self-feeding/baby-led weaning support thread... - Page 8

[ShyDaisi]

Originally Posted by BarefootScientist

Hey everybody, I just wanted to subscribe to this thread. I am attracted to the idea of BLW and am looking at some of those links ya'll posted. My DS is 6.5 mo and we've been doing solids for 2 weeks now. He's had banana, avocado, applesauce, hummus, and cooked carrots, all by spoon. But he usually tries to grab the spoon as it's coming at him and stick it in his mouth himself. I let him play in the banana and avocado but it doesn't get it in his mouth. He has had some steamed broccoli and cauliflower and brown rice, self-feeding style, which was a huge mess but he seemed to love. So maybe we will head more in that direction. I also let him suck on raw veggies when we were at restaurants a couple times, to keep him occupied. Once cauliflower and once a cucumber slice. I am paranoid about choking though. If he chokes on something, how much of a chance is there that I won't be able to get it out doing that whole back-slapping thing?

Rather than back slapping, try just sweeping your finger in his mouth to remove the object. The back slap could make it move farther down into the airway. Also, hang back to see (just half a second) to see if it really is a choke needing intervention or if it is just a gag (for manipulation).

I also let DS chew on raw veggies. He doesn't have any teeth yet, but I think it feels good on his gums. He also chewed on the remnants of a corn cobb the other day and absolutely LOVED it!!

I think it is awesome that you are interested in BLW! Feel free to ask us any questions!

[Ubelle]

I agree with a finger sweep after waiting to see if your little one can manipulate the item to the front and out (or to try again)

My DD gets a little annoyed when I sweep, but has needed the help a few times when things have been stuck on the roof of her mouth - but once I've swept she seems much happier and not mad at me.

I am still on my quest for neat food, for an airplane trip, and have come up with these baby pancakes - not neat but fun and apparently yummy - DD looked like cookie monster.

1/2 C. ground oldfashioned oatmeal
1/2 C. rice flour (arrow mills)
1 mini banana mashed (approx equal to 1/2 a reg banana)
1 tsp. Baking Powder
1 tbsp oil (I used olive)
1 C. water

Mix all together until smooth and cook like you would pancakes.

they crumble but don't seem to become a big glob (AKA choking hazzard)

They tasted pretty bland to me so you could probably use a pureed fruit for some of the water.

We haven't done wheat or eggs yet and are trying to avoid added sugar for now

Just thought I would share



Does anyone else have a VERY enthusiastic eater? DD acts like I never feed or nurse her when ever she sits down to eat - shi is always nursed right before a solids session. Am I not feeding ehr enough? She's gaining weight just fine but am I moveing to slow for her? I really don't want to encourage her to wean early, but I do want to respect her wants etc. Any thoughts?

TIA

[BarefootScientist]

Feel free to ask us any questions!

Ok, I will, lol. I've been thinking about this all last night and this morning and it makes a lot of sense but I have a lot more questions. Starting solids has got to be the most confusing thing about having a baby. Everything I read is something different.

Ok first question: choking hazards. What exactly constitutes a choking hazard? Peanuts are an obvious example, but are they a choking hazard because of the size, or the hardness, or both? Are raisins ok, which are the same size as peanuts but soft? Will they be ok once he gets a pincer grasp and can pick them up? Could he eat something like a chocolate chip? (Not that he should, nutritionally.) What about raw veggies, if he bites a chunk off? What about raw fruits? Do they have to be really ripe and soft? Or will he just gum them? How many teeth will he have to have to be able to actually chew stuff? Are cooked beans, like kidney beans and chickpeas ok? I am terrified of choking (could you tell? ) What foods don't you give your kids for fear of choking? (Mine is 6.5 mo now)

Wow that was long. That's my main question for now. But I'm sure I'll have more.

[ShyDaisi]

Alright, here is my thoughts...(take into consideration that every baby is different and this is what I have done/would do/am comfortable with, etc. -- other people might have different advice.)

Originally Posted by BarefootScientist

Ok first question: choking hazards. What exactly constitutes a choking hazard? Peanuts are an obvious example, but are they a choking hazard because of the size, or the hardness, or both? Are raisins ok, which are the same size as peanuts but soft? Will they be ok once he gets a pincer grasp and can pick them up? Could he eat something like a chocolate chip? (Not that he should, nutritionally.) What about raw veggies, if he bites a chunk off? What about raw fruits? Do they have to be really ripe and soft? Or will he just gum them? How many teeth will he have to have to be able to actually chew stuff? Are cooked beans, like kidney beans and chickpeas ok? I am terrified of choking (could you tell? ) What foods don't you give your kids for fear of choking? (Mine is 6.5 mo now)

Wow that was long. That's my main question for now. But I'm sure I'll have more.

