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Amount of aluminum in vaccines - detailed list - Page 2

post #21 of 77
If the numbers in the OP are right, and the average al content is 250 micrograms, times 4 that's 1,000 micrograms, being 1 mg...that's over the limit, although not by much.
Correct?
post #22 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by huggerwocky View Post
The daily estimated intake of an average adult is

8 mg - I will repeat, per day.


reference
The uptake by the gut is very, very low.
.1% for aluminum hydroxide.
The gut is good at keeping aluminum OUT.
No comparison to something injected.
post #23 of 77
Actually, if I'm not mistaken...thimerosal was NEVER removed from the vaccines. As of the "effective date" pharms were not allowed to create vax's with thimerosal...and that ban has since been vetoed, so they're back to doing it again.

However, the pharms were allowed to finish producing the vax's that were started before the effective date of the ban and also allowed to distribute the vax's that were created before the ban because no one wanted to waste any vax's.

It's kind of disturbing to know that my cat's get vaccinated with vax's that are thimerosal free because it's been banned by the Veterianian Association (don't remember the exact name)...but children are still getting vaxed with thimerosal-preserved vaxs.

Minute amounts, maybe, but add up all the vax's that they are "required" to get (up to 136 between birth and 5 years) and it's no wonder that there has been a rise in children's health/mental health issues...
post #24 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by julieann199930 View Post
The amount of aluminum in the recommended indiv. dose of a biological product shall not exceed 1.250mg.

When you give multiple vaccines containing aluminum it can exceed this.
Comes from the Book of Regulations for how people can regulate vaccines-cite: 21CPR Title 21 Vol 7. Sec 610.15

Unfortunately they aren't following it or taking into consideration that when you give multiple vaccines in one day containing Aluminum, they are exceeding that.

Same thing happened with Thimerosal.
post #25 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angela512 View Post
Actually, if I'm not mistaken...thimerosal was NEVER removed from the vaccines. As of the "effective date" pharms were not allowed to create vax's with thimerosal...and that ban has since been vetoed, so they're back to doing it again.

However, the pharms were allowed to finish producing the vax's that were started before the effective date of the ban and also allowed to distribute the vax's that were created before the ban because no one wanted to waste any vax's.
There was never any nationwide ban, actually. They removed it voluntarily, at the request of the government. They did, however, finish using up the stock that had already been manufactured, all of which expired in 2003, IIRC. So aside from the flu vaccine, all of the vaccines on the regular childhood schedule are either thimerosal-free or have only trace amounts, which means that thimerosal was used in the production to keep it sterile, then filtered out at the end. If you start giving vaccines not on the schedule, though, some of them might have thimerosal.
post #26 of 77
Quote:
Pentacel (DTaP as Daptacel, HIB as ActHIB and polio) - 1500 mcg.
post #27 of 77
Yep...pentacel has 1.5 milligrams of aluminum phosphate:
package insert
post #28 of 77
MK, Let's try and find out what the amount of aluminum is in Pentacel which is the crux of the discussion.

SM
post #29 of 77
Alumium phosphate is an aluminum salt. My impression is that when the limit was set, it was for the salts. There's not a different limit for al hydroxide and al phosphate, for example. (that I know of).
post #30 of 77
I tried to look this up and found what mk says. I also found that my baking powder, Rumford, is alum-free. Not that I actually bake a lot but I thought it was interesting that it is.
post #31 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamakay View Post
Alumium phosphate is an aluminum salt. My impression is that when the limit was set, it was for the salts. There's not a different limit for al hydroxide and al phosphate, for example. (that I know of).
See my first link and this is a quote from:
Quote:
FDA regulations limit the aluminum content of an individual dose of a vaccine to 0.85 mg. of elemental aluminum. This is equivalent to 15 mg. of alum per dose.
So we need to look at the chemical formulas of the adjuvant and how they were prepared, the latter stated in the package insert and then calculate the amount of aluminum. Unless, of course, someone has been so kind as to have done that for us that can be found in the literature.

For adsorption:
Aluminum oxyhdroxide (Al hydroxide): AlOOH
Aluminum hydroxyphosphate (Al phosphate): [Al(OH)]x(PO4)y

And precipitation: [KAl(SO4)]2 * 12H2O

SM
post #32 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by BethSLP View Post
which is true until they find the NEXT thing
And here it is!!

http://www.imperial.ac.uk/P8063.htm

To quote a bit (kinda long...bear with me):

Quote:
The study published this month in Nature Medicine, shows how formalin, used in the manufacture of over half of all vaccines, can alter the vaccine's effect on the immune system.

