Squelching my inner lactivist - Page 2

[boheime]

Originally Posted by llamalluv

I believe that the first few years of life are a VERY important training time, [/B]!

We don't train our children. We treat them respectfully and they in turn treat us respectfully. We embrace them as individuals and treat them as though they are people. Training is for dogs.


To the OP, I'm sorry you are dealing with that. Getting along with ILs is trciky enough as it is. Keep breastfeeding!

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by purple_kangaroo

OK, I DO think it was out of line for the mom to be asked to cover up in the nursery.

But I did want to point out that in most churches the nursery is not intended (or at least not solely intended) as a place for nursing mothers.

By definition a nursery is a place where small children are cared for. "Entertaining . . . small children . . . during the worship service" is EXACTLY the purpose for which a nursery is set up.
..................
Different churches have different set-ups, but it kind of bothered me to see someone saying that small children don't belong in a nursery being entertained, since in most churches the nursery was built with exactly that intent.

Wouldn't that be the cry-room, then?

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by boheime

We don't train our children. We treat them respectfully and they in turn treat us respectfully. We embrace them as individuals and treat them as though they are people. Training is for dogs.

Well, then I guess I am a dog, because I just went through 2 weeks of training at work.

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by SashaBear

At our church children are not expected to sit in the sanctuary for the worship service. We have children's church starting at 3 and up that is geared towards their age appropriateness.

We have adult sermons that often cover adult topics that I would not want my children hearing (mine are little now).

And there is no way my almost 3 year old could sit still long enough for a sermon. He can't even sit still and play games with the speech therapists. I don't know many that could.


llamaluv-are you currently a mom? I'm a bit confused my your siggy.

What is confusing about it? It is what it is.

No, I'm not currently a mom. But I am a big sister who spent many bleary-eyed nights making bottles, long days changing diapers, and many meals wearing more strained peas than went into my sister's tummy. And she always sat quietly for worship service when I took her, which, unfortunately was not as often as I wish it had been. She still enjoys it, but now she doesn't get to go now that I live 1800 miles away.

Granted, she was not a strong-willed child, but she wasn't exactly a cake-walk either, especially considering that I was only 18, was still in school, and had two other kids (and my mother) to cook for and clean up after.

[Breastfeeding Insomniac]

llamaluv,
I agree with the pp that children are not for training. Comparing your work training to her analogy is apples and oranges. While I respect you have your opinion, I doubt you will find many agreeing with it on this forum.

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by Breastfeeding Insomniac

llamaluv,
I agree with the pp that children are not for training. Comparing your work training to her analogy is apples and oranges. While I respect you have your opinion, I doubt you will find many agreeing with it on this forum.

I found it appalling that she compared a child to a dog, and I think it's apples and oranges to compare teaching a dog to not pee on the couch to teaching a child how to live in this world.

So, you don't teach your children anything? Not even to brush their teeth? To look both ways before crossing the street? Which shoe goes on which foot? How to read? How to use language?

And for those of you who DO attend worship services - don't your religious books tell you to train your children to love and worship whatever it is you worship? (Whether that's the Judeo-Christian God, the Islamic Allah, or whoever else you might worship?)

[llamalluv]

Ugh. Okay, you know what? This thread has gotten WAY OT, and I sincerely apologize to clicksab for hijacking her thread.

I'm dropping the nursery/cryroom/training thing, because it's just not going to go anywhere useful, and I don't want to get a thump on the noggin from a moderator. (If anyone wants to discuss it further, feel free to PM me.)

But, I hope we all can agree that it is completely out of line to throw a blanket on a baby without the parent's consent, especially when that parent is going out of her way to be considerate to those around her.

[treqi]

c'mon guys she doesn't have kids yet..... I remember the "plans" I had before dd was born.... OP that was very rude of your MIL but I understand how you felt my parents disapprove of NIP and I HATE confrontation with them its just so horrible to be stuck in a hostile environment

[ruhbehka]

Originally Posted by llamalluv

But, I hope we all can agree that it is completely out of line to throw a blanket on a baby without the parent's consent, especially when that parent is going out of her way to be considerate to those around her.

(In the churches and parishes I've attended, a "cry room" is one where you can hear or see the mass or service, but fairly soundproof so they can't hear you. A "nursery" is where you drop your kids off before mass or the service, so they don't disturb others upstairs and where they can play. My parish has neither, FWIW. Babies and young children are expected to stay with their mamas, and no one really minds if they come and go throughout mass. But mass is also very different from a protestant service, so that might explain some of the confusion.)

