LDS Papas and Mamas #48 - Page 8

[guestmama9911]

Originally Posted by LionTigerBear

The church itself does not encourage members to vote in any way, except to follow their conscience. What individual members do to encourage fellow members to vote certain ways, will differ, of course.

Actually the Church very specifically told us to vote for Prop 22 in California which would have limited marriage to between a man and a woman. Then the ACLU sued the Church for being political and said that the Church could no longer maintain its tax exempt status. Either they are still doing it or they failed. But Prop 22 was a big issue and I know people who left the Church over it.

That's why you then have to remind yourself that the Prophet speaks for God and God has His reasons. You either believe this or you don't.

[guestmama9911]

Originally Posted by magstphil

true, and i strongly disagree with what happened with the church and Prop 22. it was out of line.

.

It came from President Hinckley and the First Presidency. So, as NCD just said to me, "If it came from President Hinckley, it wasn't out of line."

[guestmama9911]

PS - thanks for the empathy re: Connor. I don't know if Bryan and I are strong enough to cope with his crying. The blessing sounds like an excellent idea and I feel stupid for not thinking of it sooner.

[LionTigerBear]

Thanks for educating me, Alisa. I wasn't aware of that. Very interesting . . . I am grateful that we have a prophet to help us with these present day issues.

[Moonprysm]

Originally Posted by alisaterry

It came from President Hinckley and the First Presidency. So, as NCD just said to me, "If it came from President Hinckley, it wasn't out of line."

But nobody is perfect and aren't we supposed to pray about the things we are told?

[quarteralien]

Originally Posted by alisaterry

That's why you then have to remind yourself that the Prophet speaks for God and God has His reasons. You either believe this or you don't.

I think this bears repeating.

ETA: pray about it by all means. But we sustain the prophet as the mouth piece of God on earth. I have a testimony that God will not tell you something different than He told the prophet.

[DucetteMama21842]

Alisa, I just love your posts. That's all.

[Moonprysm]

Originally Posted by quarteralien

I think this bears repeating.

ETA: pray about it by all means. But we sustain the prophet as the mouth piece of God on earth. I have a testimony that God will not tell you something different than He told the prophet.

I was told by my missionaries that there is a difference in when he is speaking for God and when he is speaking for himself. Being that I wasn't a member then, I don't know which this was. But I was assured that nobody is perfect and that, when speaking as himself and not for God, that he is just as fallible as the rest of us. Hence the praying.

[brightonwoman]

Originally Posted by LionTigerBear

BTW, topic change, but there is a thread going on over in TAO right now that states that any church which believes that homosexual relationships are "less than" heterosexual relationships in any way, is homophobic. Just a question-- do you believe that the LDS church is homophobic?

phobia means fear...so no, our doctrinc isn't homophobic because fear has nothing to do with it. We just believe it's wrong...
I agree with the pp who said that some members are homophobic though. Definitely.
For myself, I view homosexual desires as temptations--just like alcohol or violence...it might or might not be acted upon. Promiscuity is promiscuity no matter who you're doing it with...

My dh has a former professor who is LDS and recently came out to dh. He had been married, but his wife left him when he realized he was still struggling with the temptations and came out to her. He is currently working ong etting his doctrate in psychology and he wants to go into practice to help young men (and women) who are 'recovering homosexuals' like himself. My hat off to him!!!

jenni

[quarteralien]

Originally Posted by Moonprysm

I was told by my missionaries that there is a difference in when he is speaking for God and when he is speaking for himself. Being that I wasn't a member then, I don't know which this was. But I was assured that nobody is perfect and that, when speaking as himself and not for God, that he is just as fallible as the rest of us. Hence the praying.

I've beein thinking and thinking about how to respond to this, and I'll give it a shot, but I'd love others' input as well.

Yes, the prophet speaks just as a man at times. I would say he does this in casual conversation among his family and friends, and perhaps even in situations like being on Larry King Live. However, when he is addressing the church, I take it on faith that he is speaking for God. He would not take something like that lightly and get wrong whatever God wants us to know. He and prophets before him absolutely take their responsibilities seriously. I'm not saying what you were told was dead wrong, but it seems dangerous to me to say to assume that everything he says may or may not be the word of God. It seems to me like that would lead to members picking and choosing which commandments they are going to follow. Yes, pray about it, but I stand by what I said, I do not think you will get a different answer than the prophet did.

