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Sad for my daughter - Page 6

post #101 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by l_olive View Post

Bottom line.

Both sexes deserve to have intact genitals, and when adults, to have sexual relationships with partners with intact genitals. The OP has simply been saddened by the possibility that this won't be the case for her child.

Shouldn't be so dramatic, huh?
She said it well, I think that is the whole point of this.

I think some others here likely have a concern that marrying a circumcised man may mean their daughters may be seriously pressured to circumcise as well.

I met a man who had his son circ'd as a baby though he regretted it horribly (he was intact, his wife/doctor pressured him). He talked to his son about circumcision, but his son didn't want to hear it. When their son was old enough, got married and had twin boys...you guessed it, the boys where circ'd. He couldn't get through to his son.

I have to hope that I teach my family well enough through word and example, and that they will think logically, not be pressured by societal trends. But, ultimately as long as it is a choice in society all babies are at risk.
post #102 of 141
I was not arguing that sex would not be different if your daughter's future hypothetical male partner were circ'd as opposed to intact. Obviously it will be. Just as it will be different if he's especially large or small, if he's super tall, super short, really submissive, full of peircings etc. etc. My point is that there are so many variables to consider regarding her sex life that the best thing IMO is to let her be and let the worries subside.

I have had sex and relationships with intact men, circ'd men, women, and in my experience, neither a foreskin nor a penis is necessary for the sexual gratification or fulfillment of the woman. The level of fulfillment in my sex life has always exclusively been based upon the level of communication and chemistry I have had with my partners. It is simply not based on physicalities.

I understand that some women reach orgasm without clitoral stimulation. I do sometimes! I get it. But my point in bringing that up is to illustrate that the penis (and male foreskin) are not necessary for a woman to have a fulfilling sex life and in fact, most women in good healhty relationships (with themselves and others) have fulfilling sex lives regardless of the physical characteristics of their partner.

I understand that there are many circ complications on this board and many women (and men) here have suffered a great deal because of them. But in general, I think it's really quite cruel and shallow to judge whether or not to love and accept someone as a partner based on the physical state of any part of them (including their penis'). I think that's pretty mean, and shallow personally .
post #103 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama View Post
I understand that there are many circ complications on this board and many women (and men) here have suffered a great deal because of them. But in general, I think it's really quite cruel and shallow to judge whether or not to love and accept someone as a partner based on the physical state of any part of them (including their penis'). I think that's pretty mean, and shallow personally .
post #104 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama View Post
But in general, I think it's really quite cruel and shallow to judge whether or not to love and accept someone as a partner based on the physical state of any part of them (including their penis'). I think that's pretty mean, and shallow personally .
I'm sorry, but I must have missed the post where someone said that s/he wouldn't love or accept a partner based on the state of their genitals. Could you direct me?
post #105 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by l_olive View Post
I'm sorry, but I must have missed the post where someone said that s/he wouldn't love or accept a partner based on the state of their genitals. Could you direct me?
pg 2
Quote:
...i know i cant be with a man that is cut because I have had cut the past. so i know that the sex sucks and i dont enjoy it. I cant fall for someone who is not whole because this is a major thing that effects the whole relationship and YES i do ask....
post #106 of 141
I'd be curious to know what parents plan to teach daughters about circumcision. I'm thinking through what and when I will educate my sons about circumcision as well.

I hope that when parents inform their children about circ, it's not in a framework that demeans individuals who have suffered circumcision.

As for whether a daughter's future partner is a circed male or not, I see both points -- yes, it's a shame that there are so many circed men and boys in the US, yes it has impact on sexuality, and yes, there is more to life, sex and successful relationships than penis status.

I hope that my children find their soulmates and have satisfying sex lives. As for the details.... that's not as important to me.

I think it's odd that a parent would actively encourage their child to choose a partner based on any physical characteristic. I think it's possibly over controlling to suggest a child go to Europe to develop familiarity with intact penises, I think it's best to let the child choose their life partner based on their desires and chemistry with others.