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by ruhbehka

(In the churches and parishes I've attended, a "cry room" is one where you can hear or see the mass or service, but fairly soundproof so they can't hear you. A "nursery" is where you drop your kids off before mass or the service, so they don't disturb others upstairs and where they can play. My parish has neither, FWIW. Babies and young children are expected to stay with their mamas, and no one really minds if they come and go throughout mass. But mass is also very different from a protestant service, so that might explain some of the confusion.)

I'm a non-Catholic Christian, and where I worship we don't have either type of room, either. Where I used to worship back in Phoenix, we had a dual-purpose "cry-room"/"mother's room". It is just understood to mean that it was a place to not only take fussy babies/children, but it was also a place for women to change their babies and/or nurse them in privacy. There was also a small restroom in there with a potty chair (next to the regular toilet) for those children potty training who are afraid of the large toilet, or can't use it... The whole thing is about 20 square feet, with a small sofa and a changing table taking up space, so running loose is a hazard.

It is occasionally referred to as the nursery, because mothers nurse in there, so there is the confusion.

[Unoppressed MAMA Q]

Originally Posted by llamalluv

Okay, there's one that the parents had a hard time with, but when she misbehaved she was taken outside and they sat in the car. With nothing to look at or play with. (Unlike back in the building, where there were quiet activities).

:Puke

and,


:Puke

[Avocado]

Originally Posted by ruhbehka

I'm going to gently suggest that perhaps your expectations for age-appropriate behavior are a bit off. Especially for small children sitting quietly for long periods of time.

(

:

[KBecks]

I would just turn the chair so you are facing a different direction from where the other children are playing. If that makes you feel more comfortable. I prefer to have some privacy if I can get it. I would tell MIL something like, "no I'm not going to use a blanket" and leave it at that. Just go about your business.

[EviesMom]

llamalluv
You're misinterpreting the word "nursery" I think. The dictionary definition has NOTHING to do with nursing. Nurseries are, according to Merriam-Webster "1: attentive care; 2 a: a child's bedroom b: a place where children are temporarily cared for in their parents' absence"

I think it's a reasonable place for a mother to go to nurse her baby, but that's not what it's primary function is according to the definition of the place. I'd be more likely to nurse in a "cry room," where my understanding is that the service is piped in; and less likely to nurse in a "nursery," where I would presume the service is not piped in and there might be caretakers to watch children while their parents are in the service.

OP
Ugh on your MIL. Why was she in there with the little boy anyway? Is she a nursery caretaker? (If so, can you pick somewhere else next time and avoid her?) If you see them very rarely, I'd probably bite my lip and move on. I might put the blanket over dd once, let her toss it off, and then leave it be. My dd is still nursing at approaching 4 years old, and while I've always been much more discreet around my FIL and step MIL, but now dd can shout "I want to nurse," ask "Can I nurse?", demand "I need to nurse..." She also tells anyone who asks if she's still nursing "No, I still need to nurse... I really, really, really love the nursums, and I'm only still little, and I'm not weaned yet..."

[reikimama]

I just spent 2 1/2 days with my parents.... I totally understand.

A "little" background...

When my first DD was born, I was at my parents for Thanksgiving dinner. She was 3 months old and my older brother said, "You mean you're still nursing her?" "Yes," I said. I had planned on nursing a year.... She was the first grandchild and it annoyed the living daylights out of all of them that I nursed her for 27 months.

DD2 had a cousin 2 months after her. I think that SIL (older brother) nursed 2 months. She was a teacher and couldn't go back to work and nurse. Plus, it was so very necessary that he sleep through the night at less than 2 months because babies need schedules. Again, irriation continued, as I nursed for 28 months, and then announced I was pg with #3.

DS has a cousin 6 months older than he from my younger brother. SIL nursed him less than a month. She actually did call me for help but nothing was "right" and she quit. She also went back to work when he was 4 weeks old AND she was quick to get her figure back, as my mother pointed out this last week. BUT, the kid also has had tubes, has been on Zyrtec and prednisone for I don't know how long. He has a continuous runny nose and has been eating known allergen food since long before he was a year old. When I suggested last spring that they avoid wheat, dairy, corn, citrus... I was looked at like I was an alien. I am to them. I had suggested the same thing when she said he had itchy skin when she was nursing him. She's pregnant again and due this summer. She's planning on going back to work before 4 weeks. She's an optometrist and he's a teacher. Basically my little bro is a Mr. Mom and then they depend on my parents to keep the kids when both of them are working. I don't know what happened to maternal bonding.

