or Connect
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › How do you feel about this?
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:

How do you feel about this? - Page 2

post #21 of 91
they should give YOU some candy!
post #22 of 91
Honestly, it's not a battle I would pick.
post #23 of 91
At first read, I was irked with the candy, the homework folder and the good habits part. But after reading the comments, and seeing the different points of view, I guess it is not so bad. We try to limit candy, not use rewards for incentive and don't really want to send dd to school because of silly homework BUT these things end up happening anyway, despite our best intentions.
post #24 of 91
Kindergartners, while too young to reliably remember to bring in their homework folder by themselves, ARE old enough to start learning responsibility and to help remind mama or papa to get the homework folder ready.

I don't really have a major problem with getting a small reward for remembering to do something that helps routines run smoothly- and to appreciate something positive even if the "routines running smoothly" part doesn't feel like a direct reward to the child.

But I have a huge problem with candy being given out as rewards. First, I have a problem with the whole "food as reward" issue and developing unhealthy eating habits (so homework routines are more important than learning to eat only when you're hungry?) and I'd throw a major fit if my child was being fed synthetic colors or flavors at school, when we avoid them. Yeah, I could send in approved candies for this purpose, but I'd my other objections still stand.

If it were my child, I'd contact the teacher about using stickers or small toys as rewards instead of candy.
post #25 of 91
I dont like a food reward at all. Especially because we're vegetarian, starbursts have gelatin and he cant eat it. Id hate to have to go thru all their candy to make sure its okay for him to eat. Stickers are fine, but not food.
post #26 of 91
Wouldn't bother me.
post #27 of 91
Wouldn't bother me. Probably b/c I would be a hypocrite if it did seeing how I have given DS a treat here and there for using the potty. : (Am I gonna get flamed now?)
post #28 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by transformed View Post
I effing hate arbitrary rewards.....
It isn't arbitrary. If you do X, you get Y. How the heck is that arbitrary?

Quote:
Originally Posted by transformed View Post
Thats why its soooooooooo important that a 5 yr old can perform at a 10 yr olds level.
????? I think taking care of personal items is a necessary skill for life. It irks me terribly when my son's friends lose mittens, coats, etc and the mom says "don't worry. That happens." What about trying to track the lost item down? Asking around, etc. She buys gloves by the dozen for her one child. There is no justification for that in my mind.

I don't think an individual reward is the right thing, but I don't think the expectation is too high. I've seen the "If everyone brings their library book the class gets a star. Once you have X stars you can pick out two books to take home." That still puts pressure on the one kid who forgets every week. But it can't always be pressure free- that is how we learn.
post #29 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by mumm View Post
I think taking care of personal items is a necessary skill for life. It irks me terribly when my son's friends lose mittens, coats, etc and the mom says "don't worry. That happens." What about trying to track the lost item down? Asking around, etc. She buys gloves by the dozen for her one child. There is no justification for that in my mind.
While I'd certainly help my child try to track the lost item down, if another parent chooses to buy gloves by the dozen, why should she have to justify her decision to anyone else?

Quote:
I've seen the "If everyone brings their library book the class gets a star. Once you have X stars you can pick out two books to take home." That still puts pressure on the one kid who forgets every week. But it can't always be pressure free- that is how we learn.
Bolding mine.

Learn what?

I disagree that humans have to be under external pressure to learn. My children have done a tremendous amount of learning, where the only pressure was that of their own enthusiasm for the subject at hand. I guess passion for life is a form of pressure, and we're not "pressure-free" as long as we have the urge to get out there and try new stuff --

But I see that as a whole different ballgame from a pressure-cooker situation where a child has to watch his classmates get a treat while he misses out. There are just so many factors that can affect a 5yo's ability to remember his folder every week.

