Membrane Stripping

[dinahx]

What can we do to end this practice? It is so barbaric, IMO! I hate to read about it being done without consent!

[Jane]

What about if the mother asks for it? Many certainly do.

If consent is the issue, then make consent the issue. I think many of the problems that women face are due to lack of request.

[neverdoingitagain]

Originally Posted by dinahx

What can we do to end this practice? It is so barbaric, IMO! I hate to read about it being done without consent!

I'm very curious, why is membrane stripping bad?
I agree it shouldn't be done without consent, but otherwise, why is it barbaric?

[CookieMonsterMommy]

Originally Posted by neverdoingitagain

I agree it shouldn't be done without consent, but otherwise, why is it barbaric?

It can be incredibly painful (esp for a mama who is just expecting a vag. exam), it can tear the cervix, it increases risk of infection, and really, it's just another way of screwing with nature.

[Reha]

There is also the (small) risk that your membranes will be accidently broken.

[CookieMonsterMommy]

Originally Posted by Lennon

There is also the (small) risk that your membranes will be accidently broken.

Define accidentally.

For a lot of docs and medwives I think this would be an added bonus.

[Reha]

Originally Posted by CookieMonsterMommy

Define accidentally.

For a lot of docs and medwives I think this would be an added bonus.

:

[CookieMonsterMommy]

(but wipe the smile off his face)

It's like a "Well hey there! The water broke! Now you'll definitely have this baby within the next 24-48 hrs"

[1stimestar]

But for some it is not painful or uncomfortable at all, or any more then any regular vaginal exam, and could keep them from a chemical induction.

[Jane]

You know, it's not a bonus for me. If I break someone's water at a prenatal visit, I've pretty much guarenteed a scheduling problem. If it's morning, I'd have to cancel other people's appointments. If it's in the afternoon or evening, I've been at clinic all day and and then up all night directly after. It's okay, but I wouldn't plan it that way.
I never mind canceling things when neccesary, but why bring it on? Perhaps if someone else was on call for the births, I'd feel differently, but it doesn't make a lot of sense to me, unless there's something I'm missing.

[CookieMonsterMommy]

Originally Posted by 1stimestar

But for some it is not painful or uncomfortable at all, or any more then any regular vaginal exam, and could keep them from a chemical induction.

This is true as well.

Although one could argue that a woman would need nothing but her own refusal to avoid a chemical induction.

But I do see what you're saying, and I agree that it can be a good alternative if not only the lesser of a dozen evils.

It is not without it's own set of risks just because it's chemical free. I think it's important that women know that, as it is part of informed decision making.

[CookieMonsterMommy]

Originally Posted by Apricot

You know, it's not a bonus for me.
........
Perhaps if someone else was on call for the births, I'd feel differently, but it doesn't make a lot of sense to me, unless there's something I'm missing.

I hope you didn't think I meant all childbirth practitioners, because I didn't. I deal with mainly group practices...strip a womans membranes on Tuesday or Wednesday with the hopes she'll deliver by the weekend. If her water breaks-it's a done deal. Just send her to the hospital for the residents or your partner to "monitor" and pit her up!

When I worked in a private practice (I'm an RN at a hospital now), there was a whole lotta stripping going on before the Holidays, whether mama was 38 weeks or 41....That's all I'm sayin....

And a lot of times, the woman would comment "Wow, that one really hurt" only to be told "Oh, that's normal. I just stripped your membranes. You want to get this moving, don't you?" Peppered with something like: "You poor thing, look at those swollen ankles".

[MsBlack]

Membrane stripping without consent would not happen nearly so much if:

women did not lay down and spread legs for any internal exams prior to onset of active labor;

women made sure, repeatedly throughout prenatal period, that their care providers knew, in no uncertain terms, that it is MOM who is in charge of care, NOT HCP;

women would stop reading things like 'what to expect', or at least only read it knowing that that book is essentially 'basic training' in how to be a nice, compliant patient for your HCP's convenience and ego-comfort. If they would only read it mainly as a way to 'know thine enemy' and be forewarned/prepared to deal with what the med model expects of women;

women would come to love their beautiful powerful bodies and know with full confidence that pregnancy and birth are normal events that do best with support rather than interference and do not, most of the time, require a medical person's 'help', supervision, etc--and that even when a particular woman or pregnancy does seem to need med help, that it is still her right and responsibility to be The One In Charge;

Membrane stripping, and other useless 'routine' actions by HCPs, will stop when women stop accepting them.

[JanetF]

Ok well what she said ^^. I can't stamp out something I don't do

[neverdoingitagain]

Thank you for your replies! I was told by my doctor that we could start stripping the membranes at 38 weeks(I have factor V leiden, and will be off meds from week 38 until I give birth) to prevent me from going "overdue" too much. If I want. He made it clear that I could refuse internal exams, and the stripping.
Well, honestly, I don't know how he could have made me do it anyway.I really don't see how he can make me do anything I don't want to do

[NamastePlatypus]

Originally Posted by CookieMonsterMommy

I hope you didn't think I meant all childbirth practitioners, because I didn't. I deal with mainly group practices...strip a womans membranes on Tuesday or Wednesday with the hopes she'll deliver by the weekend. If her water breaks-it's a done deal. Just send her to the hospital for the residents or your partner to "monitor" and pit her up!