I would hate to see children trained to reject future partners because of penis status.
post #107 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama View Post
and in fact, most women in good healthy relationships (with themselves and others) have fulfilling sex lives regardless of the physical characteristics of their partner.
I find this statement disturbing. It appears to denigrate many women on this board who have posted very personal, painful things about their experiences of circumcised sex. I am not in their shoes, but if I had shared my story, the way they have, and then read this comment, I would be deeply hurt.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama View Post
I understand that there are many circ complications on this board and many women (and men) here have suffered a great deal because of them. But in general, I think it's really quite cruel and shallow to judge whether or not to love and accept someone as a partner based on the physical state of any part of them (including their penis'). I think that's pretty mean, and shallow personally .
This is a red herring. One person (as far as I'm aware) has made such a statement on this thread. Yet this quote implies that it is a widespread sentiment, which it clearly is not. Many of the women posting here have worked through extremely painful personal issues caused by male genital mutilation with their partners.

Perhaps I am reading your post wrong, and if I am, I am sorry. But that is how these statements hit me, and I am very uncomfortable with them.
post #108 of 141
Mommiska, I do not mean to denigrate the experiences shared on this board. I'm so sorry that that's how my words read .

It sounds to me that it's rather dengrating to circ'd males and their partners to make a thread full of posts saying that sex with cric'd men automatically sucks. It doesn't. It's being put forth in a pretty heartless way as well from my perspective. Sending your kids to europe to find intact men? Doesn't that sound a bit callous? I know that only one poster made the overt statement that she wouldn't date a circ'd man and I didn't want to go back and quote her because that sometimes reads as a personal attack yk?

I am responding to the OP that I think it's harmful to make assumptions of your child's sexual orientation. It's a big leap to hang worry over whether or not her partner will be intact or not over her sexual development. It's hurtful to suggest that if her male partner has some sort of 'imperfection' (and these can come from many other sources other than circumcision, by the way) that she will be 'unfulfilled'. It places far too much responsibility on the hypothetical uncirc'd male partner to see to it that she has a fulfilling sex life. I think that's unfair and kinda dangerous thinking.
post #109 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by l_olive View Post
My circ'ed dh cannot orgasm through intercourse as a direct result of the desensitization that occurs as a result of a very tight circumcision. We were not able to have children together in the normal manner as he is unable to ejaculate into my vagina.
I dated a man with a similar problem, who could not orgasm through intercourse and instead needed vigorous masturbation to climax. I dont' think it's THAT uncommon, unfortunately.
post #110 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mommiska View Post
This is a red herring. One person (as far as I'm aware) has made such a statement on this thread. Yet this quote implies that it is a widespread sentiment, which it clearly is not. Many of the women posting here have worked through extremely painful personal issues caused by male genital mutilation with their partners.

Perhaps I am reading your post wrong, and if I am, I am sorry. But that is how these statements hit me, and I am very uncomfortable with them.
: Only one woman on here stated she wouldn't be with a circumcised man. Then I guess you assumed we all agreed with her maybe?

Quote:
Originally Posted by l_olive

Bottom line.

Both sexes deserve to have intact genitals, and when adults, to have sexual relationships with partners with intact genitals. The OP has simply been saddened by the possibility that this won't be the case for her child.

Shouldn't be so dramatic, huh
Exactly!!!!!!!!!!
post #111 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama View Post

It sounds to me that it's rather dengrating to circ'd males and their partners to make a thread full of posts saying that sex with cric'd men automatically sucks. It doesn't .
I know what youre saying, I do. But I feel like in this thread these kinds of statements, going into detail about how circ'd sex "sucks" were after there were a number of posts made about circed sex is "just fine" and "there is nothing wrong with it". The reality is that its somewhere in the middle. That there are real women out there dealing with a gradient of severity of problems due to their husbands circ, and it effects them all differently.

