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Are we in the END TIMES? - Page 3

post #41 of 69

I don't think we are in the end times... no.
post #42 of 69
I can recall several times during my lifetime when people have professed the world will end on such and such a date, and yet I'm still sitting here, so I don't pay much attention to these people who claim the world will end and this is why. When the powers that be decide it's time for us to go, I'm sure that they'll let us know. Until then I'm going to live my life as well as I can, protect the Earth, love my family and friends and try to spread a little happiness. If not believing in what the various Christian/Catholic churches teach condemns me to hell or some other place, well, I feel confident I'll be in good company, as I've met many wonderful people just like me.
post #43 of 69
No, I don't. Apocalypticism is always destructive; if it doesn't happen, people will MAKE it happen in some sense (think Waco).
post #44 of 69
Be love. Be peace.

I know it sounds corny, but the only person you can change is yourself. If you EMBODY love, and EMBODY peace, then you will change the world just in changing yourself. Change your perspective. Try a day of it. Live today without anger or fear. Live today BEING love and BEING peace in everything you do. See how your interaction with others changes as you exude these qualities. It will amaze you.
post #45 of 69
I am a Christian and I DO believe that we are living in the end times.

Just wanted to add- I saw a funny bumper sticker once it said "Jesus is coming back; look busy"
post #46 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by UptownZoo View Post
No, I don't. Apocalypticism is always destructive; if it doesn't happen, people will MAKE it happen in some sense (think Waco).

I really agree with this. Something I have thought to myself
for a while now.
post #47 of 69
I think we are coming towards the end, but at this moment in time I don't believe we are in Messianic era. A lot of political prophetic events had not happened yet.
post #48 of 69
This isn't a support thread so it is being moved to Religious Studies....

Peace,

Heartmama
post #49 of 69
I think if you believe this you should step back for a bit and really dig into history. You could pin the "end times" on any era in human history, and some of the people living during those eras did claim they were living in the time of the end. I'm talking in like the 1500's, people wrote about all of the signs being fulfilled, and the end was sure to come very very soon.

It is not good to raise children believing that their world will soon be coming to an end. Especially if your beliefs include that a certain small group of people will make it, and everyone else will die. When children have to live with this reality, that all their friends and possibly grandparents or other relatives will soon die, it can be extremely destructive to their psyche. It is a very bad thing actually, and it happened to me as a child so I know. It creates an unatural hyper vigilance that can cause anxiety, depression, panic attacks, etc. Read this web site to find out more of the psychological implications of such a belief.

Of course if you truly believe this, then what I just said wont matter, because it doesn't make any difference if your child is slightly damaged in the present if they will have an eternal future with God, right? But consider that I have been told that the end would come within five years for my entire 31 years in my former religion. Dh's parents have been told the same thing, for 55 years. Dh's Grandparents have been told the same thing for almost 80 years. And so on. Is it worth the possible damage to your children to raise them to think that there will soon be a doomsday scenario playing out before their eyes? The end never came and here Dh and I are with no college education, and many damaging effects to our psyche because of this belief that our parents taught us.
post #50 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by jennica View Post
Of course if you truly believe this, then what I just said wont matter, because it doesn't make any difference if your child is slightly damaged in the present if they will have an eternal future with God, right?
WOW! I don't really know how to respond to that. Because I DO believe this. And my children are not now nor have they ever been "damaged" by our beliefs.

I am so sorry for your personal trauma, but please don't lay that on my door step.
post #51 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Meiri View Post
People have been thinking this since the 10th century, if not earlier.

Don't hold your breath.

My gut reaction to statements like the title is usually "according to which religion/culture?
:

I think it's very romantic to think we are in the 'end times.' Makes us special, yk? Special and tragic.

It kind of reminds me of all the people who think they were Cleopatra in a former life.
post #52 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by thismama View Post
:

I think it's very romantic to think we are in the 'end times.' Makes us special, yk? Special and tragic.

It kind of reminds me of all the people who think they were Cleopatra in a former life.



Wait a minute...I am Cleopatra! What are you trying to say? Huh?:

FWIW: Everything my former Catholic faith taught me about Revelation, etc. and all the End Times stuff, IIRC is that JC/G/HS had no intention of us knowing when he would return. We had to live our lives according to His teachings, pray, etc. We have no business worrying about His return, it's not up to us.

All this rapture predictor stuff and sites like those are just more fodder for the masses. More stuff to get us all hyped up, spend our money, and create more strife, death, and hatred in the world. Sounds like something "you-know-who" would like if you ask me...

