Dr Sears "The Vaccine Book" - Page 10

[guestmama9911]

I am only on page 2 of this, but thought I'd add my two cents already -


I don't read pro-vax things, not because I'm done learning, but because I'm positive that aluminum is a biohazard and destroyer of brain cells, and since all vaccines have to carry it as an adjuvent to get the immune system to respond, nothing new is going to convince me to vaccinate.

Once you know 1 + 1 = 2, you don't need to hear opposing arguements, and that doesn't make you closed minded.

[guestmama9911]

Originally Posted by p1gg1e

His schedule does two vaccines every month? and keeps aluminum vaccines from being paired together. he called the vaccines with aluminum the "new" mercury.

.

I was not aware that any of them were made without aluminum. I'll have to go back and look at package inserts again. Did he say which ones don't have it?

[mamakay]

Originally Posted by alisaterry

I am only on page 2 of this, but thought I'd add my two cents already -


I don't read pro-vax things, not because I'm done learning, but because I'm positive that aluminum is a biohazard and destroyer of brain cells, and since all vaccines have to carry it as an adjuvent to get the immune system to respond, nothing new is going to convince me to vaccinate.

Once you know 1 + 1 = 2, you don't need to hear opposing arguements, and that doesn't make you closed minded.

None of the live vaccines contain aluminum. Neither do flushots or IPV.

[guestmama9911]

Originally Posted by anewmama

Edited to add: I think I have picked up from some of these threads that people really want a reputable or well known doctor to come out completely against vaccines complete with references, facts and studies that doesn't come accross sounding a bit looney (like some of the stuff on ********* and other places). I am just not sure that will ever happen. Maybe I am mis-interpreting some of the posts. I just don't think "we" are there yet. I think the most we can expect to see for a while is doctor's coming out against some of the vaccines for particular reasons (if you are not traveling and live in the suburbs, skip polio, type thing).

Lots have, but then they become anathema and are not longer considered reputable.

I think that, despite being very anti-vaccine myself, this book is important, because the national trend has been to try and decrease a parents' right not to vaccinate, and this helps make the case that parents who delay or refuse vaccination are not child abusers or bad parents. Some law makers are trying to create law that homeschoolers have to vaccinate or else risk being accused of child neglect, for example, and this book combat that. It helps bring non-vaccinating parents out of tyhe "paranoid anarchists" category.

[guestmama9911]

Originally Posted by mamakay

None of the live vaccines contain aluminum. Neither do flushots or IPV.

I guess logically they wouldn't, since the body wouldn't have a problem recognizing a live virus.

We made our decision to not vax primarily on information contained in the package inserts themselves. Basic, and straight out of the horse's mouth.

[mamakay]

Originally Posted by alisaterry

I guess logically they wouldn't, since the body wouldn't have a problem recognizing a live virus.

Right...and if your immune system doesn't kick in and kill it off, you'll just end up catching the disease from the vaccine. And even then you'll have to eventually kill it off (and form and immunological memory) or the vaccine viruses would kill you.

My only real issue with the live virus vaccines is that a lot of them are quite possibly contaminated with other weirdo animal (mostly cow) viruses.

[mamakay]

It's also intersting that flushots and IPV are the two non-adjuvanted killed virus vaccines, and they're also the ones that don't really "work" (or at least not very well).

[rabrog]

I'll read it just because it's a higher profile book and if it comes up in conversation I'll be knowlegable about it.

However, I totally understand people saying it's not worth reading. Unless he's going to list some unknown side effect of a vax, it's nothing we haven't read before/heard before. Really, show me something he lists that isn't available anywhere else, that no one has ever seen as a side effect/"benefit" before.

To say non-vaxers aren't interested in it if he's ending with a pro-vax stance is very reasonable. We get the propaganda thrown at us every day. Some of us hear how we're "killing our children" by not vaxing them.:

Non-vaxers are generally (generally, not always) better educated about vaccines than vaxers. Vaxers I know (which is almost all of my friends) give the response of "I vax because it's a) what you're supposed to do, b) what the doctor told me to do, c) what the AAP, CDC, etc. tells us to do and d) don't you know those diseases will kill your child?" When I mention a reaction, I always get a "REALLY? I didn't know that!" even if it's a most basic reaction that they probably should have heard of. I believe everyone should read a few books on both sides of the issue before injecting anything into their kid. Sad truth is, most don't read anything.

A truly unbiased book would be "here is the disease and it's risks/treatments, here is the vaccine for said disease with it's pros/cons" - period. By putting his own vaccine schedule into the book, it is not unbiased.

And Dr. Bob did not coin "attachment parenting" and all that stuff - it was his father, Dr. William Sears.

Jenn

[ELTAZ]

Originally Posted by rabrog

Unless he's going to list some unknown side effect of a vax, it's nothing we haven't read before/heard before. Really, show me something he lists that isn't available anywhere else, that no one has ever seen as a side effect/"benefit" before.

