Why? - Page 2

[Juvysen]

Originally Posted by L'lee

I read a book that my sister has about potty training that had a short section about "early potty training" that talked about how it could be psychologically damaging to put pressure on children before they were ready and that babies have no control over their bladders or sphincters until something like 2 or 3 years. My sister actually encouraged me to read it because she was worried for her nephew! I explained to her that while I agree with the pressure statement, that its not about that at ALL rather its about learning to communicate about a need, and that regarding the abilities to control bladder and sphincter, well just observe for yourself! I think a lot of people are scared by those kinds of statements from "experts" (who may be getting funding from Pampers? NO! Never! LOL!) which is really too bad. I was surprised at how negative this author seemed and I can see why people would be scared if they didn't have much additional information.

Interesting... I actually read a book (called "potty free before 3") that sort of advocates a late EC... which is what we did w/my DD. it's a very low pressure approach, and we haven't put any pressure on her to go, really, just sort of treat it like a part of life as we have with, say, eating solids. She's really into it, though and gets SO excited when she potties. She's been having good days lately, I call them "one diaper days" but she also took a LONG potty pause for about 4 months. Before that she was going 3 or 4 times a day... whenever I put her on the potty. *shrug* I don't really approve of most of the "mainstream" parenting practices... for instance, my husband's cousin was actually PROUD of the fact that her completely non-pottying 2 year old only gets 3 diapers a day. To me, that sounds like child abuse, but who am I to say, I guess : ew.

[savienu]

Lexmas, I relate to the anxiety over the non-accepting relatives making you have more misses. I guess I feel like I have something to "prove" to them, so I'm really focused on that rather than on actually listening to my son and taking him potty when he needs to go, YKWIM?

[Evergreen]

Most of the moms in my mom's group know I do a modified EC. My dd just turned one and our first outing in underwear was to story time at the library where she both peed and pooped in her pants.

I had never done it in public because I don't want anyone thinking EC is dumb, doesn't work or I am pushing my child to do something for which she is not ready.

I have decided, though, to start slowly and keep her in the underwear for short outings like story hour.

[lexmas]

savienu- you know, I think I worry that they'll think I'm taking ds to the bathroom too much, and when he has to go I dismiss it, like, oh, he just went. If they weren't there, I certainly wouldn't do that! And then I feel bad lol. I think I just hate feeling like I'm the ONLY exposure these people are ever going to get to EC, and I want to do a good job! Which is rediculous, since the people who just think I'm trained aren't going to believe it anyway. But it just makes me mad, if I was the only one trained, he wouldn't go when I take him to the bathroom. Or he would just pee in little bits all day, not all at once. Or any number of things that show that we're communicating! I feel like it belittles the wonderful job my ds does at naturally communicating with me when they think EC is stupid or not working. And, honestly, it just hurts my feelings! Lol, I'm too sensitive about these things!

As for mentioning it to other people, sometimes my friend says, "I wonder what my ds would do if I held him over the toilet" when she's holding her son and knows he's pooping. That frustrates me...and I want to take him and hold him over the toilet so he doesn't have to poop on himself. If only MY ds was that obvious of a pooper!

I think it's just hard because we know other mom's might judge us, because we all know mom's love to play the game of who's a better parent. And no one likes to be criticized for doing something that we truly feel is better for our children. I think it's especially hard at the beginning, when you're not sure this actually works at all! It's probably easier when you can just point to your other kid, and be like, well, we did it with him and he turned out great! But maybe that's just wishful thinking, lol...

[L'lee]

My DS has been peeing a lot less for quite some time now, generally only every 2-3 hours(with exceptions) since he was no more than 12 mos. That really helps with relatives, because its not uncommon to change a diaper that often. (Though, 3 diapers a day... You sure they don't EC? ) Our close family all know what we're doing anyways. We visited my aunt and uncle recently (stayed in a hotel - DH had a work conference and we went along for the ride) and I took DS to the potty at their house several times and they had no clue!

I agree that it will be easier the second time around, not necessarily just b/c you can point to your grad but b/c you will have the internal security and confidence.

Lexmas, you should say to you friend "why don't you try and see what happens?" Maybe she is just looking for someone to say that's not such a crazy idea after all. Or maybe I'm just being optimistic.

[Ironica]

I'm neither one to flaunt it or to hide it, really. When DS was an infant, I'd ask where the bathroom was, and sometimes people would offer to hold him. Then I'd explain that he was the one who needed it, then they'd offer a spot to change him in. *Then* I'd say "No, actually, he hasn't gone yet, but he needs to... so I'd like to take him to the toilet."

I've honestly never gotten an out-and-out NEGATIVE reaction, and I've told tons and tons of people about EC by now. ;-) I've had people say things like "Wow! That's amazing! I could NEVER do that!" which I really, really don't get. ;-) People who don't have kids and don't have much experience with kids seem to be even more open-minded about it.

The line my husband came up with, which I've adopted, is "Well, as it turns out, babies are born with an instinct to NOT pee and poop in their pants." From there, EC makes perfect sense. Once you explain how diaper-training works, people at least get from a theoretical perspective that EC is more logical. Then it's just the details of how you adapt it to *your* life.

Another point that's come up more in the last year or so is that it really IS developmentally appropriate. While my son was a grad in underwear full-time by 14 months, he did not start taking *responsibility* for his elimination until maybe the last six months or so. Just like his friends who were newly potty-trained, we'd have to ask him if he needed to go, remind him to go at key times (before bed, before leaving the house, etc.) and if we didn't mention it for long enough, he'd have "uh-oh pants" before he noticed he needed to go. Even though we could totally get all the pee and poop in the potty (barring illness or allergy exposure), it was still up to us to keep track of it.