Maybe a few 5yo's have the inner organization to think of it on their own, but I think the majority are simply getting rewarded because their moms are on the ball (or punished because their moms are too disorganized or have too much on their plates).
post #30 of 91
I would jump on the teacher about the candy but that is becaus emine RARELY have sweets like that and my eldest is on the Fiengold diet, so.....
Also, I agree, it depends more on the parent at this age. I babysit for a girl whose mother has NO organization at all in her home. She is always losing her shoes, homework, etc... I feel it is not right for her to be punished if she brings her folder home, sets it on the table and then it gets buried under a stack of laundry or something.....
post #31 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by mumm View Post
It irks me terribly when my son's friends lose mittens, coats, etc and the mom says "don't worry. That happens." What about trying to track the lost item down? Asking around, etc. She buys gloves by the dozen for her one child. There is no justification for that in my mind.
You may not see the justification. But perhaps your friend knows her child well enough, through experience, to know that its better to have a dozen gloves and not sweat it, then for the child to go to school with freezing hands, because once again he came home from school with no gloves. When my son was in K, he would often lose his gloves, even his coat, and it was frustrating because it seemed the teachers did very little to remind him or help him remember. In K, i had to go out and buy all new pants for him, with pockets, because otherwise he always lost his lunch money. I asked the school if perhaps i could just pay for his lunch weekly, because i always ended up owing them money anyway (due to my son losing his money, and the school providing him a lunch anyway)...and the secretary very condescendingly said to me "This is elementary school, Mom, he has to learn sometime!!!" (ugh, i'm not your mom, but thanks anyway...)...but the school my niece goes to encourages the parents to keep an acct going, where you can deposit so much, and the child doesnt need to bring money to school everyday.

I think its easy to judge if you dont have the type of kid who is always forgetting, losing stuff....my son can have his backback *in his hands*...we get in the car, i say "Where's your backback??"...he set it down to put on his coat and forgot, just like that. He's soooo much better than when he was 5, and i'm sure he'll be even more adept at 25. But to blame him, or make him "suffer the consequences" of his forgetting doesnt work. Maybe it works with some kids. I dont know. It doesnt work with mine.


Katherine
post #32 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
While I'd certainly help my child try to track the lost item down, if another parent chooses to buy gloves by the dozen, why should she have to justify her decision to anyone else? ).
I guess I'm critical of using items meant for long term use only once. It is incredibly wasteful and I believe we all have a responsibility to tread somewhat lightly, or at least to be aware of when we are not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by mammal_mama View Post
I disagree that humans have to be under external pressure to learn. My children have done a tremendous amount of learning, where the only pressure was that of their own enthusiasm for the subject at hand. I guess passion for life is a form of pressure, and we're not "pressure-free" as long as we have the urge to get out there and try new stuff -- ).

I don't think anyone can fully recognize their potential until they have gone past it. You have to reach failure before you know your limit. So when we just get put in (or put ourselves in) over our heads we often realize just how much we can do. Think of your parenting. (well, here, I'll think of mine. ) When I had 3 kids (2 bio, 1 foster) I learned I was pregnant with twins. Yikes. I knew I could not handle that given that I'm alone 6 out of every 8 days, that we don't have $ for help, a larger house, etc. Well, the babies are 6 months old and I'm doing it. I think I'm doing all I can but what if 2 more kids suddenly came along? Maybe I could do that just fine too. (Let's hope I never find out!! )

Now, we are way off the original topic. And whether this (putting kids just out of their comfort zone to push the limit of who they are) can be done is a school setting is another whole conversation.

Back to the folder. So a kid forgets his folder one week. That failure is not so drastic, but maybe enough that he remembers it the next week. I don't think it is an unreasonable expectation for the kids my sons' class. That doesn't mean it is right for the whole world. Some 7/8 year olds are responsible for caring for other human beings. Some can't be trusted to hang on to a $28 pair of mittens for 4 hours.
post #33 of 91
But mumm, the learning situation that took you out of your comfort-zone was one essentially chosen by you, in the same way that my children constantly take themselves out of their comfort zones when learning new things they're passionate about.

In choosing to embrace your relationship with your partner, you opened yourself to the possibility that the results could grow into something bigger than you'd imagined (no pun intended!). In a similar way, a child may embrace climbing a tree and have some difficulty getting back down ... of course, when my children get into difficult spots I'm there to support them, but the actual task of climbing back down is usually pretty much that climber's "baby" (okay, a little pun intended here ).

In contrast, unless a child is choosing to go to school (I'm not speculating about whether this is the case with the OP's child, but the majority of schoolchildren DON'T have a choice in the matter) -- the child isn't really CHOOSING to be pushed out of his comfort zone by facing punishment (in the form of denied privileges) if he forgets his folder.

He's being externally pressured, not internally impelled by his own intense interest in the subject at hand. This external pressure may be essential to keeping the school machinery oiled and running smoothly, but it's NOT essential for true learning to take place. In fact, I think it's counterproductive.
post #34 of 91
I would not like that candy/food was being given as a reward. I don't have an issue with non-food items as positive reinforcement though.