Micah is almost 9 months, and we STILL don't have any teeth : (I thought he started teething at 3 1/2 mos.!!) So, I consider harder small foods "off limits" for now. I have given him smaller items that are softer such as several kinds of beans and corn since he has started to really master the pincer grasp. Before then I made sure the foods I offered were larger really soft/mushy foods -- i.e. steamed sweet potato, avacado (large pieces -- the small onesa hard to get a hold of), pear slices, baked squash, steamed broccoli (these were our firsts). I have given him raw veggies as well. He basically just gums them to death, but since we have no teeth no pieces come off. I haven't offered raisins, but I have heard other moms have.

For the most part in the beginning -- large soft pieces are good and small hard pieces are bad.... HTH

[Ubelle]

I can't answer all your questions, but maybe some of them - from what I've observed, of course every baby is different.

small peices - I've given DD small pea sized (would that be like 1/2 a peanut size) foods that were soft, before she got her pincer grip down really good they were frustrating, but she never choked - she did get them to her mouth.

When we first started I would giver DD 1/2 an apple pealed and cored and she would mash it to a pulp and then her bottom teeth came in and she could scrape, but now with her top teeth she bites of bigger pieces and doesn't mash them - so we have to dice the apple or use the mesh feeder right now. On the same note whole raw carrots, peeled she seems ok with she chips small pieces of but can't yet bite a chokable size off.

I've read that they can "chew" with their gums, since they don't get their molars typically until 1-2 yrs and we ussually chew withour molars. But the chewing with the gums would apply to softer foods - They don't have to me mushy, just soft though.

Remember babies will gag during the process - it's part of the learn - but VERY alarming to the mom and dad.

For fear of choking I cut blueberries in half and sometime if DD is gaging alot on something I will break it into smaller pieces.

HTH - at least a little

[Dolphin]

Ok, am I the only one with a babe who is not such an enthusiastic eater? I am afraid it's something I'm doing, because my lo has a completely different temperament in just about every way from my first ds, but he is very timid about trying and/or eating anything just like ds1. Each time I give him something (and now I have tried a variety of different textures and mushy-ness levels), he looks at it and me like I'm crazy! He only rarely puts it in his mouth and ingests anything. **sigh**

[sanguine_speed]

Originally Posted by ShyDaisi

Rather than back slapping, try just sweeping your finger in his mouth to remove the object. The back slap could make it move farther down into the airway. Also, hang back to see (just half a second) to see if it really is a choke needing intervention or if it is just a gag (for manipulation).

I also let DS chew on raw veggies. He doesn't have any teeth yet, but I think it feels good on his gums. He also chewed on the remnants of a corn cobb the other day and absolutely LOVED it!!

I think it is awesome that you are interested in BLW! Feel free to ask us any questions!

I took infant/child CPR and was told NOT to finger sweep as it can cause the item to become further lodged.

[sanguine_speed]

I'm also confused about what foods to offer. Does anyone know of a book based on the concept of BLW? I like having reference books on hand.

[spmamma]

Originally Posted by sanguine_speed

I took infant/child CPR and was told NOT to finger sweep as it can cause the item to become further lodged.

What should you do in the event that something is stuck in the baby's mouth/throat?

[spmamma]

Here's an update on our BLW adventures:

DD hasn't had any solids for about three weeks now, seeing as she gagged on most everything we gave her. I was eating a pear today, so I peeled the skin off a big hunk (about 1/4 of the pear) and handed it to her.

At first she just touched it with one finger and waited a while before touching it again. Eventually she picked it up and scraped a small piece into her mouth, which she swallowed without much incident (a few tiny coughs but that's it). :

She's almost 7 MO old and still doesn't have any teeth. We're still planning to take it really slow and maybe try again in a few weeks.