Wouldn't it be more worthwhile to spend the very little time we do have here on earth walking the good walk...of course good according to whom and what cultural context is a whole other discussion...
post #53 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by 2crazykids View Post
All this rapture predictor stuff and sites like those are just more fodder for the masses. More stuff to get us all hyped up, spend our money, and create more strife, death, and hatred in the world. Sounds like something "you-know-who" would like if you ask me...
I've said the same thing, when I have done some bible stuff with a JW friend.
The God I believe in, wouldn't want us feeling these negative feeligns - panic, anxiety, worry...but instead wants us to live NOW, treat each other well NOW, and let Him handle all the rapture business.
post #54 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kidzaplenty View Post
WOW! I don't really know how to respond to that. Because I DO believe this. And my children are not now nor have they ever been "damaged" by our beliefs.
But how would you know? My Mom went through a phase where she believed this when I was in my mid to late teens. Even being exposed to it at that mature age, I feel in retrospect that this was damaging and actually led me away from God. You don't really know what's going on inside your children's minds.
post #55 of 69
I don't think it hurts to wonder if we are in the End Times. I think every age has felt they were in the "end times."

Heck, even the early Christians felt it was the end times right after Jesus' Ascenscion!

At any rate, it's probably good for one's salvation to be living like any day could be your last - keep you on the path of the straight and narrow and all that.
post #56 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by HerthElde View Post
There will be a shift in consciousness throughout all of humanity.



If you are curious about some really interesting material on this topic, you should read some Catholic prophecy. They all say essentially the same thing.

A good one that compiles almost twenty centuries worth of Catholic Prophecy is this book:

Catholic Prophecy: The Coming Chastisement by Yves DuPont

God has always historically given the world a warning before He chastises it, and so that 'shift in consciousness' will be the Warning before the Great Chastisement. The Warning will be an event where everyone in the world is given the view of their soul as God Himself sees it. This will be so incredibly frightening that a few people may die from it, but it will bring about the conversion of many sinners, while increasing the fervor and devotion of the just. Of course, there will also be those who are obstinate in the face of the Warning and still refuse to recognize God.

Then the Great Chastisement will come (also known as the Three Days of Darkness) and there will be a short period of peace following. After that will be the Final Battle and then Christ's Second Coming in triumph to end this world.

Google the Apparition of Our Lady of Garabandal Spain, which has more info on these prophecies.
post #57 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kidzaplenty View Post
WOW! I don't really know how to respond to that. Because I DO believe this. And my children are not now nor have they ever been "damaged" by our beliefs.

I am so sorry for your personal trauma, but please don't lay that on my door step.
It doesn't generally become aparant while a child is still a child or a teenager, especially if they still live with their parents. I didn't become undone until I was 31, and I suffered a secondary trauma. Some kids come undone as teenagers, some as adults, some never do they just live with the depression and anxiety and the thought that the end is coming soon for the rest of their lives. Did you read the link I reffered to? I'm sorry if you feel I was personally targeting you, I am just reminding parents that their are larger reprucussions to these types of beliefs than they would ever imagine if they were not raised that way.
post #58 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChasingPeace View Post
But how would you know? My Mom went through a phase where she believed this when I was in my mid to late teens. Even being exposed to it at that mature age, I feel in retrospect that this was damaging and actually led me away from God. You don't really know what's going on inside your children's minds.
Actually, I have BTDT. I was raised from an infant with the same beliefs. And I am not traumatized. Nor are my children. It's not like we go around teaching the children that the world is crashing down and evil is upon us. There are very tactful ways of explaining and teaching what is to come. I, nor my children have, ever had any fear over the future. And we do live in the present. My children have a future planned out. They will be going to college, working on their careers or callings, and continuing with life. But just with the knowledge that the end is coming one day soon. However, that is equivocated with "Our soon and God's soon may not be the same".

Quote:
Originally Posted by jennica View Post
It doesn't generally become apparent while a child is still a child or a teenager, especially if they still live with their parents. I didn't become undone until I was 31, and I suffered a secondary trauma. Some kids come undone as teenagers, some as adults, some never do they just live with the depression and anxiety and the thought that the end is coming soon for the rest of their lives. Did you read the link I referred to? I'm sorry if you feel I was personally targeting you, I am just reminding parents that their are larger repercussions to these types of beliefs than they would ever imagine if they were not raised that way.
I don't feel personally "targeted", but the statement was directed at all that believed this way, at least that is how I read it, therefore, it included me. No, I have not checked out that link. I have not had the time and it really does not draw my interest, although I may check it out at some point. Again, I am sorry you suffered trauma, but me and my children have not. We are happy and thriving. Fear is not of God. Anxiety is not of God. So, if fear and anxiety are involved then there must a reevaluation or more getting in touch with God. We have no fear or anxiety over the future. What comes will come, will come, we can not help it or stop it, all we can do it be prepared for it.
post #59 of 69
All who are concerned with the cultural implications of "end time watching" should watch the piece that Bill Moyers did on American Zionism. Brilliant, and profoundly disturbing. You can watch it online at pbs.org or get it at the itunes store (for free) from the podcasts. If you don't have an mp3 player, you can burn it to a cd and listen to it that way.