I remember getting special stickers or stamps as a reward for doing good work when I was in school. There was also the chart that got stars on it when you completed some task or level.
post #35 of 91
I guess i dont have a problem if a teacher notices a child is doing well, and gives him a sticker or even candy as a little reward..fine, whatever. My main issue is if the entire class is now having "candy reward time" and certain kids are left out, publicly, to sit there and watch the other kids enjoy their candy. Because the ones being left out are being punished for something that may not even be their fault. There are kids that switch from mom's house to dad's house during the week, yknow? Things can get left behind. So thats what my main issue is...i just feel so sad for these little kids, only five years old (now that my son is 11, five just seems so little to me, yknow?!), sitting there, deeply sad inside, perhaps ashamed. A child could remember a moment like that forever. Thats what i have an issue with.....leaving out certain kids. I think its counterproductive.


Katherine
post #36 of 91
why don't you make a deal w/ you kid... He save 4 starbursts and gets a "insert special item/activity here". That way he still gets the treat from the teacher but is more inclined to save it then eat it.

As for the whole reward system at school... i'd be happier w/o food rewards, stickers etc...
post #37 of 91
Quote:
Originally Posted by mumm View Post
It isn't arbitrary. If you do X, you get Y. How the heck is that arbitrary?
It's arbitrary because X and Y are completely unrelated. It's not unlike natural consequences -- the natural consequence of remembering to bring your homework to school as a 5 year old is a piece of candy?

When I was in 1st grade, my math teacher gave out scented gingerbread stickers to every A paper. I was/am a highly intelligent person, but the way that this particular teacher approached math did not click with me -- hence, I NEVER received a gingerbread sticker, and it made me feel like CRUD. Eventually, my mom had me switched to the other 1st grade teacher (who didn't use rewards, btw), and I immediately understood my math, and was back to getting A's. I attribute the switch in grades to a difference in actual teaching methods, but I certainly did NOT miss the reward system. And I didn't need it.

There are limited situations in which rewards/incentives are useful. I've read in the past that reward systems are best used in situations that have a definite end goal, and that are not ongoing in nature. So, using rewards for potty learning isn't as big a deal as using them for remembering folders. At some point in the ongoing processes, many people (and this is true when training animals, too) will stop caring about whether or not they get the reward. In most cases, the focus is completely removed from the goal (remembering and being responsible for one's own things because that's what we do) and placed entirely on the reward, which in and of itself is meaningless.
post #38 of 91
Thread Starter 
Wow - this has become quite an interesting discussion. I do feel badly for those kids who don't get the treat. Especially because my ds has mentioned who didn't get it. So, it's not like the candy distribution is super subtle. And, I just feel like it's a bad idea to start them out this way. It may not have occurred to these kids that they should bring in their homework folders for any other reason than that the teacher asked them to. But now, they've been introduced to the idea that you need to find out what's in it for me? YK?

I was reading an article about how new college grads are being given all kinds of rewards at work for showing up on time. Apparently this is what this generation has come to expect - rewards for simply meeting basic expectations. And I think this is where it starts - these kids are not doing some amazing extra work that is far above and beyond what is expected of them, they are only meeting a reasonable goal. Doing your best on your homework and feeling proud to hand it in should be enough.

And I know that one boy in his class who didn't turn his in last time (actually completely lost his homework folder and its contents) has MAJOR issues at home. Totally not his fault, but still he had to sit there watching his friends eat candy.

So, if I do bring this up with the teacher, what do I say? Like I mentioned previously, I like her very much and this is really the only issue I have with her. I really want to continue to work together with her to help my ds. I just don't want to sound like a jerk.

Thanks everybody. This has really helped me think about this.
post #39 of 91
I only read about half the posts, so if someone already said this, I appologize. I agree with most that the reward being candy is what bothers me more. Although I think that the homework folder should be turned in because it's what is expected. That good habits start early thing does apply to this, because next year, if the new teacher just takes for granted that the work should be done and doesn't offer a reward, some of those kids are not going to put in the effort anymore. But what I really wanted to say is that I would mention concerns about the candy to the teacher, because she may not have thought the effects through. She might just be thinking, hey, it's a cheap, easy treat that kids love. But I know that since a lot of schools are cracking down on nutrition, those candies may get her into trouble somewhere along the line.
post #40 of 91
Theatermom: Wow, you said what I was thinking, only you sound so smart about it! Good job!
New Posts  All Forums:Forum Nav:
  Return Home
  Back to Forum: Parenting
Mothering › Mothering Forums › Mom › Parenting › How do you feel about this?