[acp]

What do you all think of hard-boiled egg yolk as a food? I was wanting to introduce something new tonight, and that occurred to me as something that might be fun. Will it just crumble if she tries to pick it up? Also, when did you all start giving your little ones tiny pieces of things to practice pincer grip. DD (almost 7 months) is starting to get pretty interested in tiny bits of lint, etc, when she's crawling around the floor, and I was thinking maybe I should start giving her peas to play with (I'm having a hard time coming up with other tiny foods - corn, maybe? small pieces of cheese? O's cereal?),
I also gave her a quarter of a pear to play with lasst night and she seemed to like it. She didn't eat a ton, but definitely a bit...

Oh, one other thing - I made chili for DH and me over the weekend (with ground meat, tomatoes, and black beans in it) and was thinking that in some ways it would be a great complex food for DD - all small pieces, stew-like, etc - but I just couldn't bring myself to do it, with the tomatoes in it, the spices, the fact that she hasn't tried meat yet. Would you all give your LOs something like chili that early? I'm not really worried about allergies since neither of us have them, but i just can't see a 7 month old eating chili...

[SparklingGemini]

Originally Posted by sanguine_speed

I'm also confused about what foods to offer. Does anyone know of a book based on the concept of BLW? I like having reference books on hand.

So far, I don't think there are any out there. If you look around online and surf through various blogs you will find that there is a recurring theme regarding the lack of information for BLW.

I've considered starting my own blog to give others out there more insight...once we start of course.

We leads me into this part of of my post...questions!!!!

My DD just turned 6 months on January 1st. I would really like to wait as long as possible to start giving her foods to try but she seems to be sort of ready. This might have something to do with the fact that I have always included her in family mealtime. Before she could sit in a highchair I would hold her, and once she could sort of sit, we put her in the highchair on the recline setting. Now she sits straight up and watches intently as we eat!

I broached the subject of BLW with our pediatrician yesterday and she didn't really give me the warm fuzzies about it. But, she didn't so no. It wouldn't have bothered me if she had but I wanted to see what her opinion was. Her main concern was choking.

Do I really need to be that worried about choking? It seems DD knows how far to put things in her mouth before she gags.

Also, what about allergies? Do I really need to follow the one food for four days rule? And do I have to avoid other "high allergen" foods such as strawberries and wheat and egg whites?

We have zero food allergies in my family and when I mentioned this to her doctor she said that the reason behind one food for four days is to avoid any elimination diet to rule things out. She also mentioned that most food allergies effect the skin more than causes breathing issues and what not. What is your experience?

And lastly...when you started offering your baby food, did you cook seperate things that were supposedly appropriate or did you just immediately start giving whatever you were eat?

OK. One more....did you offer at every meal, or just one to start with...progressing on with more?

Originally Posted by spmamma

Here's an update on our BLW adventures:

DD hasn't had any solids for about three weeks now, seeing as she gagged on most everything we gave her. I was eating a pear today, so I peeled the skin off a big hunk (about 1/4 of the pear) and handed it to her.

At first she just touched it with one finger and waited a while before touching it again. Eventually she picked it up and scraped a small piece into her mouth, which she swallowed without much incident (a few tiny coughs but that's it). :

She's almost 7 MO old and still doesn't have any teeth. We're still planning to take it really slow and maybe try again in a few weeks.

Yay! For making progress. I think in some cases slow is infinitely better! Do you have pictures?

[acp]

Originally Posted by SparklingGemini

Do I really need to be that worried about choking? It seems DD knows how far to put things in her mouth before she gags.

Also, what about allergies? Do I really need to follow the one food for four days rule? And do I have to avoid other "high allergen" foods such as strawberries and wheat and egg whites?

We have zero food allergies in my family and when I mentioned this to her doctor she said that the reason behind one food for four days is to avoid any elimination diet to rule things out. She also mentioned that most food allergies effect the skin more than causes breathing issues and what not. What is your experience?

And lastly...when you started offering your baby food, did you cook seperate things that were supposedly appropriate or did you just immediately start giving whatever you were eat?

OK. One more....did you offer at every meal, or just one to start with...progressing on with more?

Well, I'm still pretty new to this, but to answer at least a few of your questions... I think all parents do it a bit differently. I'm not worried about food allergies, but I've still more or less introduced one food at a time. I definitely haven't let 4 days go between each new food, though. I have cooked separate things for her (see my above question about chili) - in part because i dont' always eat things I'd want her to be having, and even those that might work, like the chili, i'm just having a hard time giving to her this young. We've only been offering her food once a day for now (and not always that often - we often skip a day, and we skipped over a week when it seemed like she was pooping an incredible amount and i thought it might be tied to solids). As for choking, I really haven't had to worry about it. And so far, DD has yet to even gag on something, though I know that's often pretty common.