Well, frankly, I had read online, and read a book a non-vaxing friend recommended to me, and I couldn't figure out which way was up and which was down, who to trust, who not to trust... so I ended up doing full-vaxing (with dd). So, sure, you can find this info elsewhere, but Dr. Bob consolidated a LOT of info into one easy-to-read book. So, sure, I could search hours all over the internet, and maybe find all of this information (and maybe not, or maybe just not be willing to trust a huge mass of internet-recommendations - as my experience was). But I truly appreciate having this book as a resource!

Originally Posted by rabrog

I believe everyone should read a few books on both sides of the issue before injecting anything into their kid.

I do believe that everyone should be educated about vaccines before doing any vaxes. I completely agree! But I don't think it's necessary to read books on both sides. For me, when I am trying to find out what to believe about a subject, I cannot even get through a book when I know it's one-sided (ie: completely 100% vaxing, or completely against vaxing) b/c I just don't trust it as a source. (Yes, now that I'm a non-vaxer/selective-vaxer, I can trust some books that are 100% non-vaxing, but I had to come to that opinion through unbiased education first.) That is the primary reason I liked Dr. Bob's book so much. Sure he personally has a stance on vaxes, but he presents his book without much of his opinion thrown in, so I think you end up with a very middle-of-the-road vax-book so that you can make your own opinion. I mean, really, if this book caused me (a full-vaxer) to become a non-vaxer (or a VERY selective vaxer), then I think that's proof that this book IS beneficial to people in helping them become non-vaxers (if that's your goal) or most definitely in helping them become educated non-vaxers/vaxers (which, personally, is my goal).

Originally Posted by rabrog

A truly unbiased book would be "here is the disease and it's risks/treatments, here is the vaccine for said disease with it's pros/cons" - period. By putting his own vaccine schedule into the book, it is not unbiased.

I totally see what you're saying, but I disagree. His book does say "here's the disease, here's why you might want to get the disease, here's why you might not want to get the disease, here's the vaccine, here's why you might want to get the vax, here's why you might not want to get the vax".

Regarding the schedules he includes... I think it's a great asset to those who ARE wanting to do SOME vaxes, that he has said "If you want to do some vaxes, and are looking for an example of a modified schedule, here's one you might consider." And how awesome that he also says "For those of you who want to get every vax, here's how you can do it by trying to avoid a whole lot of toxins at each time." I just think it's great that he offers solutions to those who are looking for them but aren't able to find them elsewhere. I mean, truly, this is a great resource for vaxers AND non-vaxers alike. (Which, again, is why I'm so perplexed as to why non-vaxing people here would refuse to read this book... and are arguing the book before having even read it. [Jenn, I'm not referring to you. I know I quoted you for this whole post... I'm sorry! Your post just gave me lots of provoking thoughts to share.])

[Electra375]

I think clarification on AP might need to be said...
Just because you consider yourself AP, does not necessarily mean you are "naturally living".
So, to say this vax book is worthy of reading simply based on the fact Dr. Sears wrote it is missing the entire scope of MDC "natural living".
Part of natural living is AP, but AP is not natural living -- thus the cross roads converge.

It's like LLL supports bfing and in that come a lot of AP and babywearing ideals, however, they are strictly bfing in written philosphy.

This forum has been discussing things like alumium long before Dr. Sears wrote his book about the "new mercury". There is nothing new in his book as far as I can tell to make it a gotta jump up and buy it now. I think those who have made their decision to not vax have no need to read something that has a target audience of the mainstream culture. Dr. Sear did not write his book with those who have researched and made their decision in mind, all authors write to a target audience.

I have read some of Dr. Sear's books The Fussy Baby, it was okay. However, The Family Nutrition book IMO was watered down dribble. I know I've read the entire library set and not one bit of information was "new" to me. I think a first time mom would benefit greatly from reading some of his books, but seasoned mothers, not so much.

My main point -- Just because you consider yourself AP, does not mean you are Naturally Living.

[guestmama9911]

So true. Dr Sears doesn't take a specific stance on circumcision, for instance. His book says you don't have to, but that's as far as he goes. He is also not very pro-homebirth in his pregnancy book. AP and Natural Family Living are not identical.

[Tracy]

by the way...

this might be of interest...

http://www.amazon.com/Parents-Concis...4068866&sr=1-2

[p1gg1e]

Originally Posted by rabrog

I'll read it just because it's a higher profile book and if it comes up in conversation I'll be knowlegable about it.

However, I totally understand people saying it's not worth reading. Unless he's going to list some unknown side effect of a vax, it's nothing we haven't read before/heard before. Really, show me something he lists that isn't available anywhere else, that no one has ever seen as a side effect/"benefit" before.