That doesnt mean that every sexual encounter with an intact male will be problem free, but the term used in the first post was "normal". And on this board, in this company, "normal" vaginal / anal sex is most exclusively defined as vaginal / anal sex with all male and female parts present.

Basically, the debate about the specifics of how sex with circed men is not normal came after these women were told they were silly or gross for hoping for something for their children, male or female; to have normal sex. And that debate could be seen as dismissive to their valid feelings, even if people dont agree with or where those feelings are coming from.
post #112 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mommiska View Post
I can't compare, as I've only been with my intact dh. But I've heard enough (both here, and from friends with circed husbands) to know that circumcised sex is different (and not in a good way) from normal, intact sex.

I don't recognise the need for artificial lube, the pounding away, the soreness/chaffing, etc that are described by many women with cut partners.

Of course there is more to the sex act than just genitals meeting - and I'm sure there are many circed men out there who are good, considerate sexual partners. And those cut men who have looser cuts are probably lucky - I would imagine that the severity of the circumcision would impact on how badly it affects the sexual act itself.
Yep yep!
post #113 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheacoby View Post
: Only one woman on here stated she wouldn't be with a circumcised man. Then I guess you assumed we all agreed with her maybe?
I responded to this a couple posts up.

I hope it is not coming across that I am in any way suggesting that not everyone deserves to remain intact. My sons are not circumcised, for the record .
I just think it's over-the-top to worry about a daughter's future sexual experiences with a possibly circ'd possible male. That's all really.
post #114 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama View Post
I responded to this a couple posts up.

I hope it is not coming across that I am in any way suggesting that everyone deserves to remain intact. My sons are not circumcised, for the record .
I just think it's over-the-top to worry about a daughter's future sexual experiences with a possibly circ'd possible male. That's all really.
I was writing my post when you posted.

Do you mean you do think everyone should remain intact (with the part I bolded)?
post #115 of 141
yup. Bad typo.
post #116 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamajama View Post
yup. Bad typo.
That's what I thought but I couldn't figure out what word you had left out, now I see.
post #117 of 141
it took me a bit to figure it out too
post #118 of 141
There are two separate issues which are getting confused here:
1. The assumption that the OP's dd will be heterosexual. Admittedly, when most of us straight people think of our children's future, we often project that they will be straight, too. 've been guilty of this myself.
2. The affect of circumcision on one's sexuality. Sexuality is a complicated subject; what one person loves will repel another person. Sex with a circ'ed man will vary depending on whether he had a tight or loose circ. I have no research to back this up, but I suspect that many women who insist that sex with a circ'ed man makes no difference to them are lucky enough to have partners with loose circ's, which means he still has some foreskin left. Or maybe they are lucky enough to orgasm easily.
For those of you who claim that sex with a circ'ed man is no different from that with an intact man, keep in mind that this may change as you get older and produce less lubrication. What is ok when you're young may become intolerable when you're older.
post #119 of 141
Well, if it's any consolation, my dh is circed (my boys are not and he was absolutely fine with that) and we have a great, great, great sex life. Maybe I just orgasm easily, but whatever, it's good for us both. Do I wish he wasn't circ'd? Absolutely, but for him, not me. For me, one of the biggest turn ons with dh is how much I love him, circ'd or not.
post #120 of 141
Quote:
Originally Posted by njeb View Post
I have no research to back this up, but I suspect that many women who insist that sex with a circ'ed man makes no difference to them are lucky enough to have partners with loose circ's, which means he still has some foreskin left. Or maybe they are lucky enough to orgasm easily.
I had to go look up the difference, but based on the pictures I found, DH has a tight circ. So your first assumption doesn't apply to me. Do I orgasm easily? I don't know. I can't really compare...

FTR, I am not trying to "insist" anything. I am just stating my personal experience. I know its limited. I just don't like the absolute language people use to nullify it, or somehow conclude that I am misinformed for having it, and that if I knew better, if society hadn't so crippled from seeing the light, that I would agree with you. :
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