When I worked in a private practice (I'm an RN at a hospital now), there was a whole lotta stripping going on before the Holidays, whether mama was 38 weeks or 41....That's all I'm sayin....

And a lot of times, the woman would comment "Wow, that one really hurt" only to be told "Oh, that's normal. I just stripped your membranes. You want to get this moving, don't you?" Peppered with something like: "You poor thing, look at those swollen ankles".

::::
I know what you are talking about! I had a great caretaker with e and he asked and I said no and he laughed and said good girl. THis time I am not having any vaginal exams and a midwife so I know this won't be a problem,
By the way, LOVE your siggie, I would love to have e in a shirt with that on it!

[NamastePlatypus]

Originally Posted by MsBlack

Membrane stripping without consent would not happen nearly so much if:

women did not lay down and spread legs for any internal exams prior to onset of active labor;

women made sure, repeatedly throughout prenatal period, that their care providers knew, in no uncertain terms, that it is MOM who is in charge of care, NOT HCP;

women would stop reading things like 'what to expect', or at least only read it knowing that that book is essentially 'basic training' in how to be a nice, compliant patient for your HCP's convenience and ego-comfort. If they would only read it mainly as a way to 'know thine enemy' and be forewarned/prepared to deal with what the med model expects of women;

women would come to love their beautiful powerful bodies and know with full confidence that pregnancy and birth are normal events that do best with support rather than interference and do not, most of the time, require a medical person's 'help', supervision, etc--and that even when a particular woman or pregnancy does seem to need med help, that it is still her right and responsibility to be The One In Charge;

Membrane stripping, and other useless 'routine' actions by HCPs, will stop when women stop accepting them.

:

[dinahx]

I just feel like the Onus is on the HCP to investigate whether their practices are evidence based or not! Membrane stripping happens to so many many women and it is not as a last ditch effort to avoid a chemical induction. It is as a routine procedure starting at 38 weeks. When they tell mothers that it is rountine and it works, they are engaging in Health Care Fraud, IMO. I haven't seen convincing evidence that it works AT ALL.

I understand that mamas have some responsiblity here. But we can't all be super informed superstars! Some mamas are young, some don't speak English, etc. etc. How is vaginal assault (sorry that's how I regard routing membrane stripping) any more acceptable if the mama doesn't know enough to say no?

[Ellie'sMom]

Originally Posted by dinahx

I just feel like the Onus is on the HCP to investigate whether their practices are evidence based or not! Membrane stripping happens to so many many women and it is not as a last ditch effort to avoid a chemical induction. It is as a routine procedure starting at 38 weeks. When they tell mothers that it is rountine and it works, they are engaging in Health Care Fraud, IMO. I haven't seen convincing evidence that it works AT ALL.

I understand that mamas have some responsiblity here. But we can't all be super informed superstars! Some mamas are young, some don't speak English, etc. etc. How is vaginal assault (sorry that's how I regard routing membrane stripping) any more acceptable if the mama doesn't know enough to say no?

:

I think the characterization of all women who get their membranes stripped as women who are completely uninformed and only read What to expect is really unfair. I had dd at a free standing birth center with CNMs. I thought I was in charge of my care. I knew that vag. exams were mostly unnecessary, but when offered one at 39 weeks, "just to get some idea" it was too tempting. When I had to grab dh's hand and breath through the most painful vag. exam of my life, she said, "I'm trying to help get the prostaglandins going." Then my water broke.

You know, even Sears birth book, didn't warn me that could happen. It wasn't until years later, from hanging out on this board that I realized what had happened. And I'm a healthcare provider. I was neither young, nor uninformed. I was, in my opinion assaulted. Don't lay the blame for that on me.

Yes, of course women need to reclaim our bodies and our births, but let's put the blame for this where it belongs. We shouldn't have to set up an adversarial relationship with our providers in order to get the care we want.

I have to say that it reminds me a bit of saying that there would be fewer rapes if women would just stop walking the streets alone at night.

[dinahx]

ITA Ellie's Mom! And if women are told that it WILL put them into labor and consent after that, that is NOT informed consent, IMO. I think that they should have to hand out an information sheet, get signatures, disclose that it doesn't always work, AND that it has significant risks.

Also, I don't think it should even be "offered", given the evidence. That is like, IMO, if every doctor "offered" a woman turning 18 a boob job or the equally reprehensible practice of "offering" new parents circumcision. It should HAVE to be upon request only.

I am SO sorry to hear that even women HERE on MDC are being/have been assaulted. We have to have some way to report this type of incident without lawsuits, to save other mamas from the same trouble.