To say non-vaxers aren't interested in it if he's ending with a pro-vax stance is very reasonable. We get the propaganda thrown at us every day. Some of us hear how we're "killing our children" by not vaxing them.:

Non-vaxers are generally (generally, not always) better educated about vaccines than vaxers. Vaxers I know (which is almost all of my friends) give the response of "I vax because it's a) what you're supposed to do, b) what the doctor told me to do, c) what the AAP, CDC, etc. tells us to do and d) don't you know those diseases will kill your child?" When I mention a reaction, I always get a "REALLY? I didn't know that!" even if it's a most basic reaction that they probably should have heard of. I believe everyone should read a few books on both sides of the issue before injecting anything into their kid. Sad truth is, most don't read anything.

A truly unbiased book would be "here is the disease and it's risks/treatments, here is the vaccine for said disease with it's pros/cons" - period. By putting his own vaccine schedule into the book, it is not unbiased.

And Dr. Bob did not coin "attachment parenting" and all that stuff - it was his father, Dr. William Sears.

Jenn

Having grown up unvaccinated and not vaccinating my kids I'm still really happy I bought the book.

[MichelleAnnette]

I found the book very informative but it was really the first (and only so far) reading I did on vaccines. I chose not to vaccinate my son based basically on intuition. I was not vaxed as a baby so that was part of it. The other part of it is that I generally need to be convinced TO DO something as opposed NOT TO DO something. No one convinced me to vax so I didn't do it. We may consider some when he is older - not sure yet.

[Ygle]

Originally Posted by Ozgirls

[FONT="Georgia"][I]Hmmm...what does everyone think of his comments about polio and herd immunity?

Yeah, it really, really bothers me that someone who makes those kinds of statements, "So I have to admit that parents who skip the vaccine aren't really putting their own individual child at risk. BUT they ARE putting our nation's overall public health endeavor to eliminate polio at risk." wants to keep his own choice secret. And it's even weirder to me that he states that he'll usually answer any medical or parenting decision about what he'd do with his own kids but just not when it comes to shots.

[tbavrbab]

During conference, Dr. Robert implied that his preferred schedule was the schedule in the book on pages 236 and 237 which separates all parts of the MMR.

Or at least, that is the schedule he kept comparing to the standard schedule.

The schedule in the book is not the one you have listed below, but as you mentioned, you haven't seen his book yet.

For those interested here is the schedule in the book:

2 months: DTaP, Rota
3 months*: Pc HiB
4 months: DTaP Rota
5 months*: Pc, HiB
6 months: DTaP Rota
7 months*: Pc HiB
9 months: Polio, Flu (2 doses@)
12 months: Mumps Polio
15 months: Pc HiB
18 months: DTaP CP
21 months*: Flu
2 years: Rubella Polio
2 years 6 months: Hep B# Hep A
3 years: Hep B Measles Flu$
3 years 6 months: Hep B Hep A
4 years: DTaP Polio Flu$
5 years: MMR% Flu$
6 years: CP
12 years: Tdap HPV
12 years 2 months: HPV
13 years: HPV Meningococcal^

* These shots are given at shot only visits scheduled with the nurse
@ The flu vax would start btwn 6 and 12 months if nearing flu season then yearly thereafter until 5 years
# Start Hep B at birth if mom, dad, or any close family members are carriers
$ Flu shot given seperately in Oct or Nov
% Even though I gave the first M, M, and R separately, it may be okay to group them together here. Can also split and give separately over a few years.
^ Once meningococcal vax is approved for age 2, I'll move it there and delay Hep B by 6 months.

Quoted from The Vaccine Book, Robert W. Sears, M.D., F.A.A.P. pages 236-237

Originally Posted by holly6737

Anyway, he recommends spacing them out and only giving 2 a visit. But, he recommends you bring them in for extra well baby visits the first year so you can get all of them in. Here's a copy of his practice's schedule:

SEARS FAMILY PEDIATRICS IMMUNIZATION POLICY

Here is our routine schedule of immunizations:

2 months - DTaP, Hib
3 mo - Prevnar
4 months - DTaP, Hib
5 mo - Prevnar
6 months - DTaP, Hib
9 months - Prevnar, Polio
12 months - MMR, Polio (Chickenpox optional)
15 months - Prevnar, Hib
18 months - DTaP, Polio
4 years - DTaP
5 years - MMR, Polio

No Hep B, Hep A, Rotavirus and CP is optional. Haven't read his book though...

[MsGrizzle]

He recommends the flu shot???????

[mamakay]

Originally Posted by soapdiva

He recommends the flu shot???????

For infants, no less...
I'd like to know what evidence he bases that one on...

[MsGrizzle]

Originally Posted by mamakay

For infants, no less...
I'd like to know what evidence he bases that one on...

So much for actually looking at the research...

ETA: So his schedule has ALL vaccines? I thought he was selective?

[jessjgh1]

I checked out the forum he has on vaxes a while back... actually I forgot all about it and had posted a question.

He actually seems to answer quite a bit of the comments- so a few of these questions could be fielded over there-- because you are making excellent points that seem to point to gaps in his knowledge... but I'd love to see his side too (however, I lack the knowledge to pose the question properly iykwim).

Also, there seems to be some people posted there about this forum here-- some posting positively and others not.

Jessica