Even though he's at an age now where most of his peers are out of diapers, he's still ahead of the curve, though. His preschool teacher was commenting the other day at what good "control" he has, and how amazing it is that he's never had wet pants as long as he's been there (he started at this school in July, just after his 3rd birthday). Well, duh. He's been doing this his WHOLE LIFE!

[HappyFox05]

I just don't get the "you're the one who's trained" comment. Well, duh, of course parents are trained to respond to their childrens' needs! Are you telling me that people who don't EC aren't trained to change diapers?

[lexmas]

HappyFox05...while that makes sense to US, I think they think that since they can do that at their own leisure instead of when their child needs it, they're less trained. Not that I would be proud of responding to my child in MY time not HIS time, but seems to be the norm. It just frustrates me because they think my ds just happens to pee when I take him to the bathroom, and that he's not participating. Even after they see it. Drives. Me. Crazy.

[HappyFox05]

Originally Posted by lexmas

HappyFox05...while that makes sense to US, I think they think that since they can do that at their own leisure instead of when their child needs it, they're less trained. Not that I would be proud of responding to my child in MY time not HIS time, but seems to be the norm. It just frustrates me because they think my ds just happens to pee when I take him to the bathroom, and that he's not participating. Even after they see it. Drives. Me. Crazy.

Ah, ok, makes sense. I've told DH about EC & he's very supportive. I've also mentioned it to two crunchy friends, but that's it. I like some of your responses, such as "every poo or pee I catch is one we don't have to clean up and one diaper we've saved". I'll have to remember that when "Why?" comes up.

[eastmillcreekmama]

I have a friend/neighbor who has raised several children. When he first saw my DD use the potty, he thought it was amazing, and asked how I knew she was going to go. Then another of his friends has a baby they are doing EC with (they are also friends of ours.)

THey said our friend said "Oh, I see you're doing the three year potty training. You know, it only takes two weeks if you wait until they're ready." : Maybe his wife changed all the poopy diapers?! And I have a hard time believing that traditional PL takes two weeks. Kids have accidents for years. At least our total time dealing iwth it will be less!

I was also VERY shy about it when out in public at first, but now I don't really care. It works for us and for DD, and we have accidents, but so do older kids we know, 2, 3, and 4 yo. I was a little sad, though, when my aunt asked me to bring some "pee protection" for DD when we visit next week, so she doesn't "christen the rugs". I'm a little sad that i will need to honor her request by using backup diapers on DD, when normally she is naked or in underwear. We will adapt, and it will work out, but getting the dipes on and off again to do the EC is SO much more difficult. I have struggled, too, with how DD is more likely to have accidents at home. If people visit us here, they see her peeing on the floor allt he time, but when we're not at home, she is usually dry.

Anyway, I'm rambling, but suffice it to say, everyone has an opinion, about EC or any other parenting choice. We just have to do what's right for us and our babies, or at least what we THINK it right, and that's that.

[hipumpkins]

Eastmillcreekmama; have you tried training underwear or one wet pants so this way you can honor your aunt (I totally understand her perspective) and not have to deal with the difficult on and of diapers?

[hipumpkins]

it only takes two weeks if you wait until they're ready."

Check out the toddler section of this board to see how "easy' it is when they are "ready".
Kids as old as 4 are still in diapers..that does not sound easy to me.

I know you weren't saying it was easy...

[Ironica]

Originally Posted by HappyFox05

I just don't get the "you're the one who's trained" comment. Well, duh, of course parents are trained to respond to their childrens' needs! Are you telling me that people who don't EC aren't trained to change diapers?

While I've never had that response aimed at me (oh, don't I wish), my reflex is to respond "Ummm... you mean parenting works better if you *don't* learn anything?"

As for the general "Why?" as in "Why are you doing it this way?" my primary reason, before we even had our son, was "I *remember* potty-training. It wasn't any fun."

As for the "3-year" remark... (1) I don't see how spending 3 years changing diapers is better than spending 3 years taking a child to the potty; and (2) we were graduates by 14 months. Granted, DS was getting close to 3 before he started taking responsibility for it himself, but it still had been AGES since I'd had to wipe an entire poop off his butt.

[srs]

For me, it has to do with feeling judged, and trying to decide who I want to share it with. We're still in the closet with everyone except my parents. We visited them recently and took the BBLP and my Dad commented that he had never seen a potty trained 7 month old before. I tried to explain that she wasn't actually potty trained, but he thought the idea was cool and said he had no doubt that she was learning. My mom is getting her own BBLP so we don't have to bring ours.
But I think if I brought the BBLP to my inlaws it would be a whole different story. I figure if I'm not comfortable telling them, then for sure we're going to have more misses.
I wish I had the confidence to say whatever, it's my kid, and parent around others the same way I do at home.

[fiikske]

chance to be in China

Hi,

we had the chance to be in China, which made it much easier to put EC into practice (where all babies are being EC'ed). With this background, it was also very easy to come out with my ideas. And nobody thinks I'm crazy not officially perhaps

And I must say, ECing was such a positive adventure for all of us, that I can't wait to hold my next little baby in my arms, being attentive to his/her needs from day one (instead of week 10).

Regards,
Fiikske