So, when I was nursing a fat 30Lb 17 month old on demand (which is all the time!) at their house, I got raised eyebrows. When my 24 year old stepson came to visit and I nursed in front of him, my dad almost died. I had to hear about how great my SIL (the optometrist) was at going back to work and how she lost all her baby weight so quickly last time. I'm not working and 10Lbs off from high school weight, so it's not like I'm overweight and should be scolded by mom. I said, "Well, I need some of it for the baby and nursing." Mom then asked me how long I planned on continuing. I said "1 year" and she dropped the subject quickly. You'd think after 7 years or so, they'd just give up and leave me alone.

Ironically, my MIL always asks me if DS is still nursing when we talk. I say, "Yes, of course." She says, "Well, he needs to eat real food now." I say, "He does. I don't know what you're talking about." I think she does it to pick at me because she knows I'm not going to back down. She tells DH that's one thing she loves about me. Thank goodness. I'm blessed on that end.

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by EviesMom

llamalluv
You're misinterpreting the word "nursery" I think. The dictionary definition has NOTHING to do with nursing. Nurseries are, according to Merriam-Webster "1: attentive care; 2 a: a child's bedroom b: a place where children are temporarily cared for in their parents' absence"

Yeah, and the dictionary also has "reverend" defined as member of the clergy, "church" as a building for public Christian worship, and "pastor" as a minister or priest in charge of a church - none of which are definitions recognized by the church I worship with.

I'm not misinterpreting it - we just use that word differently than the rest of the world, thus my (apparently, unrighteous) indignation at the OP's mother's abuse.

I think it's a reasonable place for a mother to go to nurse her baby, but that's not what it's primary function is according to the definition of the place. I'd be more likely to nurse in a "cry room," where my understanding is that the service is piped in; and less likely to nurse in a "nursery," where I would presume the service is not piped in and there might be caretakers to watch children while their parents are in the service.

But...IT'S THE SAME ROOM! There's only ONE room! It's just called by three different names, depending on who is referring to it. Like "soda" vs. "pop" vs. "coke".

[clicksab]

Wow, I spend three days traveling and this thread goes crazy!

I'm back home now (finally!) and very glad to report no other MIL issues. She actually told me I've done a great job with her granddaughter, and she does not just hand out compliments. We do have different opinions on what it means to be modest, but oh well. When she asked me when I plan on weaning and I replied "I don't have a plan...right now I'm hoping to make it to two years, like the WHO recommends." she did not make a single negative comment, so I am happy! She just said she gave up when they started biting, but that I seemed to be able to make it through that stage so good for me. YAAAAAY!

As far as the church stuff goes...I still don't want to comment on all that because I'm tired from 3 days on the road and am liable to bite someone's head off. And I'd really just appreciate it if you all would take that whole debate to another thread if need be, or just drop it.

[Breastfeeding Insomniac]

Originally Posted by clicksab

I'm back home now (finally!) and very glad to report no other MIL issues. She actually told me I've done a great job with her granddaughter, and she does not just hand out compliments. We do have different opinions on what it means to be modest, but oh well. When she asked me when I plan on weaning and I replied "I don't have a plan...right now I'm hoping to make it to two years, like the WHO recommends." she did not make a single negative comment, so I am happy! She just said she gave up when they started biting, but that I seemed to be able to make it through that stage so good for me. YAAAAAY!

What a nice update, and such nice compliments for you. Sounds like your MIL has been watching the beautiful bf relatiionship you have w/ your baby and is appreciating knowing her grandchild has such a wonderful mama!

[kewpie-o]

Glad to hear that the rest of the visit was without incidence. I know where you are coming from. MIL has never said anything about me nursing DD, but I get the distict feeling that it makes her uncomfortable. I was worried that I would need to nurse DD while we were out to breakfast with her the other day because I know it would've really made things awkward if I would've done it at the table, but I wouldn't feel good about banishing myself and DD to the restroom - that's just not right. DD nursed in the car just before we went in and DD was happy to munch on her puffed brown rice while we were at the table. I have to admit that I was relieved. Funny, though - I would've been totally comfortable nursing at the table in front of strangers if MIL wouldn't have been there.

[llamalluv]

Originally Posted by clicksab

I'm back home now (finally!) and very glad to report no other MIL issues. She actually told me I've done a great job with her granddaughter, and she does not just hand out compliments. We do have different opinions on what it means to be modest, but oh well. When she asked me when I plan on weaning and I replied "I don't have a plan...right now I'm hoping to make it to two years, like the WHO recommends." she did not make a single negative comment, so I am happy!

Yay! Maybe she'll come ALL the way around eventually?