The Wellcome Trust and Medical Research Council funded research shows that formalin causes chemical damage to vaccine proteins and creates reactive chemical groups called carbonyls. The immune system reacts strongly when it spots this damage.

...the presence of carbonyls can mean that the immune system overreacts once infection occurs and attacks the body in a damaging way.

In the 1960s, carbonyls in experimental vaccines for a virus known as RSV, which causes wheezy colds in children, triggered a powerful immune response that caused severe side effects leading to hospitalisation and several deaths
edited to not exceed 100 word count
post #33 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Science Mom View Post
See my first link and this is a quote from:
So we need to look at the chemical formulas of the adjuvant and how they were prepared, the latter stated in the package insert and then calculate the amount of aluminum. Unless, of course, someone has been so kind as to have done that for us that can be found in the literature.

For adsorption:
Aluminum oxyhdroxide (Al hydroxide): AlOOH
Aluminum hydroxyphosphate (Al phosphate): [Al(OH)]x(PO4)y

And precipitation: [KAl(SO4)]2 * 12H2O

SM
Huh. I don't know how to break that down. Do you?

Wouldn't you kinda like to see where that limit came from, also?
post #34 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by attachedmamaof3 View Post
And here it is!!

http://www.imperial.ac.uk/P8063.htm

To quote a bit (kinda long...bear with me):
Here's a WHO ppt that mentions that stuff...
http://www.who.int/vaccine_research/..._osterhaus.pdf



Quote:
Conclusions
1.Reactive carbonyls elicit a Th2 bias in the immune response to various antigens (OVA, “flu”HA, RSV)
2.Reactive carbonyls are added to antigens by formalin treatment and can be eliminated by reduction
3.Reactive carbonyls appear to mediate the atypical hypersensitivity reactions to RSV vaccine in a mouse model: remains to be confirmed in macaques

4.Several commercially-available formalin-treated vaccines appear to contain reactive carbonyls
post #35 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamakay View Post
Huh. I don't know how to break that down. Do you?
I will try to wade my way through that; the trouble is knowing how the adjuvant was added. But much to do tonight; sometime this week.

Quote:
Wouldn't you kinda like to see where that limit came from, also?
Well heck yes. Happy Holidays All.

SM
post #36 of 77
Wait, we have a bunch of people saying that aluminum is safe, based on research that they don't have, don't know who conducted, don't know the methods used to conduct it, don't know the point in history during which said research was supposedly conducted and can't figure out where to find any of that out....and some people (at the FDA, I mean) are still willing to believe that the conclusion of the study is accurate??? The study that for all anyone knows doesn't even exist?

It would be like me marching in here and saying, "Hey, guys! No need to worry. Tetanus can be cured with a 3 mg dose of ascorbic acid. I don't know where I read that, but I did read it somewhere," and then everyone believing me, because I said it was true. We have people in the FDA basically doing that - believing something because someone told them it was true - and we're supposed to trust these people? People who can't even figure out that you don't believe something just because someone told you it was true? Yeah, I don't think so.
post #37 of 77
:
post #38 of 77
MK, I went through the package inserts and the amount of aluminum (in the adjuvant) is listed so the original poster's list is correct for the actual amount of aluminum. Pentacel's package insert does not have that though, they only have the adjuvant amount (1.5 mg) so I don't know if that is just sloppy or that is the amount of aluminum in the adjuvant.

SM
post #39 of 77
Quote:
Originally Posted by Science Mom View Post
MK, I went through the package inserts and the amount of aluminum (in the adjuvant) is listed so the original poster's list is correct for the actual amount of aluminum. Pentacel's package insert does not have that though, they only have the adjuvant amount (1.5 mg) so I don't know if that is just sloppy or that is the amount of aluminum in the adjuvant.

SM
Huh.
Well, either way, without knowing what research the .85 mg max was based on, we don't really know much, either way I don't think.
Doesn't that seem kinda nutty to you that that info isn't out there? And that it hasn't been poured over and double checked multiple times by now?
That just strikes me as amazingly...incompetant...of the CDC/FDA to have not re-evaluated that by now. It's the kind of thing you'd expect to have been a matter of intense scrutiny over the years.
post #40 of 77
There is that and if they cobbled together a maximum aluminum content per dose then why is there no limit when considering multiple doses for infants? That is what I take exception to. Sure, great to regulate single doses but what good is that if they are not going to set maximum exposure limits.

SM
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