that it doesn't fit the situation) I think those are the feelings that a child would have had had it been safe to. Does that make sense?

For me, many aspects of my childhood would have brought about real rage from a child. But in order to survive, I connected to my mother which meant stuffing all that rage. That's what children do...they must connect and attach with their parents in order to survive...even if they're parents are neglectful or abusive. Otherwise, a child won't make it alone. There's no choice.

I love this thread and I think supporting each other as we work through this stuff is so healing and helpful. Just knowing others struggle makes me feel much less alone.