I think you just have to go with your gut and see what works for you...
I too wish there was a good book written about it, though! I think we're maybe just a bit early on this trend... I'm sure in a few years there will be something out there.

[addiemom'07]

My gen practitioner looked at me like I'd grown a third head when I told her we weren't doing rice cereal but letting baby girl eat with us. I got the allergy speech and NOOO nuts until at least age 5! I've come to just smile and nod during visits, she also had huge issues with us co-sleeping when DD was very little. The doc is a family friend and fellow Unitarian, I thought she'd be more accepting of non-mainstream ideas esp since DD is doing so well developmentally.

As for questions:

We haven't waited for anything. Some nights we introduce 2 or 3 new foods sometimes a week will go by without any baby feeding. If you're not regularly shoveling goo into babe's face, it's not hard to stop feeding babe for a couple of days to determine what was the allergen.

We've been giving her bits of our meals when appropriate. To date we have not fixed her anything separately and DH is a chef.

DD did gag once and I told DH to wait a second and DD got it out all by herself. We haven't had any real choking so far and DD is a squirrel. I put her to bed an hour after dinner one night and found tiny pieces of shredded chix on her mattress the next morning. I swear she has pockets in her cheeks

[BarefootScientist]

My gen practitioner looked at me like I'd grown a third head

Sorry this made me laugh. Do you already have a second head?

Thanks for the good info ladies. SparklingGemini asked a lot of the other questions I had rolling around in my head. Keep the answers coming!

So I gave my DS a third of my banana this morning for breakfast, as some of you suggested. He did manage to suck on it a bit, but mostly he just gave me funny looks and made angry noises. Does that mean he's not ready yet? Or was he frustrated because I wasn't feeding him? He loves banana when I spoon-feed him. Actually he could have been mad because of a wet diaper too - he always seems to think his high chair is a potty.

I scraped off two little spoonfuls of the banana, gave him the spoon, and helped him guide it to his mouth, and he gobbled that right up. Is doing something like that completely against the rationale behind self-feeding? Is there anything wrong with combining some self-feeding and some spoon-feeding? Do any of you do that?

Thanks!! I have a lot of questions!

[Ubelle]

Originally Posted by acp

Oh, one other thing - I made chili for DH and me over the weekend (with ground meat, tomatoes, and black beans in it) and was thinking that in some ways it would be a great complex food for DD - all small pieces, stew-like, etc - but I just couldn't bring myself to do it, with the tomatoes in it, the spices, the fact that she hasn't tried meat yet. Would you all give your LOs something like chili that early? I'm not really worried about allergies since neither of us have them, but i just can't see a 7 month old eating chili...

When I gave DD beef for the first time it was beef from our chili - it was a medium hot chili, low salt (came from the canned beans) and I didn;t worry about the spices, I was more worried about tomato - I sucked 90% of the sauce off. DD was ~ 7 mo old at the time. She seemed fine, made faces a few times but kept going back for more.

I would love others opinions on tomato - or BTDB experience

[SparklingGemini]

Originally Posted by BarefootScientist

Sorry this made me laugh. Do you already have a second head?

Tee Hee! Totally made me laugh! And I was thinking the same thing.

What is IT about doctors that makes them so resistant to change and natural behaviors?

So. Someone else tell me you were nervous about starting! I know this is what I want to do. I know the emotional and healthy benefits. I know the risks are minimal.

So why am I balking and feeling nervous?

[Arwyn]

I was nervous about starting food, at all. Well, nervous is probably the wrong word. I didn't want to! He's my baby! Almost every molecule in his body came from my body! He's not supposed to have food!

Which is why we delayed well after he was "ready" by the traditional measures. We waited until both his dad and I were OK with it (we both felt like that ), AND Naked Baby was lunging for our food before we "started", which really just consisted of letting him at what he was lunging for. I can't believe that was only two months ago... And now he eats what we eat. We started slow, letting him at fruits and veggies (and turkey, when he insisted ), then a little more, then a little more, and now he eats everything. He LOVES orange, he eats dairy in things (traces of cheese and butter), has had traces of a couple different types of nuts, gets wheat and eggs and just whatever. He had a couple bites of my (organic! ) microwave burrito this morning; didn't want just he beans I sucked off for him anymore (we've been doing that for a few weeks at least), he wanted a bite of the burrito, cheesy spicy sauce and all.