[brightonwoman]

Originally Posted by Moonprysm

I was told by my missionaries that there is a difference in when he is speaking for God and when he is speaking for himself. Being that I wasn't a member then, I don't know which this was. But I was assured that nobody is perfect and that, when speaking as himself and not for God, that he is just as fallible as the rest of us. Hence the praying.

If he sends it out in an official letter (to be read at sacrament meeting for example), or if it is in an article printed in the Ensign, or given over the pulpit at conference--that is speaking for God.
If you're having him over for dinner and chatting by the fire, that's from himself.
I pray, sure...but we're also told in the new testament (I can find the exact reference if you want it) that "If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God or whether I speak of myself"...SO, yes, you should pray, BUT it is though doing that you will gain a testimony of what is true.

jenni

[brightonwoman]

alisa, I just had another idea of what might help with the connor night-nursing situation...

My mom tandem nursed with three of her kids. They were 2.5 yrs apart, and she weaned the older one on their third birthday each time... They were old enough to make weaning an exciting thing--part of being big etc. They counted down days for several weeks until their birthday etc. Now I know connor is younger than that, but if weaning is the route you decide you need to go, I know mom's method sure worked well for those siblings.
The other thing is that she always had the smaller baby out of her bed (and in with a sibling) by the time the new baby came. now I realize connor doesn't have an older sibling to move in with...however, maybe could he have a little bed next to your bed? You could nurse him to sleep there, and in the night (as needed) Bryan could cuddle with him there, but he wouldnt' actuallybe IN your bed? He'd stillb e in the room, still near you,e tc, but maybe the space of a separate bed would help him. I know when Sam was born Will had a lot of struggles with adjusting, and one thing was that he wanted to sleep with us again. We welcomed him to our room, but didn't have room in the bed, so we made up a bed for him next to ours... he comes in and sleeps on our floor a couple of times a week now. I plan to start moving sammy out of our bed in a month or two (it's a double, and it's squishy!) but once i do get him moved into the sidecar-style crib, and once he night weans, then i'll be moving the crib to be a sidecar on Will's bed... Co-sleeping isn't exclusively about sleeping with the parents after all!
Anyway, I dont' know if any of that will be helpful for you, or if they are things you are comfortable with trying...but they were just some things I've been thiking about this afternoon.
jenni

[LionTigerBear]

When we weaned DS1, we didn't move him out of his bed (our bed), but we had DH start putting him to bed (instead of him nursing to bed) with a sippy cup of milk. (Of course, later on found out he was intolerant *sigh*) but anyway, that worked well. And we went cold turkey. With his personality, it was just easier *for him* that way. It actually wasn't too big of a problem, I mean there were a few tears wich was hard, but for a child so passionate and dramatic it was much less than I was afriad of. I think he was close to ready to stop on his own, anyway, which helped. (He was 2.5.) After a only a few days the transition was complete. He would still come up and cuddle with me and pat my breasts, but he seemed to get over even his desire to nurse pretty quickly. Mostly he just wanted to still be able to cuddle with me.

I was still sad about it though. I wish it could have worked out differently but it is what it is.

But, we still coslept. We didn't make the move into his own bed (which is still in our bedroom even now) until months later. We didn't want him to deal with too much change all at once. Now, at three, he starts out in his bed and then later in the early morning climbs in our bed next to me.

[brightonwoman]

OT--I think you'll appreciate this!

http://brightonwoman.blogspot.com/20...n-brother.html

Oh it's just so true...

[LionTigerBear]

Originally Posted by brightonwoman

http://brightonwoman.blogspot.com/20...n-brother.html

Oh it's just so true...

That's fantastic.

[KermitMissesJim]

The fact that President Hinckley said it is the reason I hang in there over the issue. It just seems unfair to limit someone's rights. But I have my witness of him and that's good enough for me. Not giving money to it, though. And actually, I choose to abstain from those votes.