Make no mistake, this is BIG business! Not that most of the people who are at the front of the current wave of apocalypticism don't believe it (I think that most of them do), but that doesn't mitigate the fact that they are getting massively wealthy off of book sales, speaker fees, etc. The piece that the OP linked to is a church in my city, and it is a massive church. Five services minimum a week, thousands and thousands in attendance in every service. The only other church in our town that's as big as that one is also a community of end times believers. This is a cultural force that demands our attention.

I think this piece has some great information, and the last bit called "The Apocalyptic Worldview" is especially germane to this conversation.

One key point is that apocalypticism is never an isolated phenomenon; it frequently shows up in times of broad change in the culture. Well, actually, change in the culture leads to a rise in fundamentalism (not referring specifically to Christian fundamentalism here, though that's what we see in the US right now; it's true of other religions, too, including big ones (Islam, Judaism, etc.) and tiny sects). And extreme fundamentalism tends to breed apocalypticism.

The psychology of it is not exactly complex. Cultural change is frightening, and the upheaval we're in right now is unprecedented in human history. I'm always stunned when I stop to think about how fast the world is changing. My mom's childhood (she was born in 1947) and my childhood (I was born in 1971) were not significantly different. But the differences between my childhood and my children's (born in 1993, 1995, 1997, and 2002) are huge. The changes in our culture leave us without firm definitions for anything, including our identities, and I think it's somewhat natural to want to create a black/white worldview, to simplify and define and find a way to feel safe
post #60 of 69
Quote:
Originally Posted by ChasingPeace View Post
This is exactly what I'm talking about. If you (not you, personally, of course) believe that you will be escaping the worst of what you believe is to come, then you will not be working to prevent these types of horrors. A danger of dispensationalism is that it causes people to see horrific events and developments as something to be happy about because it confirms (in their minds) that the time of Jesus' return is at hand. I remember reading posts on sites I visit about how excited people were that we were going to war with Iraq for precisely this reason. Sorry, but I don't think Jesus would be pleased.
Exactly.

Quote:
Originally Posted by maplesugar View Post
I seems like if you believe in the "end times" as dictated in the bible ny various men, you would want to be loving like Jesus. I t is really self defeating to be spewing such hatred like "invade Iraq for Jesus". Jesus supposidly said to live for today and to love you enemies.
If i did believe in the raputer it seems ad though Jesus would take those who actually follow his commandments to LOVE.
On a related not, I watched the movie documantary Jesus Camp last night, and was disturbed on so many levels, not the least of which the adults were imparting this millenarian belief upon childre. There was actually a mother homeschooling her boys to believe that global waming was nothing to worry about. Probably because she believes they will all be raptured anyways so why listed to science.
The earth is but ours to exploit and when it is all ruined, Jesus will come back and rescue all the righteous? This is very dangerous, IMO.
Totally.

Quote:
Originally Posted by PB's Mom View Post
Has anyone watched the link that I originally posted? Just wanted some comments on what Mr.Rosenberg had to say about all of this.
Frankly, I am so upset I watched that. I have seen Mr Rosenberg talk a few times on BookTV and stuff and usually I like him and even though we don't share beliefs I thought his books sounded interesting.

But after watching the link, he makes my stomach turn now. I had no idea that was the real him. He came across very differently there than he has the times I have seen him before.



_____________________



And I am scared by the people who are anticipating the "end times" to happen in our generation. I feel like theya re almost causing something really bad to happen. In a self-fulfiling prophesy sort of way. They have no reason to care about the world, just themselves and their "souls". I wonder if that is why there are all those Christian groups trying to hurry and help as many Jews as possible get over to Israel. And president Bush is no help, sounding the horns and declaring god is on our side and garbage like that.
Quote:
Bush believes he was called by God to lead the nation at this time, says Commerce Secretary Don Evans, a close friend who talks with Bush every day.
http://www.beliefnet.com/story/121/story_12112_1.html
Quote:
During that speech, Bush said, "Freedom and fear, justice and cruelty, have always been at war, and we know that God is not neutral between them."
Quote:
In his State of the Union address last month, Bush said that we place confidence in the loving God "behind all of life, and all of history" and that "we go forward with confidence, because this call of history has come to the right country. May He guide us now."
This kind of stuff must just be fueling the end times believers. And I think it gives them reason to support these crazy acts of war because it is god's will, good and evil. It's madness!
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