And yes, with some foods we'll get some on a spoon and hand to him - nothing wrong with that. Did that for the butternut squash sauce we made the other day, and for hummus today. I wouldn't necessarily guide the spoon in, but just because something is on a spoon doesn't mean they shouldn't have it.

I do think that things are different for those transitioning from spoon feeding than for those starting out with this feeding style. It seems to me that those who start out spoon feeding are more likely to want things on a spoon (duh) and also are less likely to know what to do with a big hunk of food, and might gag more. (Not that gagging is bad - my kid gags on everything, and has choked on my milk more than he's ever choked on food - but it can be scary for some people.)

And for choking fears - how many times in your life have you choked a little on something? (Me - several times a year. Maybe I'm just a bad eater ) How many times have you died from choking? Yea, choking is scary (for the choker and observers!), and it can require intervention, but it's not instant death, either, y'know?

[Ubelle]

Originally Posted by SparklingGemini

Tee Hee! Totally made me laugh! And I was thinking the same thing.

What is IT about doctors that makes them so resistant to change and natural behaviors?

So. Someone else tell me you were nervous about starting! I know this is what I want to do. I know the emotional and healthy benefits. I know the risks are minimal.

So why am I balking and feeling nervous?

Yup nervous to start with, and DH didn't help he was very sceptical and still looks at me like I am a horrible mom when DD gags and I am not reacting externally - he is ussually ready to wack her on the back.

And I still get nervous, I worry that something isn't soft enough, I still worry when she gags - I just don't react because I want her to feel ok with her eating experience. Since we send DD to daycare, I worry that something may happen there - it never has and they are all trained in first aid and CPR - but I still worry.

Like Arwyn, I don't think I am ready for her to grow up either so sometimes I feel like I hold back on giving food.

I definitly worry about doing something wrong as far as allergies go, and I waver back and forth between wanting to just letting her have what we are having and being super vigilant on food allergen foods. She hasn't gotten any of the foods on the allergen list and a few other that you are supposed to wait on - but I wonder if I need to worry.

I think if I knew less, and was spoon feeding purees, I would care less because I would have so many people backing me up that what I was doing was "right" and normal.

We never spoon fed in the traditional sense (we do load spoons and hand them over) but we moved into doing food slowly and I think it's best to set the pace that works best for you, DP and the LO (sometimes that is harder)

[acp]

So, in the past few days, I feel like DD has made huge leaps in terms of really *getting* solids. Before, she had fun when we let her play with stuff, and occasionally ate bits here and there, but mostly just spread it all around and made a mess (which was fine with me - like others on this thread, I kind of wanted my baby to remain a baby...).
But two nights ago, when I gave her some hard-boiled egg yolk and banana (she ended up picking up most of the very crumbly egg yolk bits with the banana, which they stuck to), and last night, when I gave her some hummus and some sweet potato fries, she attacked the food with a vengeance. And ate the majority of it. She seemed to really relish it - and didn't make her hysterical I'm-not-sure-about-this face that she sometimes has in the past when food, as opposed to paper, wood, or other nonedible objects, gets near her mouth.
Her poops, as a result, have been horrific - stinky, slimy messes. (Do these ever get better, or is this what I have to look forward to for the next year or two??)
We're still only sitting her down to eat with us around dinner (though I did give her some of my banana this morning since she looked so upset that I was eating some and she wasn't), and still not every day, but she's definitely embracing it enthusiastically.

On the spoon issue - I still haven't used one at all, but I may start doing it for those food that make sense. Hummus, for instance. The other night I just put a bit in a bowl and let her have it with her fingers, but it's not really the best way to go about eating hummus - not how i'd do it, certainly. And I was thinking that I may start giving her some plain whole-milk yogurt, and mashed potatoes, and applesauce (if I can find any without added sugar) in the future, and none of those are ideal finger foods. I'm not sure how I'd do it, but I'm thinking maybe I'd show her how I eat it off a spoon first, then help her the first few times, and then put some on a spoon and let her try herself, realizing that she may, of course, revert back to her fingers, and that's ok. What do you all think?