[Stacymom]

In reference to our earlier conversation, I definitely feel like a mom tonight.

I just made tuna noodle casserole for my family for dinner. It was there, cheap, and more nutritious than chinese take out or delivery pizza.

I'm going to slink away now and dodge the tomatos...

[Leiahs]

The whole same-sex marriage issue honestly gives me a headache to think about these days. But bottom line for me, right now, is that I am supportive of extending equal rights to same-sex couples - allowing them to be a "spouse" for insurance purposes through work, etc., or haivng rights at the hospital when their partner is there and sick or dying, and so on. I also do my best to not judge same-sex couples just based on the doctrine that homosexuality is wrong, but following Pres. Hinckley's comments about loving them equally without condoning their actions. But it's a struggle for me to actually implement that idea into every-day conversations, especially when I run into a same-sex partner say, at a playgroup. I enjoy their company and their personality, but when the conversation turns to their relationship, I find myself at a loss for words, not knowing the appropriate way to converse. Anyway, while I would support social rights, I would not support marriage. My mind tends to think about Book of Mormon stories, and societies there slipping away into evil. While I don't want to "limit" the choices of others, I do feel I have a right to steer society in the direction I feel is "righteous", so that myself and my children can gain blessings promised to us if the people in this land would remain righteous, by using my vote to say no to changes that would more easily allow practices against not only our doctrine, but Heavenly Father's design for mankind. I personally feel like voting for same-sex marriage would be condoning it. And while every person has their God-given agency, I don't want the society I live in to become a Sodom and Gomorrah. This is my home, too. But allowing civil rights to be extended to those same couples would allow them equal rights and priveleges as the rest of society, taking away undue hardships, without actually condoning the relationship. At least that's my take on it.

And also, I'm no history buff, nor a Constitution buff, but doesn't the current, unamended constitution say something about marriage being between a man and a woman? Or is it ambiguous? I'm under the impression that it says man and woman, but a quick google didn't help me out, and I've got a couple kids ready for bed. But if it does say man/woman like I'm thinking it does, I'm really not in favor of amending the constitution, since I believe it is a divinely inspired document.

FWIW, I don't think I have ever heard of official church involvement/encouragement with any legal questions regarding this topic. That turn of discussion has interested me.

And very quickly, since I really do need to go put the kiddos to bed, I relay emails for my DH for his Cub Scouts calling. One brother happened to mention that his schedule would be iffy since his daughter, who I believe is about 1yo, came down with a case of whooping cough. First person I've actually known in real life to catch it, not just news stories or "outbreak" scares or anything like that. And with DS completely unvaccinated, and me pregnant, it caught my attention. I'm thinking it's definitely not something I'm going to try to have DS catch at this point in time (isn't immunity very touch-and-go with this particular disease anyway?), but I do wonder, with how wards and illnesses tend to to work, if it's something we might end up being more easily exposed to because of situations or not. And actually, I was diagnosed with bronchitis way back when I was pg with my 1st, but since I've learned more about WC, I've wondered if perhaps it was not bronchitis at all, but WC. Random out-loud thoughts.

[KermitMissesJim]

Anyway, while I would support social rights, I would not support marriage.

This is how I feel. But I find a lot of my peers wish to limit social rights as well.

[guestmama9911]

Originally Posted by DucetteMama21842

Alisa, I just love your posts. That's all.

Thank you!

While it is true we should pray about things, I have prayed for a testimony that Gordon B Hinckley is a true prophet of God. The recommendation that we vote for Prop 22 came as an official statement from the First Presidency to be read during Sacrament Meetings all over CA. I didn't need to pray about it because I already have a testimony of the prophet and the first presidency.

There are a few things about the church that don't make sense to me and don't always sit well with me, but if I pray about every little thing I'll always have a doubt in my heart. Instead I pray about the prophet and apostles and the scriptures and then I don't have to pray about every little thing.

That doesn't mean you shouldn't. On the contrary, Joseph Smith said we have the right to pray about everything he taught, to get our own confirmation. However, he also said that we would get CONFIRMATION. So, if you do get an answer contrary to what the Prophet has said, then one of two things is happening - he's no longer a prophet, or we are wrong and need to fast and pray again.